3 off target shots, 1 corner in 45 minutes. We obviously parked the bus and hoped Hendo would keep us in the game, exactly what he did until the first went in, then we had no plan 'B'. Now I read this morning that you have spoken to the players and they have told you they are good enough!! No shit Sherlock, they are hardly going to say, we are crap!! and as for your other comment that we can only play 11, so it doesn't matter how big the squad is, are you for real? Of course we can only play 11 (that's the rules of the game), but IF we had a larger squad with quality players it allows you a greater selection to play different ways and formations, bloody hell everyone knows that surely!!
I was doing the match thread and it was one-way traffic for most of the game, and yes we were time-wasting even at 2-0 down, just a shambles a complete shambles. Rant over.............for now!
For the first time lost it completely doing the match thread, for which I apologise profusely, however it felt again as though we gave up after the first goal went in, but we were never really in the game from the off. We were holding off the inevitable and now it shows we are clueless as to what to do. RD needs to understand we do not have a big enough or good enough squad to arrest this alarming slide towards League One. We need a bigger squad and an experienced British manager and backroom team. This HAS to be Curbs/Euell/JJ as the set up, we will have ideas, pride and passion put back into the club at least.
Curbs/Euell/JJ! Are you really serious? Personally I would hope Curbs has more sense than to take on this job and apart from him what do you think Euell and JJ can 'bring to the table'?
Hi @Waldo, Just my opinion, so if you disagree that's fine. I agree that Curbs would be insane to come back.....but one can wish. As for Euell and JJ, I would have asked them before bringing this joker in (if they couldn't find anyone else with Championship experience from both playing and/or managing). We did it with Curbs/Gritt and that didn't turn out too bad.
Harsh to single out Mak when he had no support around him and aimless balls and clearances was all he had to work with.
And that's the problem with 4-5-1....we haven't got the forward, apart from maybe Reza that could make it work. Mak isn't mobile enough and our ball up to him isn't accurate enough (no good banging it up to his head without others around him and Jackson, Ba or Cousins aren't the sort to run past the forward).
We're probably going to have to go 4-4-2 with Cousins tucked in on the left.
So depressing to follow the match thread, and again, total respect to the travelling fans! However hard I try to tell myself that I don't care or expected it anyway, it still leaves the knot in my stomach. We should be competing with teams like Boro' but it seems we are not a team anymore just an experiment for an arrogant old man. Fraeye is never going to say that the team needs strengthening or is weak in anyway as he chose most of them! This 'Yes man' will never stand up to RD as he has a permanent job for life in the network it seems. We have to turn the apathy to anger and not let this idiot and his puppets make us another statistic: a team that plummets down the leagues because of the owner's arrogance and lack of interest/knowledge in football. We have CAST, Spell it out in Black and White, the fans forum, supporters groups, boycotts mentioned of differing kinds so the apathy can be channelled and become focused anger.
I think "park the bus" doesn't sum up the sheer ineptitude of the performance. More like "abandoned the bus in a panic".
The stats really don't lie on this occasion. We simply couldn't keep possession. If we tried to play through midfield, we gave it away cheaply and often dangerously. Ba in particular simply cannot pass accurately. So instead we'd hit aimless balls forward, rarely into channels or space.
Not one of the players appeared to believe in themselves or the team, Henderson aside. And every opponent can smell the fear..they know all they have to do is press and deny easy possession. The chances will flow merrily and eventually even someone as ineffective as Simon Church will bag one...don't expect miracles on Tuesday.
Something radical is required. Dropping Solly for a start. We wondered how Nugent was onside for the opener but seeing Chris knock the cross down on C5 I now know. Cousins to RB. JBG to CM ..no, he's not a ballwinner but neither are Ba or Cousins right now.
Fraeye surely can't get the job on this showing, can he?
If Carol said we competed for 60 minutes then I must have been at a different game. Boro by far the better side but were nothing special. They just couldn't get through ten defenders. No shape, no energy or movement when trying to get out from defence. Posession may have been greater if we could string passes together, but passes were easily cut out. Henderson by far our best player, even if he was time wasting after just 5 minutes. Bizarrely we were wasting time at 2-0 and 3-0. Presumably trying to keep the score down. Preston was a low for the season. But in many ways this was worse.
