[cite]Posted By: PaulCAFC[/cite]Can't recall the last time that we lost 4 games on the spin.
It was back in Dowies tenure when we lost 5 times on the trot to Chelsea (A), Portsmouth (H), Villa (A), Arsenal (H) and Fulham (A).We then broke the run with a home draw to Watford.
Okay - so slightly different to Hartlepool, Exeter, Notts County and Carlisle. What is going wrong?
[cite]Posted By: queensland_addick[/cite]And the reason he had no money to spend was, and I repeat :
A) He failed miserably to keep us in the Championship He failed to get us promoted last season with one of the strongest squads in the league
Even when he had a quality player at his disposal (Shelvey) he refused to play him.
He feathered his own nest and ours as supporters by failing to bring any success with better players (from the championship) than is currently available to CP.
I think that is incredibly.
The money had already gone 2 years before he took over - we were treading water financially. In terms of "one of the strongest squads", yes I agree, maybe one of the four strongest squads in the league (along with Norwich, Leeds and Southampton). Remind me where we finished again?
We finished in League one, which is where we may well be for a prolonged period now because most of our quality players were sold off during the Pardew/Parky regimes due to failure.
BTW had Parky managed to keep us in the Championship our financial predicament wouldn't have been nearly as bad as it turned out to be with relegation to league one. That was an absolute financial disaster for the club.
It really is an outrage the way that Parkinson is blamed for the relegation from the Championship, I just cannot fathom how people come to that conclusion other than from pure spite.
The squad he was handed was a fecking shambles, we have ONE CENTRE-HALF (Hudson) and as a result because there was no money available (because Pardew spunked it) we played the 5' 5" Matt Holland at centre-half.
Of course, we had about 25 central midfield players and countless woeful "strikers" - the best of whom had to be sold to fund Pardew's pay-off.
Sorry, but Parkinson did a phenomenal job for this club last season in getting us so close to promotion with an ageing Deon Burton our main attacking threat!!!
People are now finding out quite how good Parkinson actually was and they don't bloody like it.
[cite]Posted By: queensland_addick[/cite]And the reason he had no money to spend was, and I repeat :
A) He failed miserably to keep us in the Championship He failed to get us promoted last season with one of the strongest squads in the league
Even when he had a quality player at his disposal (Shelvey) he refused to play him.
He feathered his own nest and ours as supporters by failing to bring any success with better players (from the championship) than is currently available to CP.
I think that is incredibly.
The money had already gone 2 years before he took over - we were treading water financially. In terms of "one of the strongest squads", yes I agree, maybe one of the four strongest squads in the league (along with Norwich, Leeds and Southampton). Remind me where we finished again?
We finished in League one, which is where we may well be for a prolonged period now because most of our quality players were sold off during the Pardew/Parky regimes due to failure.
BTW had Parky managed to keep us in the Championship our financial predicament wouldn't have been nearly as bad as it turned out to be with relegation to league one. That was an absolute financial disaster for the club.
It really is an outrage the way that Parkinson is blamed for the relegation from the Championship, I just cannot fathom how people come to that conclusion other than from pure spite.
The squad he was handed was a fecking shambles, we have ONE CENTRE-HALF (Hudson) and as a result because there was no money available (because Pardew spunked it) we played the 5' 5" Matt Holland at centre-half.
Of course, we had about 25 central midfield players and countless woeful "strikers" - the best of whom had to be sold to fund Pardew's pay-off.
Sorry, but Parkinson did a phenomenal job for this club last season in getting us so close to promotion with an ageing Deon Burton our main attacking threat!!!
People are now finding out quite how good Parkinson actually was and they don't bloody like it.
Hooray somebody who thinks the same as me. Well done Ormiston for sticking your head above the parapet.
[cite]Posted By: queensland_addick[/cite]And the reason he had no money to spend was, and I repeat :
A) He failed miserably to keep us in the Championship He failed to get us promoted last season with one of the strongest squads in the league
Even when he had a quality player at his disposal (Shelvey) he refused to play him.
