So 1.6 million Scots voted 'yes'. Thats less than the aggregate population of Leeds and Birmingham and only around 20% of the urban population of London. Never was the term "noisy neighbours" more appropriate. My advice to the Scotish separatists would be..... 'Sit down, shut up!' but I fear we'll have to endure more of their insular self obsessed witterings over the coming months and years.
They bottled it. Had their chance, did all the shouting and when push came to shove they knew where their bread is buttered. It may have been been a great day for democracy but what a waste of my taxes.
Well thank flip that's all over. I'd like to think that we can put it to bed now, but having just listened to ten minutes of the most dreadful waffly-bollux from the ancient thespian Brian Cox "this is our gift to the people of England" ffs, I have a terrible feeling that Salmond and his mob aren't going to go quietly.
From Cameron's words this morning it sounds like the outcome of the Scottish referendum will be something approaching the federalisation of the UK - which is brilliant news for pretty much everyone in each of the four nations.
A General Election is in the offing so I can see a lot of MPs suddenly deciding that they are English in a cynical attempt to hang onto their seats after years of shafting the English.
My concern now is that Cameron will rush decisions in order to wrong foot Labour. He also needs to appease quite a few of his own MP's. Not good omens for careful policy making.
Polls are not that reliable statistically anyway, but when they are floating around 50:50 and keep flipping back and forth like they have been they are basically saying "errr, I dunno!"
Why are the scotch now demanding more money now? They voted 'no' and are therefore happy with the way things are.
From bravehearts to chickenshits in one night!
What amazes me is the amount of drivel spouted during this whole campaign.
Don't worry - Westminster wont follow through with more powers for the "jocks". England will still subsidise Scotland and everyone can stay miserable believing myths and spouting off about how "If I had a vote I'd vote for the jocks to fuck off".
Bumma. Disappointed. There will be another vote in about 15 years and it will be a "yes' then. I believe t would have worked out well for both Countries, after a few 'bumps'
Very happy with that result. Some things to note in the aftermath:
1) Salmond will likely be very annoyed with not only losing, but the main discussion being had this morning is how to devolve England, rather than extending devolution in Scotland.
2) Labour have perhaps been shafted by this. There is now a large section of Scotland who will now no longer vote Labour at the General Election because of their front-and-centre position in the No campaign. And I imagine large sections of the No campaign will also be disillusioned by Labour's cack-handed handling of the No campaign, so they face the prospect of being electoral pariahs in Scotland, which is where they were usually guaranteed dozens of safe seats to control Westminster with.
On the other hand, they look like they are going to resist any attempt to devolve England, which could be a killer in seats where they will need to compete with Tories and UKIP. The Lib Dems also have a good reason to support devolving Engand as they have been culled north of the border. At the moment, Labour will be running on a ticket whereby they will be telling English voters that they don't trust them with their own money, with an EU referendum or with their own devolved government.
3) The main message coming from the Yes camp is 'We will win...next time'. Yet Salmond promised this would not be a 'neverendum'. I know Salmond's promises are worth less than a Scottish pound in a Bromley dry-cleaners but they cannot seriously expect Westminster to allow them to keep holding referendums until they get the 'right' result. I'd hope that, to avoid this happening, Downing Street would mandate that devo-max comes at the cost of remaining in the Union for at least a period of several decades. As I have said before, I don't want to see another Scottish referendum in my lifetime - the question has been settled and there is no reason to revisit it for at least another hundred years.
So 1.6 million Scots voted 'yes'. Thats less than the aggregate population of Leeds and Birmingham and only around 20% of the urban population of London.
Very happy with that result. Some things to note in the aftermath:
1) Salmond will likely be very annoyed with not only losing, but the main discussion being had this morning is how to devolve England, rather than extending devolution in Scotland.
2) Labour have perhaps been shafted by this. There is now a large section of Scotland who will now no longer vote Labour at the General Election because of their front-and-centre position in the No campaign. And I imagine large sections of the No campaign will also be disillusioned by Labour's cack-handed handling of the No campaign, so they face the prospect of being electoral pariahs in Scotland, which is where they were usually guaranteed dozens of safe seats to control Westminster with.
On the other hand, they look like they are going to resist any attempt to devolve England, which could be a killer in seats where they will need to compete with Tories and UKIP. The Lib Dems also have a good reason to support devolving Engand as they have been culled north of the border. At the moment, Labour will be running on a ticket whereby they will be telling English voters that they don't trust them with their own money, with an EU referendum or with their own devolved government.
