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Have We Got A Better Team Than The Team That Finished 9th?

Mendonca In AsdasMendonca In Asdas
edited August 2014 in General Charlton
I was at the Brighton game today , i didn't go to last seasons 3-0 drubbing , my son did , and informed that we didn't have a shot on target , i did go to the 0-0 match 2 seasons ago when Hamer played a blinder and we did quite well from what i remember.

Its obviously early days , and some player like Igor , Yoni and Andre / Tal have hit the ground running , and other like Yohan , i believe will get better and stronger as the season goes on.

But from what we've seen so far , with what we've currently got do people think we have a stronger side than the side that finished 9th 2 seasons ago?

I'm still not sure about how good ( or even fit) Henderson is compared to Ben Hamer , and i know we hit form right at the end of the season to surge up to 9th and finish 3 points off the playoffs,

Today just had the feel that we at last have a goalscorer on our hands , i can't remember the last time a Charlton goalscorer had 5 GOALS in August before?

I will try and look it up online , i'm guessing Darren Bent , but can't be sure , we certainly look a better side than last season , and its a good sign i guess that people are disappointed with dropping 2 points in the last minute ( a much better place to be than a 3-0 drubbing)

I hope in a way that it will keep the fans grounded , Big Bob focused , and the players fired up to take maximum in our forthcoming home games.

I know i'm full of questions tonight , but if he stays fit how many goals can Igor get in September , and also by Christmas?
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Comments

  • Mendonca In AsdasMendonca In Asdas
    shine166 said:

    100% yes, im not sure its even a question that needs to be asked

    I know what you mean Shine , but sometimes you have to appreciate where you are by seeing where you've come from , if that makes sense.
  • paulie8290paulie8290
    Yes next question
  • NomadicAddickNomadicAddick
    I'd say yes. Apart from GK, CF and Jackson. I'd say every position we have is better as well as some remaining the same obviously like Solly and Wiggins. That was a right laugh when we finished 9th. Don't get me wrong I loved it, but that position suggests we were actually challenging for play offs but in fact I never really thought we were going to reach the play offs even with about 4 games to go. I already believe we can reach them this season! Would love to have Yann up top with Igor and Hamer releasing Gudmundson with his fantastic distribution.
  • AFKABartramAFKABartram
    Good question

    The team that finished 9th outperformed. We've got better players on a best 11 comparative, let's see how strong the squad and the togetherness continues when injuries, weather / pitch change etc kick in. Long ol season, things can change positively and negatively within a few weeks.
  • SillybillySillybilly
    In the words of Mr Neil Diamond "Hell Yeah"
  • Greenie JuniorGreenie Junior
    I'd say yes but at the same time, the league this season is harder than what it was that season IMO
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  • shirty5shirty5
    With 8 games to go that side 2 seasons ago was on the brink of a relegation battle after being 2 down to Bolton with 20 minutes gone. Gladly we came back and won, ending the season unbeaten.

    To go from 18th to 9th in eight games showed how tight and tough the Championship was. The league will be as tough this season and whilst we have made a good start, that's all it is. A good start.

    Wait till Christmas and evaluate where we are then. One or two injuries to key players could change things very quickly.
  • ChizzChizz
    jamescafc said:

    NomadicAddick said:

    I'd say yes. Apart from GK, CF and Jackson. I'd say every position we have is better as well as some remaining the same obviously like Solly and Wiggins. That was a right laugh when we finished 9th. Don't get me wrong I loved it, but that position suggests we were actually challenging for play offs but in fact I never really thought we were going to reach the play offs even with about 4 games to go. I already believe we can reach them this season! Would love to have Yann up top with Igor and Hamer releasing Gudmundson with his fantastic distribution.

    Yann on the bench for Bournemouth. Worth a cheeky bid now theDelort deal is dead?
    No, no, no, no, no.

