Been by far our best player this season, he's head and shoulder above anyone else, ability wise, which is why Powell gave him the 2nd half Saturday when he clearly doesn't seem fit still...
He suffers with the same problem Shelvey had, in that he was always 2 or 3 passes ahead of the rest of the team, looks for the pass, nobody has gone where he wants them to be (the run they're supposed to make) so he either plays the ball anyway or turns - 9 times out of 10 into trouble because there's no support for him from the rest of the midfield. He then gets abused for not being able to thread the eye of a needle with a ball to a player who decides to hide behind one of the other team... Gets frustrated and then goes into his shell. He's even added tackling to his game! If Powell can find the right partner for him he'll be the difference between us and the other clubs who will struggle this season.
Pritchard is a good central midfielder and you can't fault his desire and committment to the Charlton cause. If he was left alone in the middle of the park and not pushed out wide we would see a much more consistent player.
Maybe try Stephens and Pritchard in the middle, but personal i would have one or the other with a proper Defensive midfielder. Pritchard when trying to hold onto what we have, but start with Stephens to create things.
Stephens has 2 assists this season. Joint top with Prtichard. Stephens' vision combined with Pritch's energy seems like the perfect combo in CM to me. Can't remembet a time they've started there together though
He does not hide which is a huge credit to him IMO
I don't think he is a great player I think he gives the ball away too often
He does try to find the right pass but I don't think his range of passing is great he can do the short passing and the slide pass but I don't think he has a great range
His pace is not all that and his shooting I believe has a great potential to improve as he certainly possess a great shot but does not hit the target enough
He reminds me of a poor mans Danny Murphy. He has great technique and can pick a pass, but his lack of pace means you normally need to play 3 in midfield to accommodate him.
I'd look at playng him as the holding midfielder and see if we can get someone alongside him who can do the running and supporting the strikers role. He just doesn't have the pace to do that himself.
He reminds me of a poor mans Danny Murphy. He has great technique and can pick a pass, but his lack of pace means you normally need to play 3 in midfield to accommodate him.
I'd look at playng him as the holding midfielder and see if we can get someone alongside him who can do the running and supporting the strikers role. He just doesn't have the pace to do that himself.
That's the sort of role i'm looking for next year and i'll be 42 - it worked for Jan Molby to a certain extent i suppose. Just hope Paul Lambert doesn't log on to this site.
Been by far our best player this season, he's head and shoulder above anyone else, ability wise, which is why Powell gave him the 2nd half Saturday when he clearly doesn't seem fit still...
Been by far our best player this season, he's head and shoulder above anyone else, ability wise, which is why Powell gave him the 2nd half Saturday when he clearly doesn't seem fit still...
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you are deluded!
Been by far our best player this season, he's head and shoulder above anyone else, ability wise, which is why Powell gave him the 2nd half Saturday when he clearly doesn't seem fit still...
Really? have you been watching the same player as I have?
I like Dale, I think Scoham is pretty much spot on with how I see him.
On Saturday he was looking for someone to pass to, instead he got 5 players standing on the edge of the penalty area waiting for Woodgate to beat them in the air. He gives the ball away more than he should, but I don't think he's always given the help by other players that he should be given either.
I like Dale too. Always looking for the ball. Can wriggle out of tight situations. Pick a pass. He may give the ball away more than other but his job is to get things ticking.
True, he would benefit from more pacey players to pick out - Murphy suffered when curbs got the jitters and oput the handbrake on- Murphy was at his best for us when he had Rommedahl, Bent and Thomas as a 3 man attack and he had 3 options to pick out all the time. Haynes is the only player we have wuith any genuine pace and why Wagstaff has been loaned out, i don't know. It's all reeking of a patched up squad to me so we just have to dig in and get some battlers in the side.
Been by far our best player this season, he's head and shoulder above anyone else, ability wise, which is why Powell gave him the 2nd half Saturday when he clearly doesn't seem fit still...
Really? have you been watching the same player as I have?
Evidently not, but then I must watch a different game to a fair amount of people both for club and country, because I'll mention such and such player doing well and someone (usually my brother will argue)
Michael Carrick is a good comparison. Like Stephens, some people just don't rate him, others think he's a very good player. He doesn't stand out, and if you're struggling people question if he's doing enough. If you're doing well he keeps possession, is comfortable on the ball etc.
