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++Charlie Kelman signs on a 4 year deal++
Comments
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NJ is quite rigid in the way he does things as evidenced by the figures I've produced above. That message works the other way so far as his "game changers" are concerned - he wants to give them enough time to do just that. I'm not suggesting that I would be such a slave to any modus operandi but his strength is to convey one message and to stick to that.Chris_from_Sidcup said:One thing i don't think is particularly helping him is the continual early subs. There's no reason why he should be tired, so keep him on for 80-85 minutes. Often games will become more stretched as it gets into the last 15 minutes and that'd be ideal for him.
Yesterday i would've liked to have seen Jones sub TC off for Olaofe and keep Kelman on.
Given he got us promoted and that many thought we would be fighting relegation when we're two points off the play offs and eight points above the drop zone, it is difficult to criticise him too much for being that way. It doesn't help someone like Kelman but it is the unit and the results that count.3 -
Kelman? More like Kelboy hahaOff_it said:
Forgot about that. You're right. Was like a young boy trying to tackle his dad in the garden.oohaahmortimer said:Some nice touches but once again he was a proper pussio half heartedly going in to a 50-50 when if he’d gone in properly it may have broken for him clear of the last defender just in front of the west stand in the first half .
He shirked it like he did with the Derby keeper , proper lame effort .
Jokes aside, his performances have been underwhelming
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More Proof that you don’t even follow Charlton.RonnieMoore said:
He did show up and was MOM .. the fans sung his name when he was subbed again which changed the case when he went offIR94 said:Against the worst defence in the league (and by some distance), who was also missing their best CB, you expect him to show up, if he doesn't against them, then he won't against anyone at this level, and he showed some positives, and held the line well, but the fact that he still looked nowhere near like scoring is a big concern.
Carey was given MOTM.
It’s literally on all of our Social Media.1 -
Yeah i agree, and i'm not criticising Jones, just saying what i'd have liked to have seen. I was actually quite surprised TC started anyway after being away for international duty.Addick Addict said:
NJ is quite rigid in the way he does things as evidenced by the figures I've produced above. That message works the other way so far as his "game changers" are concerned - he wants to give them enough time to do just that. I'm not suggesting that I would be such a slave to any modus operandi but his strength is to convey one message and to stick to that.Chris_from_Sidcup said:One thing i don't think is particularly helping him is the continual early subs. There's no reason why he should be tired, so keep him on for 80-85 minutes. Often games will become more stretched as it gets into the last 15 minutes and that'd be ideal for him.
Yesterday i would've liked to have seen Jones sub TC off for Olaofe and keep Kelman on.
Given he got us promoted and that many thought we would be fighting relegation when we're two points off the play offs and eight points above the drop zone, it is difficult to criticise him too much for being that way. It doesn't help someone like Kelman but it is the unit and the results that count.1 -
I just don't understand this idea that if he gets one then they'll start flowing. Based on what? His lack of goals does not appear to be confidence based. If we are being kind to him, its because the system doesn't make many chances for our forwards, and if we are less kind, its because hes not getting in the right positions/not able to craft his own chances.Diebythesword said:I was actually a bit annoyed jones took him off.I’m more and more convinced when he scores one he’ll start absolutely smashing them in. He clearly has quality.
All of these explanations dont point to a sudden uptick of goals happening any time soon.1 -
I’m not sure it helps that the chant we are using for his name is the same tune used when something goes badly wrong eg it was used for some of Bannan’s stray passes.0
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Someone said Burke was given MOTM in the lounges. Maybe RM was saying Kelman was his MOTM which he is entitled to do.CafcSteve said:
More Proof that you don’t even follow Charlton.RonnieMoore said:
He did show up and was MOM .. the fans sung his name when he was subbed again which changed the case when he went offIR94 said:Against the worst defence in the league (and by some distance), who was also missing their best CB, you expect him to show up, if he doesn't against them, then he won't against anyone at this level, and he showed some positives, and held the line well, but the fact that he still looked nowhere near like scoring is a big concern.
Carey was given MOTM.
