The problems with recruitment weren't down to Phil Chapple, so why would replacing him resolve them?
No engagement or discussion is necessary around the sofa with T20k or anyone else. It's not "the subject of much debate". It's a shit idea from a brain-dead idiot with no understanding of football culture and has been widely ridiculed inside and outside the club. Just smash it up.
Better still, "build a bonfire" as, I believe, was the fate of our revered coffin....
I have neither the eloquence not articulation to write such a letter but more importantly I do not have the brain to think up the idea of 'I have been advised as to why I should not renew, please tell me why I should.'
Love it. DESERVES a proper answer along with an apology. Don't hold your breath.
All these emails from the club saying they are "working hard" to rectify the situation. What is it exactly they are "working hard" on? Making derogatory statements?
There is no evidence of working on anything to make the situation better, let alone working hard. Poor old flaggy seems to be the only one working hard.
I asked that question and got told this...........
There are many different ways in which we are trying to improve things. At the highest level one of the key priorities is getting a new Chief Scout who can help address the issues around recruitment - the process for that hire has continued apace this week. We will also shortly see Phase 1 complete of the new £12m training ground complex.
Then at the other end of the spectrum are other things are addressing specific concerns, like the request to have team sheets on the big screen rather than the live match feed. This is something we have changed and debuted in the match against Birmingham City at the weekend. We also know the Target 20K group are going to come to us with a request about replacing the Fan Sofa, which we know had been a point of much debate. But these changes come about through constructive engagement, something which we need to do more of.
Am I the only one left totally confused by this - they already know what Target20K are going to ask them? Are they telepathic or.. what?
Actually, I guess I already know that the club are going to send a few pointless tomorrow...
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
I didn't get a reply - I don't see why this Jarvis fella should be stealing my thunder
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
I didn't get a reply - I don't see why this Jarvis fella should be stealing my thunder
Surely your answer come in the form of pillow talk.
@DavidJarvis25 you will be surprised. Now that this letter has been given widespread awareness you will now get a carefully considered and crafted reply. Wait and see
I will publish their response when I receive one.
Not if I get one first
I know that you are working towards making sweet, sweet muesli with the CEO (I don't really trust her to manage to get anything right), but I really don't want to know if she gives you one....
All these emails from the club saying they are "working hard" to rectify the situation. What is it exactly they are "working hard" on? Making derogatory statements?
There is no evidence of working on anything to make the situation better, let alone working hard. Poor old flaggy seems to be the only one working hard.
I asked that question and got told this...........
There are many different ways in which we are trying to improve things. At the highest level one of the key priorities is getting a new Chief Scout who can help address the issues around recruitment - the process for that hire has continued apace this week. We will also shortly see Phase 1 complete of the new £12m training ground complex.
Then at the other end of the spectrum are other things are addressing specific concerns, like the request to have team sheets on the big screen rather than the live match feed. This is something we have changed and debuted in the match against Birmingham City at the weekend. We also know the Target 20K group are going to come to us with a request about replacing the Fan Sofa, which we know had been a point of much debate. But these changes come about through constructive engagement, something which we need to do more of.
All fair points.
But not enough, is it? It's like having your house falling down and the builder comes and paints the front door. It doesn't hurt but it hardly scratches the surface of what's wrong.
Most of this stuff should have been done long ago, but since they said they are going to start doing things differently they have started to show signs they will do so. If they are going to implement all the changes that need to happen they won't be able to do it overnight.
I don't have a crystal ball so I can't tell you if these are the beginnings of genuine change or if they are just a few minor steps to try and placate the rabble long enough to start the whole merry-go-round turning again at the start of next season. I do know though, that we can't just slam the club when they do things wrong, we also need to give the credit that is due when they do things right, even if that has to be tempered with an acknowledgement that it has taken too long to get around to making some of the changes.
