ULEZ Checker

Crusty54

Child injured in crash in Orpington after traffic lights cut down.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68022438

Hal1x

Crusty54 said:

The view from Shooters Hill on Tuesday. In the past the buildings would have been covered in a haze. Tell me ULEZ isn't working.

Heat haze? not appropriate tuesday

Huskaris

Crusty54 said:

Child injured in crash in Orpington after traffic lights cut down.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68022438

Absolutely disgusting. These people are dickheads. 

Huskaris

Also if anyone wants to give me £10 trillion I will give everyone an electric car and convert all UKs electricity generation to 100% renewable. 

Don't be nasty and say no, you'll be killing people 

swords_alive

Going from distant memory of value management theory and investment approaches... Cost/ benefit is too crude an approach I think. If the lead benefit is health then cost isn't redundant in the calculation but neither should it be the leading measure of success. More appropriate to consider benefit (as in reduction in pollution or other health impact) for the investment made. So the value of the investment is the max benefit gained in proportion to cost. (And that can be appraised against other options for this type of investment, once someone puts some numbers in there to make it an objective calculation).

Something like that anyway..

valleynick66

seth plum said:

valleynick66 said:

seth plum said:

If one single life is saved (yes that may be tricky to prove without statistics) because of the ULEZ expansion leading to some improvement in air quality, is that a ‘marginal’ gain or a substantial worthwhile gain?

Sadly we cant ignore the ongoing cost - otherwise we would not have any issues with the NHS etc.

We have to consider the financials - I am discussing the cost to the taxpayer of the ongoing infrastructure and vendor support NOT the fees paid by the motorist.

If it is about cost/benefit analysis is there a point where either costs are too high or deaths are too high?

Are you seriously suggesting money does not play a part in the health of the nation?

valleynick66

blackpool72 said:

Camera outside Orpington Station has been cut down  
It appears Orpington was targeted last night. 
While I don't really have an option on ULEZ  one way or the other, one thing I would like to see is when the people responsible for cutting the cameras down are caught they should have to pay the cost of replacing them as well as a fine. 
Why should the cost of replacing them be passed onto TFL.
Then the cost passed on to the general public. 
Heavy fines alone are not enough. 

I assume they do get that  bill already. 

paulie8290

Huskaris said:

Crusty54 said:

Child injured in crash in Orpington after traffic lights cut down.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68022438

Absolutely disgusting. These people are dickheads. 

I'm on Orpington gossip on Facebook and all I have seen today have people saying well done blade runners, brilliant taking down the traffic lights people need to drive more carefully then there wont be accidents 

As you say these people are dickheads hust care about themselves a poor child is in hospital and all they can say is well done to the people who cut the traffic lights down 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

seth plum

valleynick66 said:

seth plum said:

valleynick66 said:

seth plum said:

If one single life is saved (yes that may be tricky to prove without statistics) because of the ULEZ expansion leading to some improvement in air quality, is that a ‘marginal’ gain or a substantial worthwhile gain?

Sadly we cant ignore the ongoing cost - otherwise we would not have any issues with the NHS etc.

We have to consider the financials - I am discussing the cost to the taxpayer of the ongoing infrastructure and vendor support NOT the fees paid by the motorist.

If it is about cost/benefit analysis is there a point where either costs are too high or deaths are too high?

Are you seriously suggesting money does not play a part in the health of the nation?

I would say money, or can we broaden it and say resources, plays a part in everything more or less.

valleynick66

Seems  really weird  they take the time and effort to cut down  the traffic light rather than just trying to disable the camera in some way. 

You’d imagine they risk being ‘caught’ doing that versus just a quick bit of low key vandalism 

Just strange especially after the Sidcup explosive which might have brought these people back to their senses. 

Some strange people around. 

Covered End

valleynick66 said:

Seems  really weird  they take the time and effort to cut down  the traffic light rather than just trying to disable the camera in some way. 

You’d imagine they risk being ‘caught’ doing that versus just a quick bit of low key vandalism 

Just strange especially after the Sidcup explosive which might have brought these people back to their senses. 