Perhaps whilst Fraeye is manager we can ask for matches to only last 60 minutes, this will be to give us a chance of a result.
Surely if we lose to MK Dons and Sheff Wed then RD can't give this bloke the managers job. How have things got better than they would have been with Guy. Total joke
Surely if we lose to MK Dons and Sheff Wed then RD can't give this bloke the managers job. How have things got better than they would have been with Guy. Total joke
Roland can do what he likes because no one, least of all the CEO, will stand up to him or dare to point out that his ideas aren't working and make no business sense.
Harsh to single out Mak when he had no support around him and aimless balls and clearances was all he had to work with.
And that's the problem with 4-5-1....we haven't got the forward, apart from maybe Reza that could make it work. Mak isn't mobile enough and our ball up to him isn't accurate enough (no good banging it up to his head without others around him and Jackson, Ba or Cousins aren't the sort to run past the forward).
We're probably going to have to go 4-4-2 with Cousins tucked in on the left.
Exactly. He then brings Watt on and leaves KAG out on the wing. There was so much wrong yesterday it's hard to know where to start.
Agree with @redlanered that Solly should be dropped. I never thought I'd say that. There's not enough competition in the squad and maybe that's half the problem.
I made the pilgrimage today to watch this. Well..........Fraeye changed the tactics (at last) and played a 4-5-1 with everybody behind the ball and the players clearly told to take their time over throw ins/free kicks/goal kicks etc. It wasn't pretty but it worked. In the second half we tried to play a bit more. Always a gamble and Middlesbrough promptly scored when Nugent poached a goal. We then got outplayed in the last 25 minutes, let in 2 more and had Henderson to thank for stopping another couple. Watt and Ghoochannejad as a striking partnership looked ok actually - Reza almost scored at one point. But: realistically were we ever going to get a result out of this? Middlesbrough are a quality side playing extremely well at present. The real test would be getting something away at Milton Keynes on Tuesday evening. We still only need an average set of results from the remaining 32 games to stay up. Provided (a) we get a proper manager of any sort from anywhere and (b) we get some defensive loanees in we ought to be able to do this.
And then what? Same shit next season? With less fans and less interest. I'd rather fast forward a few years, league 2, new ownership, and start again a la Portsmouth.
Totally this. I think we should all attempt to starve RD of any money - not buy tickets,food,merchandise until it forces him to abandon a failed experiment and run him out of town - else the club will just die a very painful slow death in the hands of a megalomaniac.
Harsh to single out Mak when he had no support around him and aimless balls and clearances was all he had to work with.
And that's the problem with 4-5-1....we haven't got the forward, apart from maybe Reza that could make it work. Mak isn't mobile enough and our ball up to him isn't accurate enough (no good banging it up to his head without others around him and Jackson, Ba or Cousins aren't the sort to run past the forward).
We're probably going to have to go 4-4-2 with Cousins tucked in on the left.
Exactly. He then brings Watt on and leaves KAG out on the wing. There was so much wrong yesterday it's hard to know where to start.
Agree with @redlanered that Solly should be dropped. I never thought I'd say that. There's not enough competition in the squad and maybe that's half the problem.
We'd have got ripped apart in the first half playing 4-4-2 against Boro's 4-2-3-1. that's 5 v 4 in midfield again, as in the Brentford game. 0-3 at half-time, would have ended 0-5 or 0-6 at the end.
Whoever decided Ba could play the key role as the defensive screen got it totally wrong. Should have been our best player - Diarra.
Bottom line is, we have a number of players that are not good enough for the Championship. Unless that improves, there will be no turnaround.
You can only play 11 and if you keep losing it is because they are not good enough for the league you are playing in.
Roy Keane was said to be unsuccessful because he could not deal with players who could not do what he could.
The players are right, they are great players compared to you mate and with your history and the pure shit you have been managing they must seem that way too. It is why we must have a manager who understands what a team in the Championship needs.
No offence meant mate, you are just hopelessly out of your depth.
3 off target shots, 1 corner in 45 minutes. We obviously parked the bus and hoped Hendo would keep us in the game, exactly what he did until the first went in, then we had no plan 'B'. Now I read this morning that you have spoken to the players and they have told you they are good enough!! No shit Sherlock, they are hardly going to say, we are crap!! and as for your other comment that we can only play 11, so it doesn't matter how big the squad is, are you for real? Of course we can only play 11 (that's the rules of the game), but IF we had a larger squad with quality players it allows you a greater selection to play different ways and formations, bloody hell everyone knows that surely!!