It’s literally on all of our Social Media.2 -
Pundits often say about non scoring strikers that they're less worried about the player missing chances, as it shows he's getting in the right positions. It's when he's not getting any chances at all that's more of a problem.balham red said:
I just don't understand this idea that if he gets one then they'll start flowing. Based on what? His lack of goals does not appear to be confidence based. If we are being kind to him, its because the system doesn't make many chances for our forwards, and if we are less kind, its because hes not getting in the right positions/not able to craft his own chances.Diebythesword said:I was actually a bit annoyed jones took him off.I’m more and more convinced when he scores one he’ll start absolutely smashing them in. He clearly has quality.
All of these explanations dont point to a sudden uptick of goals happening any time soon.
https://www.fotmob.com/en-GB/leagues/48/stats/season/27195/players/expected_goals/team/8451/charlton-athletic
And it's the latter with Kelman. Looking at the xG individual stats, his xG for the season is a horrendous 0.6, with just 5 shots all season, 3 on target.
Carey by contrast has had 24 shots, 10 on target.
https://www.fotmob.com/en-GB/players/982745/charlie-kelman
https://www.fotmob.com/en-GB/players/1081081/sonny-carey1 -
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.2 -
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.2 -
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I think the reason Kelman and TC start every game is because they have the fitness to press the way Jones wants, for 60-70minutes of a game. I don’t think Leaburn or Olaofe have the fitness to do that
I still think Leaburn - TC, and Olaofe-Kelman are better combinations but Jones would probably argue we are doing pretty well with the current setup results wise, it’s just none of them are scoring1 -
Probably a sign of how long we've been away from the Championship, and how long since we took this level seriously.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
A £3m Striker is not a big money acquisition at this level anymore... Clearly £3m doesnt get you that much
Joel Piroe was signed by Leeds, didnt break the 20-goal barrier at this level, £10m; Josh Sargeant was signed by Norwich in 2021 (albeit as a Premier League team), got 15-goals last season, again around the £10m mark.
Mihailo Ivanović for that lot up the road is probably the best comparison, he got 12-goals last season, signing for a similar fee to what we paid for Charlie Kelman, has scored just the once this term though, whilst of those 12-goals, only two were scored pre-2025.
Its worth remembering as well that Kelman had no involvement as to how much we paid for him.
So to put pressure on a Footballer with that, is a bit stupid - If anything, he needs to justify the wages we're paying him.5 -
Big money for us I meant. Not big money in terms of everyone else and Kelman certainly was that.ForeverAddickted said:
Probably a sign of how long we've been away from the Championship, and how long since we took this level seriously.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
A £3m Striker is not a big money acquisition at this level anymore... Clearly £3m doesnt get you that much
Joel Piroe was signed by Leeds, didnt break the 20-goal barrier at this level, £10m; Josh Sargeant was signed by Norwich in 2021 (albeit as a Premier League team), got 15-goals last season, again around the £10m mark.
Mihailo Ivanović for that lot up the road is probably the best comparison, he got 12-goals last season, signing for a similar fee to what we paid for Charlie Kelman, has scored just the once this term though, whilst of those 12-goals, only two were scored pre-2025
Ahadme was big money for us last season. Hence why I called the situation similar. Not exactly the same. But similar2 -
Don't agree with that. Certainly in terms of Olafe. Think he could easily match or exceed Kelmans fitness level.NabySarr said:I think the reason Kelman and TC start every game is because they have the fitness to press the way Jones wants, for 60-70minutes of a game. I don’t think Leaburn or Olaofe have the fitness to do that
I still think Leaburn - TC, and Olaofe-Kelman are better combinations but Jones would probably argue we are doing pretty well with the current setup results wise, it’s just none of them are scoring1 -
I mean we don’t know because we’ve not seen it. After a couple of Olaofe’s sub appearances this season in the interviews afterwards he’s said that he feels knackered, which isn’t a great sign.carly burn said:
Don't agree with that. Certainly in terms of Olafe. Think he could easily match or exceed Kelmans fitness level.NabySarr said:I think the reason Kelman and TC start every game is because they have the fitness to press the way Jones wants, for 60-70minutes of a game. I don’t think Leaburn or Olaofe have the fitness to do that
I still think Leaburn - TC, and Olaofe-Kelman are better combinations but Jones would probably argue we are doing pretty well with the current setup results wise, it’s just none of them are scoringI think both are fit enough to start games, Leaburn started a couple and did pretty well, but it’s whether they can keep up the intensity Jones wants for 65 minutes1 -
Am I the only one that doesn't find Kelman's pressing that impressive... I struggle to believe that it's the basis for him staying in the team.