Partly agree, on the credit where t's due point, but still nowhere near enough. There should be, as an absolute minimum:
1. An open and comprehensive acknowledgement of all the things that are wrong with the club 2. A promise that these will all be addressed 3. A forward plan setting out the actions and the timeline for each 4. Regular report backs on actions taken and next steps 5. All accompanied by real signs of engagement - meeting with the Trust, setting up the long promised and still undelivered strategy group, full responses rather than cut and paste platitudes 6. Evidence that the management of the club, the coaching set up and recruitment strategy have ALL changed.
Give them a chance, they've listened to us all season asking for a team sheet & on the 2nd April they responded. Mind you what a coincidence that they manage to do that on the day that card produce another unofficial programme.
The problems with recruitment weren't down to Phil Chapple, so why would replacing him resolve them?
Exactly. This has been irking me this last couple of days, all their guff responses have obliquely blamed Phil for the shit that's been dished up on the pitch- sure he went round Rolands garden and recommended we signed Anil Koc, sure he did...but now Phil's gone and after the obligatory many-months replacement process for any role other than HEADCOACH it will, of course, be better when there's a replacement on board....
Will there be another pre-season tournament thing in Belgium this year? It'd be a good excuse to go and knock out for Roland at his house. The least we could do is pay him a visit
We understand your concerns and value the fact of the huge part our supporters play in the running of the club. We obviously are disappointed to hear that you and your family may not be renewing your season tickets, but we understand and please consider our plans below to help determine your decision. And we know we have a major job to do to bring back fans like yourself to The Valley, and the staff here are trying hard to improve things at the club for the future.
In order to improve current situation our plans are as follows: Our immediate priority is to try and improve recruitment, which is why we are currently interviewing for a Chief Scout – the Head Coach is involved in this appointment because the scout will be supplying players for his team. The club has admitted that recruitment has not been good enough. We have shown some stability of late in picking up 10 points from 15. We hope we can continue to pick up points to remain in the Championship.
We want to keep on developing and playing Academy talent because it’s something this club has a proud tradition of. It’s why we are investing in the training ground and Academy – we want to keep on attracting the best talent. And we want that talent to first and foremost be having long and prosperous careers with Charlton. Some players do move on, some of their own choosing, but it’s why we have worked hard over the last couple of years to get our young talent on long-term deals.
Importantly we know that we have to rebuild bridges with supporters. That is going to require some hard work from all of us at the club over the coming months but we will of course do that. We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations. Something like the change of the scoreboard to team sheets as opposed to live feed came about through conversations with fans, as did making the North Lower our most affordable area.
We will keep on trying and we hope that you stay with us.
We understand your concerns and value the fact of the huge part our supporters play in the running of the club. We obviously are disappointed to hear that you and your family may not be renewing your season tickets, but we understand and please consider our plans below to help determine your decision. And we know we have a major job to do to bring back fans like yourself to The Valley, and the staff here are trying hard to improve things at the club for the future.
In order to improve current situation our plans are as follows: Our immediate priority is to try and improve recruitment, which is why we are currently interviewing for a Chief Scout – the Head Coach is involved in this appointment because the scout will be supplying players for his team. The club has admitted that recruitment has not been good enough. We have shown some stability of late in picking up 10 points from 15. We hope we can continue to pick up points to remain in the Championship.
We want to keep on developing and playing Academy talent because it’s something this club has a proud tradition of. It’s why we are investing in the training ground and Academy – we want to keep on attracting the best talent. And we want that talent to first and foremost be having long and prosperous careers with Charlton. Some players do move on, some of their own choosing, but it’s why we have worked hard over the last couple of years to get our young talent on long-term deals.
Importantly we know that we have to rebuild bridges with supporters. That is going to require some hard work from all of us at the club over the coming months but we will of course do that. We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations. Something like the change of the scoreboard to team sheets as opposed to live feed came about through conversations with fans, as did making the North Lower our most affordable area.
We will keep on trying and we hope that you stay with us.
