At this stage of the season you are unlikely to see 3 or 4 goal scorelines, everyone is either fighting relegation or trying to make the play offs. Teams all now know the different strengths and weaknesses of every side meaning tighter games.
Would definitely bring Hayes back to the bench, BWP likes playing with him, and he might even link up better with Kerms than Clarke does.
One worry, is that SCP first took over last season, we started with a run of victories when we weren't playing well, amid jokes about how easy this management lark was. Then we continued playing badly, and the results dipped. If we play like we did during the second half for 90 minutes then we will start losing games.
I agree Oggy about Kerms defensively and would add Carl Leaburn to the list of centre forwards who did their defensive duties effectively . It now feels like we have an extra centre back at opposition corners . Also although he didn't score last night he did 'win' a decisive penalty which also resulted in McKenzie being sent off .He certainly knows how to get under the oppositions skin.
Win our 2 games in hand on Sheff weds and thats them out the race totally 16 points just to catch us (not that they are in it) win the game i hand on Hudds 15 Points to catch us,
The win last night took MK dons out of it
Stevenage are too far behind to catch us also
So as long as we gain the advantage in our games in hands and barring 1 fooooking Sheffield weds style Maaaaaasive collapse
Man Utd were pretty average last season but still won the PL as they know how to get results when not playing well. We didn't play well last night, and have not done so for a few games recently, but it was enough. The fluidity seems to have disappeared but I'm sure it will return soon and then we'll be flying again. Keep the faith, in SCP we trust.
Also, I'm sure they are already earmarking better players to improve the squad for an assault on the Championship next season.
Really don't understand the moaning on here, we have wanted a winning team for ages, we finally get one & we are now not winning the right way. As valleygary has said on here before we are the Chelsea side of about Five/Six years ago for this division. Abramovich did not like that style so he changed manager look how that has worked out they have neither a winning nor expansive team now. We ain't Barcelona so what, who cares? We have a winning team which I for one am grateful for.
What Rick's son said.
We have enough about us to win the games we need to mainly due to our soild defence. Other sides also know how good we can be and set up to stop us.
So yes we can win the league without playing exciting, expansive football as we are doing just that.
The 3 - 0 and 4 - 0s will come later on when the team has relaxed and promotion won. And when Andy Hughes gets back in the side : - )
If it was just a few games then we could chalk it up to luck but these results are consistent and we've got to admit that we know how to win scruffily. We've played some great football at times, and now we're playing some dry football. Couldn't care less if it means we're in the championship next year.
Much of the reason that we're still winning games has to be due to our defense which looks solid and our midfield who actually give a sh*t compared with last seasons wasters. Our strikers are cold right now (maybe time for a re-jig with Hayes and Haynes in the picture as many have said) but as long as those behind them keep their heads we are incredibly tough to beat.
All in all it feels like a completely different club from the last 5 years or so, and I'm proud to bring friends along (when its £5 a game) to show them some proper football and a proper club. COYR
A major difference from last year is that we have better players and a stronger squad. 90 points is going to get you promotion this year and if we beat Tranmere away and Rochdale and Stevenage at home in our next 3 games we will have 76 points with 14 games to go. That will mean relegation form of a point per game will get us to 90!!!! Of course I am expecting much more and sure we will get it but we are reaching the stage where the games tick down and our position looks stronger and stronger. Yestreday's results were massive in that respect!
with the players we have, i think we can afford to be more patient on the ball... we have very good ball players.
was gonna start a separate thread on Yann but won't bother now. are we using him too much as a "target man"?
it seems to be the easy thing to do now to use him as our "get out" ball but to me it negates his qualities as a striker.
bwp and Yann are not on the same wavelength, they don't buzz around each other picking up flick ons or work one two's.
maybe it is not the players that are the problem in an attacking sense but our tendency to go with the ball to Yann too often.
this is in no way a criticism, i am over the moon with our position but maybe we need to trust in our own abilities to fashion chances by creative play a bit more.
Stevenage at home will be our next great performance. Players will be really fired up for it. They wont have forgotten Westley and Co's carry on at Broadhall Way.
The game is full of ifs and buts - I always find it amusing we are lucky when opposing sides do not really create any clear cut scoring opportunities or miss their chances but when we fail to do so or miss them we are rubbish.
Were the performances against Sheff Wed and Sheff United really 3rd gear? Don't think so. They were just 3/4 weeks ago. Few of us view the 2nd half performance last night was anything but very disappointing. Powell/ the players got it wrong by trying to be too clever in the way the sought to control the game. Credit to MK Dons for the way they played.
Logically you understand the approach not in terms of "resting" but most sides with 10 men sit back getting everybody behind the ball. Charlton by trying to keep the ball within the back four admittedly not very well were simply trying to draw the opposition forward to create space behind them. We just did not do it very well. There are things to learn from that.
