The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Can you explain why you think the EU won't exist in ten years? It seems an extremely fantastical idea for anyone living in Europe -despite its organisational flaws it is not going anywhere, with or without the UK.
I think the EU project could end in failure but difficult to put a timespan on in. It could also go from strength to strength and we should be in the inside trying to ensure the latter and challenging Germany who have too much power in it!
Having just returned from Italy, I can tell you their leadership is anti EU. Watch this space!
But in a sensible country "anti EU" means reform rather than leave, and we've arrived at a place where Italy is actually a more sensible country than the UK.
Yes, it is incredible isn't it? Never thought we would get there! of course if we left and did well out of it, it might persuade others to give it a go. Which is exactly why the EU won't let us if it were possible. And I was saying this during the referendum. The EU without us is still much stronger than us on our own, much, much stronger and if people think the Chinese and Trump will come to the rescue they are deluded.
There was a graphic showing the countries the world does the most trade with by putting that county's flag over the country in question. Virtually the whole world had the German Flag - Ireland, god bless em, had the Union Jack. But it does beg the question how Germany negotiated these trade deals when we have to leave the EU to do it. I can't be anything to do with the quality of the goods they produce, surely. This is one of the big lies we are fed by Johnson, Mogg, Fox et all!
Mutts, I agree with a lot of what you say but not this view that attributes personal characteristics, like vindictiveness, to a massively complex, multi-national organisation like the EU. If the EU uses its economic or legal clout to our detriment in the future it will be because that's in the interests of its members. Not as a form of punishment. That's exactly the sort of behaviour I'd want from our own government if they were halfway competent, which they aren't of course.
They aren't going to make it easy to leave, they don't want us to leave and it was never going to be easy to leave but I don't believe they are doing anything that we wouldn't expect if we were still in and it were, say Italy, that threw it's toys out of the pram and wanted to leave.
Wouldn't we expect Italy to stump up its share financially, sort out what it wants to do with its borders, citizens rights, etc? Would we be happy for Italy to demand this, that and the other including preferential access in the future to our markets over other third party countries...but not have to contribute to the administration of that market place, etc?
I think we'd all be going gammon faced in that situation and demanding heads on sticks from our political leaders for allowing competitors to sort through the selection box of EU treats picking out the best ones while leaving us to not only pay for the box but with a handful of those disgusting strawberry cream ones.
It will never 'go well' if we leave, because finance and business is not the only measure of success and failure. The UK has voted for undemocratic nationalism so nothing can stop it being a miserable disaster even if every man woman and child in the UK got a free £10,000.
So........some people might see your image as a bunch of people having a great laugh having paid money for the ride, and all ending up safely at the end, happier for the experience.
One of the beauties of pitures is that people can interpret them however they like. I'm really struggling to see anyone that's having a 'great laugh' though. My personal interpretation came from the name of the ride, Oblivion. Which genuinely sums up where I fear we're heading. Let's hope that you are right and I am wrong.
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
Plenty of people may have had sympathetic views towards UKIP and voted in a general election partly through protest before the referendum was called.
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
Plenty of people may have had sympathetic views towards UKIP and voted in a general election partly through protest before the referendum was called.
I've come across people who didn't want to leave and do not think we should be leaving ...but who voted Leave.
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
Plenty of people may have had sympathetic views towards UKIP and voted in a general election partly through protest before the referendum was called.
I've come across people who didn't want to leave and do not think we should be leaving ...but who voted Leave.
Utter feckwits mind...
Me too. They "they wanted to send a message to the government" they did that all right (they also don't like immigrants, so there's probably that too)
Not sure if anyone else noticed but UKIP was a single issue party. What they had to say on education, health, transport, defence etc. could be written on toilet paper.
If you sympathised with what Nigel Farage had to say before the referendum and voted UKIP in the European elections and then voted to remain in the referendum then I really don’t think you were paying attention the day they were giving out brains.
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
Plenty of people may have had sympathetic views towards UKIP and voted in a general election partly through protest before the referendum was called.
I've come across people who didn't want to leave and do not think we should be leaving ...but who voted Leave.
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Come on then, money where your mouth is. Name your stake.