Best regards The Supporter Relations Team
Well David, after that enlightening and hard-hitting response I suppose you have no choice other than to re-new as they have completely addressed all of the issues and set out what they are going to do to improve.
I am so impressed that they haven't mentioned the head scout search, the academy and that we are on a good run of results like 95% of the other responses and realised that your fantastic letter deserved a more thorough response.
We understand your concerns and value the fact of the huge part our supporters play in the running of the club. We obviously are disappointed to hear that you and your family may not be renewing your season tickets, but we understand and please consider our plans below to help determine your decision. And we know we have a major job to do to bring back fans like yourself to The Valley, and the staff here are trying hard to improve things at the club for the future.
In order to improve current situation our plans are as follows: Our immediate priority is to try and improve recruitment, which is why we are currently interviewing for a Chief Scout – the Head Coach is involved in this appointment because the scout will be supplying players for his team. The club has admitted that recruitment has not been good enough. We have shown some stability of late in picking up 10 points from 15. We hope we can continue to pick up points to remain in the Championship.
We want to keep on developing and playing Academy talent because it’s something this club has a proud tradition of. It’s why we are investing in the training ground and Academy – we want to keep on attracting the best talent. And we want that talent to first and foremost be having long and prosperous careers with Charlton. Some players do move on, some of their own choosing, but it’s why we have worked hard over the last couple of years to get our young talent on long-term deals.
Importantly we know that we have to rebuild bridges with supporters. That is going to require some hard work from all of us at the club over the coming months but we will of course do that. We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations. Something like the change of the scoreboard to team sheets as opposed to live feed came about through conversations with fans, as did making the North Lower our most affordable area.
We will keep on trying and we hope that you stay with us.
Best regards The Supporter Relations Team
Ha, ha, ha, the Murray and Douchbag attempts at communication were a total disaster and those fans spoken to must have been the mysterious 2% RD reckons he met with MUST TRY HARDER!
All these emails from the club saying they are "working hard" to rectify the situation. What is it exactly they are "working hard" on? Making derogatory statements?
There is no evidence of working on anything to make the situation better, let alone working hard. Poor old flaggy seems to be the only one working hard.
I asked that question and got told this...........
There are many different ways in which we are trying to improve things. At the highest level one of the key priorities is getting a new Chief Scout who can help address the issues around recruitment - the process for that hire has continued apace this week. We will also shortly see Phase 1 complete of the new £12m training ground complex.
Then at the other end of the spectrum are other things are addressing specific concerns, like the request to have team sheets on the big screen rather than the live match feed. This is something we have changed and debuted in the match against Birmingham City at the weekend. We also know the Target 20K group are going to come to us with a request about replacing the Fan Sofa, which we know had been a point of much debate. But these changes come about through constructive engagement, something which we need to do more of.
All fair points.
But not enough, is it? It's like having your house falling down and the builder comes and paints the front door. It doesn't hurt but it hardly scratches the surface of what's wrong.
Most of this stuff should have been done long ago, but since they said they are going to start doing things differently they have started to show signs they will do so. If they are going to implement all the changes that need to happen they won't be able to do it overnight.
I don't have a crystal ball so I can't tell you if these are the beginnings of genuine change or if they are just a few minor steps to try and placate the rabble long enough to start the whole merry-go-round turning again at the start of next season. I do know though, that we can't just slam the club when they do things wrong, we also need to give the credit that is due when they do things right, even if that has to be tempered with an acknowledgement that it has taken too long to get around to making some of the changes.
Partly agree, on the credit where t's due point, but still nowhere near enough. There should be, as an absolute minimum:
1. An open and comprehensive acknowledgement of all the things that are wrong with the club 2. A promise that these will all be addressed 3. A forward plan setting out the actions and the timeline for each 4. Regular report backs on actions taken and next steps 5. All accompanied by real signs of engagement - meeting with the Trust, setting up the long promised and still undelivered strategy group, full responses rather than cut and paste platitudes 6. Evidence that the management of the club, the coaching set up and recruitment strategy have ALL changed.
