I'd like to thank ME14 for the excellent articles presented, they're very insightful.
As one of nearly a million UK immunocompromised people Covid is most certainly not over for us. It's hard to say if it ever will be.
For now in our world we're just waiting for this ridiculous Government to take note of what's happening in the USA where at least they're making it easy to access the antiviral of choice in Paxlovid within 24 hours of testing positive for Covid.
There's also a second antiviral coming soon from Japan which will at least add to the armoury.
Short of that, most Immunocompromised people are desperate to get a profilactic, having had a false dawn with Evershuld. This is the hope of millions who simply want to drop the masks and feel normal again.
For me personally, having just finished 18 months of having every baby vaccine going and last week had my MMR jab I'm looking forward and will take my chances as I can't keep hiding and we've booked our first holiday in five years this summer and we can't wait.
All I ask is that the Government don't forget us and let us access the appropriate medication when we need it.
By the way Covid 19 Boosters begin 24th April, roll up roll up! Or, get your debit card ready if you're not eligible for a freebie.
Long Covid may be no different from other post-viral syndromes such as those experienced after flu, according to new research from Queensland Health.
The lead author of the study, the state’s chief health officer Dr John Gerrard, said it was “time to stop using terms like ‘long Covid’” because they imply there is something unique about the longer-term symptoms associated with the virus, and in some cases create hypervigilance.
There are different definitions of long Covid but the World Health Organization defines post-Covid or long Covid as occurring in people still experiencing symptoms three months after their initial Covid-19 infection, when those symptoms can’t be explained by an alternative diagnosis.
The study surveyed 5,112 adults who had symptoms of a respiratory illness and underwent PCR testing between May and June 2022. Of those, 2,399 were positive for Covid-19, 995 positive for influenza and 1,718 negative for both.
A year after their PCR test, participants were asked about ongoing symptoms and impairment using a questionnaire delivered by SMS link.
Overall, 16% reported ongoing symptoms a year later, and 3.6% reported moderate-to-severe impairment in their daily activities.
The results of the study, which Gerrard will present next month at the European Congress of Clinical Microbiology and Infectious Diseases in Barcelona, found no evidence that those who had Covid-19 were more likely to have functional limitations a year on compared with those who did not have Covid-19 (3.0% v 4.1%).
The 3% of the study participants who had ongoing impairments after Covid-19 infection was similar to the 3.4% with ongoing impairments after influenza.
The study also looked at specific symptoms in the patients who had moderate to severe impairment, and found in both patients who were Covid positive and negative, the same percentage (94%) reported one or more of the commonly reported symptoms of long Covid: fatigue, post exertional symptom exacerbation, brain fog and changes to taste and smell.
Gerrard said long Covid may have appeared to be a distinct and severe illness because of the high number of people infected with Covid-19 within a short period of time, rather than the severity of long Covid symptoms.
“We believe it is time to stop using terms like ‘long Covid’. They wrongly imply there is something unique and exceptional about longer-term symptoms associated with this virus. This terminology can cause unnecessary fear, and in some cases, hypervigilance to longer symptoms that can impede recovery.”
In a press conference on Friday, Gerrard said: “I want to make it clear that the symptoms that some patients described after having Covid-19 are real, and we believe they are real. What we are saying is that the incidence of these symptoms is no greater in Covid-19 than it is with other respiratory viruses, and that to use this term ‘long Covid’ is misleading and I believe harmful.”
Did you look at the article I posted yesterday, that gave links to 122 different studies on the effects of a Covid infection on the body, what you have quoted is only one study. I've posted the link again for reference:
I've posted something that had been published in one of the most reputable newspapers in the country. Sorry if it doesn't fit your narrative.
But it's just one article from one study, I posted a link to 122 different studies on the effects of a Covid infection.
I was going to engage yesterday, when you mentioned Covid 'isn't 'flu so should not be treated in the same way. A Covid infection can cause damage to the whole body.'
This is factually incorrect, and there are plenty of studies you can look into about the various and long term effects that Flu infections can have on individuals. SHG put it best when he said '“Long Covid” is little understood just as in the same way all post viral illnesses are.' The point around how they are both managed from a healthcare perspective is of course valid, but I do think it is wrong to say Covid is acting in a complete different way to Flu when it is not.
On this point, there was a bug going around my son's school last week and we got an email saying 'do not ask your child to come back to school until 48 hours after all symptoms are gone' - which is the very opposite of encouraging them to go in when they are unwell.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
Long Covid may be no different from other post-viral syndromes such as those experienced after flu, according to new research from Queensland Health.
The lead author of the study, the state’s chief health officer Dr John Gerrard, said it was “time to stop using terms like ‘long Covid’” because they imply there is something unique about the longer-term symptoms associated with the virus, and in some cases create hypervigilance.