@nth london addick You should know what this bloke is talking about, right? Is he wrong or is he right?
Or did you sell your business and start a hedge fund, without me knowing?
Really interesting call. I’d also like to hear @nth london addick Or anyone else’s view that runs a business regularly through the Channel. Is the fella correct in what he says here?
So some UKIP voters decided to vote remain !!!!!!!! Ffs
People are allowed to change their minds. Pity more didn't.
Not sure that’s completely true regarding this. Of course people are allowed to change their minds but how can you at some point vote Ukip and then at the crucial moment vote to remain. My mind boggles but I take your point.
Plenty of people may have had sympathetic views towards UKIP and voted in a general election partly through protest before the referendum was called.
I've come across people who didn't want to leave and do not think we should be leaving ...but who voted Leave.
Utter feckwits mind...
That's mental.
Well quite, but they are out there. As @McBobbin has also experienced some Leave voters did so in the expectation they would lose but send a message to Cameron to go back to the EU for more concessions or "do something about all the immigrants" coming over here. The mental gymnastics they go through to justify their actions since Leave won is quite something.
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Can you explain why you think the EU won't exist in ten years? It seems an extremely fantastical idea for anyone living in Europe -despite its organisational flaws it is not going anywhere, with or without the UK.
I think the EU project could end in failure but difficult to put a timespan on in. It could also go from strength to strength and we should be in the inside trying to ensure the latter and challenging Germany who have too much power in it!
Having just returned from Italy, I can tell you their leadership is anti EU. Watch this space!
But in a sensible country "anti EU" means reform rather than leave, and we've arrived at a place where Italy is actually a more sensible country than the UK.
Yes, it is incredible isn't it? Never thought we would get there! of course if we left and did well out of it, it might persuade others to give it a go. Which is exactly why the EU won't let us if it were possible. And I was saying this during the referendum. The EU without us is still much stronger than us on our own, much, much stronger and if people think the Chinese and Trump will come to the rescue they are deluded.
There was a graphic showing the countries the world does the most trade with by putting that county's flag over the country in question. Virtually the whole world had the German Flag - Ireland, god bless em, had the Union Jack. But it does beg the question how Germany negotiated these trade deals when we have to leave the EU to do it. I can't be anything to do with the quality of the goods they produce, surely. This is one of the big lies we are fed by Johnson, Mogg, Fox et all!
Mutts, I agree with a lot of what you say but not this view that attributes personal characteristics, like vindictiveness, to a massively complex, multi-national organisation like the EU. If the EU uses its economic or legal clout to our detriment in the future it will be because that's in the interests of its members. Not as a form of punishment. That's exactly the sort of behaviour I'd want from our own government if they were halfway competent, which they aren't of course.
They aren't going to make it easy to leave, they don't want us to leave and it was never going to be easy to leave but I don't believe they are doing anything that we wouldn't expect if we were still in and it were, say Italy, that threw it's toys out of the pram and wanted to leave.
Wouldn't we expect Italy to stump up its share financially, sort out what it wants to do with its borders, citizens rights, etc? Would we be happy for Italy to demand this, that and the other including preferential access in the future to our markets over other third party countries...but not have to contribute to the administration of that market place, etc?
I think we'd all be going gammon faced in that situation and demanding heads on sticks from our political leaders for allowing competitors to sort through the selection box of EU treats picking out the best ones while leaving us to not only pay for the box but with a handful of those disgusting strawberry cream ones.
Yes, but you miss a bit of my point if you think I am suggesting it is vindictiveness. It is simply out of necessity, which is another reason why leaving the EU was so stupid. I personally don't think the UK could be better off out of the EU, but imagine if it was, there would be a queue to leave. If you are committed to the EU you can't take the risk, even if it is a remote one.
They will suffer some pain too, but from their perspective, it has to be done. The UK failing is going to make the EU stronger and more stable. But the EU preference is that the idiots that are trying to run us all off the cliff as fast as we can go are stopped. Actually delaying things will be welcomed by them, as they don't want to damage anybody, and the problem could be parked for somebody else to deal with in a few years, they simply have to. It is sadly common sense!