He feathered his own nest and ours as supporters by failing to bring any success with better players (from the championship) than is currently available to CP.
I think that is incredibly.
The money had already gone 2 years before he took over - we were treading water financially. In terms of "one of the strongest squads", yes I agree, maybe one of the four strongest squads in the league (along with Norwich, Leeds and Southampton). Remind me where we finished again?
We finished in League one, which is where we may well be for a prolonged period now because most of our quality players were sold off during the Pardew/Parky regimes due to failure.
BTW had Parky managed to keep us in the Championship our financial predicament wouldn't have been nearly as bad as it turned out to be with relegation to league one. That was an absolute financial disaster for the club.
It really is an outrage the way that Parkinson is blamed for the relegation from the Championship, I just cannot fathom how people come to that conclusion other than from pure spite.
The squad he was handed was a fecking shambles, we have ONE CENTRE-HALF (Hudson) and as a result because there was no money available (because Pardew spunked it) we played the 5' 5" Matt Holland at centre-half.
Of course, we had about 25 central midfield players and countless woeful "strikers" - the best of whom had to be sold to fund Pardew's pay-off.
Sorry, but Parkinson did a phenomenal job for this club last season in getting us so close to promotion with an ageing Deon Burton our main attacking threat!!!
People are now finding out quite how good Parkinson actually was and they don't bloody like it.
Sorry but unlike you I cannot completely exonerate Parky from the mess created by Pardew. They no doubt discussed signings together, scouted players together, watched the opposition together and probably even discussed tactics together. I don't think that's an unreasonable assumption to make.
Ok lets assume he was a complete subservient and disagreed with all Pardews actions, why the hell then did he turn down the Huddersfield job in order to stay with Pardew?
He agreed to take the job on after Pardew left, so couldn't he see that he was taking on a fecking shambles. Was he just stupid to take on the task or did he genuinely think that the squad (that he had helped to create) was actually good enough to stay up. I suspect the latter, because I think he's an intelligent guy.
Of course we were better off with Parkinson. He was unlucky inn the playoffs last season. We then gutted his team and told him to do it again, and he was doing it again. Poor football, but then they are poor footballers. CP was an emotional choice when experience was needed. He couldn't start without benson last night, that front line simply cannot work. But, he knows more than me so no probs. However, I do know that changes had to be made. What the hell was he thinking standing there? We had 4 lucky wins. Parkinsons team nearly hit the top of this division a few months ago when we should have beaten Colchester and Brighton away. Certainly close to the top. Playoffs were the minimum requirment this season. MINIMUM.........
I don't know much about this game, but Iknow more than those who were slagging PP. Emotion will get us nowhere. Had PP have had BWP ( I think it was his choice to sign him anyway ) then we may have been top 3 by now. The Manager looked totally lost and devoid of ideas last night. More importantly, Carlisle are the worst team I have ever seen at the valley, and that includes Apoel Nicosia. Never seen so much open space. We were simply crap. The booers will be happy though, for a while they thought of supporting elsewhere !!!!
[cite]Posted By: McLovin[/cite]Bottom of the Championship with a record breaking number of defeats on the bounce along the way and the highest paid squad. Miracles indeed.
Yeah but he inherited it all and it was because of the mess that was there before he ran things, ignoring the fact he was assistant to Pardew and more than likely would have opined in some signings tactics (otherwise what is the point of assistant manager role)
Get real McLovin....he didnt inherit the bunch of world beaters that CP has and we would be 10 points clear at the top had he been able to loan Bradley Wright Phillips.
QA, Parky had absolutely NO say in what Pardew got up to when it came to signings. He has confirmed that to me face to face. When he took on the job he did it out of loyalty to the club and because it was a very good opportunity for him. He was not going to just walk away was he? I'm sure that he hoped & believed he could turn it around. The squad was so hopelessly unbalanced, however, that he never had a chance. Matt Holland having to play at centre half FFS?! Performances DID get improve significantly once Parky took over, but results didn't.