There are different definitions of long Covid but the World Health Organization defines post-Covid or long Covid as occurring in people still experiencing symptoms three months after their initial Covid-19 infection, when those symptoms can’t be explained by an alternative diagnosis.
The study surveyed 5,112 adults who had symptoms of a respiratory illness and underwent PCR testing between May and June 2022. Of those, 2,399 were positive for Covid-19, 995 positive for influenza and 1,718 negative for both.
A year after their PCR test, participants were asked about ongoing symptoms and impairment using a questionnaire delivered by SMS link.
Overall, 16% reported ongoing symptoms a year later, and 3.6% reported moderate-to-severe impairment in their daily activities.
The results of the study, which Gerrard will present next month at the European Congress of Clinical Microbiology and Infectious Diseases in Barcelona, found no evidence that those who had Covid-19 were more likely to have functional limitations a year on compared with those who did not have Covid-19 (3.0% v 4.1%).
The 3% of the study participants who had ongoing impairments after Covid-19 infection was similar to the 3.4% with ongoing impairments after influenza.
The study also looked at specific symptoms in the patients who had moderate to severe impairment, and found in both patients who were Covid positive and negative, the same percentage (94%) reported one or more of the commonly reported symptoms of long Covid: fatigue, post exertional symptom exacerbation, brain fog and changes to taste and smell.
Gerrard said long Covid may have appeared to be a distinct and severe illness because of the high number of people infected with Covid-19 within a short period of time, rather than the severity of long Covid symptoms.
“We believe it is time to stop using terms like ‘long Covid’. They wrongly imply there is something unique and exceptional about longer-term symptoms associated with this virus. This terminology can cause unnecessary fear, and in some cases, hypervigilance to longer symptoms that can impede recovery.”
In a press conference on Friday, Gerrard said: “I want to make it clear that the symptoms that some patients described after having Covid-19 are real, and we believe they are real. What we are saying is that the incidence of these symptoms is no greater in Covid-19 than it is with other respiratory viruses, and that to use this term ‘long Covid’ is misleading and I believe harmful.”
Did you look at the article I posted yesterday, that gave links to 122 different studies on the effects of a Covid infection on the body, what you have quoted is only one study. I've posted the link again for reference:
I've posted something that had been published in one of the most reputable newspapers in the country. Sorry if it doesn't fit your narrative.
But it's just one article from one study, I posted a link to 122 different studies on the effects of a Covid infection.
I was going to engage yesterday, when you mentioned Covid 'isn't 'flu so should not be treated in the same way. A Covid infection can cause damage to the whole body.'
This is factually incorrect, and there are plenty of studies you can look into about the various and long term effects that Flu infections can have on individuals. SHG put it best when he said '“Long Covid” is little understood just as in the same way all post viral illnesses are.'
The point around how they are both managed from a healthcare perspective is of course valid, but I do think it is wrong to say Covid is acting in a complete different way to Flu when it is not.
On this point, there was a bug going around my son's school last week and we got an email saying 'do not ask your child to come back to school until 48 hours after all symptoms are gone' - which is the very opposite of encouraging them to go in when they are unwell.
As I said in an earlier post, Flu is on the whole seasonal and how many times in a lifetime do people experience it? I'm 66 and have had proper flu on only 2 occasions. Covid is so prevalent that people are having it multiple times and each time the risk of long term damage grows.
I agree that we know Long Covid is little understood, but we do know from the many studies on Covid infections that it CAN cause long term damage to the body, so given that we do know so little, surely the population deserve to be told of the risks from the studies we do know about.
How many times do you hear people saying 'now that Covid is over'? They are saying it because they are not being told the truth. Continuing with the rhetoric that Covid is over is so wrong.
I don't wear a mask in public any more, but I would not go out if there is the slightest suspicion that I have an illness that might be dangerous to other people. I do see posts from people who are very much at risk if they catch Covid and they feel abandoned by our Government. How many more will find themselves in that situation because the population is being told that Covid is over.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
I'd like to thank ME14 for the excellent articles presented, they're very insightful.
As one of nearly a million UK immunocompromised people Covid is most certainly not over for us. It's hard to say if it ever will be.
For now in our world we're just waiting for this ridiculous Government to take note of what's happening in the USA where at least they're making it easy to access the antiviral of choice in Paxlovid within 24 hours of testing positive for Covid.
There's also a second antiviral coming soon from Japan which will at least add to the armoury.
Short of that, most Immunocompromised people are desperate to get a profilactic, having had a false dawn with Evershuld. This is the hope of millions who simply want to drop the masks and feel normal again.
For me personally, having just finished 18 months of having every baby vaccine going and last week had my MMR jab I'm looking forward and will take my chances as I can't keep hiding and we've booked our first holiday in five years this summer and we can't wait.
