Maybe not best phrased but not an academy player (so could still be in longer plans or want to prove themselves) or running down a last contract and looking to earn a new one somewhere else. Players who know they have the option to just go back to their own club if things don't work out are maybe going to see how much drilling and hard work Jones demands and just not bother, potentially - if they know that in a few months they can go back to earning money on the bench again.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Absolutely. Class act when he was at Northampton and was a bit of a shame he went to Birmingham when they had Paik and Iwata lock down their midfield for most of the season.
If Leonard is available it suggests to me they plan to strengthen again.
Pretty sure they are after Prem players/players ready to make the step up. Shows the quality they have that they're willing to loan him, he's genuinely one of the best mids at league 1 level and I think he will step up to Champ easily.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
we've had success with tough youngish Scots lately .. be good for us .. I'd prefer permanent rather than loan though .. problem always is, if he succeeds as a loanee, Brum will want him back as part of their squad
If I'm honest, I think he might be done there. Paik and Iwata are very good midfielders and he won't be replacing either of those, have a feeling Birmingham will be looking to upgrade.
I think similar to us and Tennai, unfortunately for him, Birmingham have grown so quick that he's surplus to requirements now.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Whilst I agree we should be looking for an upgrade on Doc, I have that down as a priority position, but we need depth and options in every position. He has championship experience and is a leader and battler, he knows the manager and the system. We could do a lot worse for a 2nd choice in that role. Same goes for Berry
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
I am not saying Docherty is going to lead us to premiership glory, or I wouldn't want to replace him with better. But I think it's harsh to call him a league one player when he has played the majority of his career in the championship or Scottish Prem, and has captained a team back to the championship from league one at the first time of asking.
I think what he brings to the team is underrated both on and off the pitch, and I cannot imagine Jones made him captain because he thought he wouldn't at least be able to contribute in the Championship.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
Am I right that the window opened yesterday, 1st June and closes 10 June before reopening again later in the summer?
If so, how many do people think we bring in during this first period...?
I'm going to go for 3.
Also, should I be worried we are 24 hours or so in, but not yet signed anyone? 😉
Correct.
"The summer 2025 transfer window is, unusually, split into two parts.
It will initially open on Sunday, 1 June and close nine days later. The early window allows teams participating in the Club World Cup the chance to sign players before the tournament begins.
The window will reopen on Monday, 16 June, before closing on Monday, 1 September at 7pm for Premier League, EFL and Scottish Premiership clubs."
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
I am not saying Docherty is going to lead us to premiership glory, or I wouldn't want to replace him with better. But I think it's harsh to call him a league one player when he has played the majority of his career in the championship or Scottish Prem, and has captained a team back to the championship from league one at the first time of asking.
I think what he brings to the team is underrated both on and off the pitch, and I cannot imagine Jones made him captain because he thought he wouldn't at least be able to contribute in the Championship.
He is the most replaceable player in our starting XI alongside Berry though.
I would be surprised if anyone on here would be happy with him being a part of our starting line up first game of the season.
We got promoted because our defense was excellent, we lost the midfield battle more times than I can count this season. A player who can control the tempo of the game and create a bit of magic in the middle would seriously upgrade us.
Whilst I agree we should be looking for an upgrade on Doc, I have that down as a priority position, but we need depth and options in every position. He has championship experience and is a leader and battler, he knows the manager and the system. We could do a lot worse for a 2nd choice in that role. Same goes for Berry
That's how I view him, happy for him to be a back up player, but if we want to push on, the midfield is the thing that needs improving on the most. Little room for sentiment, and I think Jones hinted at that already. I'd love to know who he truly thinks is champ level, and who he is playing through necessity.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
I think Jones likes Docherty a lot and made him his captain. I’d be surprised if he doesn’t feature a lot next season. For every player there is a better player than themselves but we’ve got to find them and sign them first. I think Doc did a pretty impressive job last season.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
Ok. I believe a player isn't good, you believe otherwise.
I believe he was a passenger in the championship, you believe he was championship quality.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
Ok. I believe a player isn't good, you believe otherwise.
I believe he was a passenger in the championship, you believe he was championship quality.
Moving on.
And your evidence for him being a "passenger" is?
Again, why make stuff up just to justify replacing him.
Worth remembering not all players have to stand out to have done a good job. A lot of things the best footballers do goes unnoticed and are really important. If you have 11 players all standing out every match you probably don’t have a team but closer to 11 individuals
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
I am not saying Docherty is going to lead us to premiership glory, or I wouldn't want to replace him with better. But I think it's harsh to call him a league one player when he has played the majority of his career in the championship or Scottish Prem, and has captained a team back to the championship from league one at the first time of asking.
I think what he brings to the team is underrated both on and off the pitch, and I cannot imagine Jones made him captain because he thought he wouldn't at least be able to contribute in the Championship.
He is the most replaceable player in our starting XI alongside Berry though.
I would be surprised if anyone on here would be happy with him being a part of our starting line up first game of the season.
