[cite]Posted By: Chizz[/cite]So, the original question still stands: What could he - or anyone else - have done better over the Summer?
Nothing, the club is frozen until a takeover does or does not happen. We don't know who we can afford to keep, what we can offer out of contract players and who we can sign. Whoever was manager would have both hands tied at the moment.
OK, thanks. So that's conclusive then. We have the best manager for the job right now!
I didn't say that. What manager is going to come in when the club's ownership and structure is so up in the air. How can the current board offer the job to someone else when they may not own it tomorrow.
Well the takeover has only been in public knowledge for a week which points to the fact that if the board have known about it since the end of last season then why havent even hinted that its been on the cards. Any sensible company taking over would look at the management in place and judge them on results so if they dont deem parkinsons results last to be up to scratch then hell be off, if they do then hes got a job. Surely the current board know that his results werent up to scratch and hes not the man to take us back up the league so why hold on to him.
The players and the managers got us relegated and that has hit us financially. Not got any vitriol towards any of them but at the same time do not think he is the messiah and although not a very naughty boy he wont lead us to the title. If he does ill be over the moon and ill offer to wash the guys car and mow his lawn every week the following summer but it aint gonna happen.
I usually avoid commenting on Parky but this question required no interpretation.
Is Parky doing a good job? Who can tell at the moment. The Welling game is not the best way to judge the rest of the season.
Has Parky done a good job? No, check the results. I don't know about his motivational skills or his ability to bring in fresh talent. I do know his results on the field prove he did not do a good job for us last season.
Roll on the new season and good riddance to the last.
what an interesting debate. Multitude of views covered, and to be honest most people have given excellent reasoning for their stance. I find it very hard ready to not agree with someone who is holding an opposite stance to me !
Well the takeover has only been in public knowledge for a week which points to the fact that if the board have known about it since the end of last season then why havent even hinted that its been on the cards. Any sensible company taking over would look at the management in place and judge them on results so if they dont deem parkinsons results last to be up to scratch then hell be off, if they do then hes got a job. Surely the current board know that his results werent up to scratch and hes not the man to take us back up the league so why hold on to him.
Isn't that a bit like looking at buying a new house, having a survey done and then installing a new kitchen before you've completed on the property. You might have an idea what kitchen you want but you're not install it yet, it's not your place. Like wise if you're the seller you're not going to invest the money in a new one if it has no impact on the selling price. Either way he'll probably be gone, but until the ownership decisions are made he'll stay.
Well the takeover has only been in public knowledge for a week which points to the fact that if the board have known about it since the end of last season then why havent even hinted that its been on the cards. Any sensible company taking over would look at the management in place and judge them on results so if they dont deem parkinsons results last to be up to scratch then hell be off, if they do then hes got a job. Surely the current board know that his results werent up to scratch and hes not the man to take us back up the league so why hold on to him.
Isn't that a bit like looking at buying a new house, having a survey done and then installing a new kitchen before you've completed on the property. You might have an idea what kitchen you want but you're not install it yet, it's not your place. Like wise if you're the seller you're not going to invest the money in a new one if it has no impact on the selling price. Either way he'll probably be gone, but until the ownership decisions are made he'll stay.
Ha ha good analogy..personally id think this kitchen is bl00dy awful and Id better get rid off it other wise ill never flog this drum and cos of the damage its done its already knocked a good few grand off its value!
Well the takeover has only been in public knowledge for a week which points to the fact that if the board have known about it since the end of last season then why havent even hinted that its been on the cards. Any sensible company taking over would look at the management in place and judge them on results so if they dont deem parkinsons results last to be up to scratch then hell be off, if they do then hes got a job. Surely the current board know that his results werent up to scratch and hes not the man to take us back up the league so why hold on to him.
Isn't that a bit like looking at buying a new house, having a survey done and then installing a new kitchen before you've completed on the property. You might have an idea what kitchen you want but you're not install it yet, it's not your place. Like wise if you're the seller you're not going to invest the money in a new one if it has no impact on the selling price. Either way he'll probably be gone, but until the ownership decisions are made he'll stay.
Ha ha good analogy..personally id think this kitchen is bl00dy awful and Id better get rid off it other wise ill never flog this drum and cos of the damage its done its already knocked a good few grand off its value!
I presume all the people on here that are saying Parky should resign if he has any self respect, as he can obviously get another job, will all be resigning today.
[cite]Posted By: Covered End[/cite]I presume all the people on here that are saying Parky should resign if he has any self respect, as he can obviously get another job, will all be resigning today.
Tell me where the leaving do is :-)
I won't be resigning. I do a decent job and have performed well so there is no need for me to resign, quite the opposite, I await my annual raise as we speak.
