[cite]Posted By: se9addick[/cite]
For my part I’m a little concerned by this. Not that Powell is our manager (although his lack of experience and the fact that he’s a “nice guy” concern me somewhat). I’m more concerned that the owners were clearly unable to tempt a manager away from a relatively minor outfit (Bournemouth) and instead appear only to have been able to convince a man with no experience, a couple of coaching badges and nice recommendation from Sven to come manage the club. Does this say something about the funds (or lack of them) they have at their disposal ?
My take on it is that is seems we offered Howe the job. That would have meant his wages and compensation to Bournemouth so some money must be there. In the same way we will have to pay Powell and give Leicester some compo.
The cheap options were to let Parky's contract run down or take on an out of work manager. Rightly or wrongly they did neither.
They have also signed Eccelston for 5 months. If we guess his salary is £10k pw (which is conservative IMHO and we are paying it. (Parky said at a Q & A earlier this season that the sticking point on other loans from LFC was that they wanted 100% of wages paid) So that's at least £200k on his wages already. Lets see who else they sign or loan in as a judge of their willingness to spend. Certainly doesn't seem to be Man City or QPR but there seems to be some dosh there.
Possibly. The Ecclestone deal still strikes me as a strange one, but I guess that’s another discussion for another thread.
I wonder what criteria the new owners used when they decided they wanted Powell. I don’t think “being Charlton through and through” is really enough. I really would rather have had someone with knowledge of the division and a bit of experience managing in it than a legend. Tisdale would have been my shout I think and I really don’t think that would have cost us the world and would have set us up with a bit more stability. Another concern I have is that when you bring in a manager in January he really has to hit the ground running if the rest of your season isn’t to be a write off. If you bring in an experienced manager he already has a backroom staff more or less sorted, he knows the division and knows how you need to play to get out of it. He may even know your squad. Chris would have had a chance to get all of this right in June, but I sincerely hope this has been thought through and there is an idea of a structure in place. Not to mention a DVD of our last 6 or 7 games wining it’s way to Chris (which would make hard watching).
As I say, I have my reservations about this appointment, it seems based more in romance than logic, but I hope any doubts I have are quickly dispelled.
If Chris is appointed today the majority of the fans will be very happy - some have been totally taken over by the romance of it all. Some of us have voiced concerns and been slated for it. Undoubtedly we will remain Charlton fans and none of us will take any pleasure should Chris fail as manager of our club. We will not boo him at games or abuse him on this site. Had someone else with similar experience been appointed I feel that the general reaction would have been totally different. We have all seen that not all great players/club legends make good managers and only time will tell. We really need to take 9 out of our next 12 points to make ground on the top two teams and I just hope that CP generarates the same impact and reaction on the players as he has on the fans. I am not being negative, just very, very realistic.
[cite]Posted By: se9addick[/cite]Tisdale would have been my shout I think and I really don’t think that would have cost us the world and would have set us up with a bit more stability.
I'm sure Tisdale would have been considered, similar to Howe in many ways. From what people have said, it seems he's not interested in leaving Exeter at the moment.
[cite]Posted By: PaulCAFC[/cite]If Chris is appointed today the majority of the fans will be very happy - some have been totally taken over by the romance of it all. Some of us have voiced concerns and been slated for it. Undoubtedly we will remain Charlton fans and none of us will take any pleasure should Chris fail as manager of our club. We will not boo him at games or abuse him on this site. Had someone else with similar experience been appointed I feel that the general reaction would have been totally different. We have all seen that not all great players/club legends make good managers and only time will tell. We really need to take 9 out of our next 12 points to make ground on the top two teams and I just hope that CP generarates the same impact and reaction on the players as he has on the fans. I am not being negative, just very, very realistic.
Well said
[cite]Posted By: se9addick[/cite]Possibly. The Ecclestone deal still strikes me as a strange one, but I guess that’s another discussion for another thread.
I wonder what criteria the new owners used when they decided they wanted Powell. I don’t think “being Charlton through and through” is really enough.
Agree otherwise why not give it to a fan.
In any case Powell has played 244 out of his 655 games for Charlton. He has played more often for Southend so is he "Southend through and through" as well?
What we don't know is how he interviewed. How he explained his plans, how to said he would change the squad, what he knew about the squad, how he would deal with a defeat or run of defeats. Maybe he was more just much more impressive than the others on the shortlist and that added to his history with the club and references from the likes of Sven, Curbs and Jim Smith were enough to tip it his way.