We got promoted because our defense was excellent, we lost the midfield battle more times than I can count this season. A player who can control the tempo of the game and create a bit of magic in the middle would seriously upgrade us.
For me I wouldn't be unhappy if Docherty started. I don't for one second think he is a world beater, but I feel pretty strongly that he is a key part in how we play, and why we were successful this year.
When we were going through our rough patch, the overarching sentiment that people fell back to was focused on 'a playmaker', 'number 10', and yet we went on an absolute tear up from January onwards by not doing this - and Docherty was part of this.
If Phil Chapple still has the Midas touch then we hope that his working relationship with Nathan can reap the same rewards that Ramsey, Edwards and after slow starts at CAFC, Lloyd Jones and Macca brought to our tight defence in 24/25 along with Coventry as the link man in front and Small who can play on either side whether helping the defence or the attack.
Every newcomer needs to push the player with the shirt at present and be a potential Starter. In the ideal scouting world you wouldn't sign the likes of Kirk and Ahadme on long contracts and with the return of big Phil we really should've more upgrades than downgrades despite the financial package meaning we won't get all our targets.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
Ok. I believe a player isn't good, you believe otherwise.
I believe he was a passenger in the championship, you believe he was championship quality.
Moving on.
And your evidence for him being a "passenger" is?
Again, why make stuff up just to justify replacing him.
I'm not making anything up, it's a fucking opinion. Jesus Christ. I don't think he's very good. I am basing this off of watching every game this season, and seeing him fail to control a game.
24/25: League 1, 40 apps, 4 goals 2 assists. 23/24: 15 Champ apps, bit part player 22/23: 1940 minutes of Champ football 21/22: 40 champ apps, 1 goal, 2842 mins, 71 mins average per game 20/21: Very good league 1 numbers, 5 goals, 5 assist, 44 appearances 19/20: Scottish prem, 6 apps, bit part player 18/19: League 1, 7 goals, 8 assists, good season
The common theme is, he does decent/good in league1, and struggles to make the step up. I saw plenty of Hull fans say it was the right move to let him go. Similar to how plenty of our fans will tell another club Chuks and Tennai will do a job.
I didn't watch him all those last 6 years, so I can only go from what I've read, and then watched with my own eyes, which is that he wasn't great in league1 for us, so I am doubtful he will make the step up, as he has previous history of failing.
Is this satisfactory and no longer making stuff up?
Do we have any sense as to how FFP will impact our ambitions, whatever they may be? If (big if) the owners wanted to spend £20m - could they?
I might be wrong, but regulations are a lot tighter in Championship than L1, and it's a big reason why Birmingham spent big last summer, so they'd have the players ready for Championship without exceeding any limits in place while there.
Doherty I think is in the unfortunate position where he doesn't do particularly spectacular things but you notice his absence more than his presence, a kind of glue that sticks all the other bits together. NJ wouldn't have made him captain for no reason.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
I'll be interested to see Docherty's end of season statbank score. It will probably be in the lower quadrant. He's been part of a winning team, so obviously there's natural credit that comes with that. He's also had a couple of great games and scored some important goals. On a game-by-game basis, I personally think he could have had more of an impact. I don't think he'd let us down in the Champ but I also think an upgrade wouldn't be out of the question.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Very tidy player but going to be about 5 clubs interested in him. Rumoured to be on 10k a week at Birmingham so definitely not out of reach but if other clubs start offering big loan fees as well not sure we would be able to get him
That's the issue, although, it may help us that Birmingham probably don't see us a threat to their league position? They might prefer to send him to a team that won't be challenging top6 in their eyes.
Loan with an option to buy would be ideal. Reckon he would start for us.
Who’s place would you see him taking? Not saying he wouldn’t start for us.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
Wow, three seasons in the Championship and over 90 league games but "he's never done it at this level"?
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
Shall I now make a list of all the Charlton players that were awful but played a number of championship games?
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
More nonsense. You've gone from "never done it" to "didn't thrive"
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
Ok. I believe a player isn't good, you believe otherwise.
I believe he was a passenger in the championship, you believe he was championship quality.
Moving on.
And your evidence for him being a "passenger" is?
Again, why make stuff up just to justify replacing him.
I'm not making anything up, it's a fucking opinion. Jesus Christ. I don't think he's very good. I am basing this off of watching every game this season, and seeing him fail to control a game.
24/25: League 1, 40 apps, 4 goals 2 assists. 23/24: 15 Champ apps, bit part player 22/23: 1940 minutes of Champ football 21/22: 40 champ apps, 1 goal, 2842 mins, 71 mins average per game 20/21: Very good league 1 numbers, 5 goals, 5 assist, 44 appearances 19/20: Scottish prem, 6 apps, bit part player 18/19: League 1, 7 goals, 8 assists, good season
The common theme is, he does decent/good in league1, and struggles to make the step up. I saw plenty of Hull fans say it was the right move to let him go. Similar to how plenty of our fans will tell another club Chuks and Tennai will do a job.
I didn't watch him all those last 6 years, so I can only go from what I've read, and then watched with my own eyes, which is that he wasn't great in league1 for us, so I am doubtful he will make the step up, as he has previous history of failing.