He has won possession in the final 3rd just 3 times in 537 minutes. By comparison, Leaburn has won it 11 times in 406 minutes.
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it's really hard to know without being able to see different pairings! e.g. campbell with a different partner (is it campbell's pressing and driving up the pitch that does the work) or somebody else with Kelman!Chunes said:Am I the only one that doesn't find Kelman's pressing that impressive... I struggle to believe that it's the basis for him staying in the team.
He has won possession in the final 3rd just three times in 537 minutes. By comparison, Leaburn has won it 11 times in 406 minutes.0 -
Not saying he’s good at it, he’s not been good at much this season. Just that he can do it for 65 minutes and play every game. When Leaburn starts a game he has to manage his fitness a lot moreChunes said:Am I the only one that doesn't find Kelman's pressing that impressive... I struggle to believe that it's the basis for him staying in the team.
He has won possession in the final 3rd just three times in 537 minutes. By comparison, Leaburn has won it 11 times in 406 minutes.I personally would have Leaburn starting, but just trying to think of why Jones is sticking with Kelman0 -
You’ve answered your own question.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.0 -
Was he though? I'm sure Jones was probably hoping for a goal or two but given the way we set up and play isn't exactly setting up ANY strikers to score many I don’t think goals alone are what Jones is after here.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
If NJ didn't like what Kelman brings, he wouldn't pick him. It's that simple. And he's not just playing him because of the money spent as the second most expensive signing of the summer (Knibbs) is stuck squarely on the bench despite scoring as a sub on his first appearance.
We can argue all we like about Kelman's goal record but I feel very safe in saying he's not getting dropped any time soon.2 -
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thenewbie said:
Was he though? I'm sure Jones was probably hoping for a goal or two but given the way we set up and play isn't exactly setting up ANY strikers to score many I don’t think goals alone are what Jones is after here.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
If NJ didn't like what Kelman brings, he wouldn't pick him. It's that simple. And he's not just playing him because of the money spent as the second most expensive signing of the summer (Knibbs) is stuck squarely on the bench despite scoring as a sub on his first appearance.
We can argue all we like about Kelman's goal record but I feel very safe in saying he's not getting dropped any time soon.
With the next two games being away there is a good chance he'll still not score, assuming he's not dropped. If he starts both games and has still not got a goal I'd imagine he'll get dropped for the Swansea game.
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Surely after match 2 he would be given these basic instructions tho!fenaddick said:Interesting point in Cawley’s interview with NJ on Substack. Essentially says Kelman is moving into the space our midfielders attack and looking for the cutback rather than entering the 6 yard box. I didn’t watch a lot of Orient last year but wouldn’t be surprised if their midfielders attacked differently so he’s just getting used to our movement0 -
I could be wrong, but I reckon Kelman was signed as a project and a player that over the course of the season would be learning off Matty Godden and slowly starting to take his place as the season develops. The problem is, Godden has been injured and so Kelman has been thrown in. Just because he cost us £3million, doesn't mean they've signed a complete player who was completely ready to go.
I am sure Jones believes he will come good and that is good enough for me right now. His hold up play has been pretty decent to be fair. I reckon he will be on the bench on Tuesday as Jones alluded to the fact he should have changed it up last time we went Saturday - Tuesday.2 -
Depends on the results and the overall performance of the team. If we’re winning (or getting decent draws) why would we mess with a working system?ElfsborgAddick said:thenewbie said:
Was he though? I'm sure Jones was probably hoping for a goal or two but given the way we set up and play isn't exactly setting up ANY strikers to score many I don’t think goals alone are what Jones is after here.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
If NJ didn't like what Kelman brings, he wouldn't pick him. It's that simple. And he's not just playing him because of the money spent as the second most expensive signing of the summer (Knibbs) is stuck squarely on the bench despite scoring as a sub on his first appearance.
We can argue all we like about Kelman's goal record but I feel very safe in saying he's not getting dropped any time soon.