In terms of the rest of the season we should congratulate the players on the progress they have made so far. Many of the them were brought in from League 1 sides because they knew this league but they are learning as they go along in terms of the challenges and pressures that go with the pursuit of a championship.
Remember opposing fans decrying our early season "tippy tappy football", grandly pronouncing it and we would fail as the season wore on. The players have learned to move on. We have barely missed a beat. In response to those challenges they have made themselves difficult to beat. It is our default position but our players do have enough individual ability to create something to score goals. Nothing wrong with winning 1- 0.
Any player obviously goes on the field looking to play well but once on the field the whole objective is to win the game. If you have to do that without playing well so be it. You just have to put your shift in - for me this group of players certainly does that but opposing teams are not just there to make up the numbers. MK Dons last night played decent football but would you swap League places (18 points adrift with an inferior goal difference of 14)?
I think peoples expectations are far too high - remember the days of Jimmy Giles and Les Berry and countless others those guys earned our support simply by putting in their shift. That criteria then sort of expanded to putting in a shift and winning. Now we are demanding they have perform well every game and play open attractive football. It is rare for such a combination to occur in the Premier League or the Championship - we are in League 1.
Our players are in League 1 for a reason. That does not mean they cannot play at a higher level. You and they will only know when they are given that chance. At the moment (there is still a way to go) the squad is earning the right to be given that chance. If ever we needed an example of not prejudging players we just have to look at Steve Gritt who hardly got a kick in the promotion season under Lenny Lawrence. Most expected he would probably move on yet he became one of our most effective & valuable contributors in the old first division.
This is probably a futile request because nowdays everyone no matter their real knowledge or experience is an expert but can we please stop diminishing our players by the continual focus on what they are not doing and what they are not achieving but respect what they are achieving and attempting to achieve. As of today they appear to be achieving considerably more than anyone else in their division.
Sometimes they will get it right and sometimes they will get it wrong but 5 League wins (3 against promotion contenders) out 6 in 2012 means they are getting a great deal more right than wrong.
I'd be surprised if on current form tables we were not in the top 2 or 3 throughout the season and topping them for most of the time. That is home form, away form and both - doubt you will see many teams that can achieve that and it is a fantastic achievement.
Every team will have a bit of a dip at times, but the great thing about us is that even if we have an off game, we invariably win it. That is a great qulaity to have and you really have to be a long time member of the glass half full club not to rejoice in that fact.
Look at the Norwich game at The Valley in April 2010, we battered them senseless for 89 minutes and they nicked a goal and held on - and went up easily.
It's what the better teams do, play within themselves and still win the game.
At 46 games the League One season is incredibly long, there will be longish stretches where we don't play well but still find a way to win.
This.
I have spoken to a few Norwich fans who said that the football that season was very poor but luck and grinding out results started getting them where they are now.
no we need to start playing to potential or points will drop, having said that it depends what others do too, as I said elsewhere however, Jacko remaining fit is key, shame we didn't have him the end of last season too it might have been a very different season
further thoughts: you win games by not conceding, but more importantly having enough players on the pitch that know where the goal is, Jackson being one of them, just wondering if waggy should be given more of a look in with this in mind.
It seems a common assumption by fans of other League One teams that we have a much bigger budget than everybody else. However, when you think about it, we have lost some big earners but have a few more players. My guess is the wages budget is not much higher than last season if it is at all. You also need to think about the loan players we brought in last season which we haven't this.
Then you have purchases - we seem to have paid small fees for a few players and got others on frees. Roughly I think it has been Hamer £100k, Morrow £250k, Wiggy £250k, Stephens £200k, Green £250k, Haynes £200k - anyway I guess it is probably about 1.25m in total.
We have sold Jenkinson for £1m and Elliot for £250k so I am assuming one side pretty much cancels out the other. Then you consider that Powell would have been happy to keep Semedo but Sheff Wednesday offered him a wage we couldn't match. We lost Youga's wages that were Championship level etc... and it is even feasible we have spent less in total this year than last!
Of course the board have been fantastic and have pumped money into the club to ensure it has a bright future and is sustainable going forwards but it is right that it is understood what an excellent job Sir Chris has done. We get managers like Rossler saying that his club can't compete with the millions Charlton spend when we haven't, Wednesday fans think we have a much bigger budget than them when it is much more likely to be much smaller. Sheff Utd definitely have a much bigger budget which is a remnant from playing at the higher level last season.
What a hero and wheeler and dealer Sir Chris has shown himself to be.
Of course we give him credit for his achievement but it's probably about time everybody else did too.
I really thought we would lose last night. MK, I thought were the team that would out football us and unlock our defence. An amazing season where we have only lost 2 games and we are into Febuary. Every team, even champions (Arsenal aside), has a slip up and a bad run. I feel we are in ours now yet still winning. Teams below us are now playing for 2nd place, its ours to lose now.