Slightly unfair to Chris to assume that he was only employed because he is a "legend" although that would have been a factor.
I am actually surprised at just how popular this decision is, and those of us with concerns are getting hammered, lots of threads nowadays seem to be only about only write on this thread if you agree - I thought this forum was about discussion - anyway it seems a little odd decision to me, but then I thought the snap decision with parky was a bit odd too.
I wish Chrissy all the luck, you do have to start somewhere it is true, although is working for a board who say nothing less than promption is not good enough the best place to start your managerial career I don't know. When we employed Gritt and Curbs we had little ambition and they could work without pressure, we were also desperate.
Anyway Good luck to Mr Powell, hopefully the start of a great management career and the rebirth of our club
Start by getting a young hungry well though of, footballing man, who has been learning his trade from some of the best in the country and who have experienced the leagues.
We nearly got Eddie Whoare who most thought would fit the profile.
The fact Powelly is a Legend here helped of course it did, but our business model seems to be based on a long term view and permanent fix rather than a patched up short term plaster over a cut style which our last 4 appointments seem to have been.
I wanted Pardew but the hype didnt match the reality.
Setting our sights lower means the ambition may be higher.
Mangement is not just about tactics it is more than that a modern day manger is no longer a screaming shouting bully.
Powelly through his PFA work wouldve had to manage up and down .
Add in his coaching skills that he has required and his connections throughout the game and his name is well thought of and regarded across the country.
What we don't know is how he interviewed. How he explained his plans, how to said he would change the squad, what he knew about the squad, how he would deal with a defeat or run of defeats. Maybe he was more just much more impressive than the others on the shortlist and that added to his history with the club and references from the likes of Sven, Curbs and Jim Smith were enough to tip it his way.
Slightly unfair to Chris to assume that he was only employed because he is a "legend" although that would have been a factor.
I have heard that he was interviewed along with others, some that have been mentioned and some that havent and that in all criterea he was way above the others so the fear of him being employed just because he is a nice guy or a legend should be dispelled.
I'm one of those whose reaction is pleased ......but tempered with caution.
As others have pointed out, it seems a long term plan as part of rebuilding the club inside and out.
IMO the first thing the new owners have wanted to do is lift the spirit and atmosphere of the place;
get rid of all this negative, self-defeating shit that has poisoned everything and everyone - and start afresh.
What we don't know is how he interviewed. How he explained his plans, how to said he would change the squad, what he knew about the squad, how he would deal with a defeat or run of defeats. Maybe he was more just much more impressive than the others on the shortlist and that added to his history with the club and references from the likes of Sven, Curbs and Jim Smith were enough to tip it his way.
Slightly unfair to Chris to assume that he was only employed because he is a "legend" although that would have been a factor.[/cite]
[cite]
I have heard that he was interviewed along with others, some that have been mentioned and some that havent and that in all criterea he was way above the others so the fear of him being employed just because he is a nice guy or a legend should be dispelled.[/cite]
Good to hear but what is your source?
I'd rather have a good manager than a legend but to have both is just fine by me.
What we don't know is how he interviewed. How he explained his plans, how to said he would change the squad, what he knew about the squad, how he would deal with a defeat or run of defeats. Maybe he was more just much more impressive than the others on the shortlist and that added to his history with the club and references from the likes of Sven, Curbs and Jim Smith were enough to tip it his way.
Slightly unfair to Chris to assume that he was only employed because he is a "legend" although that would have been a factor.[/cite]
[cite]
I have heard that he was interviewed along with others, some that have been mentioned and some that havent and that in all criterea he was way above the others so the fear of him being employed just because he is a nice guy or a legend should be dispelled.[/cite]
Was one of our criteria not previous performance in a similar job? That's a normal thing in a selction process.
Dubious inside information aside, I'm delighted that we've got Powell. I guess I have to trust that the rationale for the selection was there and that he'll be a legend as a coach as well as a player. And person.
[cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]...IMO the first thing the new owners have wanted to do islift the spirit and atmosphere of the place;
get rid of all this negative, self-defeating shit that has poisoned everything and everyone - and start afresh.
This is a populist appointment by the club owners that Chris Powell just couldn't turn down. Don't expect miracles and don't expect a return to the Championship at the end of this season. We've got to give him all the time he needs.