Parky on the other hand .........
[cite]Posted By: Covered End[/cite]I presume all the people on here that are saying Parky should resign if he has any self respect, as he can obviously get another job, will all be resigning today.
Tell me where the leaving do is :-)
I won't be resigning. I do a decent job and have performed well so there is no need for me to resign, quite the opposite, I await my annual raise as we speak.
Parky on the other hand .........
What if you hadn't done a decent job this year, would you quit or wait for your redundancy cheque?
But the initial question was is he doing a good job since the Norwich game !!! Not since he's taken over ... Thats a whole different question . I believe under the circumstances he is doing a very ok job a club that doesn't know where its going. He is (and yes it is somewhat down to him) doing a good job at assuring players that their futures do not lie best somewhere else... That at this point of the season is about all he can do
i think our pre-season has gone pretty well all things considered. no-one has left i wasn't expecting and we've made some money. we've made two promising signings (they're not exciting but they're realistic for our level and FREE!) and the manager is talking about bringing in more players.
all of this is done during a time where the takeover stuff means we don't know where we're heading and what funds we'll have available. Parky's future has been well up for debate since southampton but he's just worked hard and got on with it from what i can see. he's even working with an assistant manager who doesn't seem to have a contract!
i don't think he's sitting around waiting for a payoff, i think he's out there trying to prove he's the right man for this job because he wants to keep it. He knows his reputation has suffered big time and wants to show he has what it takes to be a football manager. THAT takes pride and self-belief, just quitting doesn't.
[cite]Posted By: Nug[/cite] Like I said I think the club probably needs a new manager, but I for one will not vilify Parky for where we are.
There is no reason to vilify Parky, which puts him in a different category than Dowie and Pardont.
But he should not have been given the job after his caretaker trial had concluded nor kept on after being incharge during the worst spell in club history.
He would have left on his own, if he felt he could duplicate his salary in another job somewhere else. I don't blame him for looking out for his family first.
But ask yourself this: can he inspire players when he has allowed himself to stay in a position where he receives no support from fans or the board, and is left twisting in the wind?
But ask yourself this: can he inspire players when he has allowed himself to stay in a position where he receives no support from fans or the board, and is left twisting in the wind?
While the club are in limbo with stuff apparently happening behind the scenes, it does seem that Parky is again caretaking.
We'll find out for sure in a week or 2, I expect.
[cite aria-level=0 aria-posinset=0 aria-setsize=0]Posted By: BBClaus[/cite]i think he's out there trying to prove he's the right man for this job because he wants to keep it.
That, in my opinion, is the key, crucial, vital ingredient. He[b aria-level=0 aria-posinset=0 aria-setsize=0]wants[/b]to be manager of Charlton. And that counts for a lot.
He wants to be manager of Charlton because no one else wants him to be their manager.
And there are probably several thousand season ticket holders that would like to be the manager. At least on match days! ;-)
So when did wanting to be manager of Charlton become a qualification?
If the job opened up, anyone that applied would already have that qualification.
[cite]Posted By: BBClaus[/cite]i think he's out there trying to prove he's the right man for this job because he wants to keep it.
That, in my opinion, is the key, crucial, vital ingredient. Hewantsto be manager of Charlton. And that counts for a lot.
He wants to be manager of Charlton because no one else wants him to be their manager.
And there are probably several thousand season ticket holders that would like to be the manager. At least on match days! ;-)
So when didwantingto be manager of Charlton become a qualification?
If the job opened up, anyone that applied would already have that qualification.
Who, in their right mind, right now, would apply?
My point is that, in the position we're in, he's doing an "ok" job, he wants the job (which surely has to be an advantage) and there's no-one else we could afford, we would want and who would want the job.
[quote][cite]Nothing, the club is frozen until a takeover does or does not happen. We don't know who we can afford to keep, what we can offer out of contract players and who we can sign. Whoever was manager would have both hands tied at the moment.[/cite][/quote]
I can't understand his statement that his hands are tied - he has just signed two players. I wonder how many more he wants to bring in, he has now signed four - if he is not happy with a large portion of the squad, we are going to struggle to have a settled side before Wycombe.
[cite]Nothing, the club is frozen until a takeover does or does not happen. We don't know who we can afford to keep, what we can offer out of contract players and who we can sign. Whoever was manager would have both hands tied at the moment.[/cite]
I can't understand his statement that his hands are tied - he has just signed two players. I wonder how many more he wants to bring in, he has now signed four - if he is not happy with a large portion of the squad, we are going to struggle to have a settled side before Wycombe.
