For everyone slagging Watt and giving him 1/10 in Player Marks, btw - can you explain how the only two bits of incisive passing in the match, both of which should have resulted in goals, were down to him?
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Decided to stay in and vote with my feet tonight. Last home league game I missed was Spurs in Apr 2007, so nearly ten years. I really enjoyed the Man City v Monaco game on BT, so didn't miss it at all.
Although I'm included in the official attendance, the club will know the true attendance and the number of season ticket stayaways. Last seasons stay-aways became this seasons lapsed season ticket holders, so they will be getting an indication on how many more will not renew next season. If they are bothered, which I very much doubt, they have been served notice. The Restaurant hasn't moved, but the food is shite, the service is shite and the atmosphere is shite, so customers are dwindling away. I wouldn't be surprised if there are cockroaches in the kitchen.
Can the true attendance be disclosed by a FOI request?
Sadly not from the club, as they are not a public authority and, so, not covered by the legislation.
If, however, the Metropolitan Police are informed of the actual attendance by the club, and they "hold" a record of this, then a request can be made to them. I'd be very surprised if they could justifiably withhold the information if they did hold it. I may be being overly optimistic that they will hold this information, but I would have thought it was needed for security and health and safety reasons.
If someone was really cunning, they could make a request for all attendances from the start of the 2013-2014 season, it'd be interesting to plot a graph of the regime's success.
If that cunning person was involved with other supporters' groups, they might consider making a suggestion that it be the kind of information (for all football grounds) that should be made available under Open Data (I think the website to look at would be www.data.gov.uk)
OK. I've got my instructions.
Seriously, you've made some interesting suggestions there, and I will give it a go, but it will take a while.
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
Don't recall the exact words but the part where he says he can't say what he wants to say was interesting
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
He's a dead man walking with this lot in charge as would anyone else be. Anyone that takes the job has got to be arrogant, an idiot or desperate. Wilder could see it and told them to shove it. KR don't have talk some bollocks and stop with the pre match tactics you're embarrassing yourself now.
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
Don't recall the exact words but the part where he says he can't say what he wants to say was interesting
Comes out with that one quite often from my recollection. At MKD as well. Gobshite.
I still like Karl Robinson, I've always been a fan of a bit of belief, and he does say some sensible things.
If only he had received appropriate backing for a play off push, rather than an extraction of £5-10m, he might be in a different place.
I don't think he's a bad manager, maybe a bit prone to over the top comments, but hey, I know I've been guilty of that and I'm not scouse.
He is not the problem, removing him will not help. We have one issue here and that is the way in which Duchatelet runs his football clubs. Ideally he leaves, if not he changes, or we die the death of a thousand cuts.
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
Don't recall the exact words but the part where he says he can't say what he wants to say was interesting
Comes out with that one quite often from my recollection. At MKD as well. Gobshite.
Just in. Usual 120 mile round trip - not sure why I bother sometimes. Nervy start. McAleny's shot has improved - seem to remember he'd been coached by Church when he was with us. Mavididi looked dangerous at times and we played some occasional nice stuff that always seemed to end with us passing straight to one of them. Holmes put in a shift but can be a bit headstrong at times. Solly's sending off was down to frustration as he was being pulled all over the place and the ref (who was generally poor) didn't do anything. If Byrne's early shot (that hit the crossbar) had gone in it might have been a different story. Thought Bauer had a better game and we improved after Aribo and Watt came on - mainly down to Aribo as Watt just seems to go through the motions a lot of the time.
