They wanted it more and we didn't work as a team, it was as though we had a load of new players who'd never met each other before.
Kermorgant and Sordell were poor together and often too close or too far apart, but that should improve over time. Midfield wise we have decent individual players but not a unit.
There will be good and bad runs this season, we look to be starting on a bad one so hopefully this will at least get it (or one of them) out the way! Plus it might make the owners think about another player or two.
An abject performance and difficult to take any real positives out of that, save for a few good attacking thrusts from Harriot and decent cameos from Church and Stephens. Boro dominated us and we were fortunate that they were misfiring up front.
I expect that Chris will make a few changes for next week, although he'll be reluctant to to make too many and/or push youngsters into a struggling side. On a more positive note, most teams in this division - and certainly us - find it easier to play away than at home. We need to get back to basics and remember what made us so hard to beat on the road last season.
Jackson was limping heavily on his way off at h/t. Perhaps he shouldn't have played at all. Makes you question CPs lack of faith in his available 'fit' players.
I think the problem is not necessarily the midfield although no one in there had a particularly good game. I think the issue is thr defence are too deep meaning gower and jj had far too much ground together and they are not the type of midfielder who can cope with that. You need a kish in there for that.
Jackson was limping heavily on his way off at h/t. Perhaps he shouldn't have played at all. Makes you question CPs lack of faith in his available 'fit' players.
Nothing to do with him maybe taking a knock in that bone crunching challenge he put in then?
Or maybe he took him off because we received an offer in the first half or him.
Honestly, we do love a conspiracy theory don't we?!
Jackson was limping heavily on his way off at h/t. Perhaps he shouldn't have played at all. Makes you question CPs lack of faith in his available 'fit' players.
Nothing to do with him maybe taking a knock in that bone crunching challenge he put in then?
Or maybe he took him off because we received an offer in the first half or him.
Honestly, we do love a conspiracy theory don't we?!
It isnt too often that I am critical of the players but,living in Northumberland as I do now,it was so hard to take the performance that was on offer yesterday and then travel 320 miles back home.Losing is difficult to accept at the best of times but all I ask for is effort and I didnt see much of it yesterday.I cant get to all the home games but I purchased my season ticket as I love my club and I really hope the players read what people have said and understand what Charlton Athletic means to us all.
It isnt too often that I am critical of the players but,living in Northumberland as I do now,it was so hard to take the performance that was on offer yesterday and then travel 320 miles back home.Losing is difficult to accept at the best of times but all I ask for is effort and I didnt see much of it yesterday.I cant get to all the home games but I purchased my season ticket as I love my club and I really hope the players read what people have said and understand what Charlton Athletic means to us all.
I get the hump traveling back to Essex when we lose let alone Northumberland. Fair play to you. Don't think yesterday was through lack of effort.
It isnt too often that I am critical of the players but,living in Northumberland as I do now,it was so hard to take the performance that was on offer yesterday and then travel 320 miles back home.Losing is difficult to accept at the best of times but all I ask for is effort and I didnt see much of it yesterday.I cant get to all the home games but I purchased my season ticket as I love my club and I really hope the players read what people have said and understand what Charlton Athletic means to us all.
Let it go ffs, starting to sound like a sad old man.
Nobody is saying CP is beyond criticism (a point that you keep bringing up over and over again)
What people are saying is either the players didnt perform to anywhere near their best ability and therefore any tactics or instructions CP gave probably became redundant, and that CP has proved time and time again that you just need to have faith in him. It's two games in, cut the man some slack. Just like Solly or Kermogant will get given the benefit of the doubt because we usually get better from them, same with CP.
The main thing is that if 2 or 3 players don't perform then the other 8 or 9 can bring them through and get a result. That's pretty much true at any level of football. Yesterday, 11 players weren't at the races and you just can't get away with that.
when CP came back as manager watching him from the NWest Quad i "thought rabbit in head lights he hasnt a clue".----------------his first full season and a new team of his players we get 101 points. Re thinking ---im sure his body language was shock at how bad we were and the job he had to do. Yesterday im sure i saw something similar to when he first stood on the touch line . He isnt very animated anyway but to me it did look like " yes i know our midfield are pony but ive done the best i can with nothing---------not my fault". How long will he stay when he cant get his first choice transfers or even his 5 th choice transfers?
