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Birmingham v Charlton | Post-match thread | 15/07/2020
Comments
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I said this after either the late Hull defeat, or the late Bristol City one, it’s like the football gods have said “we gave you a blinder in May lads, now have this f***ers”ct_addick said:It does seem everything has gone against us and we seem destined to go down
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Obviously it was a different team at beginning of season, but the games we were winning back then were almost all with less than 50% possession.ForeverAddickted said:
I just think we do better against those sides who'll attack us more because of the space they leavecafcfan1990 said:
I admire your optimism but just can’t see it. They’ll beat us comfortably. This is Charlton though so we could easily beat Leeds and stay up.ForeverAddickted said:So the sole bit of positivity I can take from this:
Reading and Birmingham both knew that any result against us was a bonus (Reading were helped by being given an early lead) so sat back because they knew the result would mean safety...
These last two games have proven we cannot break teams down that sit back, we just dont have the playmaker to do it
Wigan on the other hand cannot do that on Saturday
They have to come to the Valley and win, failure to do so and they're all but down, we CAN exploit that if we're clever enough
Am convinced our defence wont capitulate in the same fashion as Hull did, its just about making sure we take our chances for once
If we want to get something from Wigan / Leeds then we have to keep the ball better
We had 62% against Reading and 64% tonight. Hopefully it will help us with Wigan and Leeds enjoying more of the ball.1 -
The thing is with three subs is that it completely disrupts any rythm you have.
It takes a while to get into things. The jobs that need doing get lost in the transition. Hence,we get caught cold....again.1 -
When you are defending at the death, you need the outlet of pace. Was a young lad like Doughty so finished he had to come off?1
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I love how Bonne has missed SITTERS. Absolute sitters!! that will cost us our division status. And yet we're supposed to be impressed because we signed him from non league. Ok then.4
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It's not all bad. We get to play Sunderland again. They must be even more upset than we are.4
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About where I am with it. ‘Bowyer’s shit’ and ‘Bowyer’s clueless’ is absolute bollocks, but I am starting to get fed up of defensive outlook and general retraction in our set up as games come to a conclusion.ValleyGary said:
Of course. But how many other managers change 40% of the outfield players within 6 mins of 13 mins to go?AFKABartram said:Can’t comment on the defensive tactics blaming in this, I didn’t watch it.
However, I do know it’s a massive frustration for every football fan when their side try to shut the game down when they are winning and then don’t achieve it. And I cannot think of a single team / manager that does not adopt this tactic when defending a slender lead in the last segment of the game. Can anyone?
I appreciate everyone is gutted when we lose and there will always be an element of blame emerge. But Bowyer is not a ‘shit manager’ for the games we don’t lose in extra time.
Given the amount of crap he’s dealt with and how he has everytime seemingly put our club first when he could easily have said f**k this, I’d love it if we could all be a bit more supportive and loyal. Just my opinion.Shutting a game down to me is bringing on an extra midfielder for a forward. Then maybe bring Swap a midfielder like for like with a couple mins to go to waste some time.Changing nearly half the side with 13 mins to go is mental to me.
Birmingham aren’t great and we were catching them on the break a bit after we scored.We lost all that ability to catch them on the break with those subs. I’m smarting that that’s the 7th time I’ve seen an injury time goal. That’s 1 pt thrown away against Millwall, Huddersfield, Bristol City, Sheff Wed, and 2pts thrown away against Hull and tonight. 8pts in total. I mean fair enough we got a point back at QPR, so let’s say 7. That would put us on 53pts. Maybe you say half of that is typical/average, so 3.5pts, would still put us on 50 pts now3 -
Bowyer should have known he was subbing on a slower player against a fast young player. Bowyer's fault not Pratley's.Leuth said:Pratley looked like an old man as Bellingham breezed past him to set up their goal. Field would not have been done so easily, even after 93 minutes of running0 -
I agree that subs changed the game, but it was Birmingham’s sub bringing Bellingham on, he changed the game for them, stopping our midfield and creating chances.I honestly don’t know what else Bowyer could do, if he leaves all the players on that people wanted him to we could easily have still conceded and they wouldn’t be fit for Wigan game.1
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Off_it said:
How the fuck have we "bottled it"? Please, tell me. Who didn't put in the required level of effort today? Who shirked challenges?cafcfan1990 said:
Sorry mate but don’t start digging people out for their views, especially in the midst of frustration at a goal which could relegate us.Off_it said:
Although this one is also "special"mid_life_crisis said:Without doubt, this lot are the biggest bunch of bottlers in the history of football.How anyone can say we haven’t bottled it at times this season is beyond me.