No idea how to put this. There was so much wrong with tonight. Here come the standard Paddy P bullet points:
- Rudd had no idea how to marshal his defence. Our centre backs simply do not communicate properly with him; each other; or the full backs. In that regard, we are REALLY missing Pearce. - Teixeira and Bauer both looked criminally casual, Tex in particular. Their distribution was woeful; Bauer was particularly slow in making decisions; both are quite slow pace-wise; neither looked in the game. Neither looked up for it, and this is a game where their "coolness" turned into complacency/sloppiness, which is unacceptable given how good they have looked before. I think it's actually a trait for both of them (the casualness of it), and I hope it changes immediately. - Speaking of mental inadequacy - JFC. What the fuck was he doing. I'm amazed he wasn't hauled off immediately after he was booked, as he was persistently making stupid fouls; couldn't pass it; didn't really do much running; and showed little in defence. He was WELL off the ball mentally. There were still... tiny flashes of quality, but far outweighed by poor play. - Page isn't good enough. Not that he played that badly, but technically he's flawed; mentally he takes too long to make what is often the wrong decision; and physically he's neither that quick nor that strong. Early call for me to make and I hope he proves me wrong, but that's what I think. - I have a bias in favour of Solly, and on first thought, I was disgraced at the red. Having mulled it over and seen others' reactions, I'm sorely disappointed. He lost it well before that challenge, and to compound his head going in the first half, made a fucking stupid decision. Now he's out for 3 games. Fuck sake. - Crofts I have respect for. He's not a great footballer, but he doesn't hide, and kept going for 90 minutes. Played a bit below his usual standard (which itself isn't great), but then again almost everyone did. - Byrne was barely in it. Hit the bar, other than that, what did he do? - Holmes showed. He wasn't at his best, but he was one of the least worst Charlton players on the pitch. - Mavididi is clearly going to be a very very good footballer. He was unlucky not to score, and despite fading quite drastically after about 60 minutes, was still our best player by a mile. - Magennis looked unfit both mentally and physically. For now, will give him the benefit of the doubt and say he's been rushed back a bit too early.
Subs: - Botaka could have run around a bit more, but that's about it. Barely had a chance to do anything. - Aribo was competent tbh. - Watt is so unfit. He just hasn't got it at the moment, whatever the "it" was when he first joined.
Team/game as a whole: - No trust, unlike when I last saw us at home vs Fleetwood. So disjointed. - We looked tired. Not overly sure why. - We played well earlyish doors 2nd half, but weren't able to connect passes fluently. - Oxford played really quite well in adjusting to us; taking the game to us; and it was a good goal they deserved (even if the goal itself was from a speculative shot). - McAleny looked different class today. - Referee was absolutely spot on with all his decision-making, except maybe one minor thing. - Mentally, we lost it and they had their tails up after the goal. We actually lost the game in the 12th minute I'd say, as there was no response. Even after half time, there wasn't *really* one.
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
Don't recall the exact words but the part where he says he can't say what he wants to say was interesting
Comes out with that one quite often from my recollection. At MKD as well. Gobshite.
Yeah, it's one of his many catch phrases - if they ever bring back the Fast Show he'll be made
For everyone slagging Watt and giving him 1/10 in Player Marks, btw - can you explain how the only two bits of incisive passing in the match, both of which should have resulted in goals, were down to him?
What, Byrne hitting the bar and Magennis shooting narrowly over after Page's cross? Both in the first half mate, so given he wasn't on the pitch, I don't think they were down to him...
I think that the thing is, other than those two moments or so per game you mention that I admittedly have scant recollection of, we play with 10 men when Watt is on. He's lazy; has lost his touch; he's lazy (yes I've said it twice); is out on the wing where he can't afford to be a Berbatov-style luxury; and he's unfit.
Sorry poor quality photos, but just to add to Henry's East stand photo this is the West and North stands just after KO.
We were dire tonight. Holmes may have put in a shift, but looked like a headless chicken as he evidently had no clue to his role. With Robinson uttering the words 'Some don't want to play' what hope is there?
'some (players) want to play, some don't'; 'we haven't got better throughout the whole season' (I thought Katy that every new manager brought improvement?), 'no cohesiveness, looked like they haven't been coached'; 'we were outplayed'; 'no link between the back 4 and midfield'......
Sounds like the end is nigh
Don't recall the exact words but the part where he says he can't say what he wants to say was interesting
And also the bit where he says hes heard alot of talk behind the scenes but now wants it backed up....mmmmm,interesting,sounds like the penny has finally dropped eh Karl??
To be fair I don't think he says much wrong there.
He has a number of problems
1. The foundations of this club are built on cancer and incompetence under RD and KM. shit rolls downhill and no matter who, what, how and where you seek to deal with this, the cancer/incompetence wins out
2. He's too young and inexperienced for this job in this climate
3. He's too rigid and wants to play to a 4-2-3-1 regardless. This is where he can be criticised because he should be adaptable and tailor his system to the players he has.
