Just caught a glimpse of the lad, he did not look too happy, not that I blame him, must be frustrating, especially with the way that Liverool are playing.
Some of the players in that side look very uncomfortable, a 1-0 win is hardly convincing, I think Hodgson looked relived at the end. Very unconvincing team performance.
Still it could be worse he could be in a 'tuna situation' not even on the bench.......
Apparently 'people' only want to see Man Utd, Chelsea, and Arsenal, Man City and this lot!, although having seen them on the box quite a lot recently it cannot be for the football!
[cite]Posted By: ken from bexley[/cite]
Still it could be worse he could be in a 'tuna situation' not even on the bench.......
Shelvey has played well for England u19s, and Liverpool in the cups and according to Hodgson been training well. He has a right to be frustrated for not being played instead of the rubbish such as Meireles in front of him.
Having not done anything approaching that, are you honestly saying that Tuna should be played in front of Benson, and Anyinsah? Or on the bench over Sodje and Abbott?
One of the toughest games on paper we will have this year is not the place to be trying a still unproven 19 year old. As Scoham says, he needs a loan...
I am saying that as a player who played in the Championship when we were in it, unlike Messrs Abbott and Sodje, the lad can hardly be criticised for not playing, or being sent out on loan!
Just to emind you that it has been over a year since he played in a first team at Charlton in the Johnson's paint trophy when he scored!. He went out on loan to various clubs last year, despite some muck ups with his registrations!
I agree about the loan, but that is up to Charlton!. I do not remember Benson being on the bench too much this season!, and what precisely was Anyinsah's record before this season!. Good luck to them,
If you read my post I was saying that he should be on the bench, as he was at the start of the season and during the freindlies. I think the last time he played he scored, and laid on a couple. Obviously is not in Parky's team line up, quite how a young player improves unless someone is injured is a strange one! After all he has been there for over 10 years!
[cite]Posted By: ken from bexley[/cite]I am saying that as a player who played in the Championship when we were in it, unlike Messrs Abbott and Sodje, the lad can hardly be criticised for not playing, or being sent out on loan!
A championship team that was pretty much already doomed to relegation and was arguably more unbalanced and a worse team than the one we have currently. Don't let that fool you into thinking he is a championship player, the fact that the highest level we can get him on loan to is the conference shows that. He's really at the age where when he goes on loan to a lower level, he really needs to do the business. I know you've mentioned mitigating circumstances before but so far he hasn't done that.
Oh and Anyinsah got 13 goals for carlisle last year, not a bad pedigree for what was predominantly a winger......
Tuna will never make it as a pro. He's too lightweight, not quick enough and not tricky enough. Ridiculous to even suggest he should be on the bench when we already have two other strikers on there.
[cite]Posted By: Leroy Ambrose[/cite]Tuna will never make it as a pro. He's too lightweight, not quick enough and not tricky enough. Ridiculous to even suggest he should be on the bench when we already have two other strikers on there.
this, seen him play a few times and have never rated him (personal opinion) - just don't think he's good enough, looks to me like a very poor mans Teddy Sheringham.
He may come good, but there's no way he should even be near our bench at the moment, he really needs a loan move to a League 2 club for 3 months to see if he's got what it takes over a sustained period.
So why was he on the bench most games this season Leroy!.
I will declare an intrest here, I know the lad, in fact he trained with my football club when i ran a team.
He has been at the academy since he was 7. He has a one year contract. My sons played with his elder brother for years in the Kent League and Bexley league.
Along with talented local footballers, it remains to be seen wether Tamer makes the grade. I have always tried to keep a balanced view, and when I have spoken to Parky, and the staff at Charlton, his skill and speed are not doubted.
There is a question mark over his physique, and that he needs to 'bulk up' or toughen up point taken. He has a really positive attitude and is a good guy. I am not sure Charlton play him in the right position, in fact he was used as Shelvey's in the hole position, last season behind the front man/centre forward. Although I have not managed for 4 years now, albeit at local level he looked the part to me, and had the ability to always have time on the ball and an excellent footballing brain, perhaps the move up in class has affected him!. I tend to think he needs games, and a regular run, hopefully at Charlton. I appreciate that young players fall aside, for whatever reason!, I am sure Charlton will give him a run, but perhaps later in the season after a loan spell as suggested..
Did not mention that he was a championship player Allez, but that he had played in the Championship, Tamer has always scored goals, as I said the last time he played in the first team he scored.