With the next two games being away there is a good chance he'll still not score, assuming he's not dropped. If he starts both games and has still not got a goal I'd imagine he'll get dropped for the Swansea game.
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Two points off relegation places having played one more gamekillerandflash said:
Orient are a free flowing team who score lots of goals. They're midtable but have scored the joint most goals in the division.stoneroses19 said:Leyton's Kelman replacement is flying at start of the season in league one.Ballard, hattrick today and 6 league goals in 6 games. 20 year old signed from Southampton.Leyton mate joked that he'll be playing for us this time next year!
Which is why it can be misleading to just look at simple stats, and assume the striker who scored 20 goals is better than one at another club who scored 14.0 -
Tanto looks instantly dangerous, kelman seems to hang back sometimes and not commit himself.1
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Ivanović got 12 last season, I would bite your hand off now if someone said Kelman would get that this season, because atm he doesn't even look like getting 1.ForeverAddickted said:
Probably a sign of how long we've been away from the Championship, and how long since we took this level seriously.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
A £3m Striker is not a big money acquisition at this level anymore... Clearly £3m doesnt get you that much
Joel Piroe was signed by Leeds, didnt break the 20-goal barrier at this level, £10m; Josh Sargeant was signed by Norwich in 2021 (albeit as a Premier League team), got 15-goals last season, again around the £10m mark.
Mihailo Ivanović for that lot up the road is probably the best comparison, he got 12-goals last season, signing for a similar fee to what we paid for Charlie Kelman, has scored just the once this term though, whilst of those 12-goals, only two were scored pre-2025.
Its worth remembering as well that Kelman had no involvement as to how much we paid for him.
So to put pressure on a Footballer with that, is a bit stupid - If anything, he needs to justify the wages we're paying him.0 -
Of course he was signed to score goals. Our strikers will be lucky to reach double figures as we are never going to be a free flowing, attacking side, but we need goals to win matches, and you'd expect a decent number to come from your No 9. Otherwise if you just want your No 9 to run around and harry people, you might as well play Karoy Anderson up top.thenewbie said:
Was he though? I'm sure Jones was probably hoping for a goal or two but given the way we set up and play isn't exactly setting up ANY strikers to score many I don’t think goals alone are what Jones is after here.carly burn said:
Why so?se9addick said:
I don’t think the Kelman situation is like Ahadme at all.carly burn said:We all do seem to be making excuses for him now.
In some ways it's similar to Ahadme.
He's not playing as bad as Ahadme was. He's not had the raft of chances Ahadme had and results on the whole are not going against us like they were a year ago. So I expect Nathan to persist even longer
I'm pretty sure Tanto would be a able to match his record so far of not scoring any goals or for that matter getting chances.
However, if nothing else he would for my money be far more effective of making a nuisance of himself up top.
Big money acquisition signed to score goals, yet to score one after a number of games but consistently getting picked.
You're right, the circumstances are different in terms of performance and where we find ourselves but the premise is the same.
If NJ didn't like what Kelman brings, he wouldn't pick him. It's that simple. And he's not just playing him because of the money spent as the second most expensive signing of the summer (Knibbs) is stuck squarely on the bench despite scoring as a sub on his first appearance.
We can argue all we like about Kelman's goal record but I feel very safe in saying he's not getting dropped any time soon.
https://www.fotmob.com/en-GB/leagues/48/stats/season/27195/players/total_scoring_att/team/8451/charlton-athletic-players
The brilliant form of Carey has compensated for the lack of goals from our strikers, and allowed NJ to give Kelman more time. The most worrying thing is his lack of shots this season. Looking at shots per 90 in our squad, he's down in 11th place, which isn't good. He's not getting in the right positions to have a shot often enough, whereas Carey is.2 -
Might sound ridiculous, but I reckon Mbick is a better option for our system.1
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It is concerning he hasn't scored in 10, but, he is adjusting to a higher standard of football in a new team, and we are undoubtedly a worse team when he comes off.
Josh Sargent is probably the best striker in this league, but I specifically remember Norwich fans at the Valley in 2022 chanting "If Sargent scores, we're on the pitch". It isn't always easy for a striker to hit the ground running, unless they're special.
He is on a long contract, and Nathan Jones specifically wanted him. He will get going at some point 👍🏻6