3) The main message coming from the Yes camp is 'We will win...next time'. Yet Salmond promised this would not be a 'neverendum'. I know Salmond's promises are worth less than a Scottish pound in a Bromley dry-cleaners but they cannot seriously expect Westminster to allow them to keep holding referendums until they get the 'right' result. I'd hope that, to avoid this happening, Downing Street would mandate that devo-max comes at the cost of remaining in the Union for at least a period of several decades. As I have said before, I don't want to see another Scottish referendum in my lifetime - the question has been settled and there is no reason to revisit it for at least another hundred years.
But: The big problem is Westminsters idea of English Devolution is chopping England up into EU regions (Balkanisation) This must be resisted and an English Parliament created within a new UK Federation.
Very happy with that result. Some things to note in the aftermath:
1) Salmond will likely be very annoyed with not only losing, but the main discussion being had this morning is how to devolve England, rather than extending devolution in Scotland.
2) Labour have perhaps been shafted by this. There is now a large section of Scotland who will now no longer vote Labour at the General Election because of their front-and-centre position in the No campaign. And I imagine large sections of the No campaign will also be disillusioned by Labour's cack-handed handling of the No campaign, so they face the prospect of being electoral pariahs in Scotland, which is where they were usually guaranteed dozens of safe seats to control Westminster with.
On the other hand, they look like they are going to resist any attempt to devolve England, which could be a killer in seats where they will need to compete with Tories and UKIP. The Lib Dems also have a good reason to support devolving Engand as they have been culled north of the border. At the moment, Labour will be running on a ticket whereby they will be telling English voters that they don't trust them with their own money, with an EU referendum or with their own devolved government.
3) The main message coming from the Yes camp is 'We will win...next time'. Yet Salmond promised this would not be a 'neverendum'. I know Salmond's promises are worth less than a Scottish pound in a Bromley dry-cleaners but they cannot seriously expect Westminster to allow them to keep holding referendums until they get the 'right' result. I'd hope that, to avoid this happening, Downing Street would mandate that devo-max comes at the cost of remaining in the Union for at least a period of several decades. As I have said before, I don't want to see another Scottish referendum in my lifetime - the question has been settled and there is no reason to revisit it for at least another hundred years.
But: The big problem is Westminsters idea of English Devolution is chopping England up into EU regions (Balkanisation) This must be resisted and an English Parliament created within a new UK Federation.
I don't understand the problem with regional assemblies?
Very happy with that result. Some things to note in the aftermath:
1) Salmond will likely be very annoyed with not only losing, but the main discussion being had this morning is how to devolve England, rather than extending devolution in Scotland.
2) Labour have perhaps been shafted by this. There is now a large section of Scotland who will now no longer vote Labour at the General Election because of their front-and-centre position in the No campaign. And I imagine large sections of the No campaign will also be disillusioned by Labour's cack-handed handling of the No campaign, so they face the prospect of being electoral pariahs in Scotland, which is where they were usually guaranteed dozens of safe seats to control Westminster with.
On the other hand, they look like they are going to resist any attempt to devolve England, which could be a killer in seats where they will need to compete with Tories and UKIP. The Lib Dems also have a good reason to support devolving Engand as they have been culled north of the border. At the moment, Labour will be running on a ticket whereby they will be telling English voters that they don't trust them with their own money, with an EU referendum or with their own devolved government.
3) The main message coming from the Yes camp is 'We will win...next time'. Yet Salmond promised this would not be a 'neverendum'. I know Salmond's promises are worth less than a Scottish pound in a Bromley dry-cleaners but they cannot seriously expect Westminster to allow them to keep holding referendums until they get the 'right' result. I'd hope that, to avoid this happening, Downing Street would mandate that devo-max comes at the cost of remaining in the Union for at least a period of several decades. As I have said before, I don't want to see another Scottish referendum in my lifetime - the question has been settled and there is no reason to revisit it for at least another hundred years.
But: The big problem is Westminsters idea of English Devolution is chopping England up into EU regions (Balkanisation) This must be resisted and an English Parliament created within a new UK Federation.
Just out of interest why are you so anti chopping up England into regions?
Happy with the result. Didn't take it seriously at first. But when the polls started showing how significant the 'Yes' vote was I started to really think about it, listened to the debates, and realised what a disaster that the start of the break-up of the UK would be.
Good result for the Labour party.
Not happy with the extra devolution measures promised to the Scots in order to stop the break-up. The prospect of the petty small minded anti european 'Little Englanders' in the Tory and UKIP parties trying to make the next election solely about devolution from europe and the UK fills me with despair.
