New Museum Items

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

fenaddick said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

For what it’s worth I think I would be more put off by the response from the museum than the decision to house the actual sticker. It’s been very standoffish and defensive, I had always viewed the museum as a friendly place that would welcome discussion but the blocking of individuals who question a decision and the tone of some of the discussions have made me wonder if discussion would actually be welcome. 

Come up next home game and put your theory to the test then. I will even put the kettle on.

cafc999 said:

fenaddick said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

For what it’s worth I think I would be more put off by the response from the museum than the decision to house the actual sticker. It’s been very standoffish and defensive, I had always viewed the museum as a friendly place that would welcome discussion but the blocking of individuals who question a decision and the tone of some of the discussions have made me wonder if discussion would actually be welcome. 

Come up next home game and put your theory to the test then. I will even put the kettle on.

Maybe things are getting lost on a written medium but that just feels so unnecessarily aggressive! I think maybe that’s what’s happening here, some nuance is being lost over the internet 

fenaddick said:

cafc999 said:

fenaddick said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

For what it’s worth I think I would be more put off by the response from the museum than the decision to house the actual sticker. It’s been very standoffish and defensive, I had always viewed the museum as a friendly place that would welcome discussion but the blocking of individuals who question a decision and the tone of some of the discussions have made me wonder if discussion would actually be welcome. 

Come up next home game and put your theory to the test then. I will even put the kettle on.

Maybe things are getting lost on a written medium but that just feels so unnecessarily aggressive! I think maybe that’s what’s happening here, some nuance is being lost over the internet 

Sorry if it comes across that way - it isn't meant to. 

Come up and have a chat and get your feelings known.

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

stoneroses19 said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

That's a really dangerous road (viewpoint) for a museum to go down. 

Yes, conversation is important in the museum sector, but it can be damaging too, especially if controversy is merely being used for said conversation. 

Our museum is a special place with hundreds of items worth having a conversation about, there's no need to add an item like this one, so you can "get a lot of people talking". 

Nope - we are not using it as that at all.

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

I think there are several reasons why the - otherwise excellent - Museum should not display stickers featuring Nigel Farage:  

Political neutrality - The museum should remain an inclusive space for all fans, avoiding associations with divisive political figures.  Displaying a sticker linked to Farage, even unintentionally, could suggest an endorsement of his views.  

Potential offence to fans - Farage is a highly controversial figure, and his presence in the museum may alienate or upset Charlton supporters.  Many fans may feel uncomfortable seeing a far-right-linked figure associated with their club’s history. 

Not relevant to Charlton Athletic - The museum’s purpose is to celebrate Charlton Athletic’s rich football history, not unrelated political movements. It's mission is to preserve, present and promote the heritage of the club.  A sticker created by political supporters of Farage has no meaningful connection to the club’s heritage. 

Misrepresentation of the club’s values - Charlton has a strong tradition of community engagement, diversity and inclusion.  Associating with a divisive political figure could misrepresent the club’s ethos and alienate fans.  In fact, it could damage the club's image. 

Risk of Political Exploitation - The sticker’s presence could be used to suggest that Charlton Athletic or its museum has links to Farage’s ideology.  This could damage the club’s reputation among supporters and the wider football community.  

Encouraging further political symbolism in football - Football is often used as a tool for political messaging, but the museum should resist becoming a battleground for political discourse. Keeping the sticker on display may encourage others to introduce more political symbols, creating unnecessary controversy.  

Respect for the Club’s supporters’ diverse views - Charlton fans come from a wide range of backgrounds and political beliefs.  A display featuring Farage risks alienating sections of the fanbase who strongly oppose him.  

Negative Publicity for the Museum and the Club - The presence of the sticker risks attracting criticism from fans, media and advocacy groups.  This could overshadow the museum’s intended purpose and damage its reputation - that's too much to risk. 

Potential breach of anti-discrimination policies - Many football clubs, including Charlton, adhere to anti-discrimination initiatives.  Given Farage’s links to far-right rhetoric, displaying his image could be seen as conflicting with these policies. 

Lack of Historical or Cultural Significance - A politically motivated sticker does not contribute to the historical documentation of Charlton Athletic.  The museum usually prioritises artefacts that genuinely reflect the club’s legacy.  

