To be fair, the strength of the team isn't a lot different to when Curbishley/Gritt took over. There weren't too many players in that team that had top league pedigree. We had Bolder who was still pretty good and Walsh who'd had his leg busted a couple of times. There were others who had played in the top league but really we were a team of journeymen and youngsters. It was alright watching them do their best and it's alright watching this lot now. Once the pitch is sorted, the confidence to play a bit of football will return and the whole spectacle will be much improved. Until then we'll need to enjoy the away games and tough it out in the home games.
I've got one of those 5 year tickets so I'll be there next season....even if the pitch is still bad.
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
As oohah mentioned earlier in his comparisons of different attitudes of support, it's unconditional love for me. I couldn't imagine not going to Charlton every home game. I can't, hand on heart, say, however, that I've been over the moon about leaving the ground frozen and pissed off after yet another home defeat. That said, I was under no illusions from the start of the season that it would be a LOT tougher than last season. Still, I'm always, or at least, usually, filled with hope when walking to the ground for the next home game. Often only to have that hope cruelly dashed…
This season at home has been frustrating, disappointing and at some points painful, but what else are you gonna do on a Saturday afternoon? Some people need to man up and realise that we're not a Cardiff or Leicester, we've been in far, far worse states in the past and saying 'we're crap at home therefore I'm not going' is the talk of a fairweather fan.
While in work and can afford to do so, will renew my 3 tickets, made better for me as my son aged 7 has this season turned into a die-hard Charlton fan (big pat on the back to me!). I enjoy the expectation on a saturday morning before the game, getting the train and then hearing The Red, red robin. Weirdly I sort of enjoy the lows as well as the highs. It's a cliche but the lows make the highs better. Watching the Cardiff game and then going to Watford with my son was enough to make this season good for me (as long as we stay up of course, which I think we will).
Well redpanda my attendance at The Valley began in 1963 as a 7 year old and has not stopped, even when we played at Selhurst I stayed faithful and will always be CAFC but there have been times when the football got so bad that I have given it a miss and that is how I feel a bit today. I am not expecting Champions League football, I'm not even expecting Premiership football I would just like something that appears to have some thought and method behind it.....like last season by the way.
Oh and by the way my old son after 53 years as a die hard fan I have the right to pick what I want to do that doesn't make me fairweather just free thinking.
The "I've been going this many years, so don't need to go if I don't want to" card is the most over-done and irrelevant one in the pack.
If you don't go because your team are not winning, then it is no different from someone who calls themselves a true fan who has only been going two or three seasons.
Slightly off topic .. It was a surprise to me that the new season ticket prices were announced before the end of the season or at least before our future in the Championship was assured. Many Lifers will not be prepared to pay the higher prices IF (and it is only a fairly remote 'if') we are relegated, as well as: a) the shocking standard of this season's home performances and b) the necessary financial commitment. I sense a tactical error here by the club hierarchy
Like Dave I've been a Charlton supporter for 50 years but I pick and chose games now, and to be quite blunt I don't give a fuck whether anyone thinks i'm a true fan or not. For the record i'm 100% in favour of C Powell but am a bit perturbed by the manner of recent defeats. We've looked totally inept at times.
I will be renewing but that's only because I will blindly follow Charlton no matter what, I suppose that's what a "true fan" is in some people's minds
I still feel like a bit of an idiot though, I feel sometimes like I'm showing a commitment superior to some of our players. They get paid to show up and in some cases do next to nothing, I on the other hand pay to show up and often get frustrated.
I think the lack of commitment from some players is what makes people question whether they should renew, if we played well and lost most weeks, I don't think people would be too bothered, it's just frustrating watching things that I genuinely in my heart of heats know I could do better than some of the players not happen.
Huskaris, who are the players not showing "commitment". Not a question of commitment for me, just lack of ability/experience at this level.
Fair enough if you believe that, I believe that sometimes (not all the time) some of our players have ability but lack the commitment, Fuller would be the best example of this, a player who has bags of ability, and has moments of greatness but is absent a lot of the time.