That's true but we sold a centre-half for £1M and brought one n for nothing on a lot less money, no brainer really, and brought in a relatively experienced RB again for nothing in a position we are light on if true Moo2 isn't wanted by the club. I suppose even though the board are hoping to sell, they still have to do the minimums. But he hasn't spent any money yet this pre-season.
he's a little more qualified than you, i'm assuming large.
But there is a comparison. if you were charlton manager you would work bloody hard and give your all to the cause, right? because you would desperately want to do a good job. well that is parky's position too, and that's why it counts for something. in the same way managers talk about signing young, hungry players with something to prove, we have that with parky.
But the initial question was is he doing a good job since the Norwich game !!! Not since he's taken over ... Thats a whole different question . I believe under the circumstances he is doing a very ok job a club that doesn't know where its going. He is (and yes it is somewhat down to him) doing a good job at assuring players that their futures do not lie best somewhere else... That at this point of the season is about all he can do[/cite]
To be fair, you're 100% right, I didn't stick to the brief.
I would say though the question is a bit like saying after the point that he crashed the unsinkable boat into the iceberg the captain of the Titanic did a grand old job, sounding the siren, getting people into the lifeboats. It's taking a snapshot in which there's very little scope for further fork ups. So, if you look at that period I'd say relatively good. There are a couple of players who I think history will should have hung onto that might have stayed had there been a new broom, but he appears to have got Kins back and there doesn't seem a clamour to the door (yet) from the more desireable members of the squad (which suggests he has something about him). So, having taken us to the bottom of the Championship, he's done a pretty reasonable job from a horrible position.
I like the Titanic analogy but I would say that rather Parky took over when the Previous captain shouted "F****ing great big iceberg" and was then pushed over board.
He didn't do enough to avoid the disaster but the ship was already well on a collison course. Since then he does seem to be steadying the ship well (or he would have if it hadn't already sunk but you know what I mean).
I like him, I think he could still do a job for us, Uncle implies (or at least I infer) that some of the saleable players like him and want to stay partly for that reason.
But I can also see why having a whole new coaching setting up (so bye-bye Kins as well) could bring a much needed fresh start.
If we do ever get taken over then do we need to review ALL our working practices and operations. Not "getting the old Charlton back" but starting again from a blank piece of paper and seeing what is needed.
[cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]But I can also see why having a whole new coaching setting up (so bye-bye Kins as well) could bring a much needed fresh start.
If we do ever get taken over then do we need to review ALL our working practices and operations. Not "getting the old Charlton back" but starting again from a blank piece of paper and seeing what is needed.
If ever a club needed a fresh start across the board, it is this one, at this time.
[cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]But I can also see why having a whole new coaching setting up (so bye-bye Kins as well) could bring a much needed fresh start.
Do you think we would be lucky enough to have a fresh start as good as it was in the old days, when we appointed Iain Dowie? Or Les Reed? Or would it be likely to be more like the more-recent fresh starts we've had under Alan Pardew and Phil Parkinson?
Or, (just for the sake of it) is it worth considering that stability might be better than a clear-out?
I cannot be bothered to read all 86 posts on this Thread but the title of the thread seems a fairly simple one. A manager is judged on results, his make him possibly the worst Manager in Charlton's recent History & my entire Charlton watching history. So the answer to the question is No in my opinion.
yep, a new Board, a new head broom, a clean sweep and a review of the whole Club, top to bottom. Appears to be what the Saints are doing. Incidentally, two days after being taken over they have announced much reduced season ticket prices, £270 tops, and if you go down today and renew you actually walk away with your season ticket book. How come we always get ours sent out a few days before the start of a season (not a whinge, an observation).
Comments
Well the takeover has only been in public knowledge for a week which points to the fact that if the board have known about it since the end of last season then why havent even hinted that its been on the cards. Any sensible company taking over would look at the management in place and judge them on results so if they dont deem parkinsons results last to be up to scratch then hell be off, if they do then hes got a job. Surely the current board know that his results werent up to scratch and hes not the man to take us back up the league so why hold on to him.
Is Parky doing a good job? Who can tell at the moment. The Welling game is not the best way to judge the rest of the season.
Has Parky done a good job? No, check the results. I don't know about his motivational skills or his ability to bring in fresh talent. I do know his results on the field prove he did not do a good job for us last season.
Roll on the new season and good riddance to the last.
Isn't that a bit like looking at buying a new house, having a survey done and then installing a new kitchen before you've completed on the property. You might have an idea what kitchen you want but you're not install it yet, it's not your place. Like wise if you're the seller you're not going to invest the money in a new one if it has no impact on the selling price. Either way he'll probably be gone, but until the ownership decisions are made he'll stay.