[cite]Posted By: Full Metal Addick[/cite]This is a populist appointment by the club owners that Chris Powell just couldn't turn down. Don't expect miracles and don't expect a return to the Championship at the end of this season. We've got to give him all the time he needs.
Very good post but I am afraid the boo boys will be out in force if we are still in league 1 next season, shame but you cannot please them all.
[cite]Posted By: Full Metal Addick[/cite]This is a populist appointment by the club owners that Chris Powell just couldn't turn down. Don't expect miracles and don't expect a return to the Championship at the end of this season. We've got to give him all the time he needs.
Very good post but I am afraid the boo boys will be out in force if we are still in league 1 next season, shame but you cannot please them all.
I can tell you what, if it happens, especially in the North Upper I'd expect a few rows between our own fans.
Bottom line is whether you agree with his appointment or not, we ALL need to give him our full backing (which I think will be the case. Yes, we're all wondering if it will turn out to be a good decision or not, only time will tell. So let's sit back, all hold hands and enjoy yet another ride on the rollercoaster that is Charlton Athletic FC. "Scream if you wanna go faster"
Imnot Athletic hits on the key point about how do you judge a manager. "Only time will tell" we hear. Yes but you can look at his attributes to see whether he has the makings of a good manager to avoid a complete punt on the choice of manager. Past performance is no indication of future returns we are warned by the investment regulators. Same goes for football managers. If you mark on attributes and can identify where past results were the result of good management or luck you will do better than marking on just results and experience. Luck and factors outside a manager's control can affect results even with good attributes. More important to have confidence that decisions are made with a clear objective, in a consistent framework, communicated well to the team so more likely to be carried out by the team to their best abilities. I think CP has enough ticks on his card in the key areas to make it less of a risk than those weighting the card on past performance and experience. Experience simply means you have more information on which to mark on attributes but is no marker of success.
[cite]Posted By: incorruptible addick[/cite]Blimey. If I was as terrified of the world as that, I don't think I'd even have the courage to get out of bed in the morning!
And there you go again. I realise that hyperbole is an occupational hazard for you, but it would be helpful for these types of discussions if you didn't reach for it quite so readily.
Chris Powell is our new manager. Most of us are thrilled and feel it's the best thing to happen to Charlton in five interminably lousy, horrible years.
Most of us were thrilled when Pardew took over. Admittedly Chris is an entirely different type of character to Pardew, but by all accounts Parky was a lovely man too, and that didn't help him any.
I presume tomorrow we will hear that he has been given a two or three year contract. That takes him through this season, the next and most of the one after that, at the very least He had the goodwill of (almost) every Charlton fan.
I should imagine he has the goodwill of all Charlton fans actually. Having reservations about this being the right decision doesn't mean we don't want him to do well. I'd rather be happy than right.
He's a splendid man who knows and loves the Chalrton way.
So was Les Reed.
Let's give him, the club , the owners, the fans and everyone a a chance to work together and restore Charlton to where we want to be, for god's sake!
But there's nothing to stop us working together while still having reservations is there? I'm sure I've heard it said repeatedly here over the last few months that expressing negative sentiments here during the week doesn't mean you aren't getting behind the boys on a Saturday. Just because the manager has changed, and it's a different group of people having reservations about what's going on at the club, doesn't mean the principle no longer applies, does it?
If he turns out to be worse than Parkinson, I'm sure you will be back saying 'told you so'.
I doubt it, as that'd mean that a good man (not to mention a Charlton legend) had been vilified and ignominiously sacked, and I can't see any reason to take any pleasure in that. What I certainly won't be doing is going on about it in thread after thread, and dismissing those who disagreed with me as "rose-tinted" and not being realistic.
At the same time as agreeing with everything Aliwibble has said here, I would also like to point out that it is almost exculsivley the rose-tinted / optimistc fans who come out with 'I told you so' comments when they are right, the more cautious among us tend to take any confirmation of our doubts with a reluctant acceptance and shrug of our shoulders.
If I predict we are going to lose on Saturday, that does not, by any stretch mean I am happy when we do. It also does not mean I am unhappy if I am proved wrong. I am just being, what I consider, to be realistic.
Comments
My take on it is that is seems we offered Howe the job. That would have meant his wages and compensation to Bournemouth so some money must be there. In the same way we will have to pay Powell and give Leicester some compo.
The cheap options were to let Parky's contract run down or take on an out of work manager. Rightly or wrongly they did neither.