All I ask is that the Government don't forget us and let us access the appropriate medication when we need it.
By the way Covid 19 Boosters begin 24th April, roll up roll up! Or, get your debit card ready if you're not eligible for a freebie.
I see pleas for more help from many people like you, our Government has been one of the worst for providing effective treatment for vulnerable people. Our vaccination programme has been scaled back more than most countries, when we know that vaccination can mitigate some of the effects of Covid infection. It's appalling that Covid vaccines are going to be available for those with the deepest pockets, yet again those least able to afford a vaccine will be left to suffer the effects if they catch the virus.
Everyone is ignoring the economic effects of so many people unable to work due to long term illness. At the end of 2023 there were 2.8 million people claiming sickness benefit which was an increase of 200,00 on the previous year.
I hope that you can enjoy your holiday this year and that you can get any treatments you need.
I'd like to thank ME14 for the excellent articles presented, they're very insightful.
As one of nearly a million UK immunocompromised people Covid is most certainly not over for us. It's hard to say if it ever will be.
For now in our world we're just waiting for this ridiculous Government to take note of what's happening in the USA where at least they're making it easy to access the antiviral of choice in Paxlovid within 24 hours of testing positive for Covid.
There's also a second antiviral coming soon from Japan which will at least add to the armoury.
Short of that, most Immunocompromised people are desperate to get a profilactic, having had a false dawn with Evershuld. This is the hope of millions who simply want to drop the masks and feel normal again.
For me personally, having just finished 18 months of having every baby vaccine going and last week had my MMR jab I'm looking forward and will take my chances as I can't keep hiding and we've booked our first holiday in five years this summer and we can't wait.
All I ask is that the Government don't forget us and let us access the appropriate medication when we need it.
By the way Covid 19 Boosters begin 24th April, roll up roll up! Or, get your debit card ready if you're not eligible for a freebie.
I see pleas for more help from many people like you, our Government has been one of the worst for providing effective treatment for vulnerable people. Our vaccination programme has been scaled back more than most countries, when we know that vaccination can mitigate some of the effects of Covid infection. It's appalling that Covid vaccines are going to be available for those with the deepest pockets, yet again those least able to afford a vaccine will be left to suffer the effects if they catch the virus.
Everyone is ignoring the economic effects of so many people unable to work due to long term illness. At the end of 2023 there were 2.8 million people claiming sickness benefit which was an increase of 200,00 on the previous year.
I hope that you can enjoy your holiday this year and that you can get any treatments you need.
Thanks ME14, at least your a voice of reason and for that I appreciate it. For what it's worth my Consultant has said many times that Covid is not the flu or pneumonia, it's a potential killer for immunosuppressed and immunocompromised people of ANY age so be careful.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
A runny nose and/or a stomach ache can be symptoms of Covid. Pupils were able to study at home when the schools were closed, we now have the technology for pupils to study at home if they are have symptoms but feel well enough to attend class remotely.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
A runny nose and/or a stomach ache can be symptoms of Covid. Pupils were able to study at home when the schools were closed, we now have the technology for pupils to study at home if they are have symptoms but feel well enough to attend class remotely.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
Great that kids can learn from home if they have a snotty nose, how does the country function though and people pay bills when millions of parents can't work ? If my son is well enough to work from home... he's well enough to attend actial school in person.
It's great that the vulnerable are considered, but how does the rest of society function ?
It anecdotally seems worse 'post' covid as millions of children stopped mixing and working on the natural immune systems.
Another article on why we should care about a virus that has a 99.8% survival rate.
It is long but well presented and highlights the actual impact a virus with a high survival rate can have on the population and why it is all the people who survive that we should be most worried about.
We should all be informed about risks that a Covid infection poses, it's unforgivable that the vast majority of the population is unaware of these risks.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
It’s about balance and risk. My children’s school sent an email last year explaining if your child is suspected of having chicken pox or measles to let them know immediately, and the same if a member of the household has shingles. This was because a pupil was having treatment for cancer.
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
Covid isn’t like influenza and never has been. Although both are predominantly respiratory tract infections it’s a completely different virus and will impact the body in ways that influenza doesn’t. The fact that some of the symptoms of both are similar in some respect is incidental. It was an easy jump for the media and others during the worst of the pandemic to equate one to the other. People understood the flu. That doesn’t mean though that we don’t need to individually treat Covid in a similar way to how we view influenza. It’s a virus that we are all going to be exposed to for ever more. It’s now part of the viral landscape. We all know some viruses are worse to contract than others but for this argument, both influenza and Covid are potential killers. Those that are in need of extra protection via vaccines and anti viral drugs should expect to have that protection. Those that are generally fit and healthy should act responsibly and be aware of the risks but have to get on with it. Acting responsibly is actually more difficult with Covid because not everyone that has it has symptoms or they are so mild that you wouldn’t think to act any differently to normal. Going forward I’d in my humble opinion suggest that those that feel vulnerable take as many precautions as they see fit and those that are in robust health act sensibly. I’d expect someone with a nut allergy to take responsibility for their own wellbeing. Sadly that will impact on their lives but those are the breaks.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
It’s about balance and risk. My children’s school sent an email last year explaining if your child is suspected of having chicken pox or measles to let them know immediately, and the same if a member of the household has shingles. This was because a pupil was having treatment for cancer.