Kerkar would be another example, for me Stephens can also be guilty of this, as can most players on a bad day, when it falls apart it really falls apart.
Having said this I suppose it's only fair to point out that in my opinion Morrison, Solly, Wiggins, Kermorgant and Pritchard never have less than 100% commitment to Charlton.
Kerkar has been dropped and not seen in a long time, probably for the reason you mentioned so I think it's a little unfair to cite him as contributor to whats going on at the moment.
Fuller - well, I think we'll have to agree to disagree there. At his age I think he chooses to conserve his energy for when he gets on the ball, which is not a bad thing. Quite often he'll successfully hold off two players at once. Let's keep his injury record in mind as well.
Not sure if this helps or is even relevant to the debate...
Am a life long Bohemians fan and member (Kevin Feely's old club).
Moved to London 6 months ago for job reasons. I am living in Leytonstone. Football was by far and away the biggest thing I missed from home. Our league is far from glamorous - my club get an everage attendance of circa 1,200 hard core, rising to maybe 3-4k for bigger games / when success comes around. I used to be a Liverpool "fan" but gave that up to attend local games regularly. I didn't miss a game home or away for 6 years.
Arriving in London I was dying to go to games and "find a team". I started with Orient due to proximity. Then tried West Ham, Milwall, Charlton, Palace, Fulham and Brentford. I didn't want to go near the 'big 3' in London as I despise the pricing and lack of awareness amongst fans of larger clubs.
I liked Orient at first but began to find their brand of football and the attitude of some of their fans to my dislike. West Ham were interesting but not exactly the most welcoming of clubs to an Irish lad with no London connections. Milwall were just lunatics!
What I found with Charlton was an amazing stadium (pitch apart!!), a very impressive fan base and a very welcoming club with knowledgeable and friendly fans. I liked the style of football too. I've been to 7 Charlton games now and despite the poor results I really enjoy it. The prices are very fair and I think Powell always tries to play the right style of football. At £24, Orient's cave man football is hard to stomach.
I brought friends to the Burnley match and after filling them in on who I seen as the better players / one's to watch, it was to my shock to see the level of changes CP implemented!! The style of football was very different to what I'd come to expect - very direct. For what it's worth, my opinion is that he's a young manager feeling the heat a little and tried something different. His changes in the second half were admirable.
I guess what I'm saying is I think you guys have a good deal....
I know from personal experience with Bohemians that a clubs financial health and simple existence is all that really matters - if the club has a good footballing philosophy on top of that, it helps!!
I will be purchasing a 13/14 season ticket for the Valley and now look forward to every game.
I don't want to patronise any fans on here and appreciate you know this club better than I could even imagine, all I would say is that from an outsider looking in, it doesn't seem too bad.
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Slight contradiction in there. If it's lots of home wins I want, why would Premier League football at the Valley appeal to me?
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought. I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Slight contradiction in there. If it's lots of home wins I want, why would Premier League football at the Valley appeal to me?
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought. I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
Because for a club like Charlton, just the chance to play Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc is considered 'glorious'. Being in the Premier League seems to instantly make a club 'relevant' in the eyes of everyone else in the land and a lot of our supporters would happily jump on the bandwagon for that. The drop in attendances since we were there in 2007 surely tells you that?
As for your last comment....Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks...
Yes, the true fans will have the credentials to their name by going to Hartlepool, Yeovil, Huddersfield and by going when times are tough. But a true fan doesn't think about trying to prove themselves as a supporter, they will be at the next game regardless.
You're one of the many suggesting that fans, maybe including yourself, won't go because the team are losing. This is a debate about those fairweathers, not those on the other side of the fence.
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Slight contradiction in there. If it's lots of home wins I want, why would Premier League football at the Valley appeal to me?