The simple fact is our squad just isn't good enough or strong enough for this league, not since we lost our two best players. If we stay up it will be a miracle. It was always going to be a miracle.
You can't say the players are shit on the one hand and then expect them not to make genuine mistakes. You can point at the manager, the substitutions, the referees, anything you like. But our squad is piss weak for this league and ultimately that's the real problem.
Spot on.
The players are giving everything for the shirt despite their shortcomings and the comedy club that we have become. We were inches away from going 2 nil up.3 - Sponsored links:
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Spot on. Very disappointing.carly burn said:The thing is with three subs is that it completely disrupts any rythm you have.
It takes a while to get into things. The jobs that need doing get lost in the transition. Hence,we get caught cold....again.Well lets hope leeds win by saturday, wigan a massive game now then Leeds to do bows a favour0 -
Yeah thats exactly where my mind is going...stoneroses19 said:
Obviously it was a different team at beginning of season, but the games we were winning back then were almost all with less than 50% possession.ForeverAddickted said:
I just think we do better against those sides who'll attack us more because of the space they leavecafcfan1990 said:
I admire your optimism but just can’t see it. They’ll beat us comfortably. This is Charlton though so we could easily beat Leeds and stay up.ForeverAddickted said:So the sole bit of positivity I can take from this:
Reading and Birmingham both knew that any result against us was a bonus (Reading were helped by being given an early lead) so sat back because they knew the result would mean safety...
These last two games have proven we cannot break teams down that sit back, we just dont have the playmaker to do it
Wigan on the other hand cannot do that on Saturday
They have to come to the Valley and win, failure to do so and they're all but down, we CAN exploit that if we're clever enough
Am convinced our defence wont capitulate in the same fashion as Hull did, its just about making sure we take our chances for once
If we want to get something from Wigan / Leeds then we have to keep the ball better
We had 62% against Reading and 64% tonight. Hopefully it will help us with Wigan and Leeds enjoying more of the ball.
Of course we dont WANT to let teams have more of the ball but when we do have more of the ball its because teams are having for us to try and break them down
Referee didnt help today or Saturday because whenever we got a free-kick it would result in just that with no advantage (when more often or not we'd have moved the ball on into a dangerous position) - Tonight especially it allowed the opposition to get the numbers back they needed and the chances were gone as the choice would be to play it back (which the fans dont like) or lump it forward (header clear by the Centre-Back), from Birmingham it was a lot more persistent and the referee basically let them get on with it all evening
My only worry about Saturday is Jamal Lowe, he's a nippy / problematic player (we saw that from the Portsmouth fixtures last year)
Wigan could be looking at the gaps we've been leaving these last two games and could go into Saturday thinking: "Right, we'll let Charlton have the ball and then we'll win it back and counter on them"0 -
The only reason we didn't deserve to win is because we didn't put the ball in the onion bag more than them. No other stat matters in football.Viewfinder said:An absolute sickener – but we did not deserve to win. Brum had 24 shots to our seven. Phillips made excellent saves, best of all diving to his right to parry a fierce low shot through a crowd.
We had 60 per cent of the possession – most of it ineffective. Pissing about on the halfway line, putting team-mates under pressure with hospital balls. One of our perennial problems is strikers like statues – no movement to make space or invite passes from midfield. And when Hemed and Bonne do eventually get possession, they haven’t the skill or cunning to threaten the goal.
Doughty accelerates and leaves the defender for dead – and two minutes later makes a basic mistake, leaving us exposed. Chuks did well as sub, driving at the defence. Our central defenders were resolute as usual: Lockyer made vital last-ditch tackles.
McGeady is bang ordinary at best. Cullen made errors: causing the penalty was the worst of several. Crowley and Gardner bossed the game in Brum’s favour.