Ha ha good analogy..personally id think this kitchen is bl00dy awful and Id better get rid off it other wise ill never flog this drum and cos of the damage its done its already knocked a good few grand off its value!
You're probably right!
Tell me where the leaving do is :-)
I won't be resigning. I do a decent job and have performed well so there is no need for me to resign, quite the opposite, I await my annual raise as we speak.
Parky on the other hand .........
What if you hadn't done a decent job this year, would you quit or wait for your redundancy cheque?
But the initial question was is he doing a good job since the Norwich game !!! Not since he's taken over ... Thats a whole different question . I believe under the circumstances he is doing a very ok job a club that doesn't know where its going. He is (and yes it is somewhat down to him) doing a good job at assuring players that their futures do not lie best somewhere else... That at this point of the season is about all he can do
all of this is done during a time where the takeover stuff means we don't know where we're heading and what funds we'll have available. Parky's future has been well up for debate since southampton but he's just worked hard and got on with it from what i can see. he's even working with an assistant manager who doesn't seem to have a contract!
i don't think he's sitting around waiting for a payoff, i think he's out there trying to prove he's the right man for this job because he wants to keep it. He knows his reputation has suffered big time and wants to show he has what it takes to be a football manager. THAT takes pride and self-belief, just quitting doesn't.
There is no reason to vilify Parky, which puts him in a different category than Dowie and Pardont.
But he should not have been given the job after his caretaker trial had concluded nor kept on after being incharge during the worst spell in club history.
He would have left on his own, if he felt he could duplicate his salary in another job somewhere else. I don't blame him for looking out for his family first.
But ask yourself this: can he inspire players when he has allowed himself to stay in a position where he receives no support from fans or the board, and is left twisting in the wind?
While the club are in limbo with stuff apparently happening behind the scenes, it does seem that Parky is again caretaking.
We'll find out for sure in a week or 2, I expect.
He wants to be manager of Charlton because no one else wants him to be their manager.
And there are probably several thousand season ticket holders that would like to be the manager. At least on match days! ;-)
So when did wanting to be manager of Charlton become a qualification?
If the job opened up, anyone that applied would already have that qualification.
My point is that, in the position we're in, he's doing an "ok" job, he wants the job (which surely has to be an advantage) and there's no-one else we could afford, we would want and who would want the job.
I can't understand his statement that his hands are tied - he has just signed two players. I wonder how many more he wants to bring in, he has now signed four - if he is not happy with a large portion of the squad, we are going to struggle to have a settled side before Wycombe.
That's true but we sold a centre-half for £1M and brought one n for nothing on a lot less money, no brainer really, and brought in a relatively experienced RB again for nothing in a position we are light on if true Moo2 isn't wanted by the club. I suppose even though the board are hoping to sell, they still have to do the minimums. But he hasn't spent any money yet this pre-season.
I want to be Charlton manager and that counts for nothing
But there is a comparison. if you were charlton manager you would work bloody hard and give your all to the cause, right? because you would desperately want to do a good job. well that is parky's position too, and that's why it counts for something. in the same way managers talk about signing young, hungry players with something to prove, we have that with parky.
**cough colchester Cough**
To be fair, you're 100% right, I didn't stick to the brief.
I would say though the question is a bit like saying after the point that he crashed the unsinkable boat into the iceberg the captain of the Titanic did a grand old job, sounding the siren, getting people into the lifeboats. It's taking a snapshot in which there's very little scope for further fork ups. So, if you look at that period I'd say relatively good. There are a couple of players who I think history will should have hung onto that might have stayed had there been a new broom, but he appears to have got Kins back and there doesn't seem a clamour to the door (yet) from the more desireable members of the squad (which suggests he has something about him). So, having taken us to the bottom of the Championship, he's done a pretty reasonable job from a horrible position.
You can cough Colchester all you want. But Hull and Charlton have choked and gagged under his management.
He didn't do enough to avoid the disaster but the ship was already well on a collison course. Since then he does seem to be steadying the ship well (or he would have if it hadn't already sunk but you know what I mean).
I like him, I think he could still do a job for us, Uncle implies (or at least I infer) that some of the saleable players like him and want to stay partly for that reason.
But I can also see why having a whole new coaching setting up (so bye-bye Kins as well) could bring a much needed fresh start.
If we do ever get taken over then do we need to review ALL our working practices and operations. Not "getting the old Charlton back" but starting again from a blank piece of paper and seeing what is needed.
If ever a club needed a fresh start across the board, it is this one, at this time.
Or, (just for the sake of it) is it worth considering that stability might be better than a clear-out?
Total Number of Relegations from the CCC to League One
Large: Nil
Parky: One
On this basis, I'm not so sure...