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought. I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
Because for a club like Charlton, just the chance to play Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc is considered 'glorious'. Being in the Premier League seems to instantly make a club 'relevant' in the eyes of everyone else in the land and a lot of our supporters would happily jump on the bandwagon for that. The drop in attendances since we were there in 2007 surely tells you that?
As for your last comment....Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks...
Yes, the true fans will have the credentials to their name by going to Hartlepool, Yeovil, Huddersfield and by going when times are tough. But a true fan doesn't think about trying to prove themselves as a supporter, they will be at the next game regardless.
You're one of the many suggesting that fans, maybe including yourself, won't go because the team are losing. This is a debate about those fairweathers, not those on the other side of the fence.
Okay then, by wondering about whether to renew my season ticket I am a 'fairweather'. Happy? Now what?
Everyone whose saying that we're not to expect to win every game is correct but I don't think anyone expects us to do that.
I do however expect us to win more than 4 home games after 18 home games. I also expect a bit of determination, urgency and fight and in the past few games the players have failed to show these traits.
On the subject of fair weather fans not renewing, I'm considering not renewing due to the cost. 210 pound for an 18 year old to come home p*ssed off every other Saturday doesn't sound like a good deal.
Everyone whose saying that we're not to expect to win every game is correct but I don't think anyone expects us to do that.
I do however expect us to win more than 4 home games after 18 home games. I also expect a bit of determination, urgency and fight and in the past few games the players have failed to show these traits.
On the subject of fair weather fans not renewing, I'm considering not renewing due to the cost. 210 pound for an 18 year old to come home p*ssed off every other Saturday doesn't sound like a good deal.
Fair enough but with respect you seem to be assuming that next season is going to be exactly the same as this season. Might be better and it might be worse. There are no guarantees in football and no two seasons are exactly the same. How would you feel if come October we were third and playing really well and you didn't get a ST? I'm not after an argument just genuinely interested in your answer
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Slight contradiction in there. If it's lots of home wins I want, why would Premier League football at the Valley appeal to me?
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought. I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
Because for a club like Charlton, just the chance to play Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc is considered 'glorious'. Being in the Premier League seems to instantly make a club 'relevant' in the eyes of everyone else in the land and a lot of our supporters would happily jump on the bandwagon for that. The drop in attendances since we were there in 2007 surely tells you that?
As for your last comment....Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks...
Yes, the true fans will have the credentials to their name by going to Hartlepool, Yeovil, Huddersfield and by going when times are tough. But a true fan doesn't think about trying to prove themselves as a supporter, they will be at the next game regardless.
You're one of the many suggesting that fans, maybe including yourself, won't go because the team are losing. This is a debate about those fairweathers, not those on the other side of the fence.
Okay then, by wondering about whether to renew my season ticket I am a 'fairweather'. Happy? Now what?
Same can be said about those who aren't sure about renewing but then have to come on here and tell us all about it. What sort of reaction they expect, I do not know.
Everyone whose saying that we're not to expect to win every game is correct but I don't think anyone expects us to do that.
I do however expect us to win more than 4 home games after 18 home games. I also expect a bit of determination, urgency and fight and in the past few games the players have failed to show these traits.
On the subject of fair weather fans not renewing, I'm considering not renewing due to the cost. 210 pound for an 18 year old to come home p*ssed off every other Saturday doesn't sound like a good deal.
Fair enough but with respect you seem to be assuming that next season is going to be exactly the same as this season. Might be better and it might be worse. There are no guarantees in football and no two seasons are exactly the same. How would you feel if come October we were third and playing really well and you didn't get a ST? I'm not after an argument just genuinely interested in your answer
If it's just a case of finance then just ignore.
It's finance, if I didn't renew cos of money then is make the odd game at home but I'd go away more than home purely due to atmosphere and i wnjoy them more, win lose or draw. I'm saving for a holiday at the moment but once that's out the way then my financial situation will be a bit healthier.
My point more was that for people like myself not 100% sure about renewing due to finance, coming away annoyed near enough everytime won't help convince me to renew and go on even more of a budget for a few months.
