Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
The population of the EU is 508 million. We have had the free movement of goods, services, capital and people since 1973 and net migration was 50,000 a year last century. Recently it has risen to 300,000 but is set to go back down to 200,000.
The fact is that only 1% of the EU population move regions within their country each year, let alone move country. And only 4% of EU citizens move countries in their lifetime.
The whole of Sheffield, Hull and Newcastle could move to London overnight but they don't because of the cost of living and they need a job or a serious wad of cash to make it work.
In the the US which is fully formed single currency zone, California and the East coast are popular but people live in all 50 states.
In theory the whole of SE London could move to Paris this weekend but it's not happening and it's nonsense.
The EU have made it clear that the four freedoms are indivisible. Over the next six months the debate will hopefully mature and the politicians will choose to go for WTO, Norway model perhaps followed by another vote to let people decide between the chosen option or to retain the status quo.
As people are beginning to notice nothing changes if we go with EEA and nothing happens until the Prime Minister invokes Article 50...and that's if s/he does. Some are predicting this might happen in Q4, but if this happens and the Treasury model is right then next years budget will be savage to maintain credibility.
Unless Osborne starts reading up on Keynes and uses record low rates to spend a wedge on infrastructure and jobs - who knows?
The best idea right now is to kick the can down the road and keep kicking! Farage will moan but so what - he's not even an MP and he's unlikely to have any impact on the new administration.
Hopefully we will move beyond the days of the tail wagging the dog but I won't hold my breath.
As for why the FTSE is back and where it goes? No idea but we should look at the whole picture in a few months and a year. At that point we will see what path is taken as well as the full scale of BoE intervention this last week.
One thing is that long term guilts are down to record rates - some negative even. A shame for all those old people who voted leave
I agree with you that immigration is not a bad thing,but you seem to have forgotten that 17 million people voted to leave the EU, not to ban immigration. It would be a disgrace to our democracy to 'kick the can down the road' and would amount to the kind of behaviour we always condemn when it happens in other parts of the world where governments ignore the will of the people. That is why I am supporting the campaign to trigger Brexit immediately.
Sorry Prague I misread the way I'm betting. Regarding the kipper last week's result showed us the country is split. Now do the two main parties take notice of this,i think they have to for both leave and remain. I dont think we will push the nuclear bomb button but the government have got to keep everyone happy. If I do down the line believe I've been sold a kipper I will vote accordingly, if this means voting for a party who does say "we will invoke article 50" then so be. The saddest thing in this though is a couple of weeks ago a labour mp was murdered I thought polotics and politicians might change for the better saddly over the past week I've been proved wrong.
May will win the conservative vote and unite the party. Article 50 will be put in motion. No second referendum and we go forward. Time will tell whether leave have got it right ,i believe we have
If you had any morals then you would use an alternative platform.
Yes well I have been with them since 2011 but only discovered Hargreaves odious views last month, and I will switch as soon as Fidelity or someone else manages to produce a platform fit for purpose. I did tell the guy on the phone that I didn't like his boss's comments and he sheepishly said " as a company we are neutral". I had the impression it was the 50th time he'd said it that day.
May will win the conservative vote and unite the party. Article 50 will be put in motion. No second referendum and we go forward. Time will tell whether leave have got it right ,i believe we have
As a member of the Conservative Party I am voting for May (assuming she gets to the last two) because she is basically a Remainer. She won't sign anything until we get guarantees that our economic security and health will be better by leaving (keeping the same isn't good enough for me). And bearing in mind how hard that will be to get, she will hold off as long as is required.
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
The population of the EU is 508 million. We have had the free movement of goods, services, capital and people since 1973 and net migration was 50,000 a year last century. Recently it has risen to 300,000 but is set to go back down to 200,000.
The fact is that only 1% of the EU population move regions within their country each year, let alone move country. And only 4% of EU citizens move countries in their lifetime.
The whole of Sheffield, Hull and Newcastle could move to London overnight but they don't because of the cost of living and they need a job or a serious wad of cash to make it work.
In the the US which is fully formed single currency zone, California and the East coast are popular but people live in all 50 states.
In theory the whole of SE London could move to Paris this weekend but it's not happening and it's nonsense.
The EU have made it clear that the four freedoms are indivisible. Over the next six months the debate will hopefully mature and the politicians will choose to go for WTO, Norway model perhaps followed by another vote to let people decide between the chosen option or to retain the status quo.
As people are beginning to notice nothing changes if we go with EEA and nothing happens until the Prime Minister invokes Article 50...and that's if s/he does. Some are predicting this might happen in Q4, but if this happens and the Treasury model is right then next years budget will be savage to maintain credibility.
Unless Osborne starts reading up on Keynes and uses record low rates to spend a wedge on infrastructure and jobs - who knows?
The best idea right now is to kick the can down the road and keep kicking! Farage will moan but so what - he's not even an MP and he's unlikely to have any impact on the new administration.