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
Have a read of the article I posted above and make up your own mind as to whether the overall risk is low.
Covid isn’t like influenza and never has been. Although both are predominantly respiratory tract infections it’s a completely different virus and will impact the body in ways that influenza doesn’t. The fact that some of the symptoms of both are similar in some respect is incidental. It was an easy jump for the media and others during the worst of the pandemic to equate one to the other. People understood the flu. That doesn’t mean though that we don’t need to individually treat Covid in a similar way to how we view influenza. It’s a virus that we are all going to be exposed to for ever more. It’s now part of the viral landscape. We all know some viruses are worse to contract than others but for this argument, both influenza and Covid are potential killers. Those that are in need of extra protection via vaccines and anti viral drugs should expect to have that protection. Those that are generally fit and healthy should act responsibly and be aware of the risks but have to get on with it. Acting responsibly is actually more difficult with Covid because not everyone that has it has symptoms or they are so mild that you wouldn’t think to act any differently to normal. Going forward I’d in my humble opinion suggest that those that feel vulnerable take as many precautions as they see fit and those that are in robust health act sensibly. I’d expect someone with a nut allergy to take responsibility for their own wellbeing. Sadly that will impact on their lives but those are the breaks.
The point I'm trying to get across is that the vast majority of people are unaware of the risks, because there is a concerted effort by governments and much of the media to downplay the risks. If more people were aware of the risks they would be demanding better protection such as good filtration of air in public places.
It's going to be hard to get the message across if the reaction on this site is anything to go by.
The effect of so much long term illness on the economy shouldn't be overlooked, The UK was one of the first countries to remove all mitigations and we're now paying the price with so much ill health.
Years of austerity, followed by Covid, have left Britain with unhealthy workers and businesses struggling to recruit, but the road to recovery, of all kinds, will be long
Britain has a sick economy and it is getting sicker. The clear message from last week’s raft of economic data is that the UK is being held back by the growing number of people not able to work because of long-term illness.
There are many theories about why the trend is worsening. Possible factors include long Covid, delays in NHS treatment as waiting lists grow longer, poor workplace practices, stress and the impact of austerity.
But one thing is certain. The economic impact of ill health is a headache for Jeremy Hunt. It will be a headache for Rachel Reeves if she becomes the first female chancellor. It is a headache for every business that is struggling to fill vacancies.
Figures released last week by the Office for National Statistics illustrated the extent of the problem. The number of people saying they are inactive due to long-term sickness is now 2.8 million – an increase of more than 200,000 in the past year and of 700,000 since the pandemic started in 2020.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
It’s about balance and risk. My children’s school sent an email last year explaining if your child is suspected of having chicken pox or measles to let them know immediately, and the same if a member of the household has shingles. This was because a pupil was having treatment for cancer.
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
Have a read of the article I posted above and make up your own mind as to whether the overall risk is low.
When a lot of the time a mild cold or cough is going to be exactly that you can’t expect schools to tell parents to keep a child at home for a week or two until they’re better.
Is that what you’d like them to do? That’s the impression I got when you said it’s not common sense. It’s not practical for parents at all.
For nursery aged children it’s even worse, they constantly have mild illnesses as they’re passed around so easily at that age and in that environment. As they get older it reduces, which partly must be through building up their immune system at a younger age. Stopping that would be a risk too.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
It’s about balance and risk. My children’s school sent an email last year explaining if your child is suspected of having chicken pox or measles to let them know immediately, and the same if a member of the household has shingles. This was because a pupil was having treatment for cancer.
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
Have a read of the article I posted above and make up your own mind as to whether the overall risk is low.
When a lot of the time a mild cold or cough is going to be exactly that you can’t expect schools to tell parents to keep a child at home for a week or two until they’re better.
Is that what you’d like them to do? That’s the impression I got when you said it’s not common sense. It’s not practical for parents at all.
For nursery aged children it’s even worse, they constantly have mild illnesses as they’re passed around so easily at that age and in that environment. As they get older it reduces, which partly must be through building up their immune system at a younger age. Stopping that would be a risk too.