Some strange people around. 

Quite the opposite.
If you see any footage the traffic light is taken down in a matter of 5-10 seconds.

valleynick66

seth plum said:

valleynick66 said:

seth plum said:

valleynick66 said:

seth plum said:

If one single life is saved (yes that may be tricky to prove without statistics) because of the ULEZ expansion leading to some improvement in air quality, is that a ‘marginal’ gain or a substantial worthwhile gain?

Sadly we cant ignore the ongoing cost - otherwise we would not have any issues with the NHS etc.

We have to consider the financials - I am discussing the cost to the taxpayer of the ongoing infrastructure and vendor support NOT the fees paid by the motorist.

If it is about cost/benefit analysis is there a point where either costs are too high or deaths are too high?

Are you seriously suggesting money does not play a part in the health of the nation?

I would say money, or can we broaden it and say resources, plays a part in everything more or less.

As was my point !

valleynick66

Covered End said:

valleynick66 said:

Seems  really weird  they take the time and effort to cut down  the traffic light rather than just trying to disable the camera in some way. 

You’d imagine they risk being ‘caught’ doing that versus just a quick bit of low key vandalism 

Just strange especially after the Sidcup explosive which might have brought these people back to their senses. 

Some strange people around. 

Quite the opposite.
If you see any footage the traffic light is taken down in a matter of 5-10 seconds.

Oh wow. I stand corrected !

clb74

JamesSeed said:

clb74 said:

seth plum said:

If one single life is saved (yes that may be tricky to prove without statistics) because of the ULEZ expansion leading to some improvement in air quality, is that a ‘marginal’ gain or a substantial worthwhile gain?

There's over 1600 car related deaths a year.
Should we do away with cars altogether?

People driving cars take a calculated risk, and that’s fine. You can always choose not to drive if you want to reduce that risk to zero. 

People breathing don’t have that choice. 

My post said car related deaths.
Around 240 people are killed by drink drivers every year.
If banning cars takes that down to zero, is it not worth it?

clive

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Lurker

Davynix said:

Bournemouth Addick said:

charltonkeston said:

Rizzo said:

guinnessaddick said:

https://twitter.com/kent_999s/status/1732506561438785713?s=46&t=l3gVPecVjs4wU2WBKFZZyw

We heard the explosion from Welling. Drove past the van in that video a few days later after the road had reopened and it was proper fucked. If that van hadn't been there and anyone had been in the path of the debris they would be dead. Whoever is responsible is an absolute moron and needs to be locked up. 

They arrested a couple of men from miles away, 60 & 61 years old. They must be seriously unhinged, assuming they did it. At their age, if convicted they are never going to pay a congestion  or ULEZ charge again in their lives. Causing explosions you normally quite righty have the keys thrown away.

There should be some legal repercussions for whoever 'radicalised' these scumbags too.

Loaded phrase or not, men in their early 60's don't suddenly decide, off their own back, to start making IED's and using them on our streets.

Radicalised- behave

Radicalised - the action or process of making somebody more extreme or radical in their opinions on political, social or religious issues.

Which bit do you disagree with?  

I'm all for people protesting / taking action for a cause but this cause is just a bizarre hill to die on, leaving no alternative explanation other than radicalisation in my mind.  

Of all the issues in the UK over say the last 20 years, people want to risk prison / other peoples lives for the cause of driving an older car into London without paying a fee?

Fortune 82nd Minute

clive said:

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Is there an election for the Mayor's office later this year?

seth plum

I am pretty sure there is a mayoral election in May.
Judging by what happened in the by-election in Uxbridge the ULEZ issue might be a bit of a factor, I personally believe the people who damage the camera infrastructure are antagonistic towards the present mayor for another reason beyond money.

Davynix

Lurker said:

Davynix said:

Bournemouth Addick said:

charltonkeston said:

Rizzo said:

guinnessaddick said:

https://twitter.com/kent_999s/status/1732506561438785713?s=46&t=l3gVPecVjs4wU2WBKFZZyw

We heard the explosion from Welling. Drove past the van in that video a few days later after the road had reopened and it was proper fucked. If that van hadn't been there and anyone had been in the path of the debris they would be dead. Whoever is responsible is an absolute moron and needs to be locked up. 