Hopefully we will move beyond the days of the tail wagging the dog but I won't hold my breath.
As for why the FTSE is back and where it goes? No idea but we should look at the whole picture in a few months and a year. At that point we will see what path is taken as well as the full scale of BoE intervention this last week.
One thing is that long term guilts are down to record rates - some negative even. A shame for all those old people who voted leave
I agree with you that immigration is not a bad thing,but you seem to have forgotten that 17 million people voted to leave the EU, not to ban immigration. It would be a disgrace to our democracy to 'kick the can down the road' and would amount to the kind of behaviour we always condemn when it happens in other parts of the world where governments ignore the will of the people. That is why I am supporting the campaign to trigger Brexit immediately.
Au contraire!
After my initial shock at the result and the pollsters/bookies getting it wrong (again!) I have dug into the analysis by some smart cookies to reveal that the regions voted 58:42 leave.
So the vote was emphatic and should be the catalyst for providing decent opportunities for those outside the M25. Stop the racist and xenophobic far right in their fecking tracks by spending serious government money on jobs, education, infrastructure, housing and health.
What we are witnessing is democracy in its purest form and the government with new leadership must do what it can to drop the austerity bullshit and start spending (printing) money to bolster the whole country and not just the metropolitan elite. I find myself nervously on the same platform as Varoufakis and Owen Jones because the more I look at it, the more this appears to be a schism between rich and poor, metropolitan elite and ordinary people.
It's not xenophobes, racists and people trying to break up a structure that has built peace between 28 countries.
The analysis of why the 17 million voted leave could be very complex and I don't live in the Midlands or the North so I can't comment. But I did live in a very deprived area elsewhere in Europe 25 years ago for three years and those people are pro EU because they have hope and progress.
So I accept "kicking the can" is both an over simplification as well as an ironic reference to the Euro dance etc. But it is also a euphemism for keep calm and carry on... spending
What I am really saying is that true leaders will create time and space to move our country into a place where less people are registering a protest vote and more are experiencing growth and opportunities in their post code.
That is how Thatcher and Blair kept winning elections - they kept most people happy, most of the time.
Instead we have the 5th biggest economy in the world talking austerity and cuts while cutting corporation tax for big (and I mean mega) companies from 30% down to 20%.
I could go on but my response is that the government must shift the landscape such that they can persuade enough voters to back a new deal.
Give in to the far right here and Italy, France and Austria will surely follow - don't let Trump, Le Pen, Farrage and Putin win!
I must say you all seem very calm considering a financial earthquake has just happened in your country which will soon (or is already) affect the global market.... I work in the international business department of a bank here in China and thank goodness we don't have corporate customers who do import/export business in pounds... Currency fluctuations are never good for a country's economy and I reckon there will be a lot of British companies facing financial losses now that the pound is in free fall.
Most of us have been there, done that. It's the little kids with no real experience of what to do that will be running around, panicking, chasing markets up and down. the reality is nothing has actually changed and nothing will change, in or out. The UK Will carry on trading, we will keep on crossing borders, as will the EU and the rest of the world. The Pound crashing hurts the rest of the world just as much as it does the UK. If we can't afford to buy goods because they are too expensive then it's somebody else's problem that they need to solve psq especially if our goods become a lot cheaper and undercut theirs. The Pound will be back where it started pretty soon, as will the stock markets. A lot of traders will have their fingers burnt in the meantime and a few lucky ones will make a huge profit and try and delutionally claim it was all down to their skills, whereas the reality will be they were lucky. In the meantime what really matters is who is going to be charlton's next signing and will England beat Iceland
That is such a macro view. Things will happen to real people, like job losses, not just on paper markets.
The only job losses that will happen because of this are Cameron's resignation and those traders that got fcked by last nights market swings
All that rebalancing you dismiss with a couple of sentences, what happens to people working for companies involved in this? Some companies are going to go bust, people are going to lose jobs over this.
It's not just about some headline figure, there are real social costs and consequences.
Terrible for those affected of course, but it happens! What about all the people at BHS and Woolworths etc. that have lost jobs and the industries up in the midland and Ooop north!
A job loss is a job loss - these will not be any more terrible than those that have gone before.
I know 2 ex Woolworths managers who now own their own chain of toyshops
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Dead right. I'm buggered as work enforce a set holding period given the information I have available to me. Seeing market conditions like this and the profits that can be made if you get the swing right make it very frustrating.
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Are you still "avoiding" tax? :-)
LOL, like ALL good citizens! It's a duty isn't it?
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Are you still "avoiding" tax? :-)
LOL, like ALL good citizens! It's a duty isn't it?
Tax is similar to a duty, but there are technical differences
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Are you still "avoiding" tax? :-)
LOL, like ALL good citizens! It's a duty isn't it?