Perhaps there should be a compete re-think on dealing with illness - better sick pay for workers and parental leave for looking after sick children, could in the long run reduce the amount of ill health. More people can work from home now and better sick pay would allow people to isolate themselves if unwell. It's something that should have been done properly in the first 2 years of the pandemic when there was a good chance of reducing infection to very low levels.
If we can reduce the spread of viruses, fewer people will need to take time off. As I've stated before, there is a big hit to the economy with so much illness, so the let it rip plan is not without costs to the economy and health.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
You can say that again. I kept our youngest off to get up and clean the inside of our chimney. The looks the neighbours gave me when his head popped out the top.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
A runny nose and/or a stomach ache can be symptoms of Covid. Pupils were able to study at home when the schools were closed, we now have the technology for pupils to study at home if they are have symptoms but feel well enough to attend class remotely.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
Great that kids can learn from home if they have a snotty nose, how does the country function though and people pay bills when millions of parents can't work ? If my son is well enough to work from home... he's well enough to attend actial school in person.
It's great that the vulnerable are considered, but how does the rest of society function ?
It anecdotally seems worse 'post' covid as millions of children stopped mixing and working on the natural immune systems.
It's over 2 years since almost all restrictions were released, the 'immunity debt' argument went away long ago.
Some kids have almost permanent sniffles, so under ME14's proposal they would miss a substantial amount of schooling.
I remember my nephew had a permanent runny nose for many many years. He would never have been allowed to go to school.
A significant amount of children are suffering from mental health issues due to lockdown and it is totally wrong and also unworkable to be proposing that children are kept off school for every illness, including the slightest sniffle.
I think you've lost touch with the reality of the lives of people with children and grandchildren.
It was quite apparent from the early Covid days that you you would find it nigh on impossible to return to living a normal life. I'm very sorry that it has turned out that way. All the best.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
A runny nose and/or a stomach ache can be symptoms of Covid. Pupils were able to study at home when the schools were closed, we now have the technology for pupils to study at home if they are have symptoms but feel well enough to attend class remotely.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
Great that kids can learn from home if they have a snotty nose, how does the country function though and people pay bills when millions of parents can't work ? If my son is well enough to work from home... he's well enough to attend actial school in person.
It's great that the vulnerable are considered, but how does the rest of society function ?
It anecdotally seems worse 'post' covid as millions of children stopped mixing and working on the natural immune systems.
It's over 2 years since almost all restrictions were released, the 'immunity debt' argument went away long ago.
What immunity debt ? Youve misread my post. Things regards children's sickness have pretty much returned to normal... it seemed different for 2 years as any sign of sickness and they were off school... and parents not working either, which was OK when people got paid to sit at home.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache. I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache. My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
We are now living in different times, we have a new virus that we do know can cause damage to peoples health, so should be taking more care to stop the spread of illnesses.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
It’s about balance and risk. My children’s school sent an email last year explaining if your child is suspected of having chicken pox or measles to let them know immediately, and the same if a member of the household has shingles. This was because a pupil was having treatment for cancer.
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
Have a read of the article I posted above and make up your own mind as to whether the overall risk is low.
When a lot of the time a mild cold or cough is going to be exactly that you can’t expect schools to tell parents to keep a child at home for a week or two until they’re better.
Is that what you’d like them to do? That’s the impression I got when you said it’s not common sense. It’s not practical for parents at all.
For nursery aged children it’s even worse, they constantly have mild illnesses as they’re passed around so easily at that age and in that environment. As they get older it reduces, which partly must be through building up their immune system at a younger age. Stopping that would be a risk too.
Perhaps there should be a compete re-think on dealing with illness - better sick pay for workers and parental leave for looking after sick children, could in the long run reduce the amount of ill health. More people can work from home now and better sick pay would allow people to isolate themselves if unwell. It's something that should have been done properly in the first 2 years of the pandemic when there was a good chance of reducing infection to very low levels.
If we can reduce the spread of viruses, fewer people will need to take time off. As I've stated before, there is a big hit to the economy with so much illness, so the let it rip plan is not without costs to the economy and health.
A complete rethink is what it would take but there would be so much to consider that it couldn’t be entirely focussed on Covid. There are other impacts that are a higher priority, children need to go to school regularly for education and socialising, and people need to work to pay the bills.
There are so many aspects to it, to mention a few where the sick pay comes from and how it works for self employed people. Then there’s the negative impact on physical and mental health that would come from being at home all the time (almost literally for some children) and effectively locking down for any minor illness.
It’s a lot more than a shift in attitudes and what you’re suggesting has plenty of negatives that for most people outweigh the benefits.
An interesting aspect of this post pandemic period is just how far and how much attitudes have been changed. I very much doubt the world will wait as long as it previously did before we are subject to another pandemic. Will governments be ready and prepared and will people be as inclined to do the necessary?