I am firmly with Ormiston and dickplumb on this one.
he was getting results , powell first four wins were lucky , apart from peterbrough , the next four were very very poor , no passion in the team , i think we may have been higher up the table with parky .
I've learned something else reading this thread... How people re-write history, ignore so many other aspects that have contributed to our downfall & generally just make up stuff so it slots into their flimsy opinions...
Two young keepers (who are now far more experienced) and Weaver now in this league.
Obviously lacking numbers at centre back. Lack of quality at full back.
Midfield - can anyone say it's not far too lightweight and unbalanced? Most were inconsistent attacking midfielders who either wouldn't or couldn't tackle.
[cite]Posted By: joeaddick[/cite]I've learned something else reading this thread... How people re-write history, ignore so many other aspects that have contributed to our downfall & generally just make up stuff so it slots into their flimsy opinions...
yep works for both sides of the argument. Same as politics!
[cite]Posted By: McLovin[/cite]If Parky had no say under the Parky regime, what were we paying him for?
If the training day is anything to go by to walk around with a clipboard whilst Pardew did the talking and Kinsella ran around collecting practice balls like a puppy in the park.
I bow to no man in my admiration for Mark Kinsella and my comment was intended to show how Pardew used both Parky and Kins as stooges for the Alan Pardew show rather than dig out Kins.
The thread was discussing how much influence Parky had under Pardew and I'm suggesting, from what I saw, not a lot.
No, Powell has already won 4 more games than Parky did in his first 8 games. Parky's tenure at the club coincided with this clubs fall through the leagues on its worst ever run. I can't beleive people still harp on about him.
Red Pete
I'm sorry but I just don't buy that. Why would any assistant manager stick around if he wasn't allowed any say in the squad of players that he was working with? It's well documented that he had a big say in the signing of Chris Iwelumo for example.
Pesonally I think it would have been far more loyal to the club to speak out against the actions of Pardew at an early stage before he had completely emptied the coffers, failing that, protest with his feet by taking the Huddersfield job. He couldn't have disagreed with Pardew too much or he wouldn't have signed an extended contract!
Performances did improve and we looked more solid when he took over. I actually think he did have a good chance to keep us up, the problem was too many draws owing to his negative over cautious tactics, something that also cost us promotion last season.
BTW I have absolutely nothing against him as a person and believe he did as best as he could. However I don't believe he was a good manager and I don't buy into the idea that he performed miracles just because he 'nearly' got us promoted.
I prefer to look at the players that departed during his tenure compared to those that we are left with and then make the judgement as to whether the club moved forward or backwards under his stewardship.
Parky's tenure at the club coincided with this clubs fall through the leagues on its worst ever run.
And that was all down to him, was it?
Did he inherit a squad that resembled Barcelona or something? No! None of our managers have... They have all their best players sold from under them, then have to go looking for lower league gambles... A point that the board have often put across to us, and one which quite rightly protects their managers, but one that fans quickly forget about...
i was all for changing the manager but because i thought in would comea new broom who would get to the heart of the biggest problem - central midfield - transfer window came and went - plaese ddon't tell me we couldn't have secured 1, if not 2 players better than Macormack or Racon. For me, if this isn't sorted in the loan market or we bring in Macarthy and a defender say then we may as well line up a new manager for the summer - Call it an over reaction if you like, i don't care.
Would we be saying the same thing if the order of results hadnt been so dramatic?
What i mean is, if we had lost the first 2, won 2, lost 2, won 2? Everyone gets lucky and it seems that luck also works both ways but the guy is working with dog s*it players for the most part and im sure once hes won the next 4 in a row we'll all be lining up to pat his back again...
I was quite vociferous in my support of Parkinson when he was sacked, I thought and still think it was a joke decision to do it just after a takeover and BWP on the way, and where we were in the table even if Swindon was rubbish (or as rubbish as last night and Exeter).
