[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]Heard that one too many times this season.
Yes, but it's still true isn't it?
I'm not saying we were good enough, I was disagreeing with uncle that we "should have smashed Exeter out of sight". It's not realistic at all to expect that.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]alright, truthfully, I dont think were going up, but you never know... and we have been unlucky weve needed a striker all yr and we havnt got it....
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.
Poor management by parkison and the board post curbs but the players also have to take responsibility.
As ive said on another thread ive been vocally pessimistic all season and stand by my views but over 3 games if we can avoid the mental stumbling block of millwall i reckon we can beat any of the others over 3 games.
The players will now know we have 2 and hopefully 3 games to turn the season around regardless even of what happens next saturday and hopefully they can use that to turn it around.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]alright, truthfully, I dont think were going up, but you never know... and we have been unlucky weve needed a striker all yr and we havnt got it....
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.
I dont think many would get in a championship side...
Then we are an average Leaque 1 side, and I just can't get my head around that. I keep thinking that we do have the quality and experience, which is why I can't help but blame Parky.
[quote][cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]alright, truthfully, I dont think were going up, but you never know... and we have been unlucky weve needed a striker all yr and we havnt got it....
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....[/quote]
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.[/quote]
Nothing wrong with this squad of players especially with Forster, Reid and Borrowdale added in recent weeks. The problem is negative tactics and poor team selection. Shelvey, Wagstaff and Reid should all have played a much bigger part. Pace, skill and vision has been lacking. It's not surprising that we can't score goals.
If we get to Wembley on that big pitch Reid has to start. He is one of only a few regular scorers in the last few months and his pace would stretch the oppo
[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.
Like who? Squad players at best most of them.
Goalkeepers - nothing special above this level. We can't judge Randolph properly yet.
Defenders - Well most of them we signed last summer, and not early on. If they were that good, wouldn't Championship sides have been after them? Squad players at best or regulars in clubs fighting relegation.
Midfielders - There are several midfielders at a similar level to them in the top 8 of this league. Shelvey one day yes. Semedo probably yeah. Bailey when he's on form and scoring goals.
Wingers - None of them, all too inconsistent to keep a place, they'd all be squad players at best.
Strikers - I don't need to explain do I? Burton only possibility at a lower Championship side.
[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.
Like who? Squad players at best most of them.
Goalkeepers - nothing special above this level. We can't judge Randolph properly yet.
Defenders - Well most of them we signed last summer, and not early on. If they were that good, wouldn't Championship sides have been after them? Squad players at best or regulars in clubs fighting relegation.
Midfielders - There are several midfielders at a similar level to them in the top 8 of this league. Shelvey one day yes. Semedo probably yeah. Bailey when he's on form and scoring goals.
Wingers - None of them, all too inconsistent to keep a place, they'd all be squad players at best.
Strikers - I don't need to explain do I? Burton only possibility at a lower Championship side.
Not sure why people are talking about the mass exodus then as most of those players should be still here next season. Can only see Southampton as the biggest threat, assuming of course we miss promotion.
[quote][cite]Posted By: RodneyCharltonTrotta[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]alright, truthfully, I dont think were going up, but you never know... and we have been unlucky weve needed a striker all yr and we havnt got it....
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....[/quote]
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.[/quote]
Poor management by parkison and the board post curbs but the players also have to take responsibility.
As ive said on another thread ive been vocally pessimistic all season and stand by my views but over 3 games if we can avoid the mental stumbling block of millwall i reckon we can beat any of the others over 3 games.
The players will now know we have 2 and hopefully 3 games to turn the season around regardless even of what happens next saturday and hopefully they can use that to turn it around.[/quote]
Vocally pessimistic...
i thought wed finish 11 th odd this year with the way we collapsed, personally I think Parkey has done a very good job turning the club around from a full valley all booing the entire team against sheff utd, a team that were getting thumped all over the place and finished firmly bottom, and the first few games we showed signs of that fear factor...
he sorted out the dressing room and got us playing some great stuff and yes we have stuttered for most of the season... but he has got us here on zero money to spend...
everyone else can blame him and feel free, but I think he has done well, and taken a club from free fall to a chance, a chance as good as any in the playoffs... we dont have a striker and that was proved again by forster missing a couple today.. but i think the want form the players is there, we kept going and going and going against norwich and exeter...
and that may be the smae in the play offs we may be missing that little bit of quality, and ok so we sell the players of value and keep going, we dont have a right to have a good team... I think this team has worked very hard in the last two games and deserves some respect and I think parkinson deserves respect too... just my opinion, over thwe last couple of yrs weve sold everyone of any quality, we are relying on 35 yr old players who hey day has long long since gone, bailey our star player came from this league and has played most of his football here, burton well ols, richardson old, semedo has been great, racon hot and cold and mostly cold... we arent that good, thats why i think we have done well... just my opinion...