  • seriously_redseriously_red
    100% yes brand new team has hit the ground running and remains undefeated having played three play-off teams from last season. And a new midfielder just joined with more players to come in the loan window and January?
    We will have to see if we can consistently take 4/6 points off of the bottom half teams for that is the mark of top teams in the Championship.
    And yes, I'd take Kermorgant back as we clearly need someone like him up front. I don't see it happening simply because Liege and CAFC signings are ten+ years younger.
  • FiiishFiiish
    We've yet to win away this season (including in the cup), whereas our away form in 2012/13 was what got us a 9th place finish. Brentford & Huddersfield could both have been expected to wins and whereas most people would have taken a point before a ball was kicked today we threw away a lead twice in today's game. BP needs to start working the magic on the road, and granted we have a lot of new signings who won't be familiar with travelling to the tinpot grounds north of the Watford Gap to be jeered at for 90 minutes by crowds who look like they share both the same sets of grandparents and chromosomes whilst force-feeding themselves John Smiths and meat & potato pies, so really I can see us picking up very few points away before Christmas whilst they get used to what non-Premiership English football is. In the meantime our woeful home form is where we have really dropped a bollock in the last 2 seasons and if we're going to make headway in this division, BP will need to turn it into Fortress Valley. Watford, Wolves and Middlesbrough will be visiting SE7 in September and they're not going to be easy opponents.
  • PragueAddickPragueAddick
    Not sure yet. My pre season prediction was 14th so obviously I'm delighted with our start. Vetokele is the big reason why you'd say yes. And Buyens another reason.

    I'm still wondering about keeper and full backs. Is Chris Solly going to be able to stay fit enough? And what's up with Wiggins? He got injured and his eventual return coincided with our surge up the table. I Think the role those two played in our 3rd division title is often underrated. Keeper, well, you tell me. I was disappointed to see Hamer leave but some say he wasn't popular with other players.

    Have we got enough pace in central defense, too? Mind you I didn't expect to see Morro on the bench so that suggests greater strength.

    But maybe I'm being cautious because there are so many unknowns at this early stage. I do feel good about the overall approach so far, and since so many elements are new, you have to be optimistic that many aspects will get better.

    Good question...

  • Kap10Kap10
    I think on paper we are a much better team, but there are a whole load of factors that may result in a lower league position.
    The 9th place team over achieved whilst if we hit 9th I think wel could well be just underachieving.
  • uie2uie2
    defo yes!!
  • BR7_addickBR7_addick
    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it
  • soapy_jonessoapy_jones
    Yes
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  • Lazy_eye_metaphorLazy_eye_metaphor
    Yes by about 70% in my opinion. Like others on here though, I'm not sure that will translate into a ninth place or better finish this season.
  • chester_conradchester_conrad
    edited August 2014
    Much better squad and more options. Dare I say it, a better manager as well?

    Time will tell.
  • southamptonaddicksouthamptonaddick
    I think we should compare results against the teams we play on a like for like basis that way it gives a better idea if we have improved or not.

    As a measure this season against last, I know your talking two seasons ago, our results have improved if that keeps going we are going to finish in a better position.

    I know it's a simplistic way of looking at it but I think it's a reasonable comparison.

    And yes I think we've got a better team.
  • PragueAddickPragueAddick
    BR7_addick said:

    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it

    But this team already includes the two full backs and Jacko, and may yet see Morro starting regularly so your remark is not as dramatic as it first sounds.

    The "upgrades" are basically

    Vetokele for BWP
    Buyens for Stephens
    Gudmunsson for Green

    I don't think (yet) we can say Tucudean is an upgrade on Fuller, can we?

    Of course then we have the kids coming through, led by Cousins, but its too early to say how much of an impact they will have this season.

  • RedChaserRedChaser
    PragueAddick said:

    BR7_addick said:

    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it

    But this team already includes the two full backs and Jacko, and may yet see Morro starting regularly so your remark is not as dramatic as it first sounds.

    The "upgrades" are basically

    Vetokele for BWP
    Buyens for Stephens
    Gudmunsson for Green

    I don't think (yet) we can say Tucudean is an upgrade on Fuller, can we?

    Of course then we have the kids coming through, led by Cousins, but its too early to say how much of an impact they will have this season.

    What about the two CBs?
  • PragueAddickPragueAddick
    RedChaser said:

    PragueAddick said:

    BR7_addick said:

    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it

    But this team already includes the two full backs and Jacko, and may yet see Morro starting regularly so your remark is not as dramatic as it first sounds.

    The "upgrades" are basically

    Vetokele for BWP
    Buyens for Stephens
    Gudmunsson for Green

    I don't think (yet) we can say Tucudean is an upgrade on Fuller, can we?