I am not claiming that he is a better player than Anyinsah, or any one else come to think of it, but the dilema that he has as a Charlton player. He does not decide where he plays, when he plays , or at what club he is prepared to play. He has never declined to go out on loan in the discussions I have had with him.He got into that championship team doomed or not because of his goal scoring in the youth team. I am personally not convinced of Sodje, or Abbott, but it is like compairing apples with oranges a different position, both of those players are hold up/front men. Albeit he played as a token player in the relegated side, are we really going to condem him for that!. It really is a question of how he develops at Charlton, he has a part to play, but in fairness he has to be given an opportunity to do that. By the way, Wright, Kevin Phillips, Micheal Owen, Shearer, Rooney, and our own Sir Clive where not actually giants in the height/weight department, Muscle bound forwards, at youth football I had found tend to run with there head down, and blast the ball in the back of the net, or row Z of the stand, give me skill over muscle any day!
This is what they were talking about for a bit on Charlton Live last night. Young players need games to develop, but when we are going for promotion how do you give them games?
Ben Davisson went to Bromley but only came off the bench a couple of times, same with Tuna in his loan spells last season (might have had the odd start as well). League Two clubs aren't going to take them on loan, they've not proven they're capable at that level. They might well be, but clubs two divisions below won't give them a good run in their side and they've got to prove themselves at a lower level first.
Stavrinou was lucky enough to go to a BSP side last season and is back there with another club. Mambo proved himself in the BSS last season and this season Eastbourne took him on loan in the BSP. Unfortunately he was dropped to the bench and they've just taken another young centre back on loan from Bournemouth.
The club isn't in a situation where they can give a young player a run in the side to see how they cope. It's also easier to give games to players in certain positions than others, Wagstaff for example was regularly coming off the bench last season, but you can't really put on a young defender in a close game.
I'm not even sure a proper reserve side is the answer. The club have said now they aren't in a league, they have more choice when it comes to the quality of the opponents. Even then, they still don't compare to competitive games, playing alongside first team players.
[cite]Posted By: ken from bexley[/cite] It really is a question of how he develops at Charlton, he has a part to play, but in fairness he has to be given an opportunity to do that. By the way, Wright, Kevin Phillips, Micheal Owen, Shearer, Rooney, and our own Sir Clive where not actually giants in the height/weight department, Muscle bound forwards, at youth football I had found tend to run with there head down, and blast the ball in the back of the net, or row Z of the stand, give me skill over muscle any day!
Couldn't agree with you more, I want him to succeed as much as you, I met him at a party a year or two back and he seemed a good lad, plus you can never have enough goalscorers. What I will say is that when I have seen him play for the reserves and in friendlies he hasn't looked to have had the best attitude on the pitch (I think someone else even commented on it in the Bromley match thread if memory serves me correct). That's just what I as an onlooker noticed though...
Tamer's problem is that he is 19, and as I said originally, is getting to the stage where "when he goes on loan to a lower level, he really needs to do the business". The club can't afford to carry token players around, and if his situation doesn't change by the end of the season, I can't see his contract being renewed.
Scoham has brought up an interesting debate about the loaning of young players, I actually think that if we were still in the Premiership, players like Tuna would stand a much better chance of making the grade, if not with us then with someone else. Small lads like him frankly get man handled in this league, whereas skilful players like him are more likely to impress in the Premiership. It would also help with loaning him out, because clubs are far more likely to take a Premiership young pro instead of a League One young pro. Scotty Parker went to Norwich in the league below and it made him as a player, Tamer needs a similar experience. Unfortunately I think that circumstances dictate that he won't get it.....
Hopefully as BSP team will take a chance on Tuna and take him for 3months plus. This way he has time to bed in, get some games and hopefully some goals. Stavinrou may have gone straight into Cambridges team but he will certainly have time there to establish himself.
In the lower leagues, a month just is not long enough for a young player to make much of an impact. They are only likely to be involved in 3-4 games and a couple of these may be sub appearances. With winter here and the likelihood of postponements, players like Tuna/Mambo and even Davisson and Perkins would surely benefit from a longer period away from Charlton. None of them are quite ready for the first team and even if there are injuries we are far more likely to go down the loan route and there is only so much impact a player can have in training.
I agree with all the points made which are fair and valid, I have exchanged views with Scoham before and although we do not always share the same point of view, he is keen like yourself to develop the young talent at Charlton.
I appreciate it is difficult for Tamer and Charlton to accomadate his inexperience, and rawness, but it would be rash to write off talented footballers especially if they really have not had a fair run in the side.
I am sure Tamer would relish going to a club and having a loan spell but would expect to play. If he is anything like his brother, he will want to!. Tamer was always up for a game, I remember training at Hall place on Boxing day morning in the snow years ago with lads a couple of years older, he expected no quater we gave him none!. He got his payback a couple of years ago when I played in goal, being the old man that I am, and picking the ball out of the net! on several occassions.
Our friends from Northwich were not overly impressed with Waggy when he went there with Rachid Yussuf (?spelling). They reckoned Yussuf was the better player.
The difference a year or two makes.
Tuna, like Waggy even now, is still developing physically so don't disregard him just yet.