They arrested a couple of men from miles away, 60 & 61 years old. They must be seriously unhinged, assuming they did it. At their age, if convicted they are never going to pay a congestion  or ULEZ charge again in their lives. Causing explosions you normally quite righty have the keys thrown away.

There should be some legal repercussions for whoever 'radicalised' these scumbags too.

Loaded phrase or not, men in their early 60's don't suddenly decide, off their own back, to start making IED's and using them on our streets.

Radicalised- behave

Radicalised - the action or process of making somebody more extreme or radical in their opinions on political, social or religious issues.

Which bit do you disagree with?  

I'm all for people protesting / taking action for a cause but this cause is just a bizarre hill to die on, leaving no alternative explanation other than radicalisation in my mind.  

Of all the issues in the UK over say the last 20 years, people want to risk prison / other peoples lives for the cause of driving an older car into London without paying a fee?

There speaks a person who is either a student or works for the public sector- the older car issue,most people can't afford to change or there's no alternative public transport wise- ffs radicalised indeed

Davynix

seth plum said:

I am pretty sure there is a mayoral election in May.
Judging by what happened in the by-election in Uxbridge the ULEZ issue might be a bit of a factor, I personally believe the people who damage the camera infrastructure are antagonistic towards the present mayor for another reason beyond money.

No shit

Super_Eddie_Youds

Davynix said:

Lurker said:

Davynix said:

Bournemouth Addick said:

charltonkeston said:

Rizzo said:

guinnessaddick said:

https://twitter.com/kent_999s/status/1732506561438785713?s=46&t=l3gVPecVjs4wU2WBKFZZyw

We heard the explosion from Welling. Drove past the van in that video a few days later after the road had reopened and it was proper fucked. If that van hadn't been there and anyone had been in the path of the debris they would be dead. Whoever is responsible is an absolute moron and needs to be locked up. 

They arrested a couple of men from miles away, 60 & 61 years old. They must be seriously unhinged, assuming they did it. At their age, if convicted they are never going to pay a congestion  or ULEZ charge again in their lives. Causing explosions you normally quite righty have the keys thrown away.

There should be some legal repercussions for whoever 'radicalised' these scumbags too.

Loaded phrase or not, men in their early 60's don't suddenly decide, off their own back, to start making IED's and using them on our streets.

Radicalised- behave

Radicalised - the action or process of making somebody more extreme or radical in their opinions on political, social or religious issues.

Which bit do you disagree with?  

I'm all for people protesting / taking action for a cause but this cause is just a bizarre hill to die on, leaving no alternative explanation other than radicalisation in my mind.  

Of all the issues in the UK over say the last 20 years, people want to risk prison / other peoples lives for the cause of driving an older car into London without paying a fee?

There speaks a person who is either a student or works for the public sector- the older car issue,most people can't afford to change or there's no alternative public transport wise- ffs radicalised indeed

They planted a bomb in Sidcup mate, that’s pretty extreme by anyone’s standards, not just your euphemisms for lefties. 

Friend Or Defoe

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

clive said:

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Is there an election for the Mayor's office later this year?

Explains why he's keeping ULEZ.

Friend Or Defoe

paulie8290 said:

Huskaris said:

Crusty54 said:

Child injured in crash in Orpington after traffic lights cut down.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68022438

Absolutely disgusting. These people are dickheads. 

I'm on Orpington gossip on Facebook and all I have seen today have people saying well done blade runners, brilliant taking down the traffic lights people need to drive more carefully then there wont be accidents 

As you say these people are dickheads hust care about themselves a poor child is in hospital and all they can say is well done to the people who cut the traffic lights down 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

I think a lot of people from outside of the M25 post om that group as well. Crank central.