Sorry but those who base their renewals on how the team is performing really is just a form of glory hunting. You won't get a great deal of glory at a club like Charlton - how about you go and support a team at the top of League One? Those teams rack up more points in their season than we're likely to in ours' in the Championship.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Slight contradiction in there. If it's lots of home wins I want, why would Premier League football at the Valley appeal to me?
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought. I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
Because for a club like Charlton, just the chance to play Chelsea, United, Arsenal etc is considered 'glorious'. Being in the Premier League seems to instantly make a club 'relevant' in the eyes of everyone else in the land and a lot of our supporters would happily jump on the bandwagon for that. The drop in attendances since we were there in 2007 surely tells you that?
As for your last comment....Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks...
Yes, the true fans will have the credentials to their name by going to Hartlepool, Yeovil, Huddersfield and by going when times are tough. But a true fan doesn't think about trying to prove themselves as a supporter, they will be at the next game regardless.
You're one of the many suggesting that fans, maybe including yourself, won't go because the team are losing. This is a debate about those fairweathers, not those on the other side of the fence.
Okay then, by wondering about whether to renew my season ticket I am a 'fairweather'. Happy? Now what?
Same can be said about those who aren't sure about renewing but then have to come on here and tell us all about it. What sort of reaction they expect, I do not know.
I expect no reaction. I'm simply responding to the topic under discussion as I suspect most others that have posted are too.
It's interesting to get a snapshot as to whether it is footballing or non footballing reasons that are making people hesitant about renewing.
Greenie junior, to take one example, is a passionate young fan yet may not renew.
He has made it clear above the reason is financial rather than football.
If I end up not renewing, as I said above, it is for the other reasons I described rather than the football.
The Club therefore, as the two examples I've mentioned demonstrate, could easily reach the wrong conclusion as to the true motivation for non-renewals and simply assume it's down to the boring football and react accordingly.
Comments
I've got one of those 5 year tickets so I'll be there next season....even if the pitch is still bad.
I'm sure some of you would find the motivation and finances required to come watch us as a Premier League side though....
Oh and by the way my old son after 53 years as a die hard fan I have the right to pick what I want to do that doesn't make me fairweather just free thinking.
If we can somehow beat Millwall at home (a pretty big if admittedly), all will seem right in the world and at The Valley.
If you don't go because your team are not winning, then it is no different from someone who calls themselves a true fan who has only been going two or three seasons.
I sense a tactical error here by the club hierarchy
For the record i'm 100% in favour of C Powell but am a bit perturbed by the manner of recent defeats. We've looked totally inept at times.
I am hoping they will have one eye on that.
I suppose that's what a "true fan" is in some people's minds
I still feel like a bit of an idiot though, I feel sometimes like I'm showing a commitment superior to some of our players. They get paid to show up and in some cases do next to nothing, I on the other hand pay to show up and often get frustrated.
I think the lack of commitment from some players is what makes people question whether they should renew, if we played well and lost most weeks, I don't think people would be too bothered, it's just frustrating watching things that I genuinely in my heart of heats know I could do better than some of the players not happen.
I believe that sometimes (not all the time) some of our players have ability but lack the commitment, Fuller would be the best example of this, a player who has bags of ability, and has moments of greatness but is absent a lot of the time.
Kerkar would be another example, for me Stephens can also be guilty of this, as can most players on a bad day, when it falls apart it really falls apart.
Having said this I suppose it's only fair to point out that in my opinion Morrison, Solly, Wiggins, Kermorgant and Pritchard never have less than 100% commitment to Charlton.
Fuller - well, I think we'll have to agree to disagree there. At his age I think he chooses to conserve his energy for when he gets on the ball, which is not a bad thing. Quite often he'll successfully hold off two players at once. Let's keep his injury record in mind as well.
Am a life long Bohemians fan and member (Kevin Feely's old club).