4. We don't have that good a team/squad. We hardly started the season with a team/squad that were good enough. We have a few good players and yes he should probably be getting more out of them, as per point 4, but ultimately we don't have the talent
5. His manner, is marmite, and he's accepted a job at a club where the owners aren't wanted. There's too much friction.
If he gets the boot then you could say he knew what he was walking into, but ultimately for me, for a 36 year old at the start of his managerial career it would be a bit unfair. That's my personal opinion on him, I respect that won't be the same for others
If he does get the boot, that really will take RD and KM from an object of incompetence in the national football press to absolute laughing stock. Unfortunately there seems to be a disease in modern day football of incompetent owners (Blackburn, blackpool, orient etc) and I feel that Orient's recent shitfest has only inspired RD to go one better. If this run continues, KR could be gone by April
Decided to stay in and vote with my feet tonight. Last home league game I missed was Spurs in Apr 2007, so nearly ten years. I really enjoyed the Man City v Monaco game on BT, so didn't miss it at all.
Although I'm included in the official attendance, the club will know the true attendance and the number of season ticket stayaways. Last seasons stay-aways became this seasons lapsed season ticket holders, so they will be getting an indication on how many more will not renew next season. If they are bothered, which I very much doubt, they have been served notice. The Restaurant hasn't moved, but the food is shite, the service is shite and the atmosphere is shite, so customers are dwindling away. I wouldn't be surprised if there are cockroaches in the kitchen.
Can the true attendance be disclosed by a FOI request?
Sadly not from the club, as they are not a public authority and, so, not covered by the legislation.
If, however, the Metropolitan Police are informed of the actual attendance by the club, and they "hold" a record of this, then a request can be made to them. I'd be very surprised if they could justifiably withhold the information if they did hold it. I may be being overly optimistic that they will hold this information, but I would have thought it was needed for security and health and safety reasons.
If someone was really cunning, they could make a request for all attendances from the start of the 2013-2014 season, it'd be interesting to plot a graph of the regime's success.
If that cunning person was involved with other supporters' groups, they might consider making a suggestion that it be the kind of information (for all football grounds) that should be made available under Open Data (I think the website to look at would be www.data.gov.uk)
OK. I've got my instructions.
Seriously, you've made some interesting suggestions there, and I will give it a go, but it will take a while.
Just to say, Open Data is about reusable datasets (to help encourage development of apps etc.), but if the dataset was for actual attendances it should be relatively easy to make sense of it - and supporters' groups could use the information to help provide almost real time attendance analysis for campaigning. Media might find the data useful too.
I didn't mind him being a slight oddball, flawed genius or whatever, but don't come onto the pitch looking about 2 stone overweight and start acting like a petulant knob, shouting at everyone else for not being good enough and sulking when you don't get the ball.
He had a real go at Aribo for about two minutes solid for not playing him through on goal. It looked like Aribo had finally had enough and said something back, and Watt turned really nasty - from a distance it all looked unnecessarily threatening to a young kid that was our best player when he came on.
TBH both Watt and Magennis' body language toward the end was pretty terrible.
The majority of our team made CONOR MCALENY look like a warrior. Backs turned on shots, failing to win pretty much all 50/50's, no challenges aerially. Pathetic. Passing is awful. Throw ins regularly went straight to an Oxford player. The likes of Holmes, Magennis, Bauer look shadows of the players they were at the start of the season. One dimensional.
KR is bang on in one comment he makes. To me they looked like they are not getting coached. If his answer is simply 'but they are' then I suggest he goes back to the drawing board and realises that whatever shit coaching him and his team are giving them is not working.
He's not going to do jack! He loves himself and talks shit. It wouldn't matter if we were rock bottom he'd convince himself he was the fucking messiah! Like all those before him. They either stay and pick up their pay cheque or wait to get fired and paid off. Either way, being a manager at Charlton carries very little blame or accountability so it doesn't matter.
Why does he insist in interviews, to pretend like he is on the verge of saying something controversial then say " I can't say too much "? I can only think it's an act to convince fans he's really cross with someone else and will be having strong words with them later....! The bloke is an utter knob
For everyone slagging Watt and giving him 1/10 in Player Marks, btw - can you explain how the only two bits of incisive passing in the match, both of which should have resulted in goals, were down to him?