To quote a well known (para)phrase "England is a proud and historic nation" and that's how I want it to stay. Would you equally suggest Scotland and Wales should be regionalised ? No one in Westminster has. They are happy to retain Scotland and Wales as nations. It's only England they wish to destroy. Balkanisation plays into the EU hands. They have long wanted to remove England from the map. There can be Devolution down to areas of England, but it must come as the remit of an English Parliament within a Federal UK.
Am in Edinburgh at the moment. Was here last night was very lively with 'YES' campaigners. Did not see many 'NO' campaigners. Was well suprised at the result this morning. Now off to stay in Dunfermline with a mate who as he says was the biggest YES supporter. Hope he ainrt commited hari-kari
Comments
Thats less than the aggregate population of Leeds and Birmingham and only around 20% of the urban population of London.
Never was the term "noisy neighbours" more appropriate.
My advice to the Scotish separatists would be.....
'Sit down, shut up!'
but I fear we'll have to endure more of their insular self obsessed witterings over the coming months and years.
It may have been been a great day for democracy but what a waste of my taxes.
NO 67% Yes 33%
I never saw 1 no voter all night just yes voters all young very proud Scots quite aggressive in their nation's defence,
Great turnout from the Scots a huge wake up call for all those who don't vote normally, that you should use your voice
Exactly why a yes vote really wouldn't have bothered me.
Happy for all my Rangers mates who see themselves as British. Would happily let the yes voters go independent on their own though.
Well done Scotland
Interesting times may lie ahead re the Barnett formula though. Even the man himself acknowledges that it is unfair and not a long term solution.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11100400/My-funding-formula-for-Scotland-is-a-terrible-mistake-Lord-Barnett-admits.html
A General Election is in the offing so I can see a lot of MPs suddenly deciding that they are English in a cynical attempt to hang onto their seats after years of shafting the English.
Don't worry - Westminster wont follow through with more powers for the "jocks". England will still subsidise Scotland and everyone can stay miserable believing myths and spouting off about how "If I had a vote I'd vote for the jocks to fuck off".
1) Salmond will likely be very annoyed with not only losing, but the main discussion being had this morning is how to devolve England, rather than extending devolution in Scotland.
2) Labour have perhaps been shafted by this. There is now a large section of Scotland who will now no longer vote Labour at the General Election because of their front-and-centre position in the No campaign. And I imagine large sections of the No campaign will also be disillusioned by Labour's cack-handed handling of the No campaign, so they face the prospect of being electoral pariahs in Scotland, which is where they were usually guaranteed dozens of safe seats to control Westminster with.
On the other hand, they look like they are going to resist any attempt to devolve England, which could be a killer in seats where they will need to compete with Tories and UKIP. The Lib Dems also have a good reason to support devolving Engand as they have been culled north of the border. At the moment, Labour will be running on a ticket whereby they will be telling English voters that they don't trust them with their own money, with an EU referendum or with their own devolved government.
3) The main message coming from the Yes camp is 'We will win...next time'. Yet Salmond promised this would not be a 'neverendum'. I know Salmond's promises are worth less than a Scottish pound in a Bromley dry-cleaners but they cannot seriously expect Westminster to allow them to keep holding referendums until they get the 'right' result. I'd hope that, to avoid this happening, Downing Street would mandate that devo-max comes at the cost of remaining in the Union for at least a period of several decades. As I have said before, I don't want to see another Scottish referendum in my lifetime - the question has been settled and there is no reason to revisit it for at least another hundred years.
This must be resisted and an English Parliament created within a new UK Federation.
Salmon gave his people the right to yes or no------its not a bad legacy.
Federal Uk ---what utter tosh---England split into regions ( The country formally known as England)------labours utopia
Good result for the Labour party.
Not happy with the extra devolution measures promised to the Scots in order to stop the break-up. The prospect of the petty small minded anti european 'Little Englanders' in the Tory and UKIP parties trying to make the next election solely about devolution from europe and the UK fills me with despair.
To quote a well known (para)phrase "England is a proud and historic nation" and that's how I want it to stay.
Would you equally suggest Scotland and Wales should be regionalised ? No one in Westminster has. They are happy to retain Scotland and Wales as nations. It's only England they wish to destroy.
Balkanisation plays into the EU hands. They have long wanted to remove England from the map.
There can be Devolution down to areas of England, but it must come as the remit of an English Parliament within a Federal UK.