If we do leave, I will vote for any party in future who promises to imprison Michael Gove for crimes against the country as long as they promise to throw away the key. He and his Himmler, Dominic Cummings have no scruples and lie and popularise their lies to get their way and con gullible people.
The NHS advert Brexit aired should have carried a life sentence to those involved. I am reminded of a big sun story which these two crooks were behind before the 2015 general election. Gove claimed that the Department of Education had a Sauna and massage room for its staff. What the reality was, was that there was a gym in the building, run by a private company, that users had to pay for. Within the gym there was one of those cheap massage chairs. Gove painted the picture of tax payers money being used to allow staff to go about with towels on!!!! And he also announced there was a marble staircase from the ground floor to the basement floor there, painting the picture it was to rival Buckingham Palace, when it was a bog standard staircase. Maybe it had some marble on it, but it was far away from the picture he painted.
It was a big thing at the time, and Cameron even mentioned it in a live leaders debate. I would wonder what Gove thought when he became Education secretary and saw the truth, but then I know he knew it was a lie from the start. The guy is a pathological liar and even stabbed his partner in crime, Boris in the back.
Then you have Rees-Mogg who should be an exhibit in a museum and you have to sigh. And Liam Fox should not even be in politics after abusing his office. Are we going to let these morons destroy us. I like Anna Soubry - she calls these loons for what they are.
If we do leave, I will vote for any party in future who promises to imprison Michael Gove for crimes against the country as long as they promise to throw away the key. He and his Himmler, Dominic Cummings have no scruples and lie and popularise their lies to get their way and con gullible people.
The NHS advert Brexit aired should have carried a life sentence to those involved. I am reminded of a big sun story which these two crooks were behind before the 2015 general election. Gove claimed that the Department of Education had a Sauna and massage room for its staff. What the reality was, was that there was a gym in the building, run by a private company, that users had to pay for. Within the gym there was one of those cheap massage chairs. Gove painted the picture of tax payers money being used to allow staff to go about with towels on!!!! And he also announced there was a marble staircase from the ground floor to the basement floor there, painting the picture it was to rival Buckingham Palace, when it was a bog standard staircase. Maybe it had some marble on it, but it was far away from the picture he painted.
It was a big thing at the time, and Cameron even mentioned it in a live leaders debate. I would wonder what Gove thought when he became Education secretary and saw the truth, but then I know he knew it was a lie from the start. The guy is a pathological liar and even stabbed his partner in crime, Boris in the back.
Then you have Rees-Mogg who should be an exhibit in a museum and you have to sigh. And Liam Fox should not even be in politics after abusing his office. Are we going to let these morons destroy us. I like Anna Soubry - she calls these loons for what they are.
Obviously, asva remainer, I don't agree with Dominic Cummings on most things but I actually thought there was a lot of truth in this blog post that he wrote this week;
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Come on then, money where your mouth is. Name your stake.
Way safer than cryptocurrency, this...
Would definitely be interested in why @Southbank thinks the EU won't exist in ten years.
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Come on then, money where your mouth is. Name your stake.
Way safer than cryptocurrency, this...
Not a betting man, Peague. Otherwise I would have taken money off you when the the dollar went back to 1.40 against the pound, remember that?
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Come on then, money where your mouth is. Name your stake.
Way safer than cryptocurrency, this...
Would definitely be interested in why @Southbank thinks the EU won't exist in ten years.
Most likely because there will likely be a recession in that period and the debtor countries will not tolerate another going over by the German/ EU powerbase-hence what is already happening in Italy.
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
Like what?
Like saying the EU is undemocratic. When challenged with detail...no response.
The age difference between leave and remain voters is fascinating and definitely relevant. It seems almost impossible to find people under 40 or at least 30 who voted Leave, unless they are too embarrassed to admit it. Anyone know any leave voters under 30 or 40?
Yes lots. It has been a classic response from Remainers since the referendum that they do not know anybody who voted leave. If you went outside the M25 at any point , and went further north, you might ask the question the other way round.
Ah good. Won't be any problem then if there was a potential vote to rejoin then in say 10 years?
I doubt there will be anything left to rejoin in ten years.