Give them a chance, they've listened to us all season asking for a team sheet & on the 2nd April they responded. Mind you what a coincidence that they manage to do that on the day that card produce another unofficial programme.
It does seem the club are responding to CARD more than fans, although disguising their action as being fan-led. I am fairly sure the club will hand out official beach balls and whistle before the next home game. That'll show CARD who's in charge.
"We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations"
As a journalist (not that you need to be one to see through the sham) I can tell you that neither was an interview. They were press releases in the guise of an interview, A very different beast. If the club is sincere about doing interviews to help communicate then the interviewer needs to be able to interview, not lob a series of leg-side full tosses.
Can someone translate this into Latin and wrap around the club badge it should be our motto.. " we know we have a big job to bring back fans like yourself to The Valley, but the staff here are trying hard to improve things at the club."
Copy, paste and patronise. Lady on train back from Cardiff just asked me why I grumbled "oh Jesus." Gave her very brief explanation, she said that it was a calm response considering!
It is laughable when they say rebuild bridges, and hard work over the coming months. They term it having more conversations.
It simply won't happen. They lie. They use power points to give some kind of sixth-former authority to their lies.
Bridges need both banks of the river to have strong foundations first, what they mean is they will cut the foliage on their side and say their work is done, the heavy lifting and structural engineering is the job of the supporters whilst they shout instructions across the water.
Hard work is laughable. I have it on good authority that nobody does jack at the Valley any more, beyond count the days until payday. Katrien herself can hardly be bothered to turn up and do a decent days work, especially on matchdays. Mind you if her kind of work is dreaming up capers like house music in Crossbars it may be better if she stays at home longer checking the phone for messages from Tony, Mandy, David, Roland, Phil and her advisor Jo.
Having more 'conversations'. Ha bloody ha. is that why the head of communications left after 46 days then? A conversation is a two way street, with a hoped for positive development as a result of the dialogue. If the 'big screen' change last Saturday is what they consider to be the kind of thing we ought to be having because we have had a 'conversation' they continue to be deluded. Maybe if they were so keen on conversations they would not declare that the fans have to accept the owner dictates everything, and they would have had a conversation with Peter Varney who they dismiss as a billboard salesman.
Their idea of a con ver say shun, is a hectoring lecture. Peppered with stuff like 'you're not helping' (to David Norris) and 'you're inciting a riot' (to Henry Irving of this parish).
All they will ever do, and all they have ever done, is to fob us off like mug punters.
as it's the Easter Holidays, I'll give the Club the benefit of the doubt and assume that this response was written by an 11 year old involved in voluntary work experience.
Maybe it's worth replying to them thanking them for their reply, but what you were actually trying to get was an answer to the questions you asked them. Whilst it's great to know about the Chief Scout recruitment, and that they need to make more of an effort to communicate.....it simply doesn't address your questions.
Their idea of a con ver say shun, is a hectoring lecture. Peppered with stuff like 'you're not helping' (to David Norris) and 'you're inciting a riot' (to Henry Irving of this parish).
Don't forget, 'I thought we already explained this several times'
If their idea of building bridges is to attempt to tar peaceful protestors with an isolated incident months ago and issue veiled threats via the Met then I'd hate to see what they do when they turn on their own! What next? Genocide?
When will they understand? For a sizable majority there is no way back. They have burnt the bridges they claim to want to mend to the ground.
If one of them is reading this, the only words I am interested in hearing are "we've found a buyer and will look to conclude the deal as soon as possible".
"We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations"
As a journalist (not that you need to be one to see through the sham) I can tell you that neither was an interview. They were press releases in the guise of an interview, A very different beast. If the club is sincere about doing interviews to help communicate then the interviewer needs to be able to interview, not lob a series of leg-side full tosses.
Comments
Love it. DESERVES a proper answer along with an apology. Don't hold your breath.