[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]Heard that one too many times this season.
Yes, but it's still true isn't it?
I'm not saying we were good enough, I was disagreeing with uncle that we "should have smashed Exeter out of sight". It's not realistic at all to expect that.
Actually its realistic to expect it. Whether it happens or not is another matter but it is realistic to expect that from a top team against a bottom team. The problem is no one does expect it Fans Players or Manger and thats where the problem lies, no belief. Do you think Man u dont think they are going to smash hull out of sight? Yes they do it's not about if they do or not its about the belief the mindset of the manager and the players. So yes its very realistic to think so
yes Im a bit pissed and the typings poor as its 242 am here...
Ive actually enjoyed this season more that the last few as at least weve had some wins, and some goals and some flippin joy, ive had loads of sundays where ive been able to dream of it turning for us, and that dream is still alive...
Yes it's all very well saying we have the players good enough, but when you look at how games are going recently you can't fault our tactics at all. It's not negative, we're creating more chances than the opposition and over the past 4 games could've come away with 12 points rather than 4.
To me, it shows the tactics are not the problem, but the players not being good enough to be able to finish every chance we make.
It all points to the fact that we are a League 1 team with a League 1 squad. I would've taken play-offs at the start of the season, so let's go into them confident. As others have said, our fate is still completely in our hands, we just have to do it the difficult way. Isn't that what Charlton are about?
Mascot the pro-anti parkison debate has gone on all season afte and will probably continue long into next regardless of where we are at but it is actually irrelevant going into the playoffs.
3 games for the players to step up and prove the doubters like myself wrong. They can do it and hopefully we will.
the gulf between man U and Hull is alot alot alot larger than the gulf between charlton and exeter.... our players arent very good ... thats the problem...
What I do want now, is to finish 3rd or 4th, having the second leg at home is a massive advantage, so beat Leeds, get a result at Oldham, and hopefully go do the business at Wembley.
[cite]Posted By: uncle[/cite]Do you think Man u dont think they are going to smash hull out of sight? Yes they do it's not about if they do or not its about the belief the mindset of the manager and the players. So yes its very realistic to think so
Problem with that argument is that the lower you go down the leagues, the tighter it is.
For example Gillingham & Exeter are fighting relegation, yet can beat anyone at home with a couple of fantastic home records. Would you say the same is true of Hull or Burnley?
[cite]Posted By: Jayajosh[/cite]Heard that one too many times this season.
Yes, but it's still true isn't it?
I'm not saying we were good enough, I was disagreeing with uncle that we "should have smashed Exeter out of sight". It's not realistic at all to expect that.
Actually its realistic to expect it. Whether it happens or not is another matter but it is realistic to expect that from a top team against a bottom team. The problem is no one does expect it Fans Players or Manger and thats where the problem lies, no belief. Do you think Man u dont think they are going to smash hull out of sight? Yes they do it's not about if they do or not its about the belief the mindset of the manager and the players. So yes its very realistic to think so
If you had said win the game, that would be fair enough. Some players thought we'd destroy Northwich just by turning up, look where that got us.
On our day we might thrash them but there simply isn't such a gap in quality that we should expect it away from home when it's just as big a game for them.
the gulf between man U and Hull is alot alot alot larger than the gulf between charlton and exeter.... our players arent very good ... thats the problem...[/quote]
At Div 1 level no one realistically expects the players to be international world beaters, but we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter
[cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]At Div 1 level no one realistically expects the players to be international world beaters, but we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter
And at this level where it can be so tight, Exeter will have had the drive and commitment to feel they can nick all three points. It's not like they had nothing to play for themselves.
Totally agree with everything Mascot88 has said on this thread.
I am disappointed with finishing in the Playoffs considering the start we had, but I would have taken this at the start of the season. The fact is our squad is not one of the best two in the division, Parky has done well to get us in the top 6 and challenge for the auto's this far into the season with no money to spend compared to Leeds, Norwich, Colchester, Huddersfield and Southampton. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that something we used to praise Curbs for?
There's not many of us would have disagreed with the first XI today, with the possible exception of Bailey and his fitness.
Anyone have think we'd been relegated today. We are in the Playoffs and can still get promoted - I fancy us to at least get to the final and genuinely believe we're going go up.
[cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]ut we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter
We are playing commitment and drive though aren't we? So do the other clubs we play.
Flip the question around, if we somehow do get promoted, will everyone accept a hard working performance in which we are thrashed by Portsmouth, Burnley or Hull at home?
[cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]ut we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter
We are playing commitment and drive though aren't we? So do the other clubs we play.