I was doing the match thread and it was one-way traffic for most of the game, and yes we were time-wasting even at 2-0 down, just a shambles a complete shambles. Rant over.............for now!
Surely if we lose to MK Dons and Sheff Wed then RD can't give this bloke the managers job. How have things got better than they would have been with Guy. Total joke
You would think so. But do you think a small matter like three more losses would influence RD? If we keep three first-half clean sheets, that would probably secure Fraeye something until the end of the season
What is Carol Fry meant to say though? Whether or not he has any ability, whether or not he is a puppet, he has the squad we currently have until January and perhaps beyond. He couldn't really say "yes they are all shit and I will be clearing them out at the first opportunity" or "we were lucky to get nil".
Our problems are not what the bloke has just said, they appear to be just about everything else though.
N.B. This is not support of the regime, far from it.
I was at the game. The big problem is the midfield. We seem incapable of passing to each other or accurately forward. We don't have a player that can take the ball off the back four and start to develop an attacking move. We don't hunt the ball down in packs when we lose posession. The whole midfield did not appear to have the energy to compete with Boro. Like some lifers I don't particularly blame the defensive players. If you are under the cosh for 75% of the game you are going to make a mistake or be out of position at some point. Compare this to Boro where Clayton was picking up the ball off the defenders, spraying the ball around nicely. Every time a Boro player had the ball there were a variety of options close by. When they didn't have the ball any Charlton player was immediately surrounded by three Boro players who inevitably won the ball back. When Boro were in posession, neat triangles, accurate passing, with only one Charlton player trying to close down the player on the ball. If we were able to keep posession of the ball, control the midfield, it would enable the team to move forward as a unit, allowing the full backs to join in the attack. We need to start playing as a team, rather than 11 blokes chucked onto the pitch. The defeats against Preston, Huddersfield and Brentford were caused by exactly the same problems, and unless they are sorted quickly it's going to be a long, hard season.
“We can only play 11 players. Whether we have a squad of just 11 or 30, we can only put 11 on the pitch at any one time."
That quote from Mr Fraeye was exactly what Roland wants him to say. Many of you above have commented this. So sad how we have gone backwards as a team. I can remember Scott Parker and Claus Jensen in midfield. Don't think we will ever have players of that class again. So glad that I didn't renew my season ticket after having on mainly since 1986. How I wish we had those crooks back. We have sold (or given away) a quality team down the river. Morro, Kermo, Stephens and Wiggins would never have quit like this lot. MK Dons have Poyet on loan we have an Everton reserve. Says it all!
Total shambles.'Boro' supporter said to me we were one of the worst sides his ever seen & i agreed with him,we don't look like scoring another goal this season. This is by far the worse team i've seen wearing a Charlton Shirt. Thanks Roland.
Firstly I wasn't there but my only observation from this is to ask why.
This is not the worst group of players we have had is it.
Henderson, Solly, Bauer, Diarra, Cousins, Jackson, JBG, Watt all I suspect are rated quite well by most of us ?
The core of actually something quite good. I know there's not much to add to that but why are we now just so desperately awful.
Not saying the squad should be challanging but I don't understand why this group above are now worse than useless.
The players are hardly like to be honest to Karol Fraeye, company man and speak openly when they know that questioning the owners strategy may lead them to be out of the door pronto......on second thoughts
Wasn't there yesterday but, in recent games, each player looks nowhere near fit enough to compete. Not just injury wise, core fitness is a big problem IMO.
Woke up this morning still feeling sick to the pit of my stomach and wishing I had £60 million. Charlton Athletic is the plaything of Mr Duchatelet and he hasn't got a clue how to run us, even to the point of cost cutting because our relegation will wipe out any current savings made. I can see with Euell involved that Lookman travelled with the team. I would like to think there were footballing reasons for that, but I fear it is the nurturing of a potential big money sale for Roland somewhere down the line.
Wasn't there yesterday but, in recent games, each player looks nowhere near fit enough to compete. Not just injury wise, core fitness is a big problem IMO.