What, Byrne hitting the bar and Magennis shooting narrowly over after Page's cross? Both in the first half mate, so given he wasn't on the pitch, I don't think they were down to him...
I think that the thing is, other than those two moments or so per game you mention that I admittedly have scant recollection of, we play with 10 men when Watt is on. He's lazy; has lost his touch; he's lazy (yes I've said it twice); is out on the wing where he can't afford to be a Berbatov-style luxury; and he's unfit.
Cutback to Holmes who decided to try to win a penalty rather than shoot, and wonderful little scoop to Magennis who could have headed it first-time but brought it down and got crowded out by the keeper
Very depressing and sad state of affairs. Even Karl seems to agree - I make @daveydanger right on his interpretation, a man teetering on the brink of despair, it would seem (that's Karl not daveydanger).
It's often said that good teams add up to more than the sum of their individual parts. I thought tonight's team looked ok on paper, but it proved to be truly awful on grass. Currently our team is somehow adding up to less than the sum of its parts. And some of the parts look a bit defective too.
My insane decision to inflict tonight's dross on three generations of my family was then compounded by the realisation that people who stayed at home, or live away, or were in the pub, had been royally entertained by @JiMMy 85 all evening - brilliant stuff!
Comments
JiMMy85 is the highlight of the season so far. A new signing that is actually living up to it's promise.
Sounds like the end is nigh
Seriously, you've made some interesting suggestions there, and I will give it a go, but it will take a while.
If only he had received appropriate backing for a play off push, rather than an extraction of £5-10m, he might be in a different place.
I don't think he's a bad manager, maybe a bit prone to over the top comments, but hey, I know I've been guilty of that and I'm not scouse.
He is not the problem, removing him will not help. We have one issue here and that is the way in which Duchatelet runs his football clubs. Ideally he leaves, if not he changes, or we die the death of a thousand cuts.
Well I'd suggest don't play those who don't want to play. What a prick.
- Rudd had no idea how to marshal his defence. Our centre backs simply do not communicate properly with him; each other; or the full backs. In that regard, we are REALLY missing Pearce.
- Teixeira and Bauer both looked criminally casual, Tex in particular. Their distribution was woeful; Bauer was particularly slow in making decisions; both are quite slow pace-wise; neither looked in the game. Neither looked up for it, and this is a game where their "coolness" turned into complacency/sloppiness, which is unacceptable given how good they have looked before. I think it's actually a trait for both of them (the casualness of it), and I hope it changes immediately.
- Speaking of mental inadequacy - JFC. What the fuck was he doing. I'm amazed he wasn't hauled off immediately after he was booked, as he was persistently making stupid fouls; couldn't pass it; didn't really do much running; and showed little in defence. He was WELL off the ball mentally. There were still... tiny flashes of quality, but far outweighed by poor play.
- Page isn't good enough. Not that he played that badly, but technically he's flawed; mentally he takes too long to make what is often the wrong decision; and physically he's neither that quick nor that strong. Early call for me to make and I hope he proves me wrong, but that's what I think.
- I have a bias in favour of Solly, and on first thought, I was disgraced at the red. Having mulled it over and seen others' reactions, I'm sorely disappointed. He lost it well before that challenge, and to compound his head going in the first half, made a fucking stupid decision. Now he's out for 3 games. Fuck sake.
- Crofts I have respect for. He's not a great footballer, but he doesn't hide, and kept going for 90 minutes. Played a bit below his usual standard (which itself isn't great), but then again almost everyone did.
- Byrne was barely in it. Hit the bar, other than that, what did he do?
- Holmes showed. He wasn't at his best, but he was one of the least worst Charlton players on the pitch.
- Mavididi is clearly going to be a very very good footballer. He was unlucky not to score, and despite fading quite drastically after about 60 minutes, was still our best player by a mile.
- Magennis looked unfit both mentally and physically. For now, will give him the benefit of the doubt and say he's been rushed back a bit too early.
Subs:
- Botaka could have run around a bit more, but that's about it. Barely had a chance to do anything.
- Aribo was competent tbh.
- Watt is so unfit. He just hasn't got it at the moment, whatever the "it" was when he first joined.