Flip the question around, if we somehow do get promoted, will everyone accept a hard working performance in which we are thrashed by Portsmouth, Burnley or Hull at home?
I would. Want to get out of this financially- sapping league as soon as possible and would happily see us in a few gutsy successful relegation battles for the next few seasons while we stabilise as would rather do that in the Championship where we would be a lot less economically unstable.
[quote][cite]Posted By: Scoham[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: Kap10[/cite]ut we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter[/quote] We are playing commitment and drive though aren't we? So do the other clubs we play.
Flip the question around, if we somehow do get promoted, will everyone accept a hard working performance in which we are thrashed by Portsmouth, Burnley or Hull at home?[/quote]
If we go up, then that may be what we have to expect next season,without investment in the team.
i thought wed finish 11 th odd this year with the way we collapsed, personally I think Parkey has done a very good job turning the club around from a full valley all booing the entire team against sheff utd, a team that were getting thumped all over the place and finished firmly bottom, and the first few games we showed signs of that fear factor...
he sorted out the dressing room and got us playing some great stuff and yes we have stuttered for most of the season... but he has got us here on zero money to spend...
everyone else can blame him and feel free, but I think he has done well, and taken a club from free fall to a chance, a chance as good as any in the playoffs... we dont have a striker and that was proved again by forster missing a couple today.. but i think the want form the players is there, we kept going and going and going against norwich and exeter...
and that may be the smae in the play offs we may be missing that little bit of quality, and ok so we sell the players of value and keep going, we dont have a right to have a good team... I think this team has worked very hard in the last two games and deserves some respect and I think parkinson deserves respect too... just my opinion, over thwe last couple of yrs weve sold everyone of any quality, we are relying on 35 yr old players who hey day has long long since gone, bailey our star player came from this league and has played most of his football here, burton well ols, richardson old, semedo has been great, racon hot and cold and mostly cold... we arent that good, thats why i think we have done well... just my opinion...
I make you pretty much spot on, Mascot.
We have a realistic chance of making it via the play-offs.
If we make it, I defy anyone to say it was achieved through poor management.
If we don't he still has my backing for now.
Comments
I'm not saying we were good enough, I was disagreeing with uncle that we "should have smashed Exeter out of sight". It's not realistic at all to expect that.
Poor management by parkison and the board post curbs but the players also have to take responsibility.
As ive said on another thread ive been vocally pessimistic all season and stand by my views but over 3 games if we can avoid the mental stumbling block of millwall i reckon we can beat any of the others over 3 games.
The players will now know we have 2 and hopefully 3 games to turn the season around regardless even of what happens next saturday and hopefully they can use that to turn it around.
Then we are an average Leaque 1 side, and I just can't get my head around that. I keep thinking that we do have the quality and experience, which is why I can't help but blame Parky.
Playoffs, in our own hands... 3 wins and were in ...... first sniff of success for yrs...
Feeling good now, can we get Smithy in for the playoffs?
Can we focus on that getting to the National Stadium now?
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....[/quote]
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.[/quote]
Nothing wrong with this squad of players especially with Forster, Reid and Borrowdale added in recent weeks. The problem is negative tactics and poor team selection. Shelvey, Wagstaff and Reid should all have played a much bigger part. Pace, skill and vision has been lacking. It's not surprising that we can't score goals.
Goalkeepers - nothing special above this level. We can't judge Randolph properly yet.
Defenders - Well most of them we signed last summer, and not early on. If they were that good, wouldn't Championship sides have been after them? Squad players at best or regulars in clubs fighting relegation.
Midfielders - There are several midfielders at a similar level to them in the top 8 of this league. Shelvey one day yes. Semedo probably yeah. Bailey when he's on form and scoring goals.
Wingers - None of them, all too inconsistent to keep a place, they'd all be squad players at best.
Strikers - I don't need to explain do I? Burton only possibility at a lower Championship side.
Not sure why people are talking about the mass exodus then as most of those players should be still here next season. Can only see Southampton as the biggest threat, assuming of course we miss promotion.
maybe Im just a bit sick of the negativity, does my head in...
we arent a very good team, we havnt got particularly good players.... and I beleive that those limited players have given everything in the last couple of games ... and I think that deserves support...
So im supporting them....[/quote]
That begs the question, how many of our players would actually get in a Championship side...I think quite a number of them. Poor management has let us down this season in my opinion.[/quote]
Poor management by parkison and the board post curbs but the players also have to take responsibility.
As ive said on another thread ive been vocally pessimistic all season and stand by my views but over 3 games if we can avoid the mental stumbling block of millwall i reckon we can beat any of the others over 3 games.