Come on then, money where your mouth is. Name your stake.
Way safer than cryptocurrency, this...
Would definitely be interested in why @Southbank thinks the EU won't exist in ten years.
Most likely because there will likely be a recession in that period and the debtor countries will not tolerate another going over by the German/ EU powerbase-hence what is already happening in Italy.
Definitely good that you're not a betting man then.
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
Like what?
Like saying the EU is undemocratic. When challenged with detail...no response.
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
Like what?
Like saying the EU is undemocratic. When challenged with detail...no response.
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
Like what?
Like saying the EU is undemocratic. When challenged with detail...no response.
You don't have to be bloody clever or even just ordinarily clever to work it out (not that I'm suggesting that Rinse8 isn't).
Would they be the older and less educated people who have spent their lives working and paying taxes to pay for the education of young better educated people?
Obviously they should be grateful they were even allowed to vote.
None of you 'young' Remainers prepared to respond to this, funny eh.
Yes and No.
Now you go back and respond to the many times others have pulled you up on ridiculous claims and statements you have made and then not followed up when challenged.
Like what?
Like saying the EU is undemocratic. When challenged with detail...no response.
I have answered that-you may have missed it.
I think not. You asked 'like what'? There have been many points raised, for example in whatever suggestions you might have thought up regarding the Irish Border, when those suggestions have been legitimately challenged you have folded. You have certainly not demonstrated that the EU is undemocratic, and whenever you slip that opinion in I have challenged you. I have not missed your justification, because there hasn't been one.
If we do leave, I will vote for any party in future who promises to imprison Michael Gove for crimes against the country as long as they promise to throw away the key. He and his Himmler, Dominic Cummings have no scruples and lie and popularise their lies to get their way and con gullible people.
The NHS advert Brexit aired should have carried a life sentence to those involved. I am reminded of a big sun story which these two crooks were behind before the 2015 general election. Gove claimed that the Department of Education had a Sauna and massage room for its staff. What the reality was, was that there was a gym in the building, run by a private company, that users had to pay for. Within the gym there was one of those cheap massage chairs. Gove painted the picture of tax payers money being used to allow staff to go about with towels on!!!! And he also announced there was a marble staircase from the ground floor to the basement floor there, painting the picture it was to rival Buckingham Palace, when it was a bog standard staircase. Maybe it had some marble on it, but it was far away from the picture he painted.
It was a big thing at the time, and Cameron even mentioned it in a live leaders debate. I would wonder what Gove thought when he became Education secretary and saw the truth, but then I know he knew it was a lie from the start. The guy is a pathological liar and even stabbed his partner in crime, Boris in the back.
Then you have Rees-Mogg who should be an exhibit in a museum and you have to sigh. And Liam Fox should not even be in politics after abusing his office. Are we going to let these morons destroy us. I like Anna Soubry - she calls these loons for what they are.
Obviously, asva remainer, I don't agree with Dominic Cummings on most things but I actually thought there was a lot of truth in this blog post that he wrote this week;
This rant by Cummings is worth a read. As he says himself: "In short, the state has made no preparations to leave and plans to make no preparations to leave even after leaving."
A comment from the FT: "However, many of us said in advance that Brexit would be so complex that it would not be worth the effort (regardless of any merits you may believe in). Dominic Cummings should have considered that argument more carefully - complexity is a killer of good deals, and it will absolutely destroy bad deals beyond rescue. The country is now being destroyed because Dom didn't think this through properly. No point ranting now mate."
It's too late to mount a campaign to reverse the referendum and also too divisive. But there is nothing to stop us staying in the Customs Union and Single Market which would be an administrative walk in the park.
Over in Italy we have another outbreak of populism and tabloids like the Daily Mail position it as Italy vs Brussels. The reality is actually very, very different with some interesting ideas such as universal basic income to help the South, identification of a real refugee/immigration threat and the need to find solutions for the Eurozone. It isn't Italy vs Brussels and more like Rome Government vs the markets.