We know we are potless and thats not down to CP but i still dont get why he is so down on Hollands ? the team is crying out for energy and at least he does get up and down the pitch.
Jackson was limping heavily on his way off at h/t. Perhaps he shouldn't have played at all. Makes you question CPs lack of faith in his available 'fit' players.
Charlton Live @charltonlive Gaffer saying he might have bought back the skipper too soon #CAFC
If MA wants to swim against the tide I suppose it's his option and as long as he's prepared to take some flack, let him express his opinions for as they say its a free country (allegedly) ;-)))
It was horrible. I say that for our Lifers in Australia, Canada, and anywhere north of the Watford Gap who haven't heard it... It was utterly ghastly. Not a single man in our team can pass the ball, trap it, give it, and move.... This is why lost all those games last season at home to Barnsley, Ipswich, Watford, Crystal Palace, Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Nottingham Forest, Burnley, Millwall, - and Middlesbrough - again! Our midfield is weak, the defence goes to pieces at the slightest pressure, our strikers are impotent.
It is simply unrehearsed. Are you telling me that man-for-man the opposition is better than us? In that case, what's the point of us being in the Championship? Why don't we just all decamp to the Conference and be done with it? Look at Danny Green - in the first half, we've got a free-kick on the edge of their box. Trundle, trundle, all of our tall defenders are standing in the box - and Green takes the kick, and can't clear the Boro wall.
Second half; we've got a corner. Green takes it - and it lands, untouched, on top of the net. What in hell's name is the point of that? It is the most shameful waste, and no-one minds, least of all the opposition, of course. Stephens comes on as a sub, and for ten minutes he worries the Boro midfield - then he simply evaporates. But, hang on! - he's suddenly taking a corner, which he over-hits by miles and it goes out for a goal-kick.
This is worse than non-League. The Boro keeper is limping for ten minutes. Do we worry him, hassle him, do we pepper him? We don't know how to cross the half-way line. Kermorgant is limping, so we have no-one - I mean no-one - up front. Kermorgant looks at the bench, at Powell, who doesn't replace him.
Church is thrown on: Hang on, all is not lost - we've got a throw-in. Our man stands there with the ball in his hands, tippetty-tappetty, looks around, and there is no-one running or moving. Not a soul. The nearest player in a red shirt is the midfield, vacant, staring at him, 30 yards away.
We are 1-0 down again. To Middlesbrough - and don't forget Bournemouth last week - and Barnsley, Ipswich, Watford, Palace, Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Forest, Burnley, and Millwall, last season. We simply do not know what to do with the ball the beat the opposition. There is no physical or mental strength, no deceit, no guile nor cunning, and there is nothing instinctive - there are no rehearsed moves.
I wonder, I really do - What on earth do they do on that training pitch in Sparrows Lane on Monday to Friday?
It was horrible. I say that for our Lifers in Australia, Canada, and anywhere north of the Watford Gap who haven't heard it... It was utterly ghastly. Not a single man in our team can pass the ball, trap it, give it, and move.... This is why lost all those games last season at home to Barnsley, Ipswich, Watford, Crystal Palace, Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Nottingham Forest, Burnley, Millwall, - and Middlesbrough - again! Our midfield is weak, the defence goes to pieces at the slightest pressure, our strikers are impotent.
It is simply unrehearsed. Are you telling me that man-for-man the opposition is better than us? In that case, what's the point of us being in the Championship? Why don't we just all decamp to the Conference and be done with it? Look at Danny Green - in the first half, we've got a free-kick on the edge of their box. Trundle, trundle, all of our tall defenders are standing in the box - and Green takes the kick, and can't clear the Boro wall.