Brum, Boro and Stoke seem to be safe. Will we avoid the drop? By one point, one place...?
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And of course it was Jutkiewicz that scored in the injury time racked up by him busting Lockyer's nose, pisstake.4
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2 in 2 games from less than 3 yards out, but it’s ok because he wasn’t meant to be playing this year....Chunes said:I love how Bonne has missed SITTERS. Absolute sitters!! that will cost us our division status. And yet we're supposed to be impressed because we signed him from non league. Ok then.1 -
This season has been toxic. I honestly think it’s been bad for my health both physically and mentally. Hoping for something positive to come of all of this, but it’s hard to imagine when it’s pretty much a constant flow of negativity.Whatever happens I’ll keep supporting the team, but bloody hell it’s been a slog recently!12
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Doughty was really dangerous in attacking areas, but struggled a bit defensively. I don't get why he cannot just start at left midfield, his actual position and play a LB (Purrington) at LBViewfinder said:An absolute sickener – but we did not deserve to win. Brum had 24 shots to our seven. Phillips made excellent saves, best of all diving to his right to parry a fierce low shot through a crowd.
We had 60 per cent of the possession – most of it ineffective. Pissing about on the halfway line, putting team-mates under pressure with hospital balls. One of our perennial problems is strikers like statues – no movement to make space or invite passes from midfield. And when Hemed and Bonne do eventually get possession, they haven’t the skill or cunning to threaten the goal.
Doughty accelerates and leaves the defender for dead – and two minutes later makes a basic mistake, leaving us exposed. Chuks did well as sub, driving at the defence. Our central defenders were resolute as usual: Lockyer made vital last-ditch tackles.
McGeady is bang ordinary at best. Cullen made errors: causing the penalty was the worst of several. Crowley and Gardner bossed the game in Brum’s favour.
Brum, Boro and Stoke seem to be safe. Will we avoid the drop? By one point, one place...?
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Missed one sitter the other was a point blank save.Croydon said:
2 in 2 games from less than 3 yards out, but it’s ok because he wasn’t meant to be playing this year....Chunes said:I love how Bonne has missed SITTERS. Absolute sitters!! that will cost us our division status. And yet we're supposed to be impressed because we signed him from non league. Ok then.
He was also our only scorer.1 -
Actually, over 44 games they've shown that they are good enough because they have more points than 3 other teams. Not trying to split hairs but it's that simple.The Prince-e-Paul said:Don't know about Bowyer picking the players up after this, can they pick him up?
That is a brutal blow. We aren't down, but the problems remain.
Every season three clubs aren't good enough to stay up. Our squad was probably the weakest throughout the season. Bowyer said fourth bottom or higher was his goal.
To stay out of the bottom three we need to gain more points and have two games left. Is it likely, no. Is it possible, yes.
Do we still trust Bowyer? I think I trust him, but the players have shown over 44 games that they aren't really good enough for this division.1 - Sponsored links:
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The pen wasn't missed, it was saved - thanks to Dills. That's our player doing his job brilliantly. But Brum were awarded the pen in the first place.killerandflash said:
Not "luck" as such, but Birmingham missed a penalty. If that had gone in, we would probably have lost the matchOggy Red said:
Although there's been times when we haven't helped ourselves, missing good chances and conceding a string of penalties, we've been fairly sound as a team unit.LoOkOuT said:After a great start since the break, we haven't collected enough points to lift us out of the relegation fight. Razor thin margins have not gone our way. We'll have to limp to safety now if we are to stay up. It's still doable, but it won't be easy and is not totally in our own hands (feet?).
But every team needs to get some breaks .... the lucky deflected goal, the ricochet in the box that falls at the feet of our unmarked striker, the dodgy penalty - they just don't seem to come our way at the moment.
Where's the rub of the green when we need it most?
They got a late streaky equaliser, when the loose ball fell into the path of their striker - it could have fallen anywhere.
Yet a little while before McGeady hits the post which could have made it 2-0 and perhaps game over. Fine margins, eh?
Look back over the past few games .... the Brentford penalty, where Cullen played the ball and the opponent fell over Cullen's outstretched leg but only after Cullen had already played the ball.