Gribbo

clive said:

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Need to be frozen until 2035 to represent value for money

valleynick66

seth plum said:

I am pretty sure there is a mayoral election in May.
Judging by what happened in the by-election in Uxbridge the ULEZ issue might be a bit of a factor, I personally believe the people who damage the camera infrastructure are antagonistic towards the present mayor for another reason beyond money

I think knife crime is also a sad statistic and policing more generally are issues he will be criticised for. 

valleynick66

Friend Or Defoe said:

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

clive said:

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Is there an election for the Mayor's office later this year?

Explains why he's keeping ULEZ.

But didn’t we say yesterday ULEZ funds are invested in greener buses etc?

JamesSeed

seth plum said:

I am pretty sure there is a mayoral election in May.
Judging by what happened in the by-election in Uxbridge the ULEZ issue might be a bit of a factor, I personally believe the people who damage the camera infrastructure are antagonistic towards the present mayor for another reason beyond money.

If they’d held the mayoral election at that time it might have been close, but the issue get nowhere near the same level of social media hits as it did back then, now that the policy has actually been implemented. Same as happened with the congestion charge, the original ULEZ, and even the smoking ban - and even further back, the compulsorily seat belt laws.
And yes, would there have been the same level of anger if Johnson was the mayor? Maybe not. 

If you look at Khan’s tweets from during the ULEZ expansion period, the vitriol he received was off the scale, but you’d notices the same weird accounts appearing again and again. Pro Brexit, anti immigrant, pro Trump, pro bulldog (!?) etc, and very few of them located in London. It was almost as if it was an orchestrated campaign.  🤔

JamesSeed

Gribbo said:

clive said:

London mayor's has announced he is freezing Transport for London (TfL) fares until March 2025 as part of a £123m investment in the capital's transport services.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68020031

Need to be frozen until 2035 to represent value for money

I don’t follow?

JamesSeed

Davynix said:

Lurker said:

Davynix said:

Bournemouth Addick said:

charltonkeston said:

Rizzo said:

guinnessaddick said:

https://twitter.com/kent_999s/status/1732506561438785713?s=46&t=l3gVPecVjs4wU2WBKFZZyw

We heard the explosion from Welling. Drove past the van in that video a few days later after the road had reopened and it was proper fucked. If that van hadn't been there and anyone had been in the path of the debris they would be dead. Whoever is responsible is an absolute moron and needs to be locked up. 

They arrested a couple of men from miles away, 60 & 61 years old. They must be seriously unhinged, assuming they did it. At their age, if convicted they are never going to pay a congestion  or ULEZ charge again in their lives. Causing explosions you normally quite righty have the keys thrown away.

There should be some legal repercussions for whoever 'radicalised' these scumbags too.

Loaded phrase or not, men in their early 60's don't suddenly decide, off their own back, to start making IED's and using them on our streets.

Radicalised- behave

Radicalised - the action or process of making somebody more extreme or radical in their opinions on political, social or religious issues.

Which bit do you disagree with?  

I'm all for people protesting / taking action for a cause but this cause is just a bizarre hill to die on, leaving no alternative explanation other than radicalisation in my mind.  

Of all the issues in the UK over say the last 20 years, people want to risk prison / other peoples lives for the cause of driving an older car into London without paying a fee?

There speaks a person who is either a student or works for the public sector- the older car issue,most people can't afford to change or there's no alternative public transport wise- ffs radicalised indeed

This has been debated ad nauseam on here, and posters have demonstrated that you can buy a compliant car for a grand, or just over which, with the scrappage scheme, makes it affordable to most people. 

So I don’t believe that ‘most people can’t afford to change’ at all. Some can’t of course, but not most. 

The argument that this affects the poorest in society the most is nonsense. The poorest in society can’t afford to own a car as well as insure it, pay for repairs and pay for fuel.

JamesSeed

Davynix said:

seth plum said:

I am pretty sure there is a mayoral election in May.
Judging by what happened in the by-election in Uxbridge the ULEZ issue might be a bit of a factor, I personally believe the people who damage the camera infrastructure are antagonistic towards the present mayor for another reason beyond money.

No shit

And what’s your opinion on that?