Second half; we've got a corner. Green takes it - and it lands, untouched, on top of the net. What in hell's name is the point of that? It is the most shameful waste, and no-one minds, least of all the opposition, of course. Stephens comes on as a sub, and for ten minutes he worries the Boro midfield - then he simply evaporates. But, hang on! - he's suddenly taking a corner, which he over-hits by miles and it goes out for a goal-kick.
This is worse than non-League. The Boro keeper is limping for ten minutes. Do we worry him, hassle him, do we pepper him? We don't know how to cross the half-way line. Kermorgant is limping, so we have no-one - I mean no-one - up front. Kermorgant looks at the bench, at Powell, who doesn't replace him.
Church is thrown on: Hang on, all is not lost - we've got a throw-in. Our man stands there with the ball in his hands, tippetty-tappetty, looks around, and there is no-one running or moving. Not a soul. The nearest player in a red shirt is the midfield, vacant, staring at him, 30 yards away.
We are 1-0 down again. To Middlesbrough - and don't forget Bournemouth last week - and Barnsley, Ipswich, Watford, Palace, Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Forest, Burnley, and Millwall, last season. We simply do not know what to do with the ball the beat the opposition. There is no physical or mental strength, no deceit, no guile nor cunning, and there is nothing instinctive - there are no rehearsed moves.
I wonder, I really do - What on earth do they do on that training pitch in Sparrows Lane on Monday to Friday?
Great post. Football is such an easy & simple game - 11 blokes on hackney marshes on a sunday morning, without any training, can do it........why can't we ???
good points are Callum was exciting and a threat; erm there aren't any more good points. Areas for improvement: Sordell needs to be told not to become another bwp and start working harder. Church needs to get a start. Hughes needs to start as does stephens. Morison needs to start shouting more, much much more. Need to use the left wing much more. Green needs more fitness and defensive work. Good constructive criticism. Early days.
I haven't read all the comments on the thread but I am guessing that most posts are pretty much in line with how I feel. This game reminded me of the worst part of last season when we fialed to compete in midfield and as a result we were left exposed at the back. Apart from Dervite nobody came out of the game with much credit even Solly was poor by his own standards, Morrison at the moment looks shakey and Wiggins was too often turned.
It has to be said that the Boro defence, especially Woodgate dealt with Kermit and Sordell with ease and I for one got a little fed up with seeing Kermit laying on the floor with his head in his hands I love the man but he likes to put it about so when it comes back at him he needs to man up a bit, mind you their player was lucky not to be red carded for whatt looked like a deliberate elbow.
Boro were well organised but nothing special and it needed a moment of pure madness for them to score once again Hamer was back to being "Flapper" although he was left exposed.
Two games don't make a season but my small concern is that the league looks stronger than last year the relegated teams are better and certainly Forest, Leicester and even Ipswitch are greatly improved which possibly means a big struggle. Apparently CP said that "We weren't sharp enough" which is a little worrying considering we are at the very start of the season. We don't seem to have addressed where the problems lie i.e. midfield so it appears this season could be a long one. But as I said its only two matches.
All is all the performance was abysmal, the crowd smaller than reported and the general feeling (around where I sit at least) was that this team is not good enough.
I suspect Gower will look exposed unless we play a 5 man midfield or 4-4-2 with someone like Pritchard/Wilson on the right, who tuck in defensively. It's obvious Green can't be trusted in a 4-4-2 to do the defensive work (unless we are chasing the game and it's worth a gamble....) because he hasn't got the drive or fitness for the role. He is more suited to a 4-5-1 or 4-3-3.
I suspect Gower will look exposed unless we play a 5 man midfield or 4-4-2 with someone like Pritchard/Wilson on the right, who tuck in defensively. It's obvious Green can't be trusted in a 4-4-2 to do the defensive work (unless we are chasing the game and it's worth a gamble....) because he hasn't got the drive or fitness for the role. He is more suited to a 4-5-1 or 4-3-3.
My team for the next game to nick a 1-0 win......
Hamer
Solly Cort Dervite Evina
Wilson Hollands Gower Stephens Harriott
Kermorgant
Good shout. Time to batten down the hatches, do it the "Curbs way" for a few games until we steady the ship.