Our new coach insinuated that in his post match interview didn't he? I agree to an extent but we are often just as poor in the first half as we are in the second.....
I was at the game. The big problem is the midfield. We seem incapable of passing to each other or accurately forward. We don't have a player that can take the ball off the back four and start to develop an attacking move. We don't hunt the ball down in packs when we lose posession. The whole midfield did not appear to have the energy to compete with Boro. Like some lifers I don't particularly blame the defensive players. If you are under the cosh for 75% of the game you are going to make a mistake or be out of position at some point. Compare this to Boro where Clayton was picking up the ball off the defenders, spraying the ball around nicely. Every time a Boro player had the ball there were a variety of options close by. When they didn't have the ball any Charlton player was immediately surrounded by three Boro players who inevitably won the ball back. When Boro were in posession, neat triangles, accurate passing, with only one Charlton player trying to close down the player on the ball. If we were able to keep posession of the ball, control the midfield, it would enable the team to move forward as a unit, allowing the full backs to join in the attack. We need to start playing as a team, rather than 11 blokes chucked onto the pitch. The defeats against Preston, Huddersfield and Brentford were caused by exactly the same problems, and unless they are sorted quickly it's going to be a long, hard season.
Totally agree. We seem to be giving opposing cm who picks the ball up from defenders to much time and space. Games you mentioned we made their centre mids look world class. I'd also like to add Fulham to that list as Jamie o'hara was again given to muck time and space. In all these games we were missing kashi. don't think ba, cousins or jacko can do that job. Need kashi back urgently! Only other player who could do job is possibly diarra, and with sarr's improved performance against Brentford this could be an option. Another thing is if we don't have 2 wingers we don't have to play 2 wingers. Jbg can be used as a few, wandering winger giving us an extra cm to defend/attack when needed.
Total shambles.'Boro' supporter said to me we were one of the worst sides his ever seen & i agreed with him,we don't look like scoring another goal this season. This is by far the worse team i've seen wearing a Charlton Shirt. Thanks Roland.
Firstly I wasn't there but my only observation from this is to ask why.
This is not the worst group of players we have had is it.
Henderson, Solly, Bauer, Diarra, Cousins, Jackson, JBG, Watt all I suspect are rated quite well by most of us ?
The core of actually something quite good. I know there's not much to add to that but why are we now just so desperately awful.
Not saying the squad should be challanging but I don't understand why this group above are now worse than useless.
There are other forces at play.
Maybe not technically the worst, but certainly the most heartless, gutless collection of individuals since the arse end of the Pardew era.
Comments
Exactly. We could've had Lewandowski up front yesterday, but what would he have done with next to no service?
HT stats addicks first-:
possession.....21% - 79%
shots on........ 0 - 2
shots off....... 3 - 10
corners......... 1 - 10
GOALS.......... 0 - 0
3 off target shots, 1 corner in 45 minutes. We obviously parked the bus and hoped Hendo would keep us in the game, exactly what he did until the first went in, then we had no plan 'B'.
Now I read this morning that you have spoken to the players and they have told you they are good enough!! No shit Sherlock, they are hardly going to say, we are crap!! and as for your other comment that we can only play 11, so it doesn't matter how big the squad is, are you for real? Of course we can only play 11 (that's the rules of the game), but IF we had a larger squad with quality players it allows you a greater selection to play different ways and formations, bloody hell everyone knows that surely!!
I was doing the match thread and it was one-way traffic for most of the game, and yes we were time-wasting even at 2-0 down, just a shambles a complete shambles.
Rant over.............for now!
We're probably going to have to go 4-4-2 with Cousins tucked in on the left.
Fraeye is never going to say that the team needs strengthening or is weak in anyway as he chose most of them! This 'Yes man' will never stand up to RD as he has a permanent job for life in the network it seems.
We have to turn the apathy to anger and not let this idiot and his puppets make us another statistic: a team that plummets down the leagues because of the owner's arrogance and lack of interest/knowledge in football. We have CAST, Spell it out in Black and White, the fans forum, supporters groups, boycotts mentioned of differing kinds so the apathy can be channelled and become focused anger.
The stats really don't lie on this occasion. We simply couldn't keep possession. If we tried to play through midfield, we gave it away cheaply and often dangerously. Ba in particular simply cannot pass accurately. So instead we'd hit aimless balls forward, rarely into channels or space.