Some kids have almost permanent sniffles, so under ME14's proposal they would miss a substantial amount of schooling.
I remember my nephew had a permanent runny nose for many many years. He would never have been allowed to go to school.
A significant amount of children are suffering from mental health issues due to lockdown and it is totally wrong and also unworkable to be proposing that children are kept off school for every illness, including the slightest sniffle.
I think you've lost touch with the reality of the lives of people with children and grandchildren.
It was quite apparent from the early Covid days that you you would find it nigh on impossible to return to living a normal life. I'm very sorry that it has turned out that way. All the best.
I lead a perfectly normal life, you're quite wrong to suggest that I don't.
What I am suggesting is that with all the evidence that we have, that having a Covid infection can cause so many health problems, we should be informing people of those risks. Instead it is being hidden from most of the population. If it was explained to people that letting your child have multiple infections may well affect their health for life, I think the attitude would be very different.
The number of people living with long term illness is growing and when we have a virus that is known to cause so many of those illnesses, it is wrong to keep that information from the population.
If children with new symptoms could be tested for Covid, we could then keep those children at home and prevent them from mixing until clear.
@ShootersHillGuru sadly many have learnt nothing from the early pandemic years and when the next pandemic hits, which it surely will, I think it will be very difficult to take the necessary actions to prevent huge loss of life and illness.
An interesting aspect of this post pandemic period is just how far and how much attitudes have been changed. I very much doubt the world will wait as long as it previously did before we are subject to another pandemic. Will governments be ready and prepared and will people be as inclined to do the necessary?
I suspect the public will be far less willing to comply, chiefly due to the blatant double standards in compliance with previous lockdowns and regulations by the government of the day. The constant stream of misinformation from certain sources will also mean that people will be far more prepared to ignore medical facts.
Pray to whatever you hold dear that the next pandemic is as mild as this one. Imagine something like Ebola, with a mortality rate averaging about 50% and going as high as 90% in some places!
An interesting aspect of this post pandemic period is just how far and how much attitudes have been changed. I very much doubt the world will wait as long as it previously did before we are subject to another pandemic. Will governments be ready and prepared and will people be as inclined to do the necessary?
I suspect the public will be far less willing to comply, chiefly due to the blatant double standards in compliance with previous lockdowns and regulations by the government of the day. The constant stream of misinformation from certain sources will also mean that people will be far more prepared to ignore medical facts.
Pray to whatever you hold dear that the next pandemic is as mild as this one. Imagine something like Ebola, with a mortality rate averaging about 50% and going as high as 90% in some places!
Unfortunately we had the worst possible Government in charge. Anyone listening to the Covid Inquiry will know that to be the case.
In the last 2 years protection for the population by vaccination had been far worse than many comparable countries. I believe that inyil very recently, the US was suggesting that everyone get boosters, including children
An interesting aspect of this post pandemic period is just how far and how much attitudes have been changed. I very much doubt the world will wait as long as it previously did before we are subject to another pandemic. Will governments be ready and prepared and will people be as inclined to do the necessary?
I suspect the public will be far less willing to comply, chiefly due to the blatant double standards in compliance with previous lockdowns and regulations by the government of the day. The constant stream of misinformation from certain sources will also mean that people will be far more prepared to ignore medical facts.
Pray to whatever you hold dear that the next pandemic is as mild as this one. Imagine something like Ebola, with a mortality rate averaging about 50% and going as high as 90% in some places!
Unfortunately we had the worst possible Government in charge. Anyone listening to the Covid Inquiry will know that to be the case.
In the last 2 years protection for the population by vaccination had been far worse than many comparable countries. I believe that inyil very recently, the US was suggesting that everyone get boosters, including children
Prescription drug and medicines are often reported as being far more expensive in the US and although Joe Biden seems to have been trying to do something about that of late I’d rather take the cynical view that a call for everyone in the US to get boosters might be more driven by the desire to make more profits. It’s easy to take the same cynical view in this country given the contracts that were supposedly dished out to friends of ministers but to counter that I would have suspected that those health scientists and advisors we had and have would have probably spoken out by now if they felt it was unsafe and Jeremy Hunt as the current Chancellor would have told them to do one on the cost of it this side of a general election given that unlike the US it would be the UK government that would be paying the bill and he’d need to really piss off voters by upping income tax and NI
Some kids have almost permanent sniffles, so under ME14's proposal they would miss a substantial amount of schooling.
I remember my nephew had a permanent runny nose for many many years. He would never have been allowed to go to school.
A significant amount of children are suffering from mental health issues due to lockdown and it is totally wrong and also unworkable to be proposing that children are kept off school for every illness, including the slightest sniffle.