Not being funny, love the guy, but Kermit does not link up with people very well, especially BWP. Its a concern. We play it around alot though, allows other people to get in scoring positions as well as the strikers.
BWP was unlucky tonight, didnt notice Kermit much.
Balanced game tonight. One we were 2-0 up against 10 men, we was always going to just sit back and break up there moves. Clever, but boring.
But clever..
Agree about Kermit - Love what he does but he isn't great when he has the ball at his feet and has a bit of time. Hayes was better at that. I also don't think enough comes from Green and would rotate him more with Wagstaff as we lack pace in attack sometimes. Ditto BWP and Haynes. Stephens and or Hollands need to get ahead of the strikers occassionally as well. Having said all that, the team has a tried and tested formula that gets results so i'm not complaining, and i'm not suggesting that our results would be better but if we want to see more flowing football, then some of the above needs to happen. (in my opinion)
Perhaps we should change nothing because it is not broken and there's no need to fix it I think you have just been charltonised to the max Danny , We are doing enough to win every game , go to expansive and we become open , go to defensive and we can sit to deep and concede We are a very organised and solid team, once we get ahead we rarely lose , So we don't need to push on and open up the game , powelly has worked out a winning formula it is not 3rd gear , imo it is knowing how to win and once ahead the onus is on our opposition to Chase the game and not us
Totally agree, as for the comment that we were totally outplayed what game were you at ? Yes they may have had the ball more than us & they may have knocked it around their back 4 & into midfield but teams very very rarely score from there. Once they moved forward we put them under pressure & they had to play more adveturas balls which frequently came to nothing or we won the ball. Don't get me wrong they certainly had their chances & Hamer made one absolutely brilliant save to keep them out in the 1st half but outplayed us ? I think not. I've not seen the goals again yet but from where I was Hamer seemed to let the ball through his hands same as against Bury. Anyone confirm ?
Comments
Would definitely bring Hayes back to the bench, BWP likes playing with him, and he might even link up better with Kerms than Clarke does.
And defensively too, like Shaun Bartlett did.
Boring mid table Premiership football.
Curbs managed Powell for a long time and we are seeing his influence in SCP's own management style. It's not pretty at times but it's effective.
ONE AIM!
A win for Charlton at Tranmere would make us 15 points ahead of Huddersfield (4th place), with the same number of games played.
PS: Stevenage v Huddersfield re-arranged for Tues 28th Feb
The win last night took MK dons out of it
Stevenage are too far behind to catch us also
So as long as we gain the advantage in our games in hands and barring 1 fooooking Sheffield weds style Maaaaaasive collapse
we are there folks
cigar slippers and champagne on ice
Also, I'm sure they are already earmarking better players to improve the squad for an assault on the Championship next season.
What Rick's son said.
We have enough about us to win the games we need to mainly due to our soild defence. Other sides also know how good we can be and set up to stop us.
So yes we can win the league without playing exciting, expansive football as we are doing just that.
The 3 - 0 and 4 - 0s will come later on when the team has relaxed and promotion won. And when Andy Hughes gets back in the side : - )
Much of the reason that we're still winning games has to be due to our defense which looks solid and our midfield who actually give a sh*t compared with last seasons wasters. Our strikers are cold right now (maybe time for a re-jig with Hayes and Haynes in the picture as many have said) but as long as those behind them keep their heads we are incredibly tough to beat.
All in all it feels like a completely different club from the last 5 years or so, and I'm proud to bring friends along (when its £5 a game) to show them some proper football and a proper club. COYR
and Stevenage v Huddersfield to look forward to.
And we play Stevenage at home.
24 March...Huddersfield v Charlton
7 April ..... Huddersfield v Sheff Weds
Sheff Utd have still to play both MKD and Stevenage
was gonna start a separate thread on Yann but won't bother now. are we using him too much as a "target man"?
it seems to be the easy thing to do now to use him as our "get out" ball but to me it negates his qualities as a striker.
bwp and Yann are not on the same wavelength, they don't buzz around each other picking up flick ons or work one two's.
maybe it is not the players that are the problem in an attacking sense but our tendency to go with the ball to Yann too often.
this is in no way a criticism, i am over the moon with our position but maybe we need to trust in our own abilities to fashion chances by creative play a bit more.
Were the performances against Sheff Wed and Sheff United really 3rd gear? Don't think so.
They were just 3/4 weeks ago. Few of us view the 2nd half performance last night was anything but very disappointing. Powell/ the players got it wrong by trying to be too clever in the way the sought to control the game. Credit to MK Dons for the way they played.
Logically you understand the approach not in terms of "resting" but most sides with 10 men sit back getting everybody behind the ball. Charlton by trying to keep the ball within the back four admittedly not very well were simply trying to draw the opposition forward to create space behind them. We just did not do it very well. There are things to learn from that.