    Of course then we have the kids coming through, led by Cousins, but its too early to say how much of an impact they will have this season.

    What about the two CBs?
    Well, I think its early days to say they are "Upgrades"myself, even though both have started better than most of us expected. I'm worried about pace. Ben Haim is 32. If Morro regains his place, then its actually three of the back four from that season, but with worries about whether the full backs, for different reasons, will be as good as they were then.
  • RedChaserRedChaser
    edited August 2014
    PragueAddick said:

    RedChaser said:

    PragueAddick said:

    BR7_addick said:

    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it

    But this team already includes the two full backs and Jacko, and may yet see Morro starting regularly so your remark is not as dramatic as it first sounds.

    The "upgrades" are basically

    Vetokele for BWP
    Buyens for Stephens
    Gudmunsson for Green

    I don't think (yet) we can say Tucudean is an upgrade on Fuller, can we?

    Of course then we have the kids coming through, led by Cousins, but its too early to say how much of an impact they will have this season.

    What about the two CBs?
    Well, I think its early days to say they are "Upgrades"myself, even though both have started better than most of us expected. I'm worried about pace. Ben Haim is 32. If Morro regains his place, then its actually three of the back four from that season, but with worries about whether the full backs, for different reasons, will be as good as they were then.
    I agree that it is early days but in answer to the OP, at this precise point in time it is a Yes IMO, FWIIW. Yesterday we had 7 'different' players in the starting 11, almost 2/3rds of the team. The two CBs have been getting very good marks and reviews from those at the games, quite rightly so as I have watched five out of the seven competitive games thus far. Yesterday the gloss was taken off their defending by two late ariel goals which could be attributed to tactics but on the floor with the ball at their feet they are ahead of Moro as much as I like him. Only time will tell though :-)
  • PragueAddickPragueAddick
    One reason why I could be optimistic is that we generally did our business early, as we did in our promotion season, and totally failed to do in the last two seasons. That is a big thumbs up to the RD/Katrien regime from me, and may turn out to be more significant than the individual players. There is some architecture to this squad whereas poor old CP had to try and cobble it together.
  • Henry IrvingHenry Irving
    edited August 2014
    PragueAddick said:

    One reason why I could be optimistic is that we generally did our business early, as we did in our promotion season, and totally failed to do in the last two seasons. That is a big thumbs up to the RD/Katrien regime from me, and may turn out to be more significant than the individual players. There is some architecture to this squad whereas poor old CP had to try and cobble it together.

    This is the key difference.

    Back your manager and give him the time and money you promised him, not constantly pull the rug from under him and see how much better that works.

    Well done Roland and Katrien and well done Bob. Keep up the good work.

    Long way to go yet but we are moving in the right direction now the other lot have gone from the boardroom.

  • thenewbiethenewbie
    PragueAddick said:

    BR7_addick said:

    From that team that finished 9th you'd probably have Yann & Hamer in the side that's it

    But this team already includes the two full backs and Jacko, and may yet see Morro starting regularly so your remark is not as dramatic as it first sounds.

    The "upgrades" are basically

    Vetokele for BWP
    Buyens for Stephens
    Gudmunsson for Green

    I don't think (yet) we can say Tucudean is an upgrade on Fuller, can we?

    Of course then we have the kids coming through, led by Cousins, but its too early to say how much of an impact they will have this season.

    In saying that, that's a proper commanding midfielder, another who genuinely scares defenders and makes things happen (much more reliably than Stephens did), and a striker who I would back to score pretty regularly - in terms of numbers 'only' three players, but in what those three actually offer it turns a poor-to-average team into one I'd back for mid-table comfort at the least.

    Our defence was very good under CP and I don't see it as any worse, even if I can't say it's a massive step up either. The only position we are possibly weaker is goalkeeper, but I say that as someone who really rated Hamer and not everyone did.

    The two full backs are the best we've had for a long time and Jackson is Charlton personified so I wouldn't call them weaknesses of the team, and with Fuller's injury record if Gorgeous George stays fit he'll likely score more by default - and it's Vetokele who will be occupying/scaring defences as Fuller once did so I wouldn't call them like for like.
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