I also thought, and still think that the timing wasnt right for Chris. We arent in a position where we can experiment with inexperienced managers and coaching staff and at this moment in time Parkinson is a better manager than Chris. If Chris came to us in 3 years time when we are in a better state and he has made his mistakes....
However, obviously want Chris to succeed but at the same time another fella shouldnt have to entitle a thread "Im still 100% behind Powell but" if he is making mistakes.
In a sadistic way I find it quite funny coming on here after a defeat now and seeing all the vitriol against the players and not the manager when if truth be told nothing has changed from the last fella. We have some half decent wide midfielders and strikers, a league one standard keeper, a good centre half and a crock of shit elsewhere. Parky kept us steadily in the top 4/5 for a season and a half, hopefully Powell can do the same.
I dont buy the Sir Chris nonsense, he will get sacked one day, whether its May 2012, November 2013 or whatever, it will happen one day. Managers come and go, I would have Gaddafi in charge now if he sorted out our defending at set pieces.
The ONLY good thing about going to The Valley these days is that the morons that used to boo Parky after 10 mins, leave it to full time now.
Anyone who thinks we are playing any better after these 8 games to the previous 20 probably also believe in Father Christmas and that those two old girls in Ransom Walk really are collecting for a childrens hospital.
[cite]Posted By: Southendaddick[/cite]
Anyone who thinks we are playing any better after these 8 games to the previous 20 probably also believe in Father Christmas and that those two old girls in Ransom Walk really are collecting for a childrens hospital.
Comments
Okay - so slightly different to Hartlepool, Exeter, Notts County and Carlisle. What is going wrong?
It really is an outrage the way that Parkinson is blamed for the relegation from the Championship, I just cannot fathom how people come to that conclusion other than from pure spite.
The squad he was handed was a fecking shambles, we have ONE CENTRE-HALF (Hudson) and as a result because there was no money available (because Pardew spunked it) we played the 5' 5" Matt Holland at centre-half.
Of course, we had about 25 central midfield players and countless woeful "strikers" - the best of whom had to be sold to fund Pardew's pay-off.
Sorry, but Parkinson did a phenomenal job for this club last season in getting us so close to promotion with an ageing Deon Burton our main attacking threat!!!
People are now finding out quite how good Parkinson actually was and they don't bloody like it.
Hooray somebody who thinks the same as me. Well done Ormiston for sticking your head above the parapet.
Sorry but unlike you I cannot completely exonerate Parky from the mess created by Pardew. They no doubt discussed signings together, scouted players together, watched the opposition together and probably even discussed tactics together. I don't think that's an unreasonable assumption to make.
Ok lets assume he was a complete subservient and disagreed with all Pardews actions, why the hell then did he turn down the Huddersfield job in order to stay with Pardew?
He agreed to take the job on after Pardew left, so couldn't he see that he was taking on a fecking shambles. Was he just stupid to take on the task or did he genuinely think that the squad (that he had helped to create) was actually good enough to stay up. I suspect the latter, because I think he's an intelligent guy.
I don't know much about this game, but Iknow more than those who were slagging PP. Emotion will get us nowhere. Had PP have had BWP ( I think it was his choice to sign him anyway ) then we may have been top 3 by now. The Manager looked totally lost and devoid of ideas last night. More importantly, Carlisle are the worst team I have ever seen at the valley, and that includes Apoel Nicosia. Never seen so much open space. We were simply crap. The booers will be happy though, for a while they thought of supporting elsewhere !!!!
Yeah but he inherited it all and it was because of the mess that was there before he ran things, ignoring the fact he was assistant to Pardew and more than likely would have opined in some signings tactics (otherwise what is the point of assistant manager role)
Get real McLovin....he didnt inherit the bunch of world beaters that CP has and we would be 10 points clear at the top had he been able to loan Bradley Wright Phillips.
I am firmly with Ormiston and dickplumb on this one.
There's our 08/09 squad.
Two young keepers (who are now far more experienced) and Weaver now in this league.