In other words, the populists will only survive if they don't provoke a crash in Italian bonds and assets so they have to find policy solutions which keep the lights on. Perhaps they do nothing for a year or two? That doesn't seem to have harmed the UK of late
Comments
They aren't going to make it easy to leave, they don't want us to leave and it was never going to be easy to leave but I don't believe they are doing anything that we wouldn't expect if we were still in and it were, say Italy, that threw it's toys out of the pram and wanted to leave.
Wouldn't we expect Italy to stump up its share financially, sort out what it wants to do with its borders, citizens rights, etc? Would we be happy for Italy to demand this, that and the other including preferential access in the future to our markets over other third party countries...but not have to contribute to the administration of that market place, etc?
I think we'd all be going gammon faced in that situation and demanding heads on sticks from our political leaders for allowing competitors to sort through the selection box of EU treats picking out the best ones while leaving us to not only pay for the box but with a handful of those disgusting strawberry cream ones.
Utter feckwits mind...
If you sympathised with what Nigel Farage had to say before the referendum and voted UKIP in the European elections and then voted to remain in the referendum then I really don’t think you were paying attention the day they were giving out brains.
Way safer than cryptocurrency, this...
They will suffer some pain too, but from their perspective, it has to be done. The UK failing is going to make the EU stronger and more stable. But the EU preference is that the idiots that are trying to run us all off the cliff as fast as we can go are stopped. Actually delaying things will be welcomed by them, as they don't want to damage anybody, and the problem could be parked for somebody else to deal with in a few years, they simply have to. It is sadly common sense!
The NHS advert Brexit aired should have carried a life sentence to those involved. I am reminded of a big sun story which these two crooks were behind before the 2015 general election. Gove claimed that the Department of Education had a Sauna and massage room for its staff. What the reality was, was that there was a gym in the building, run by a private company, that users had to pay for. Within the gym there was one of those cheap massage chairs. Gove painted the picture of tax payers money being used to allow staff to go about with towels on!!!! And he also announced there was a marble staircase from the ground floor to the basement floor there, painting the picture it was to rival Buckingham Palace, when it was a bog standard staircase. Maybe it had some marble on it, but it was far away from the picture he painted.
It was a big thing at the time, and Cameron even mentioned it in a live leaders debate. I would wonder what Gove thought when he became Education secretary and saw the truth, but then I know he knew it was a lie from the start. The guy is a pathological liar and even stabbed his partner in crime, Boris in the back.
Then you have Rees-Mogg who should be an exhibit in a museum and you have to sigh. And Liam Fox should not even be in politics after abusing his office. Are we going to let these morons destroy us. I like Anna Soubry - she calls these loons for what they are.
https://dominiccummings.com/2018/05/23/on-the-referendum-25-a-letter-to-tory-mps-donors-on-the-brexit-shambles/
When challenged with detail...no response.
You asked 'like what'?
There have been many points raised, for example in whatever suggestions you might have thought up regarding the Irish Border, when those suggestions have been legitimately challenged you have folded. You have certainly not demonstrated that the EU is undemocratic, and whenever you slip that opinion in I have challenged you. I have not missed your justification, because there hasn't been one.
This rant by Cummings is worth a read. As he says himself: "In short, the state has made no preparations to leave and plans to make no preparations to leave even after leaving."
A comment from the FT: "However, many of us said in advance that Brexit would be so complex that it would not be worth the effort (regardless of any merits you may believe in). Dominic Cummings should have considered that argument more carefully - complexity is a killer of good deals, and it will absolutely destroy bad deals beyond rescue. The country is now being destroyed because Dom didn't think this through properly. No point ranting now mate."
It's too late to mount a campaign to reverse the referendum and also too divisive. But there is nothing to stop us staying in the Customs Union and Single Market which would be an administrative walk in the park.
Over in Italy we have another outbreak of populism and tabloids like the Daily Mail position it as Italy vs Brussels. The reality is actually very, very different with some interesting ideas such as universal basic income to help the South, identification of a real refugee/immigration threat and the need to find solutions for the Eurozone. It isn't Italy vs Brussels and more like Rome Government vs the markets.
In other words, the populists will only survive if they don't provoke a crash in Italian bonds and assets so they have to find policy solutions which keep the lights on. Perhaps they do nothing for a year or two? That doesn't seem to have harmed the UK of late