The players will now know we have 2 and hopefully 3 games to turn the season around regardless even of what happens next saturday and hopefully they can use that to turn it around.[/quote]
Vocally pessimistic...
i thought wed finish 11 th odd this year with the way we collapsed, personally I think Parkey has done a very good job turning the club around from a full valley all booing the entire team against sheff utd, a team that were getting thumped all over the place and finished firmly bottom, and the first few games we showed signs of that fear factor...
he sorted out the dressing room and got us playing some great stuff and yes we have stuttered for most of the season... but he has got us here on zero money to spend...
everyone else can blame him and feel free, but I think he has done well, and taken a club from free fall to a chance, a chance as good as any in the playoffs... we dont have a striker and that was proved again by forster missing a couple today.. but i think the want form the players is there, we kept going and going and going against norwich and exeter...
and that may be the smae in the play offs we may be missing that little bit of quality, and ok so we sell the players of value and keep going, we dont have a right to have a good team... I think this team has worked very hard in the last two games and deserves some respect and I think parkinson deserves respect too... just my opinion, over thwe last couple of yrs weve sold everyone of any quality, we are relying on 35 yr old players who hey day has long long since gone, bailey our star player came from this league and has played most of his football here, burton well ols, richardson old, semedo has been great, racon hot and cold and mostly cold... we arent that good, thats why i think we have done well... just my opinion...
Actually its realistic to expect it. Whether it happens or not is another matter but it is realistic to expect that from a top team against a bottom team. The problem is no one does expect it Fans Players or Manger and thats where the problem lies, no belief. Do you think Man u dont think they are going to smash hull out of sight? Yes they do it's not about if they do or not its about the belief the mindset of the manager and the players. So yes its very realistic to think so
Ive actually enjoyed this season more that the last few as at least weve had some wins, and some goals and some flippin joy, ive had loads of sundays where ive been able to dream of it turning for us, and that dream is still alive...
To me, it shows the tactics are not the problem, but the players not being good enough to be able to finish every chance we make.
It all points to the fact that we are a League 1 team with a League 1 squad. I would've taken play-offs at the start of the season, so let's go into them confident. As others have said, our fate is still completely in our hands, we just have to do it the difficult way. Isn't that what Charlton are about?
3 games for the players to step up and prove the doubters like myself wrong. They can do it and hopefully we will.
the gulf between man U and Hull is alot alot alot larger than the gulf between charlton and exeter.... our players arent very good ... thats the problem...
Oddly, Leeds in the final won't be a bad thing
Problem with that argument is that the lower you go down the leagues, the tighter it is.
For example Gillingham & Exeter are fighting relegation, yet can beat anyone at home with a couple of fantastic home records. Would you say the same is true of Hull or Burnley?
On our day we might thrash them but there simply isn't such a gap in quality that we should expect it away from home when it's just as big a game for them.
the gulf between man U and Hull is alot alot alot larger than the gulf between charlton and exeter.... our players arent very good ... thats the problem...[/quote]
At Div 1 level no one realistically expects the players to be international world beaters, but we do expect them to have commitment and drive and belief and that is what will create the ability to hammer teams like exeter
And at this level where it can be so tight, Exeter will have had the drive and commitment to feel they can nick all three points. It's not like they had nothing to play for themselves.
I am disappointed with finishing in the Playoffs considering the start we had, but I would have taken this at the start of the season. The fact is our squad is not one of the best two in the division, Parky has done well to get us in the top 6 and challenge for the auto's this far into the season with no money to spend compared to Leeds, Norwich, Colchester, Huddersfield and Southampton. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that something we used to praise Curbs for?
There's not many of us would have disagreed with the first XI today, with the possible exception of Bailey and his fitness.
Anyone have think we'd been relegated today. We are in the Playoffs and can still get promoted - I fancy us to at least get to the final and genuinely believe we're going go up.
again, not top 10 side have beaten , let alone hammer exeter at home this season......
and they had commitment and drive and belief... as they did against norwich, where they didnt give up for even a minute...
Flip the question around, if we somehow do get promoted, will everyone accept a hard working performance in which we are thrashed by Portsmouth, Burnley or Hull at home?
I would. Want to get out of this financially- sapping league as soon as possible and would happily see us in a few gutsy successful relegation battles for the next few seasons while we stabilise as would rather do that in the Championship where we would be a lot less economically unstable.
We are playing commitment and drive though aren't we? So do the other clubs we play.
Flip the question around, if we somehow do get promoted, will everyone accept a hard working performance in which we are thrashed by Portsmouth, Burnley or Hull at home?[/quote]
If we go up, then that may be what we have to expect next season,without investment in the team.
I make you pretty much spot on, Mascot.
We have a realistic chance of making it via the play-offs.
If we make it, I defy anyone to say it was achieved through poor management.
If we don't he still has my backing for now.