I am going to say it!! Yes I am, Nathan Jones......................

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

Callumcafc said:

ElfsborgAddick said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

If we go up this season I'm going to bump the Crawley home post match thread.
That'll embarrass a few.

Not if I do it first!
****
I am sure you will.
Please do not think our view will be from the same angle.

cafc_se7 said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

But then to be fair mate, you could argue was NJ unlucky to lose LJ and he has also never really had a fit Miles Leaburn where other managers in the past have, who we have been comparing NJ to. That coupled in with our player of the season so far in Ramsay, being out for a large chunk of the season, who is absolutely paramount to the way Jones likes to set up a team (strong full backs)? Just before that, he also lost Josh Edward’s to bad injury. 

I am not defending the way he has come out shooting from the hip at the fans. That being said, I hope we can put it behind us now anyway  because we finally seem to have regained an identity and we look a very tough nut to crack! 

 

It will be very interesting to see how far we have come in recent weeks when we take on PNE.

Radostanradical said:

Smithy said:

Anything other than promotion is a failure for Charlton in League One, but throughout our terrible run I've been of the opinion that if we could see clear building blocks and an attempt to play in a certain way, it would be a lot easier to accept a disappointing league position. There have been signs of that over the last 4 games and if we maintain this style of play for the rest of the season I think most people would be confident of our chances next year. I do think we've left ourselves a bit too much to do this season though. 

Absolute nonsense, we have no god given right to success just like any other team in the world.

Wrexham, Birmingham, Bolton, Reading, Huddersfield could all equally say they are as big if not bigger than us as a club. Ultimately you finish where you belong. 

MuttleyCAFC said:

A few weeks ago I reached a point where I couldn't see how things would improve but they have improved. When things are improving, it seems to make sense to go with it and see where it takes you. I do look behind results and that is in terms of were we lucky or unlucky etc... I think overall our performances have been good enough to justify the results which is important in terms of sustainability. I was thinking Luton sacking their manager might be an opportunity, but now I see it as a potential problem. If Jones were to leave, I might put that down to him lacking confidence he has turned the corner though. He has said multiple times he is a builder, well if he is building something he needs to follow it through.

paulsturgess said:

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

The question is (and has always been), can we attract a better manager than Nathan Jones? I would say that we probably can’t. Even more so when we’ve started building a team he wants. It would have been a bad decision to sack him before but it would be a disaster to lose him now 

Mate calm yourself. We’ve managed 4 acceptable performances. And personally I wasn’t impressed by the Cambridge one. The overall picture is still that we’ve had a really poor season, are miles off the plays off in current and projected points, and in league position, and have a squad heavily populated by Jones-recruited duds. 

He is on no more than a 5/10 for this season so far (I would rate lower) , let’s hope he’s about to elevate that drastically and take us flying up the table with this new approach (enforced on him?) - but let’s not pretend he’s the proclaimed second coming. 

We’re 11th in league one.

Croydon said:

Garrymanilow said:

paulsturgess said:

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

The question is (and has always been), can we attract a better manager than Nathan Jones? I would say that we probably can’t. Even more so when we’ve started building a team he wants. It would have been a bad decision to sack him before but it would be a disaster to lose him now 

Mate calm yourself. We’ve managed 4 acceptable performances. And personally I wasn’t impressed by the Cambridge one. The overall picture is still that we’ve had a really poor season, are miles off the plays off in current and projected points, and in league position, and have a squad heavily populated by Jones-recruited duds. 

He is on no more than a 5/10 for this season so far (I would rate lower) , let’s hope he’s about to elevate that drastically and take us flying up the table with this new approach (enforced on him?) - but let’s not pretend he’s the proclaimed second coming. 

We’re 11th in league one.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think it would be a disaster if we lost him now. The squad is so very tailored to his way of playing and there's almost no-one else who sets up like he does. If he leaves tomorrow we need to get someone else in and we've already lost more than a week of the transfer window as it is. What do we do? Des Buckingham is unemployed but he often plays with wingers and we've barely got two of those so we'd have to rush out to get some in January while also completely overhauling the squad yet again to push out the big violent runners and bring in more technical players in a window that almost never represents value. Or we get someone in who plays more like Jones despite the fact it wasn't setting the league alight when Jones did it. Losing your manager mid-transfer window when he has a very particular and unusual set of demands for the players he wants is not a good thing. We sacked Appleton in this window last year and that's why we're now watching Jones trying to play with Gillesphey and REG in his squad because Scott and Apples decided we needed ball-playing centre halves. We'd have to decide if we're happy to completely write off this season and start planning the total rebuild in the summer with limited funds or we'd have to accept that for the foreseeable future we're playing aggressive, wingerless percentages football without the manager who has made a career of doing just that his way. I would not be excited about either of those concepts.

Disaster is well OTT.

Stig said:

NabySarr said:

Croydon said:

Garrymanilow said:

paulsturgess said:

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

The question is (and has always been), can we attract a better manager than Nathan Jones? I would say that we probably can’t. Even more so when we’ve started building a team he wants. It would have been a bad decision to sack him before but it would be a disaster to lose him now 

Mate calm yourself. We’ve managed 4 acceptable performances. And personally I wasn’t impressed by the Cambridge one. The overall picture is still that we’ve had a really poor season, are miles off the plays off in current and projected points, and in league position, and have a squad heavily populated by Jones-recruited duds. 

He is on no more than a 5/10 for this season so far (I would rate lower) , let’s hope he’s about to elevate that drastically and take us flying up the table with this new approach (enforced on him?) - but let’s not pretend he’s the proclaimed second coming. 