Actually, I guess I already know that the club are going to send a few pointless tomorrow...
outfor Roland at his house. The least we could do is pay him a visitHello David,
Thank you for your email.
We understand your concerns and value the fact of the huge part our supporters play in the running of the club. We obviously are disappointed to hear that you and your family may not be renewing your season tickets, but we understand and please consider our plans below to help determine your decision. And we know we have a major job to do to bring back fans like yourself to The Valley, and the staff here are trying hard to improve things at the club for the future.
In order to improve current situation our plans are as follows: Our immediate priority is to try and improve recruitment, which is why we are currently interviewing for a Chief Scout – the Head Coach is involved in this appointment because the scout will be supplying players for his team. The club has admitted that recruitment has not been good enough. We have shown some stability of late in picking up 10 points from 15. We hope we can continue to pick up points to remain in the Championship.
We want to keep on developing and playing Academy talent because it’s something this club has a proud tradition of. It’s why we are investing in the training ground and Academy – we want to keep on attracting the best talent. And we want that talent to first and foremost be having long and prosperous careers with Charlton. Some players do move on, some of their own choosing, but it’s why we have worked hard over the last couple of years to get our young talent on long-term deals.
Importantly we know that we have to rebuild bridges with supporters. That is going to require some hard work from all of us at the club over the coming months but we will of course do that. We are trying to communicate more, the Richard Murray Q&A and Roland Duchatelet interviews were part of that, as is this new email – we know we need to have more conversations. Something like the change of the scoreboard to team sheets as opposed to live feed came about through conversations with fans, as did making the North Lower our most affordable area.
We will keep on trying and we hope that you stay with us.
Best regards
The Supporter Relations Team
I am so impressed that they haven't mentioned the head scout search, the academy and that we are on a good run of results like 95% of the other responses and realised that your fantastic letter deserved a more thorough response.
In fact I am tempted to renew myself.
(Tongue protruding from my cheek.)
As a journalist (not that you need to be one to see through the sham) I can tell you that neither was an interview. They were press releases in the guise of an interview, A very different beast. If the club is sincere about doing interviews to help communicate then the interviewer needs to be able to interview, not lob a series of leg-side full tosses.
It simply won't happen.
They lie.
They use power points to give some kind of sixth-former authority to their lies.
Bridges need both banks of the river to have strong foundations first, what they mean is they will cut the foliage on their side and say their work is done, the heavy lifting and structural engineering is the job of the supporters whilst they shout instructions across the water.
Hard work is laughable. I have it on good authority that nobody does jack at the Valley any more, beyond count the days until payday. Katrien herself can hardly be bothered to turn up and do a decent days work, especially on matchdays. Mind you if her kind of work is dreaming up capers like house music in Crossbars it may be better if she stays at home longer checking the phone for messages from Tony, Mandy, David, Roland, Phil and her advisor Jo.
Having more 'conversations'. Ha bloody ha. is that why the head of communications left after 46 days then? A conversation is a two way street, with a hoped for positive development as a result of the dialogue. If the 'big screen' change last Saturday is what they consider to be the kind of thing we ought to be having because we have had a 'conversation' they continue to be deluded. Maybe if they were so keen on conversations they would not declare that the fans have to accept the owner dictates everything, and they would have had a conversation with Peter Varney who they dismiss as a billboard salesman.
Their idea of a con ver say shun, is a hectoring lecture. Peppered with stuff like 'you're not helping' (to David Norris) and 'you're inciting a riot' (to Henry Irving of this parish).
All they will ever do, and all they have ever done, is to fob us off like mug punters.
Tell me where I'm wrong?
scoreboard? what do they we are - a cricket team??????
When will they understand? For a sizable majority there is no way back. They have burnt the bridges they claim to want to mend to the ground.
If one of them is reading this, the only words I am interested in hearing are "we've found a buyer and will look to conclude the deal as soon as possible".