Obviously lacking numbers at centre back. Lack of quality at full back.
Midfield - can anyone say it's not far too lightweight and unbalanced? Most were inconsistent attacking midfielders who either wouldn't or couldn't tackle.
Strikers - Again where is the quality?
yep works for both sides of the argument. Same as politics!
Pardew made the final decisions as any manager does. Parky as the assistant was surely there to offer his opinion.
Clearly they disagreed over certains things, Pardew was a big fan of Matt Holland for one thing.
If the training day is anything to go by to walk around with a clipboard whilst Pardew did the talking and Kinsella ran around collecting practice balls like a puppy in the park.
EDIT: I thought we were talking Pardew's regime!
DOH!
I bow to no man in my admiration for Mark Kinsella and my comment was intended to show how Pardew used both Parky and Kins as stooges for the Alan Pardew show rather than dig out Kins.
The thread was discussing how much influence Parky had under Pardew and I'm suggesting, from what I saw, not a lot.
I'm sorry but I just don't buy that. Why would any assistant manager stick around if he wasn't allowed any say in the squad of players that he was working with? It's well documented that he had a big say in the signing of Chris Iwelumo for example.
Pesonally I think it would have been far more loyal to the club to speak out against the actions of Pardew at an early stage before he had completely emptied the coffers, failing that, protest with his feet by taking the Huddersfield job. He couldn't have disagreed with Pardew too much or he wouldn't have signed an extended contract!
Performances did improve and we looked more solid when he took over. I actually think he did have a good chance to keep us up, the problem was too many draws owing to his negative over cautious tactics, something that also cost us promotion last season.
BTW I have absolutely nothing against him as a person and believe he did as best as he could. However I don't believe he was a good manager and I don't buy into the idea that he performed miracles just because he 'nearly' got us promoted.
I prefer to look at the players that departed during his tenure compared to those that we are left with and then make the judgement as to whether the club moved forward or backwards under his stewardship.
And that was all down to him, was it?
Did he inherit a squad that resembled Barcelona or something? No! None of our managers have... They have all their best players sold from under them, then have to go looking for lower league gambles... A point that the board have often put across to us, and one which quite rightly protects their managers, but one that fans quickly forget about...
What i mean is, if we had lost the first 2, won 2, lost 2, won 2? Everyone gets lucky and it seems that luck also works both ways but the guy is working with dog s*it players for the most part and im sure once hes won the next 4 in a row we'll all be lining up to pat his back again...
I was quite vociferous in my support of Parkinson when he was sacked, I thought and still think it was a joke decision to do it just after a takeover and BWP on the way, and where we were in the table even if Swindon was rubbish (or as rubbish as last night and Exeter).
I also thought, and still think that the timing wasnt right for Chris. We arent in a position where we can experiment with inexperienced managers and coaching staff and at this moment in time Parkinson is a better manager than Chris. If Chris came to us in 3 years time when we are in a better state and he has made his mistakes....
However, obviously want Chris to succeed but at the same time another fella shouldnt have to entitle a thread "Im still 100% behind Powell but" if he is making mistakes.
In a sadistic way I find it quite funny coming on here after a defeat now and seeing all the vitriol against the players and not the manager when if truth be told nothing has changed from the last fella. We have some half decent wide midfielders and strikers, a league one standard keeper, a good centre half and a crock of shit elsewhere. Parky kept us steadily in the top 4/5 for a season and a half, hopefully Powell can do the same.
I dont buy the Sir Chris nonsense, he will get sacked one day, whether its May 2012, November 2013 or whatever, it will happen one day. Managers come and go, I would have Gaddafi in charge now if he sorted out our defending at set pieces.
The ONLY good thing about going to The Valley these days is that the morons that used to boo Parky after 10 mins, leave it to full time now.
Anyone who thinks we are playing any better after these 8 games to the previous 20 probably also believe in Father Christmas and that those two old girls in Ransom Walk really are collecting for a childrens hospital.
lol them two old girls