In summary, keeping the sticker in the museum risks political controversy, misrepresentation of the club and alienation of supporters. The best course of action would be to remove it to maintain the museum’s neutrality and focus on Charlton’s football heritage.  The Museum itself is a great part of the club's heritage.  Something like this tawdry sticker shouldn't be allowed to diminish the great and genuine pride a lot of supporters have in the work that the museum does. 
Thank you for letting me give my view. 

The sticker isn't on display btw - it's just in our archive.

Thanks for your input on what we should be doing and how to maintain our neutrality.

It has been on display all over social media. Without any context or explanation, just a wild claim it's representative of fan culture. 

Actually I don't agree with all that long list. I'm quite happy to be offended if it's a genuine part of our history. I was deeply offended by much of what I saw in Bergen-Belsen but if it starts to lose its mark on me I'll be back in a shot. 

My main gripe is that the defence of it is nonsensical. It's literally got nothing to do with the club other than it has our badge on it and someone may or may not have stuck it up in away ground toilets. Hardly the historic totem of fan culture that seems to be being claimed.

I value what you all do and I know it's a tough job. However when people disagree with something you're doing, particularly when it's clearly several unconnected voices, maybe it deserves seeking understanding on your part as much as demanding understanding back from the critics. Thus far most of what I've heard is arguing to win rather than to further mutual understanding.

If you were defending including something controversial but a genuine part of our history I'd back you to the hilt. In this instance, the hill you've opted to die on is a Nigel f'ing Farage sticker. I doubt anyone would give two hoots if it was filed in a bin. 

cafc999 said:

fenaddick said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

All I will say is that the offending item has got a lot of people talking - which is good

Even if it lowers the opinion of the museum among some supporters or makes some of them less unwilling to visit or support the museum?  

You cannot choose your history.

Fan can make there own mind up about supporting the museum. If they choose not to support us because of one item out of a few thousand, then that's down to them.

What is it the club are promoting at the moment?

All Different. All Together. All Charlton

For what it’s worth I think I would be more put off by the response from the museum than the decision to house the actual sticker. It’s been very standoffish and defensive, I had always viewed the museum as a friendly place that would welcome discussion but the blocking of individuals who question a decision and the tone of some of the discussions have made me wonder if discussion would actually be welcome. 

Come up next home game and put your theory to the test then. I will even put the kettle on.

He's boiling sugar, give it a swerve... 😉 

rikofold said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

I think there are several reasons why the - otherwise excellent - Museum should not display stickers featuring Nigel Farage:  

Political neutrality - The museum should remain an inclusive space for all fans, avoiding associations with divisive political figures.  Displaying a sticker linked to Farage, even unintentionally, could suggest an endorsement of his views.  

Potential offence to fans - Farage is a highly controversial figure, and his presence in the museum may alienate or upset Charlton supporters.  Many fans may feel uncomfortable seeing a far-right-linked figure associated with their club’s history. 

Not relevant to Charlton Athletic - The museum’s purpose is to celebrate Charlton Athletic’s rich football history, not unrelated political movements. It's mission is to preserve, present and promote the heritage of the club.  A sticker created by political supporters of Farage has no meaningful connection to the club’s heritage. 

Misrepresentation of the club’s values - Charlton has a strong tradition of community engagement, diversity and inclusion.  Associating with a divisive political figure could misrepresent the club’s ethos and alienate fans.  In fact, it could damage the club's image. 

Risk of Political Exploitation - The sticker’s presence could be used to suggest that Charlton Athletic or its museum has links to Farage’s ideology.  This could damage the club’s reputation among supporters and the wider football community.  

Encouraging further political symbolism in football - Football is often used as a tool for political messaging, but the museum should resist becoming a battleground for political discourse. Keeping the sticker on display may encourage others to introduce more political symbols, creating unnecessary controversy.  

Respect for the Club’s supporters’ diverse views - Charlton fans come from a wide range of backgrounds and political beliefs.  A display featuring Farage risks alienating sections of the fanbase who strongly oppose him.  

Negative Publicity for the Museum and the Club - The presence of the sticker risks attracting criticism from fans, media and advocacy groups.  This could overshadow the museum’s intended purpose and damage its reputation - that's too much to risk. 

Potential breach of anti-discrimination policies - Many football clubs, including Charlton, adhere to anti-discrimination initiatives.  Given Farage’s links to far-right rhetoric, displaying his image could be seen as conflicting with these policies. 

Lack of Historical or Cultural Significance - A politically motivated sticker does not contribute to the historical documentation of Charlton Athletic.  The museum usually prioritises artefacts that genuinely reflect the club’s legacy.  