The Reading game, JFC manhandled and bundled over, exactly the same type of foul as the penalty they were awarded - but ref decided no foul and booked JFC for simulation, yet their player was hands wrapped all round JFC pushing him down. That's what the footage shows. What's the difference?
The Reading game again, the disallowed Aneke goal - error by the officials, but it cost an equaliser. Even the late Millwall winner, the ball broke in to the pathway of their player. It cost us a point.
These are the breaks that teams need to win matches. We've had precious few of them, compared to the way the ball has broken for our opponents recently.
If we'd had that little bit of run of the ball, decisions, that rub of the green, that fell the way of our recent opponents, we'd surely have had at least a couple more points on the board.
That's what I mean.
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He's a left back by trade.killerandflash said:
Doughty was really dangerous in attacking areas, but struggled a bit defensively. I don't get why he cannot just start at left midfield, his actual position and play a LB (Purrington) at LBViewfinder said:An absolute sickener – but we did not deserve to win. Brum had 24 shots to our seven. Phillips made excellent saves, best of all diving to his right to parry a fierce low shot through a crowd.
We had 60 per cent of the possession – most of it ineffective. Pissing about on the halfway line, putting team-mates under pressure with hospital balls. One of our perennial problems is strikers like statues – no movement to make space or invite passes from midfield. And when Hemed and Bonne do eventually get possession, they haven’t the skill or cunning to threaten the goal.
Doughty accelerates and leaves the defender for dead – and two minutes later makes a basic mistake, leaving us exposed. Chuks did well as sub, driving at the defence. Our central defenders were resolute as usual: Lockyer made vital last-ditch tackles.
McGeady is bang ordinary at best. Cullen made errors: causing the penalty was the worst of several. Crowley and Gardner bossed the game in Brum’s favour.
Brum, Boro and Stoke seem to be safe. Will we avoid the drop? By one point, one place...?
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I don't know how it's possible to make a team as poor as Birmingham, look like Barcelona in the last 20 minutes.
There was no one to put their foot on the ball, slow things down, keep possession, draw fouls and generally frustrate the hell out of them, as other teams do to us in the final minutes when we're losing.
Oztumer could have done it, but he wasn't even on the bench.
We just kept inviting pressure down our right side with endless long throws into the box.
Something had to give and 7 minutes was always going to be too much for us.4 -
The Bonne miss/save. He needed to put his foot thru it rather than side foot it. Supporting this team is bad for my health. I have to stop.1
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The easy thing to do is relax, why worry about relegation, nobody will agree a price with RD, so we stumble on, any chance of getting loan players such as Cullen and Field will be out of the question, young players like Doughty will find another club and any other young players with contracts will be sold cheaply. We will have no money to get any decent players and no good loans will want to play in League 1. If fans can come back to the Valley, how many will we get. So you see, nothing to worry about, sob, sob, sob. Why was I born in Charlton?0
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I dunno if you're right about that, but I need the positivity at the moment.ForeverAddickted said:So the sole bit of positivity I can take from this:
Reading and Birmingham both knew that any result against us was a bonus (Reading were helped by being given an early lead) so sat back because they knew the result would mean safety...
These last two games have proven we cannot break teams down that sit back, we just dont have the playmaker to do it
Wigan on the other hand cannot do that on Saturday
They have to come to the Valley and win, failure to do so and they're all but down, we CAN exploit that if we're clever enough
Am convinced our defence wont capitulate in the same fashion as Hull did, its just about making sure we take our chances for once
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Lowest budget in league, our BIG signing of the summer was bonne a non league player for 200k and people moaning at bowyer he’s got a playoff placed league 1 squad - don’t think he can be blamed tbh our strike force was very reliant on one prick who has decided he is above playing for us.5
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The keeper was brilliantly positioned, you have to put that down as good keepingct_addick said:The Bonne miss/save. He needed to put his foot thru it rather than side foot it. Supporting this team is bad for my health. I have to stop.5 -
He can be blamed it's his tactical genius to go defensive with 20 minutes to play.palarsehater said:Lowest budget in league, our BIG signing of the summer was bonne a non league player for 200k and people moaning at bowyer he’s got a playoff placed league 1 squad - don’t think he can be blamed tbh our strike force was very reliant on one prick who has decided he is above playing for us.3