[cite]Posted By: cafcdan18[/cite]Hopefully as BSP team will take a chance on Tuna and take him for 3months plus. This way he has time to bed in, get some games and hopefully some goals. Stavinrou may have gone straight into Cambridges team but he will certainly have time there to establish himself.
In the lower leagues, a month just is not long enough for a young player to make much of an impact. They are only likely to be involved in 3-4 games and a couple of these may be sub appearances. With winter here and the likelihood of postponements, players like Tuna/Mambo and even Davisson and Perkins would surely benefit from a longer period away from Charlton. None of them are quite ready for the first team and even if there are injuries we are far more likely to go down the loan route and there is only so much impact a player can have in training.
Don't forget Stav had a lot of games in the Conference last season with Ebbsfleet so is a "known quantity" at that level.
[cite]Posted By: LenGlover[/cite]Our friends from Northwich were not overly impressed with Waggy when he went there with Rachid Yussuf (?spelling). They reckoned Yussuf was the better player.
The difference a year or two makes.
Tuna, like Waggy even now, is still developing physically so don't disregard him just yet.
That young lad who scored a brace for Tranmere on the weekend was born in December 1992 - more than a year younger than Tuna!
I'm not making any specific point here other than born in 19 chuffin' 92 - jeez i am getting old
Comments
Some of the players in that side look very uncomfortable, a 1-0 win is hardly convincing, I think Hodgson looked relived at the end. Very unconvincing team performance.
Still it could be worse he could be in a 'tuna situation' not even on the bench.......
Looks like Perkins is going back to Cray for another loan with them.
Apparently 'people' only want to see Man Utd, Chelsea, and Arsenal, Man City and this lot!, although having seen them on the box quite a lot recently it cannot be for the football!
Shelvey has played well for England u19s, and Liverpool in the cups and according to Hodgson been training well. He has a right to be frustrated for not being played instead of the rubbish such as Meireles in front of him.
Having not done anything approaching that, are you honestly saying that Tuna should be played in front of Benson, and Anyinsah? Or on the bench over Sodje and Abbott?
One of the toughest games on paper we will have this year is not the place to be trying a still unproven 19 year old. As Scoham says, he needs a loan...
Just to emind you that it has been over a year since he played in a first team at Charlton in the Johnson's paint trophy when he scored!. He went out on loan to various clubs last year, despite some muck ups with his registrations!
I agree about the loan, but that is up to Charlton!. I do not remember Benson being on the bench too much this season!, and what precisely was Anyinsah's record before this season!. Good luck to them,
If you read my post I was saying that he should be on the bench, as he was at the start of the season and during the freindlies. I think the last time he played he scored, and laid on a couple.
Obviously is not in Parky's team line up, quite how a young player improves unless someone is injured is a strange one! After all he has been there for over 10 years!
A championship team that was pretty much already doomed to relegation and was arguably more unbalanced and a worse team than the one we have currently. Don't let that fool you into thinking he is a championship player, the fact that the highest level we can get him on loan to is the conference shows that. He's really at the age where when he goes on loan to a lower level, he really needs to do the business. I know you've mentioned mitigating circumstances before but so far he hasn't done that.
Oh and Anyinsah got 13 goals for carlisle last year, not a bad pedigree for what was predominantly a winger......
this, seen him play a few times and have never rated him (personal opinion) - just don't think he's good enough, looks to me like a very poor mans Teddy Sheringham.
He may come good, but there's no way he should even be near our bench at the moment, he really needs a loan move to a League 2 club for 3 months to see if he's got what it takes over a sustained period.
I will declare an intrest here, I know the lad, in fact he trained with my football club when i ran a team.
He has been at the academy since he was 7. He has a one year contract. My sons played with his elder brother for years in the Kent League and Bexley league.
Along with talented local footballers, it remains to be seen wether Tamer makes the grade. I have always tried to keep a balanced view, and when I have spoken to Parky, and the staff at Charlton, his skill and speed are not doubted.
There is a question mark over his physique, and that he needs to 'bulk up' or toughen up point taken. He has a really positive attitude and is a good guy. I am not sure Charlton play him in the right position, in fact he was used as Shelvey's in the hole position, last season behind the front man/centre forward. Although I have not managed for 4 years now, albeit at local level he looked the part to me, and had the ability to always have time on the ball and an excellent footballing brain, perhaps the move up in class has affected him!. I tend to think he needs games, and a regular run, hopefully at Charlton. I appreciate that young players fall aside, for whatever reason!, I am sure Charlton will give him a run, but perhaps later in the season after a loan spell as suggested..
Did not mention that he was a championship player Allez, but that he had played in the Championship, Tamer has always scored goals, as I said the last time he played in the first team he scored.