They have also signed Eccelston for 5 months. If we guess his salary is £10k pw (which is conservative IMHO and we are paying it. (Parky said at a Q & A earlier this season that the sticking point on other loans from LFC was that they wanted 100% of wages paid) So that's at least £200k on his wages already. Lets see who else they sign or loan in as a judge of their willingness to spend. Certainly doesn't seem to be Man City or QPR but there seems to be some dosh there.
I wonder what criteria the new owners used when they decided they wanted Powell. I don’t think “being Charlton through and through” is really enough. I really would rather have had someone with knowledge of the division and a bit of experience managing in it than a legend. Tisdale would have been my shout I think and I really don’t think that would have cost us the world and would have set us up with a bit more stability. Another concern I have is that when you bring in a manager in January he really has to hit the ground running if the rest of your season isn’t to be a write off. If you bring in an experienced manager he already has a backroom staff more or less sorted, he knows the division and knows how you need to play to get out of it. He may even know your squad. Chris would have had a chance to get all of this right in June, but I sincerely hope this has been thought through and there is an idea of a structure in place. Not to mention a DVD of our last 6 or 7 games wining it’s way to Chris (which would make hard watching).
As I say, I have my reservations about this appointment, it seems based more in romance than logic, but I hope any doubts I have are quickly dispelled.
Well said
Agree otherwise why not give it to a fan.
In any case Powell has played 244 out of his 655 games for Charlton. He has played more often for Southend so is he "Southend through and through" as well?
What we don't know is how he interviewed. How he explained his plans, how to said he would change the squad, what he knew about the squad, how he would deal with a defeat or run of defeats. Maybe he was more just much more impressive than the others on the shortlist and that added to his history with the club and references from the likes of Sven, Curbs and Jim Smith were enough to tip it his way.
Slightly unfair to Chris to assume that he was only employed because he is a "legend" although that would have been a factor.
I wish Chrissy all the luck, you do have to start somewhere it is true, although is working for a board who say nothing less than promption is not good enough the best place to start your managerial career I don't know. When we employed Gritt and Curbs we had little ambition and they could work without pressure, we were also desperate.
Anyway Good luck to Mr Powell, hopefully the start of a great management career and the rebirth of our club
Could do with a Wally Downes type as his No.2 to kick backsides....
Start by getting a young hungry well though of, footballing man, who has been learning his trade from some of the best in the country and who have experienced the leagues.
We nearly got Eddie Whoare who most thought would fit the profile.
The fact Powelly is a Legend here helped of course it did, but our business model seems to be based on a long term view and permanent fix rather than a patched up short term plaster over a cut style which our last 4 appointments seem to have been.
I wanted Pardew but the hype didnt match the reality.
Setting our sights lower means the ambition may be higher.
Mangement is not just about tactics it is more than that a modern day manger is no longer a screaming shouting bully.
Powelly through his PFA work wouldve had to manage up and down .
Add in his coaching skills that he has required and his connections throughout the game and his name is well thought of and regarded across the country.
Ticks more boxes than it crosses
I have heard that he was interviewed along with others, some that have been mentioned and some that havent and that in all criterea he was way above the others so the fear of him being employed just because he is a nice guy or a legend should be dispelled.
As others have pointed out, it seems a long term plan as part of rebuilding the club inside and out.
IMO the first thing the new owners have wanted to do is lift the spirit and atmosphere of the place;
get rid of all this negative, self-defeating shit that has poisoned everything and everyone - and start afresh.
And I believe that is a very good place to start.
Good to hear but what is your source?
I'd rather have a good manager than a legend but to have both is just fine by me.
Dubious inside information aside, I'm delighted that we've got Powell. I guess I have to trust that the rationale for the selection was there and that he'll be a legend as a coach as well as a player. And person.
With you on that Oggy
Very good post but I am afraid the boo boys will be out in force if we are still in league 1 next season, shame but you cannot please them all.
Good luck
At the same time as agreeing with everything Aliwibble has said here, I would also like to point out that it is almost exculsivley the rose-tinted / optimistc fans who come out with 'I told you so' comments when they are right, the more cautious among us tend to take any confirmation of our doubts with a reluctant acceptance and shrug of our shoulders.
If I predict we are going to lose on Saturday, that does not, by any stretch mean I am happy when we do. It also does not mean I am unhappy if I am proved wrong. I am just being, what I consider, to be realistic.