Time perhaps to bring Dervite into midfield again, play Wood or Cort alongside Morrison and start with Church and Pigott, give Kermorgant a break . We all 'love' Powell but his conservatism and pragmatism need to take second place to some innovation and aggression. We are not a particularly skilful side and need to put out a team that will at least graft hard. My team for Barnsley: Hamer Solly Morrison Cort Wiggins Stephens Dervite Jackson (if fit, if not Hollands) Harriott Church Pigott
Time perhaps to bring Dervite into midfield again, play Wood or Cort alongside Morrison and start with Church and Pigott, give Kermorgant a break . We all 'love' Powell but his conservatism and pragmatism need to take second place to some innovation and aggression. We are not a particularly skilful side and need to put out a team that will at least graft hard. My team for Barnsley: Hamer Solly Morrison Cort Wiggins Stephens Dervite Jackson (if fit, if not Hollands) Harriott Church Pigott
That's a very good shout.. Dervite in a holding role could be a very good option. Maybe Morrison needs someone like Wood playing along side him, experienced and very vocal
21st will be a success this year. Mid table is a pipe dream with our midfield. Gower is too slow and old, and Jacko (whilst clearly not fit) is too slow to play alongside him. On that second half showing, Stephens needs to be in there.But we needs two strong cm's in sharpish. Next two are more winnable on paper. 4 points is a must. They were far too good for us man for man today. Amazing the comments they got in the match preview. Some top top players in their team. Oh, and the golden boys Solly and Kermo were cack. They cant be immune to criticism.
Pretty much agree with this, excespt to say i thought JJ did ok first half and we missed him second half
I hope there will be some movement before the window closes and judging by Powell's post match comments I think there will be.
I also fear we might lose players. The speculation about about Wiggins looks credible following the articles in VOTV,but with Ceddy and Morgan Fox in reserve it is probably one position where a sacrifice could be made.I thought he had an awful game Saturday and wondered whether his mind was elsewhere.
On the assumption there is no more player movement before Saturday ,I too would like to see Hollands return to the line up whilst Jacko is injured partly because he is left footed so keeps the balance JJ gives us, but also I feel last year injuries spoilt his pre season,so was his loss of form due to that and not the step up in Division ?I also think we should move Dervite into a DMF role and consideration should be given to going 4 5 1 at Barnsley:
Time perhaps to ibring Dervite into midfield again, play Wood or Cort alongside Morrison and start with Church and Pigott, give Kermorgant a break . We all 'love' Powell but his conservatism and pragmatism need to take second place to some innovation and aggression. We are not a particularly skilful side and need to put out a team that will at least graft hard. My team for Barnsley: Hamer Solly Morrison Cort Wiggins Stephens Dervite Jackson (if fit, if not Hollands) Harriott Church Pigott
My criticism of this is Dervite was almost universally slated last season playing in midfield. It's putting square pegs in round holes, and, IMO unnecessary. Don't weaken the defence, when we have a ready made player to fill that role in Cousins.
Unfortunately, one of CP's weaknesses, is that he has certain favourites. If Morro is perceived to not be performing, perhaps the best thing to do would be to play Wood and Dervite, which would also be more balanced?
Comments
Kermorgant and Sordell were poor together and often too close or too far apart, but that should improve over time. Midfield wise we have decent individual players but not a unit.
There will be good and bad runs this season, we look to be starting on a bad one so hopefully this will at least get it (or one of them) out the way! Plus it might make the owners think about another player or two.
I expect that Chris will make a few changes for next week, although he'll be reluctant to to make too many and/or push youngsters into a struggling side. On a more positive note, most teams in this division - and certainly us - find it easier to play away than at home. We need to get back to basics and remember what made us so hard to beat on the road last season.
Or maybe he took him off because we received an offer in the first half or him.
Honestly, we do love a conspiracy theory don't we?!
Gaffer saying he might have bought back the skipper too soon #CAFC
It is simply unrehearsed. Are you telling me that man-for-man the opposition is better than us? In that case, what's the point of us being in the Championship? Why don't we just all decamp to the Conference and be done with it? Look at Danny Green - in the first half, we've got a free-kick on the edge of their box. Trundle, trundle, all of our tall defenders are standing in the box - and Green takes the kick, and can't clear the Boro wall.