I am not claiming that he is a better player than Anyinsah, or any one else come to think of it, but the dilema that he has as a Charlton player. He does not decide where he plays, when he plays , or at what club he is prepared to play. He has never declined to go out on loan in the discussions I have had with him.He got into that championship team doomed or not because of his goal scoring in the youth team. I am personally not convinced of Sodje, or Abbott, but it is like compairing apples with oranges a different position, both of those players are hold up/front men. Albeit he played as a token player in the relegated side, are we really going to condem him for that!. It really is a question of how he develops at Charlton, he has a part to play, but in fairness he has to be given an opportunity to do that. By the way, Wright, Kevin Phillips, Micheal Owen, Shearer, Rooney, and our own Sir Clive where not actually giants in the height/weight department, Muscle bound forwards, at youth football I had found tend to run with there head down, and blast the ball in the back of the net, or row Z of the stand, give me skill over muscle any day!
Without seeing someone play over a prolonged period in training etc, I don't really see how anyone can judge a player?
Ben Davisson went to Bromley but only came off the bench a couple of times, same with Tuna in his loan spells last season (might have had the odd start as well). League Two clubs aren't going to take them on loan, they've not proven they're capable at that level. They might well be, but clubs two divisions below won't give them a good run in their side and they've got to prove themselves at a lower level first.
Stavrinou was lucky enough to go to a BSP side last season and is back there with another club. Mambo proved himself in the BSS last season and this season Eastbourne took him on loan in the BSP. Unfortunately he was dropped to the bench and they've just taken another young centre back on loan from Bournemouth.
The club isn't in a situation where they can give a young player a run in the side to see how they cope. It's also easier to give games to players in certain positions than others, Wagstaff for example was regularly coming off the bench last season, but you can't really put on a young defender in a close game.
I'm not even sure a proper reserve side is the answer. The club have said now they aren't in a league, they have more choice when it comes to the quality of the opponents. Even then, they still don't compare to competitive games, playing alongside first team players.
Couldn't agree with you more, I want him to succeed as much as you, I met him at a party a year or two back and he seemed a good lad, plus you can never have enough goalscorers. What I will say is that when I have seen him play for the reserves and in friendlies he hasn't looked to have had the best attitude on the pitch (I think someone else even commented on it in the Bromley match thread if memory serves me correct). That's just what I as an onlooker noticed though...
Tamer's problem is that he is 19, and as I said originally, is getting to the stage where "when he goes on loan to a lower level, he really needs to do the business". The club can't afford to carry token players around, and if his situation doesn't change by the end of the season, I can't see his contract being renewed.
Scoham has brought up an interesting debate about the loaning of young players, I actually think that if we were still in the Premiership, players like Tuna would stand a much better chance of making the grade, if not with us then with someone else. Small lads like him frankly get man handled in this league, whereas skilful players like him are more likely to impress in the Premiership. It would also help with loaning him out, because clubs are far more likely to take a Premiership young pro instead of a League One young pro. Scotty Parker went to Norwich in the league below and it made him as a player, Tamer needs a similar experience. Unfortunately I think that circumstances dictate that he won't get it.....
In the lower leagues, a month just is not long enough for a young player to make much of an impact. They are only likely to be involved in 3-4 games and a couple of these may be sub appearances. With winter here and the likelihood of postponements, players like Tuna/Mambo and even Davisson and Perkins would surely benefit from a longer period away from Charlton. None of them are quite ready for the first team and even if there are injuries we are far more likely to go down the loan route and there is only so much impact a player can have in training.
I appreciate it is difficult for Tamer and Charlton to accomadate his inexperience, and rawness, but it would be rash to write off talented footballers especially if they really have not had a fair run in the side.
I am sure Tamer would relish going to a club and having a loan spell but would expect to play. If he is anything like his brother, he will want to!. Tamer was always up for a game, I remember training at Hall place on Boxing day morning in the snow years ago with lads a couple of years older, he expected no quater we gave him none!. He got his payback a couple of years ago when I played in goal, being the old man that I am, and picking the ball out of the net! on several occassions.
What I was going to say. Same goes for Solly.
Tuna is 18 months younger than Wagstaff so he still has time to develop.
Will he make it? I don't know but writing him off so early is pointless.
Have doubts, that's fine, but you can't completely write any of them off. They've won pro contracts for a reason.
Sometimes players just suddenly push on, or do well in the first team despite not standing out in the reserves or out on loan.
Watford have a young striker, Marvin Sordell who has scored 7 goals this season. Yet last season he went to Tranmere and only scored once.
The difference a year or two makes.
Tuna, like Waggy even now, is still developing physically so don't disregard him just yet.
Don't forget Stav had a lot of games in the Conference last season with Ebbsfleet so is a "known quantity" at that level.
That young lad who scored a brace for Tranmere on the weekend was born in December 1992 - more than a year younger than Tuna!
I'm not making any specific point here other than born in 19 chuffin' 92 - jeez i am getting old
And i thought you were going to crawl back under your rock