Team/game as a whole:
- No trust, unlike when I last saw us at home vs Fleetwood. So disjointed.
- We looked tired. Not overly sure why.
- We played well earlyish doors 2nd half, but weren't able to connect passes fluently.
- Oxford played really quite well in adjusting to us; taking the game to us; and it was a good goal they deserved (even if the goal itself was from a speculative shot).
- McAleny looked different class today.
- Referee was absolutely spot on with all his decision-making, except maybe one minor thing.
- Mentally, we lost it and they had their tails up after the goal. We actually lost the game in the 12th minute I'd say, as there was no response. Even after half time, there wasn't *really* one.
------------
... Why do I bother any more?
"What I wanna say, I don't think I can say. I have to keep certain things to myself. I just need to be careful what I say."
"I've heard a lot of talking, for a while, internally, and it's got to start to be backed up now."
"It's about bringing in a number of players. I know the players, exactly the type of players."
"This whole team is where it is, for the whole season. So before me, and now, it's not got any better."
I think that the thing is, other than those two moments or so per game you mention that I admittedly have scant recollection of, we play with 10 men when Watt is on. He's lazy; has lost his touch; he's lazy (yes I've said it twice); is out on the wing where he can't afford to be a Berbatov-style luxury; and he's unfit.
We were dire tonight. Holmes may have put in a shift, but looked like a headless chicken as he evidently had no clue to his role. With Robinson uttering the words 'Some don't want to play' what hope is there?
He has a number of problems
1. The foundations of this club are built on cancer and incompetence under RD and KM. shit rolls downhill and no matter who, what, how and where you seek to deal with this, the cancer/incompetence wins out
2. He's too young and inexperienced for this job in this climate
3. He's too rigid and wants to play to a 4-2-3-1 regardless. This is where he can be criticised because he should be adaptable and tailor his system to the players he has.
4. We don't have that good a team/squad. We hardly started the season with a team/squad that were good enough. We have a few good players and yes he should probably be getting more out of them, as per point 4, but ultimately we don't have the talent
5. His manner, is marmite, and he's accepted a job at a club where the owners aren't wanted. There's too much friction.
If he gets the boot then you could say he knew what he was walking into, but ultimately for me, for a 36 year old at the start of his managerial career it would be a bit unfair. That's my personal opinion on him, I respect that won't be the same for others
If he does get the boot, that really will take RD and KM from an object of incompetence in the national football press to absolute laughing stock. Unfortunately there seems to be a disease in modern day football of incompetent owners (Blackburn, blackpool, orient etc) and I feel that Orient's recent shitfest has only inspired RD to go one better. If this run continues, KR could be gone by April
I listened to that and thought he was talking about the players.
Maybe he is about to give both barrells to Daisy.
I'd have more respect for him if he did.
I didn't mind him being a slight oddball, flawed genius or whatever, but don't come onto the pitch looking about 2 stone overweight and start acting like a petulant knob, shouting at everyone else for not being good enough and sulking when you don't get the ball.
He had a real go at Aribo for about two minutes solid for not playing him through on goal. It looked like Aribo had finally had enough and said something back, and Watt turned really nasty - from a distance it all looked unnecessarily threatening to a young kid that was our best player when he came on.
TBH both Watt and Magennis' body language toward the end was pretty terrible.
KR is bang on in one comment he makes. To me they looked like they are not getting coached. If his answer is simply 'but they are' then I suggest he goes back to the drawing board and realises that whatever shit coaching him and his team are giving them is not working.
Why does he insist in interviews, to pretend like he is on the verge of saying something controversial then say " I can't say too much "? I can only think it's an act to convince fans he's really cross with someone else and will be having strong words with them later....! The bloke is an utter knob
I'm off to bed. Hope I don't have nightmares about that godawful game.
It's often said that good teams add up to more than the sum of their individual parts. I thought tonight's team looked ok on paper, but it proved to be truly awful on grass. Currently our team is somehow adding up to less than the sum of its parts. And some of the parts look a bit defective too.
My insane decision to inflict tonight's dross on three generations of my family was then compounded by the realisation that people who stayed at home, or live away, or were in the pub, had been royally entertained by @JiMMy 85 all evening - brilliant stuff!