In terms of the rest of the season we should congratulate the players on the progress they have made so far. Many of the them were brought in from League 1 sides because they knew this league but they are learning as they go along in terms of the challenges and pressures that go with the pursuit of a championship.
Remember opposing fans decrying our early season "tippy tappy football", grandly pronouncing it and we would fail as the season wore on. The players have learned to move on. We have barely missed a beat. In response to those challenges they have made themselves difficult to beat. It is our default position but our players do have enough individual ability to create something to score goals. Nothing wrong with winning 1- 0.
Any player obviously goes on the field looking to play well but once on the field the whole objective is to win the game. If you have to do that without playing well so be it. You just have to put your shift in - for me this group of players certainly does that but opposing teams are not just there to make up the numbers. MK Dons last night played decent football but would you swap League places (18 points adrift with an inferior goal difference of 14)?
I think peoples expectations are far too high - remember the days of Jimmy Giles and Les Berry and countless others those guys earned our support simply by putting in their shift. That criteria then sort of expanded to putting in a shift and winning. Now we are demanding they have perform well every game and play open attractive football. It is rare for such a combination to occur in the Premier League or the Championship - we are in League 1.
Our players are in League 1 for a reason. That does not mean they cannot play at a higher level. You and they will only know when they are given that chance. At the moment (there is still a way to go) the squad is earning the right to be given that chance. If ever we needed an example of not prejudging players we just have to look at Steve Gritt who hardly got a kick in the promotion season under Lenny Lawrence. Most expected he would probably move on yet he became one of our most effective & valuable contributors in the old first division.
This is probably a futile request because nowdays everyone no matter their real knowledge or experience is an expert but can we please stop diminishing our players by the continual focus on what they are not doing and what they are not achieving but respect what they are achieving and attempting to achieve. As of today they appear to be achieving considerably more than anyone else in their division.
Sometimes they will get it right and sometimes they will get it wrong but 5 League wins (3 against promotion contenders) out 6 in 2012 means they are getting a great deal more right than wrong.
Grapevine49
Every team will have a bit of a dip at times, but the great thing about us is that even if we have an off game, we invariably win it. That is a great qulaity to have and you really have to be a long time member of the glass half full club not to rejoice in that fact.
I have spoken to a few Norwich fans who said that the football that season was very poor but luck and grinding out results started getting them where they are now.
We have beaten all our nearest rivals & sometimes twice. None of them have beaten us.
I thought in the close season we would go up. I thought after the 1st game we would go up.
We will go up.
Now can all you misearble buggers stop moaning & enjoy the best season (results wise) you'll probably ever witness.
further thoughts: you win games by not conceding, but more importantly having enough players on the pitch that know where the goal is, Jackson being one of them, just wondering if waggy should be given more of a look in with this in mind.
Then you have purchases - we seem to have paid small fees for a few players and got others on frees. Roughly I think it has been Hamer £100k, Morrow £250k, Wiggy £250k, Stephens £200k, Green £250k, Haynes £200k - anyway I guess it is probably about 1.25m in total.
We have sold Jenkinson for £1m and Elliot for £250k so I am assuming one side pretty much cancels out the other. Then you consider that Powell would have been happy to keep Semedo but Sheff Wednesday offered him a wage we couldn't match. We lost Youga's wages that were Championship level etc... and it is even feasible we have spent less in total this year than last!
Of course the board have been fantastic and have pumped money into the club to ensure it has a bright future and is sustainable going forwards but it is right that it is understood what an excellent job Sir Chris has done. We get managers like Rossler saying that his club can't compete with the millions Charlton spend when we haven't, Wednesday fans think we have a much bigger budget than them when it is much more likely to be much smaller. Sheff Utd definitely have a much bigger budget which is a remnant from playing at the higher level last season.
What a hero and wheeler and dealer Sir Chris has shown himself to be.
Of course we give him credit for his achievement but it's probably about time everybody else did too.
An amazing season where we have only lost 2 games and we are into Febuary.
Every team, even champions (Arsenal aside), has a slip up and a bad run. I feel we are in ours now yet still winning.
Teams below us are now playing for 2nd place, its ours to lose now.
Totally agree, as for the comment that we were totally outplayed what game were you at ? Yes they may have had the ball more than us & they may have knocked it around their back 4 & into midfield but teams very very rarely score from there. Once they moved forward we put them under pressure & they had to play more adveturas balls which frequently came to nothing or we won the ball. Don't get me wrong they certainly had their chances & Hamer made one absolutely brilliant save to keep them out in the 1st half but outplayed us ? I think not.
I've not seen the goals again yet but from where I was Hamer seemed to let the ball through his hands same as against Bury. Anyone confirm ?