Is this satisfactory and no longer making stuff up?
You’re still making things up though. How do you justify this nonsense statement ?
Doc played 40 games for Hull in 21/22, a season in which they finished 19th in the Championship.
Doc played 35 games for Hull in 22/23, a season in which they finished 15th in the Championship.
He’s been there and done it.
I don’t know about anyone else but I’d take 19th and 15th over the next two seasons.
Interesting as you literally just posted that Preston aren't a club to aspire to, yet they've been a better/more successful club than Hull for a fair few seasons now, with a lower wage bill.
Hull also spent a shit load on wages like you also said you don't want to see us do to secure those league finishes.
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If so, how many do people think we bring in during this first period...?
I'm going to go for 3.
Also, should I be worried we are 24 hours or so in, but not yet signed anyone? 😉
Players who know they have the option to just go back to their own club if things don't work out are maybe going to see how much drilling and hard work Jones demands and just not bother, potentially - if they know that in a few months they can go back to earning money on the bench again.
If I'm honest, I think he might be done there. Paik and Iwata are very good midfielders and he won't be replacing either of those, have a feeling Birmingham will be looking to upgrade.
I think similar to us and Tennai, unfortunately for him, Birmingham have grown so quick that he's surplus to requirements now.
For me Docherty, hypothetically.
Docherty is a league1 quality player imo. I am expecting us to upgrade on him.
I think Jones should be club captain and Docherty shouldn't be starting. Might sound harsh but it just worries me how little he played for Hull and he's never really done it at this level.
Sorry to any Doc fans but I'd like to see us sign two new mids to play with Cov.
We should, if we can, upgrade on Doc but the same can be said for every player in the side. You could argue he dropped down a level for a reason but to pretend he never did it is just nonsense.
I think what he brings to the team is underrated both on and off the pitch, and I cannot imagine Jones made him captain because he thought he wouldn't at least be able to contribute in the Championship.
When I say he didn't do it, I mean he didn't thrive in this league. If he did, he would have been kept by Hull. He couldn't even stand out in League1 if we are being honest.
We need better to progress, harsh but true.
"The summer 2025 transfer window is, unusually, split into two parts.
It will initially open on Sunday, 1 June and close nine days later. The early window allows teams participating in the Club World Cup the chance to sign players before the tournament begins.
The window will reopen on Monday, 16 June, before closing on Monday, 1 September at 7pm for Premier League, EFL and Scottish Premiership clubs."
I would be surprised if anyone on here would be happy with him being a part of our starting line up first game of the season.
We got promoted because our defense was excellent, we lost the midfield battle more times than I can count this season. A player who can control the tempo of the game and create a bit of magic in the middle would seriously upgrade us.
He was kept by Hull, for three seasons, and then like most players at one time or another he moved on to be the captain of a promotion winning team in league one but that isn't enough somehow.
We do need better players to progress but that is no reason to dismiss the contributions that Doc and many others have made.
I just don't get this whole either/or justification. Someone can like both Chinese and Indian food. You don't have to run down one to like the other.
We can praise a player AND want better replacements
We don't have to write off a player, and in this case our captain who did contribute greatly, just to justify bringing in someone better, younger, fitter, more suited.
I believe he was a passenger in the championship, you believe he was championship quality.
Moving on.
Again, why make stuff up just to justify replacing him.
When we were going through our rough patch, the overarching sentiment that people fell back to was focused on 'a playmaker', 'number 10', and yet we went on an absolute tear up from January onwards by not doing this - and Docherty was part of this.
Every newcomer needs to push the player with the shirt at present and be a potential Starter.
In the ideal scouting world you wouldn't sign the likes of Kirk and Ahadme on long contracts and with the return of big Phil we really should've more upgrades than downgrades despite the financial package meaning we won't get all our targets.
Doc played 35 games for Hull in 22/23, a season in which they finished 15th in the Championship.
He’s been there and done it.
I don’t know about anyone else but I’d take 19th and 15th over the next two seasons.
24/25: League 1, 40 apps, 4 goals 2 assists.
23/24: 15 Champ apps, bit part player
22/23: 1940 minutes of Champ football
21/22: 40 champ apps, 1 goal, 2842 mins, 71 mins average per game
20/21: Very good league 1 numbers, 5 goals, 5 assist, 44 appearances
19/20: Scottish prem, 6 apps, bit part player
18/19: League 1, 7 goals, 8 assists, good season
The common theme is, he does decent/good in league1, and struggles to make the step up. I saw plenty of Hull fans say it was the right move to let him go. Similar to how plenty of our fans will tell another club Chuks and Tennai will do a job.
I didn't watch him all those last 6 years, so I can only go from what I've read, and then watched with my own eyes, which is that he wasn't great in league1 for us, so I am doubtful he will make the step up, as he has previous history of failing.
Is this satisfactory and no longer making stuff up?
I like both Chinese and Indian food.
Hull also spent a shit load on wages like you also said you don't want to see us do to secure those league finishes.