We’re 11th in league one.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think it would be a disaster if we lost him now. The squad is so very tailored to his way of playing and there's almost no-one else who sets up like he does. If he leaves tomorrow we need to get someone else in and we've already lost more than a week of the transfer window as it is. What do we do? Des Buckingham is unemployed but he often plays with wingers and we've barely got two of those so we'd have to rush out to get some in January while also completely overhauling the squad yet again to push out the big violent runners and bring in more technical players in a window that almost never represents value. Or we get someone in who plays more like Jones despite the fact it wasn't setting the league alight when Jones did it. Losing your manager mid-transfer window when he has a very particular and unusual set of demands for the players he wants is not a good thing. We sacked Appleton in this window last year and that's why we're now watching Jones trying to play with Gillesphey and REG in his squad because Scott and Apples decided we needed ball-playing centre halves. We'd have to decide if we're happy to completely write off this season and start planning the total rebuild in the summer with limited funds or we'd have to accept that for the foreseeable future we're playing aggressive, wingerless percentages football without the manager who has made a career of doing just that his way. I would not be excited about either of those concepts.

Disaster is well OTT.

I’d say guaranteeing another season in league 1 (tbf that’s likely anyway but this would properly rule out promotion) and more significantly making a lot of the work and progress made so far worthless and going back to square one (yet again!) is pretty disastrous 

Not really, because you need to consider the likelihood of us going up anyway. We've got a slim chance of going up but it's unlikely*. Losing Jones is therefore unlikely to impact our status next season. You can't really say that a personnel change that is more likely than not to have no impact on final results is a disaster. BTW, losing Jones does not actually guarantee anything other than that Jones will be elsewhere.


*You can currently get 33/1 on us getting promoted. Compare this with genuine promotion contenders, Birmingham 1/33. 

Stig said:

NabySarr said:

Croydon said:

Garrymanilow said:

paulsturgess said:

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

Tricky one, a few weeks ago I'd have loved Luton to come in for him, now, I'm not sure. 

Is Jones fortunate that Lloyd Jones and Miles have shown form, and any manager would be getting these results, or, has he changed us tactically. 

I think it's somewhere in between, I think he's massively benefited from having our good players available, just like a lot of old Charlton managers would have been.

I am still very confident a different manager wouldn't have overseen so many disappointing performances we witnessed in the last 2-3 months, but it's hard to deny the last 5 or so games have been very decent performances to watch.

The question is (and has always been), can we attract a better manager than Nathan Jones? I would say that we probably can’t. Even more so when we’ve started building a team he wants. It would have been a bad decision to sack him before but it would be a disaster to lose him now 

Mate calm yourself. We’ve managed 4 acceptable performances. And personally I wasn’t impressed by the Cambridge one. The overall picture is still that we’ve had a really poor season, are miles off the plays off in current and projected points, and in league position, and have a squad heavily populated by Jones-recruited duds. 

He is on no more than a 5/10 for this season so far (I would rate lower) , let’s hope he’s about to elevate that drastically and take us flying up the table with this new approach (enforced on him?) - but let’s not pretend he’s the proclaimed second coming. 

We’re 11th in league one.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think it would be a disaster if we lost him now. The squad is so very tailored to his way of playing and there's almost no-one else who sets up like he does. If he leaves tomorrow we need to get someone else in and we've already lost more than a week of the transfer window as it is. What do we do? Des Buckingham is unemployed but he often plays with wingers and we've barely got two of those so we'd have to rush out to get some in January while also completely overhauling the squad yet again to push out the big violent runners and bring in more technical players in a window that almost never represents value. Or we get someone in who plays more like Jones despite the fact it wasn't setting the league alight when Jones did it. Losing your manager mid-transfer window when he has a very particular and unusual set of demands for the players he wants is not a good thing. We sacked Appleton in this window last year and that's why we're now watching Jones trying to play with Gillesphey and REG in his squad because Scott and Apples decided we needed ball-playing centre halves. We'd have to decide if we're happy to completely write off this season and start planning the total rebuild in the summer with limited funds or we'd have to accept that for the foreseeable future we're playing aggressive, wingerless percentages football without the manager who has made a career of doing just that his way. I would not be excited about either of those concepts.

Disaster is well OTT.

I’d say guaranteeing another season in league 1 (tbf that’s likely anyway but this would properly rule out promotion) and more significantly making a lot of the work and progress made so far worthless and going back to square one (yet again!) is pretty disastrous 

Not really, because you need to consider the likelihood of us going up anyway. We've got a slim chance of going up but it's unlikely*. Losing Jones is therefore unlikely to impact our status next season. You can't really say that a personnel change that is more likely than not to have no impact on final results is a disaster. BTW, losing Jones does not actually guarantee anything other than that Jones will be elsewhere.


*You can currently get 33/1 on us getting promoted. Compare this with genuine promotion contenders, Birmingham 1/33. 

NabySarr said:

ElliotCAFC said:

I do find unfair that people blame Jones (quite rightly) for the team playing hoofball - but since we've adjusted tactically for the better, the same people are insinuating that he was forced to change by the SMT or some other tactical guru at the club.

Jones actually said at the time he didn’t want the players to go long as much and that wasn’t his instructions. He wanted them to be braver and try and play more. Lloyd Jones also said this was the case and that the manager wants them to play more 

I think there must have been some kind of adjustment to the plan, but I do think some of it was just our players panicking on the ball and going long. Before the Northampton game Docherty was saying that Jones had really been trying to “free them” or something like that, it seems to have worked and we are a lot more relaxed on the ball 

Exactly. It's no coincidence our overall play improved as key players returned to the team. While this doesn't excuse the earlier poor performances, the players must shoulder more responsibility.

With pace and width alongside a target man who can also run in behind, we can now stretch the pitch by going long. If teams press, we play over the top; if they don't, we play through them—unlike the aimless hit and hope balls to Ahadme.