Tax is similar to a duty, but there are technical differences
Actually, I think in technical terms tax IS a duty. But fuck me, it's late and this bottle of Jack is looking sexier than my Tolley's Orange book, so am sticking with that.
Freedom of movement as an ideology is deeply flawed. In theory the entire population of the EU, just short of a billion people could turn up on our doorstep, or Germany, France and demand entry. It has been sanctioned by Brussels but is not a policy that stands up to any scrutiny. There must be some quotas. Without this there would be no out verdict. A Labour wanabee should negotiate this with Merkyl and fight an election on a remain ticket.
Kerching. 10% rise in a week. Sell now and wait for the next big dip.
Exactly. Thats my 6500 sell level breached. Will sell tonight ( assuming my crap iPad is up to the task) and buy back when it tanks below 5500. (SIPP maybe at 5700) Expect that before year end although no idea exactly when or why. Events, dear boy, events, who was it said that?
And why will it stick or go positive after 5500. If it's heading that way I doubt world markets will be dealing with their national debt and consumer slow downs.
I would not be looking for a quick profit, but 5500 would be some 25% below historic high, so probably a good point for the longer term investor to buy. But I would still keep some cash back in case it drops even lower to say 5000.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
Cheers Prague. Always protect your cash, lord knows I should have done that in my youth chasing my small cap losses! The way I see it is that this year is just wobbles but by next year we'll see what the true problems are in the world markets: with a correspondingly large reaction within two years. Whilst 5,500 long term is a reasonable investment marker, Price Earnings are artificially high over the last 5 years due to huge fiscal stimulus. Now that's stopped - predominately in the US - true organic PEs are way lower.
The unfortunate aspect is whilst companies were saved when uncompetitive, they now expect to be saved again; just look at the housebuilders response recently. Still that moral segue would be true for all of us.
Comments
That is why I am supporting the campaign to trigger Brexit immediately.
Regarding the kipper last week's result showed us the country is split.
Now do the two main parties take notice of this,i think they have to for both leave and remain.
I dont think we will push the nuclear bomb button but the government have got to keep everyone happy.
If I do down the line believe I've been sold a kipper I will vote accordingly, if this means voting for a party who does say "we will invoke article 50" then so be.
The saddest thing in this though is a couple of weeks ago a labour mp was murdered I thought polotics and politicians might change for the better saddly over the past week I've been proved wrong.
Time will tell whether leave have got it right ,i believe we have
No need to rush in to it.
After my initial shock at the result and the pollsters/bookies getting it wrong (again!) I have dug into the analysis by some smart cookies to reveal that the regions voted 58:42 leave.
So the vote was emphatic and should be the catalyst for providing decent opportunities for those outside the M25. Stop the racist and xenophobic far right in their fecking tracks by spending serious government money on jobs, education, infrastructure, housing and health.
What we are witnessing is democracy in its purest form and the government with new leadership must do what it can to drop the austerity bullshit and start spending (printing) money to bolster the whole country and not just the metropolitan elite. I find myself nervously on the same platform as Varoufakis and Owen Jones because the more I look at it, the more this appears to be a schism between rich and poor, metropolitan elite and ordinary people.
It's not xenophobes, racists and people trying to break up a structure that has built peace between 28 countries.
The analysis of why the 17 million voted leave could be very complex and I don't live in the Midlands or the North so I can't comment. But I did live in a very deprived area elsewhere in Europe 25 years ago for three years and those people are pro EU because they have hope and progress.
So I accept "kicking the can" is both an over simplification as well as an ironic reference to the Euro dance etc. But it is also a euphemism for keep calm and carry on... spending
What I am really saying is that true leaders will create time and space to move our country into a place where less people are registering a protest vote and more are experiencing growth and opportunities in their post code.
That is how Thatcher and Blair kept winning elections - they kept most people happy, most of the time.
Instead we have the 5th biggest economy in the world talking austerity and cuts while cutting corporation tax for big (and I mean mega) companies from 30% down to 20%.
I could go on but my response is that the government must shift the landscape such that they can persuade enough voters to back a new deal.
Give in to the far right here and Italy, France and Austria will surely follow - don't let Trump, Le Pen, Farrage and Putin win!
Long term borrowing government borrowing costs are at all time historical lows.
I think now is the time to borrow to build infrastructure projects.
That big tidal electricity project in the Severn, government fund it and then when it's working, sell it.
Government fund local housing projects, schools, hospitals, roads and especially local transport (I like trams)
All UK markets rose strongly today, so was possibly another good day to sell, if you hadn't already.
Wait for the next big fall & dive back in. I'm sure it won't be too far away.
Reality is I am very cautious and always have more than 50% of my savings in cash. This is why I am still working while @Covered End lives the good life.:-)
:-)
It's a duty isn't it?
Xx
The unfortunate aspect is whilst companies were saved when uncompetitive, they now expect to be saved again; just look at the housebuilders response recently. Still that moral segue would be true for all of us.