I think you've lost touch with the reality of the lives of people with children and grandchildren.
It was quite apparent from the early Covid days that you you would find it nigh on impossible to return to living a normal life. I'm very sorry that it has turned out that way. All the best.
I lead a perfectly normal life, you're quite wrong to suggest that I don't.
What I am suggesting is that with all the evidence that we have, that having a Covid infection can cause so many health problems, we should be informing people of those risks. Instead it is being hidden from most of the population. If it was explained to people that letting your child have multiple infections may well affect their health for life, I think the attitude would be very different.
The number of people living with long term illness is growing and when we have a virus that is known to cause so many of those illnesses, it is wrong to keep that information from the population.
If children with new symptoms could be tested for Covid, we could then keep those children at home and prevent them from mixing until clear.
@ShootersHillGuru sadly many have learnt nothing from the early pandemic years and when the next pandemic hits, which it surely will, I think it will be very difficult to take the necessary actions to prevent huge loss of life and illness.
With all due respect ME you make it sound like the government are deliberately hiding stuff from the general public and that we are all to stupid to realise. When in fact I believe most people are fully aware of what Covid entails. The thing is we all draw our own conclusions as to the potential dangers and act accordingly. Most of us are happy to have the booster injection when it when offered and then carry on our lives as usual. You see it as a bigger problem and that's fine but most of us don't see it in the Same way as you do.
Not everyone can work from home. So what do those do with a kid who has a runny nose. Take annual leave at short notice? Lose a day's salary so you can set your kid up in the front room with an ipad/laptop that you might not even own. All for a runny nose 🤦♂️
Not everyone can work from home. So what do those do with a kid who has a runny nose. Take annual leave at short notice? Lose a day's salary so you can set your kid up in the front room with an ipad/laptop that you might not even own. All for a runny nose 🤦♂️
In perhaps a perfectly perfect world, that might be the way to go but we don’t live in that world so we have to recognise that will rarely if ever happen. Adjust to the reality and get on with it.
Comments
Bubonic plague still exists in a few places…..Madagascar being one and quite unbelievably California!
This is factually incorrect, and there are plenty of studies you can look into about the various and long term effects that Flu infections can have on individuals. SHG put it best when he said '“Long Covid” is little understood just as in the same way all post viral illnesses are.'
The point around how they are both managed from a healthcare perspective is of course valid, but I do think it is wrong to say Covid is acting in a complete different way to Flu when it is not.
On this point, there was a bug going around my son's school last week and we got an email saying 'do not ask your child to come back to school until 48 hours after all symptoms are gone' - which is the very opposite of encouraging them to go in when they are unwell.
The government are campaigning to send children to school if they have a runny nose or stomach ache.
I don't ever recall being kept off school due to illness, definitely not for a runny nose or stomach ache.
My view is the government are campaigning for common sense.
If the campaign was to send your kids to school if they have Covid, that would be a different matter. But I can't see that they are.
I agree that we know Long Covid is little understood, but we do know from the many studies on Covid infections that it CAN cause long term damage to the body, so given that we do know so little, surely the population deserve to be told of the risks from the studies we do know about.
How many times do you hear people saying 'now that Covid is over'? They are saying it because they are not being told the truth. Continuing with the rhetoric that Covid is over is so wrong.
I don't wear a mask in public any more, but I would not go out if there is the slightest suspicion that I have an illness that might be dangerous to other people. I do see posts from people who are very much at risk if they catch Covid and they feel abandoned by our Government. How many more will find themselves in that situation because the population is being told that Covid is over.
During the early days of the pandemic, much was made of the idea that in future, people will have learnt that it isn't acceptable to go out if you have symptoms of illness, unfortunately that learning has been lost very quickly.
It is not common sense to send children to school with a runny nose or stomach ache, it is risking the health of other people.
Everyone is ignoring the economic effects of so many people unable to work due to long term illness. At the end of 2023 there were 2.8 million people claiming sickness benefit which was an increase of 200,00 on the previous year.
I hope that you can enjoy your holiday this year and that you can get any treatments you need.
We are living in a different world, things are not the same as they were pre 2020.
It's great that the vulnerable are considered, but how does the rest of society function ?
It anecdotally seems worse 'post' covid as millions of children stopped mixing and working on the natural immune systems.
It is long but well presented and highlights the actual impact a virus with a high survival rate can have on the population and why it is all the people who survive that we should be most worried about.
We should all be informed about risks that a Covid infection poses, it's unforgivable that the vast majority of the population is unaware of these risks.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/16jhcwz02T4AoIzipf0Z1RQkZSak0UzIm1J_J_W98gv4/edit?fbclid=IwAR1HnrEeWf8QvSEU-usuMrO12S9o4EbiWddcaa6TWxXwkn5GGEN0Gzn3K2Y
They know realistically they can’t demand parents stop working to keep their children off for a week or two due to a mild cough or cold. That’s common sense because overall the risk is relatively low.