Not one of the players appeared to believe in themselves or the team, Henderson aside. And every opponent can smell the fear..they know all they have to do is press and deny easy possession. The chances will flow merrily and eventually even someone as ineffective as Simon Church will bag one...don't expect miracles on Tuesday.
Something radical is required. Dropping Solly for a start. We wondered how Nugent was onside for the opener but seeing Chris knock the cross down on C5 I now know. Cousins to RB. JBG to CM ..no, he's not a ballwinner but neither are Ba or Cousins right now.
Fraeye surely can't get the job on this showing, can he?
Agree with @redlanered that Solly should be dropped. I never thought I'd say that. There's not enough competition in the squad and maybe that's half the problem.
Boro big screen had team line ups on it most of the time plus replays of the goals / chances and occasional ads.
I think we should all attempt to starve RD of any money - not buy tickets,food,merchandise until it forces him to abandon a failed experiment and run him out of town - else the club will just die a very painful slow death in the hands of a megalomaniac.
Whoever decided Ba could play the key role as the defensive screen got it totally wrong. Should have been our best player - Diarra.
Bottom line is, we have a number of players that are not good enough for the Championship. Unless that improves, there will be no turnaround.
Roy Keane was said to be unsuccessful because he could not deal with players who could not do what he could.
The players are right, they are great players compared to you mate and with your history and the pure shit you have been managing they must seem that way too. It is why we must have a manager who understands what a team in the Championship needs.
No offence meant mate, you are just hopelessly out of your depth.
Our problems are not what the bloke has just said, they appear to be just about everything else though.
N.B. This is not support of the regime, far from it.
Compare this to Boro where Clayton was picking up the ball off the defenders, spraying the ball around nicely. Every time a Boro player had the ball there were a variety of options close by. When they didn't have the ball any Charlton player was immediately surrounded by three Boro players who inevitably won the ball back. When Boro were in posession, neat triangles, accurate passing, with only one Charlton player trying to close down the player on the ball.
If we were able to keep posession of the ball, control the midfield, it would enable the team to move forward as a unit, allowing the full backs to join in the attack. We need to start playing as a team, rather than 11 blokes chucked onto the pitch.
The defeats against Preston, Huddersfield and Brentford were caused by exactly the same problems, and unless they are sorted quickly it's going to be a long, hard season.
we can only put 11 on the pitch at any one time."
That quote from Mr Fraeye was exactly what Roland wants him to say.
Many of you above have commented this. So sad how we have gone
backwards as a team. I can remember Scott Parker and Claus Jensen in midfield.
Don't think we will ever have players of that class again.
So glad that I didn't renew my season ticket after having on
mainly since 1986. How I wish we had those crooks back.
We have sold (or given away) a quality team down the river.
Morro, Kermo, Stephens and Wiggins would never have quit
like this lot. MK Dons have Poyet on loan we have an Everton reserve.
Says it all!
This is not the worst group of players we have had is it.
Henderson, Solly, Bauer, Diarra, Cousins, Jackson, JBG, Watt all I suspect are rated quite well by most of us ?
The core of actually something quite good. I know there's not much to add to that but why are we now just so desperately awful.
Not saying the squad should be challanging but I don't understand why this group above are now worse than useless.
There are other forces at play.
Charlton Athletic is the plaything of Mr Duchatelet and he hasn't got a clue how to run us, even to the point of cost cutting because our relegation will wipe out any current savings made.
I can see with Euell involved that Lookman travelled with the team. I would like to think there were footballing reasons for that, but I fear it is the nurturing of a potential big money sale for Roland somewhere down the line.
We seem to be giving opposing cm who picks the ball up from defenders to much time and space.
Games you mentioned we made their centre mids look world class. I'd also like to add Fulham to that list as Jamie o'hara was again given to muck time and space.
In all these games we were missing kashi. don't think ba, cousins or jacko can do that job. Need kashi back urgently!
Only other player who could do job is possibly diarra, and with sarr's improved performance against Brentford this could be an option.
Another thing is if we don't have 2 wingers we don't have to play 2 wingers. Jbg can be used as a few, wandering winger giving us an extra cm to defend/attack when needed.