The obvious thing to me is that we don't get the best out of him playing alongside Hollands and Jackson (plus Green if in a 4 man midfield). We got away with it in League 1, but they're too slow at this level to play together. Pritchard's quicker but has the same weaknesses in that he's not comfortable running with the ball.
I'm not sure about him playing further forward, he's clearly more comfortable dropping deep and passing the ball, rather than making runs and dribbling with the ball.
I think he'd look a very good player in the right midfield (while others wouldn't be able to make the step up). Ideally I'd say that would be a Scott Parker type in the middle - someone that puts tackles in, can carry the ball and add drive, pace and energy. Then out wide if we had a Championship standard winger (Wilson is only one looking like he might get there at the moment) and another creative player (a Reid or Jensen type).
Last season some compared him to Steven Gerrard - he's not that type of player. We're not going to see him drive forward with the ball, dominate the midfield and be creative in the way players like Reid or Jensen were - but alongside better players he could be capable of stepping up.
He can spreads the ball out wide fairly well, but at the same time he slows things down and the opposition get back behind the ball. With the right midfielders next to him they would be the ones upping the tempo and running with the ball, Stephens would be the one getting the ball off the defence and giving it to them.
As usual Scoham has is spot on.
If you think back to that excellent midfield trio Milan had a few years back - Gattuso, Kaka and Pirlo that is the balance of players we need to get the best out of Stephens. Obviously we will almost certainly never have even one player that good, let alone 3, but if you look at the individual roles they all fulfiled Stephens would be Pirlo - do we have a Championship equivalent of Gattuso and Kaka? Not really.
Injuries limit Chrissy's options a lot at the moment, but I think the next thing to try at home is a 5-3-2. I'm not generally a fan but we have attacking fullbacks and a good centre backs, but a weak midfield that needs the extra body. 5-3-2 would allow us to beef up midfield without sacrificing a forward. It's getting the right 3 man midfield that is key though.
He should be our most creative player - and sometimes shows it.
No doubt that Stephens has good ability on the ball but, as others have pointed out, he doesn't fit well within this team and how it is set up to play.
Even last season in League One with Stephens out injured, the team moved the ball around quicker - and were prolific in the number of opportunities created and goals scored.
But looking deeper into the reasons for that, we saw that the midfield was set up with a holding defensive CM with good positional self-discipline which gave other players the freedom to move into attacking positions, assured that their defensive duty was covered.
Even playing in a similar deep lying role, Stephens doesn't cover other players as well as he should.
With his ability to pick a killer pass, decent 1st touch and occasionally venomous shooting, he should perhaps be played further forward but ...... I remain to be convinced.
For now, Stephens is probably best paired with Pritchard, whose phenominal work rate, quick feet, tackling and tidy passing compliments him best. But then that makes a physically lightweight central midfield.
"We are a better team without him" - Where is the evidence for this?
He has featured in both wins so far this season. Was excellent in our first game away to Birmingham. The first game he missed out was also the first game we looked outclassed - Forest away.
So it that opinion based on any evidence whatsoever? Not really. Is it wrong? well....
the villa move might still be in his mind, keeping him from focusing on charlton.
if he plays it right, hopefully, stephens will work even harder to gain the attention back from villa in jan and prove to not only villa hes worth a purchase, but to charlton fans and the charlton team.
Michael Carrick is a good comparison. Like Stephens, some people just don't rate him, others think he's a very good player. He doesn't stand out, and if you're struggling people question if he's doing enough. If you're doing well he keeps possession, is comfortable on the ball etc.
The obvious thing to me is that we don't get the best out of him playing alongside Hollands and Jackson (plus Green if in a 4 man midfield). We got away with it in League 1, but they're too slow at this level to play together. Pritchard's quicker but has the same weaknesses in that he's not comfortable running with the ball.
I'm not sure about him playing further forward, he's clearly more comfortable dropping deep and passing the ball, rather than making runs and dribbling with the ball.
I think he'd look a very good player in the right midfield (while others wouldn't be able to make the step up). Ideally I'd say that would be a Scott Parker type in the middle - someone that puts tackles in, can carry the ball and add drive, pace and energy. Then out wide if we had a Championship standard winger (Wilson is only one looking like he might get there at the moment) and another creative player (a Reid or Jensen type).
Last season some compared him to Steven Gerrard - he's not that type of player. We're not going to see him drive forward with the ball, dominate the midfield and be creative in the way players like Reid or Jensen were - but alongside better players he could be capable of stepping up.