It's going to be hard to get the message across if the reaction on this site is anything to go by.
The effect of so much long term illness on the economy shouldn't be overlooked, The UK was one of the first countries to remove all mitigations and we're now paying the price with so much ill health.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2024/feb/17/record-long-term-sickness-bodes-ill-for-uk-economic-growth
Years of austerity, followed by Covid, have left Britain with unhealthy workers and businesses struggling to recruit, but the road to recovery, of all kinds, will be long
There are many theories about why the trend is worsening. Possible factors include long Covid, delays in NHS treatment as waiting lists grow longer, poor workplace practices, stress and the impact of austerity.
But one thing is certain. The economic impact of ill health is a headache for Jeremy Hunt. It will be a headache for Rachel Reeves if she becomes the first female chancellor. It is a headache for every business that is struggling to fill vacancies.
Figures released last week by the Office for National Statistics illustrated the extent of the problem. The number of people saying they are inactive due to long-term sickness is now 2.8 million – an increase of more than 200,000 in the past year and of 700,000 since the pandemic started in 2020.
This matters, and not just for those who would be working if their circumstances were different. This high level of long-term illness helps explain why the UK’s workforce is 700,000 smaller than its pre-Covid level, why the labour market is so tight and why the economy is flatlining.
Is that what you’d like them to do? That’s the impression I got when you said it’s not common sense. It’s not practical for parents at all.
For nursery aged children it’s even worse, they constantly have mild illnesses as they’re passed around so easily at that age and in that environment. As they get older it reduces, which partly must be through building up their immune system at a younger age. Stopping that would be a risk too.
If we can reduce the spread of viruses, fewer people will need to take time off. As I've stated before, there is a big hit to the economy with so much illness, so the let it rip plan is not without costs to the economy and health.
The looks the neighbours gave me when his head popped out the top.
I remember my nephew had a permanent runny nose for many many years.
He would never have been allowed to go to school.
A significant amount of children are suffering from mental health issues due to lockdown and it is totally wrong and also unworkable to be proposing that children are kept off school for every illness, including the slightest sniffle.
I think you've lost touch with the reality of the lives of people with children and grandchildren.
It was quite apparent from the early Covid days that you you would find it nigh on impossible to return to living a normal life. I'm very sorry that it has turned out that way. All the best.
There are so many aspects to it, to mention a few where the sick pay comes from and how it works for self employed people. Then there’s the negative impact on physical and mental health that would come from being at home all the time (almost literally for some children) and effectively locking down for any minor illness.
It’s a lot more than a shift in attitudes and what you’re suggesting has plenty of negatives that for most people outweigh the benefits.
What I am suggesting is that with all the evidence that we have, that having a Covid infection can cause so many health problems, we should be informing people of those risks. Instead it is being hidden from most of the population. If it was explained to people that letting your child have multiple infections may well affect their health for life, I think the attitude would be very different.
The number of people living with long term illness is growing and when we have a virus that is known to cause so many of those illnesses, it is wrong to keep that information from the population.
If children with new symptoms could be tested for Covid, we could then keep those children at home and prevent them from mixing until clear.
@ShootersHillGuru sadly many have learnt nothing from the early pandemic years and when the next pandemic hits, which it surely will, I think it will be very difficult to take the necessary actions to prevent huge loss of life and illness.
Pray to whatever you hold dear that the next pandemic is as mild as this one. Imagine something like Ebola, with a mortality rate averaging about 50% and going as high as 90% in some places!
In the last 2 years protection for the population by vaccination had been far worse than many comparable countries. I believe that inyil very recently, the US was suggesting that everyone get boosters, including children
Prescription drug and medicines are often reported as being far more expensive in the US and although Joe Biden seems to have been trying to do something about that of late I’d rather take the cynical view that a call for everyone in the US to get boosters might be more driven by the desire to make more profits. It’s easy to take the same cynical view in this country given the contracts that were supposedly dished out to friends of ministers but to counter that I would have suspected that those health scientists and advisors we had and have would have probably spoken out by now if they felt it was unsafe and Jeremy Hunt as the current Chancellor would have told them to do one on the cost of it this side of a general election given that unlike the US it would be the UK government that would be paying the bill and he’d need to really piss off voters by upping income tax and NI
When in fact I believe most people are fully aware of what Covid entails.
The thing is we all draw our own conclusions as to the potential dangers and act accordingly. Most of us are happy to have the booster injection when it when offered and then carry on our lives as usual.
You see it as a bigger problem and that's fine but most of us don't see it in the Same way as you do.