Second half; we've got a corner. Green takes it - and it lands, untouched, on top of the net. What in hell's name is the point of that? It is the most shameful waste, and no-one minds, least of all the opposition, of course. Stephens comes on as a sub, and for ten minutes he worries the Boro midfield - then he simply evaporates. But, hang on! - he's suddenly taking a corner, which he over-hits by miles and it goes out for a goal-kick.
This is worse than non-League. The Boro keeper is limping for ten minutes. Do we worry him, hassle him, do we pepper him? We don't know how to cross the half-way line. Kermorgant is limping, so we have no-one - I mean no-one - up front. Kermorgant looks at the bench, at Powell, who doesn't replace him.
Church is thrown on: Hang on, all is not lost - we've got a throw-in. Our man stands there with the ball in his hands, tippetty-tappetty, looks around, and there is no-one running or moving. Not a soul. The nearest player in a red shirt is the midfield, vacant, staring at him, 30 yards away.
We are 1-0 down again. To Middlesbrough - and don't forget Bournemouth last week - and Barnsley, Ipswich, Watford, Palace, Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Forest, Burnley, and Millwall, last season. We simply do not know what to do with the ball the beat the opposition. There is no physical or mental strength, no deceit, no guile nor cunning, and there is nothing instinctive - there are no rehearsed moves.
I wonder, I really do - What on earth do they do on that training pitch in Sparrows Lane on Monday to Friday?
It has to be said that the Boro defence, especially Woodgate dealt with Kermit and Sordell with ease and I for one got a little fed up with seeing Kermit laying on the floor with his head in his hands I love the man but he likes to put it about so when it comes back at him he needs to man up a bit, mind you their player was lucky not to be red carded for whatt looked like a deliberate elbow.
Boro were well organised but nothing special and it needed a moment of pure madness for them to score once again Hamer was back to being "Flapper" although he was left exposed.
Two games don't make a season but my small concern is that the league looks stronger than last year the relegated teams are better and certainly Forest, Leicester and even Ipswitch are greatly improved which possibly means a big struggle. Apparently CP said that "We weren't sharp enough" which is a little worrying considering we are at the very start of the season. We don't seem to have addressed where the problems lie i.e. midfield so it appears this season could be a long one. But as I said its only two matches.
All is all the performance was abysmal, the crowd smaller than reported and the general feeling (around where I sit at least) was that this team is not good enough.
My team for the next game to nick a 1-0 win......
Hamer
Solly
Cort
Dervite
Evina
Wilson
Hollands
Gower
Stephens
Harriott
Kermorgant
My team for Barnsley: Hamer Solly Morrison Cort Wiggins Stephens Dervite Jackson (if fit, if not Hollands) Harriott Church Pigott
Maybe Morrison needs someone like Wood playing along side him, experienced and very vocal
I hope there will be some movement before the window closes and judging by Powell's post match comments I think there will be.
I also fear we might lose players. The speculation about about Wiggins looks credible following the articles in VOTV,but with Ceddy and Morgan Fox in reserve it is probably one position where a sacrifice could be made.I thought he had an awful game Saturday and wondered whether his mind was elsewhere.
On the assumption there is no more player movement before Saturday ,I too would like to see Hollands return to the line up whilst Jacko is injured partly because he is left footed so keeps the balance JJ gives us, but also I feel last year injuries spoilt his pre season,so was his loss of form due to that and not the step up in Division ?I also think we should move Dervite into a DMF role and consideration should be given to going 4 5 1 at Barnsley:
My team
Hamer
Solly Cort Morrison Wiggins
Dervite Hollands
Wilson Stephens Harriott
Kermorgant
Subs : Pope,Evina,Wood,Gower,Green,Church,Sordell.
Unfortunately, one of CP's weaknesses, is that he has certain favourites. If Morro is perceived to not be performing, perhaps the best thing to do would be to play Wood and Dervite, which would also be more balanced?