He can spreads the ball out wide fairly well, but at the same time he slows things down and the opposition get back behind the ball. With the right midfielders next to him they would be the ones upping the tempo and running with the ball, Stephens would be the one getting the ball off the defence and giving it to them.
Agree 100%. One of our most talented players but needs the right set-up to give his best.
Comments
He suffers with the same problem Shelvey had, in that he was always 2 or 3 passes ahead of the rest of the team, looks for the pass, nobody has gone where he wants them to be (the run they're supposed to make) so he either plays the ball anyway or turns - 9 times out of 10 into trouble because there's no support for him from the rest of the midfield. He then gets abused for not being able to thread the eye of a needle with a ball to a player who decides to hide behind one of the other team... Gets frustrated and then goes into his shell. He's even added tackling to his game! If Powell can find the right partner for him he'll be the difference between us and the other clubs who will struggle this season.
Maybe try Stephens and Pritchard in the middle, but personal i would have one or the other with a proper Defensive midfielder. Pritchard when trying to hold onto what we have, but start with Stephens to create things.
Dale Stephens as I see him
He does not hide which is a huge credit to him IMO
I don't think he is a great player I think he gives the ball away too often
He does try to find the right pass but I don't think his range of passing is great he can do the short passing and the slide pass but I don't think he has a great range
His pace is not all that and his shooting I believe has a great potential to improve as he certainly possess a great shot but does not hit the target enough
Weak at heading very weak IMO
Out of ten dale is about 5 or 6 week in week out
I'd look at playng him as the holding midfielder and see if we can get someone alongside him who can do the running and supporting the strikers role. He just doesn't have the pace to do that himself.
Is what my I phone puts in with out auto correct
And is more apt IMO
On Saturday he was looking for someone to pass to, instead he got 5 players standing on the edge of the penalty area waiting for Woodgate to beat them in the air. He gives the ball away more than he should, but I don't think he's always given the help by other players that he should be given either.
Not scared of getting stuck in neither
If you think back to that excellent midfield trio Milan had a few years back - Gattuso, Kaka and Pirlo that is the balance of players we need to get the best out of Stephens. Obviously we will almost certainly never have even one player that good, let alone 3, but if you look at the individual roles they all fulfiled Stephens would be Pirlo - do we have a Championship equivalent of Gattuso and Kaka? Not really.
Injuries limit Chrissy's options a lot at the moment, but I think the next thing to try at home is a 5-3-2. I'm not generally a fan but we have attacking fullbacks and a good centre backs, but a weak midfield that needs the extra body. 5-3-2 would allow us to beef up midfield without sacrificing a forward. It's getting the right 3 man midfield that is key though.
The new Racon, no one will miss him if he goes, but I fear we shot ourselves in the foot in August and that ship has sailed.
Have to say person who said he was the best player this season must have his seat the wrong way round FFS
He should be our most creative player - and sometimes shows it.
No doubt that Stephens has good ability on the ball but, as others have pointed out, he doesn't fit well within this team and how it is set up to play.
Even last season in League One with Stephens out injured, the team moved the ball around quicker - and were prolific in the number of opportunities created and goals scored.
But looking deeper into the reasons for that, we saw that the midfield was set up with a holding defensive CM with good positional self-discipline which gave other players the freedom to move into attacking positions, assured that their defensive duty was covered.
Even playing in a similar deep lying role, Stephens doesn't cover other players as well as he should.
With his ability to pick a killer pass, decent 1st touch and occasionally venomous shooting, he should perhaps be played further forward but ...... I remain to be convinced.
For now, Stephens is probably best paired with Pritchard, whose phenominal work rate, quick feet, tackling and tidy passing compliments him best. But then that makes a physically lightweight central midfield.
but, this league a little too fast paced for him, especially with the team we have.
Think the move to Villa would have been better for all involved.
He has featured in both wins so far this season. Was excellent in our first game away to Birmingham. The first game he missed out was also the first game we looked outclassed - Forest away.
So it that opinion based on any evidence whatsoever? Not really. Is it wrong? well....
There is evidence as already detailed in this thread if you chose to read it, but go ahead and keep the blinkers on
if he plays it right, hopefully, stephens will work even harder to gain the attention back from villa in jan and prove to not only villa hes worth a purchase, but to charlton fans and the charlton team.
;o)