Moved to London 6 months ago for job reasons. I am living in Leytonstone. Football was by far and away the biggest thing I missed from home. Our league is far from glamorous - my club get an everage attendance of circa 1,200 hard core, rising to maybe 3-4k for bigger games / when success comes around. I used to be a Liverpool "fan" but gave that up to attend local games regularly. I didn't miss a game home or away for 6 years.
Arriving in London I was dying to go to games and "find a team". I started with Orient due to proximity. Then tried West Ham, Milwall, Charlton, Palace, Fulham and Brentford. I didn't want to go near the 'big 3' in London as I despise the pricing and lack of awareness amongst fans of larger clubs.
I liked Orient at first but began to find their brand of football and the attitude of some of their fans to my dislike. West Ham were interesting but not exactly the most welcoming of clubs to an Irish lad with no London connections. Milwall were just lunatics!
What I found with Charlton was an amazing stadium (pitch apart!!), a very impressive fan base and a very welcoming club with knowledgeable and friendly fans. I liked the style of football too. I've been to 7 Charlton games now and despite the poor results I really enjoy it. The prices are very fair and I think Powell always tries to play the right style of football. At £24, Orient's cave man football is hard to stomach.
I brought friends to the Burnley match and after filling them in on who I seen as the better players / one's to watch, it was to my shock to see the level of changes CP implemented!! The style of football was very different to what I'd come to expect - very direct. For what it's worth, my opinion is that he's a young manager feeling the heat a little and tried something different. His changes in the second half were admirable.
I guess what I'm saying is I think you guys have a good deal....
I know from personal experience with Bohemians that a clubs financial health and simple existence is all that really matters - if the club has a good footballing philosophy on top of that, it helps!!
I will be purchasing a 13/14 season ticket for the Valley and now look forward to every game.
I don't want to patronise any fans on here and appreciate you know this club better than I could even imagine, all I would say is that from an outsider looking in, it doesn't seem too bad.
I'm daresay I'll renew, like most on here, but I think it's legitimate to say that as a rational human being the prospect of spending time and money on something that mostly results in disappointment does give pause for thought.
I appreciate that to say that is heresy to some of you, though in one or two cases I suspect that you actually prefer it when we're struggling, so that you can build up you 'true fan' credentials. Well done.
As for your last comment....Sorry, but that is absolute bollocks...
Yes, the true fans will have the credentials to their name by going to Hartlepool, Yeovil, Huddersfield and by going when times are tough. But a true fan doesn't think about trying to prove themselves as a supporter, they will be at the next game regardless.
You're one of the many suggesting that fans, maybe including yourself, won't go because the team are losing. This is a debate about those fairweathers, not those on the other side of the fence.
Now what?
I do however expect us to win more than 4 home games after 18 home games. I also expect a bit of determination, urgency and fight and in the past few games the players have failed to show these traits.
On the subject of fair weather fans not renewing, I'm considering not renewing due to the cost. 210 pound for an 18 year old to come home p*ssed off every other Saturday doesn't sound like a good deal.
Fair enough but with respect you seem to be assuming that next season is going to be exactly the same as this season. Might be better and it might be worse. There are no guarantees in football and no two seasons are exactly the same. How would you feel if come October we were third and playing really well and you didn't get a ST? I'm not after an argument just genuinely interested in your answer
If it's just a case of finance then just ignore.
My point more was that for people like myself not 100% sure about renewing due to finance, coming away annoyed near enough everytime won't help convince me to renew and go on even more of a budget for a few months.
It's interesting to get a snapshot as to whether it is footballing or non footballing reasons that are making people hesitant about renewing.
Greenie junior, to take one example, is a passionate young fan yet may not renew.
He has made it clear above the reason is financial rather than football.
If I end up not renewing, as I said above, it is for the other reasons I described rather than the football.
The Club therefore, as the two examples I've mentioned demonstrate, could easily reach the wrong conclusion as to the true motivation for non-renewals and simply assume it's down to the boring football and react accordingly.