In summary, keeping the sticker in the museum risks political controversy, misrepresentation of the club and alienation of supporters. The best course of action would be to remove it to maintain the museum’s neutrality and focus on Charlton’s football heritage.  The Museum itself is a great part of the club's heritage.  Something like this tawdry sticker shouldn't be allowed to diminish the great and genuine pride a lot of supporters have in the work that the museum does. 
Thank you for letting me give my view. 

The sticker isn't on display btw - it's just in our archive.

Thanks for your input on what we should be doing and how to maintain our neutrality.

It has been on display all over social media. Without any context or explanation, just a wild claim it's representative of fan culture. 

Actually I don't agree with all that long list. I'm quite happy to be offended if it's a genuine part of our history. I was deeply offended by much of what I saw in Bergen-Belsen but if it starts to lose its mark on me I'll be back in a shot. 

My main gripe is that the defence of it is nonsensical. It's literally got nothing to do with the club other than it has our badge on it and someone may or may not have stuck it up in away ground toilets. Hardly the historic totem of fan culture that seems to be being claimed.

I value what you all do and I know it's a tough job. However when people disagree with something you're doing, particularly when it's clearly several unconnected voices, maybe it deserves seeking understanding on your part as much as demanding understanding back from the critics. Thus far most of what I've heard is arguing to win rather than to further mutual understanding.

If you were defending including something controversial but a genuine part of our history I'd back you to the hilt. In this instance, the hill you've opted to die on is a Nigel f'ing Farage sticker. I doubt anyone would give two hoots if it was filed in a bin. 

I doubt the majority give two hoots that it's in the museum. 

What a huge overreaction to a 7cmx10cm bit of sticky paper. 

Belv said:

rikofold said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

I think there are several reasons why the - otherwise excellent - Museum should not display stickers featuring Nigel Farage:  

Political neutrality - The museum should remain an inclusive space for all fans, avoiding associations with divisive political figures.  Displaying a sticker linked to Farage, even unintentionally, could suggest an endorsement of his views.  

Potential offence to fans - Farage is a highly controversial figure, and his presence in the museum may alienate or upset Charlton supporters.  Many fans may feel uncomfortable seeing a far-right-linked figure associated with their club’s history. 

Not relevant to Charlton Athletic - The museum’s purpose is to celebrate Charlton Athletic’s rich football history, not unrelated political movements. It's mission is to preserve, present and promote the heritage of the club.  A sticker created by political supporters of Farage has no meaningful connection to the club’s heritage. 

Misrepresentation of the club’s values - Charlton has a strong tradition of community engagement, diversity and inclusion.  Associating with a divisive political figure could misrepresent the club’s ethos and alienate fans.  In fact, it could damage the club's image. 

Risk of Political Exploitation - The sticker’s presence could be used to suggest that Charlton Athletic or its museum has links to Farage’s ideology.  This could damage the club’s reputation among supporters and the wider football community.  

Encouraging further political symbolism in football - Football is often used as a tool for political messaging, but the museum should resist becoming a battleground for political discourse. Keeping the sticker on display may encourage others to introduce more political symbols, creating unnecessary controversy.  

Respect for the Club’s supporters’ diverse views - Charlton fans come from a wide range of backgrounds and political beliefs.  A display featuring Farage risks alienating sections of the fanbase who strongly oppose him.  

Negative Publicity for the Museum and the Club - The presence of the sticker risks attracting criticism from fans, media and advocacy groups.  This could overshadow the museum’s intended purpose and damage its reputation - that's too much to risk. 

Potential breach of anti-discrimination policies - Many football clubs, including Charlton, adhere to anti-discrimination initiatives.  Given Farage’s links to far-right rhetoric, displaying his image could be seen as conflicting with these policies. 

Lack of Historical or Cultural Significance - A politically motivated sticker does not contribute to the historical documentation of Charlton Athletic.  The museum usually prioritises artefacts that genuinely reflect the club’s legacy.  

In summary, keeping the sticker in the museum risks political controversy, misrepresentation of the club and alienation of supporters. The best course of action would be to remove it to maintain the museum’s neutrality and focus on Charlton’s football heritage.  The Museum itself is a great part of the club's heritage.  Something like this tawdry sticker shouldn't be allowed to diminish the great and genuine pride a lot of supporters have in the work that the museum does. 
Thank you for letting me give my view. 

The sticker isn't on display btw - it's just in our archive.

Thanks for your input on what we should be doing and how to maintain our neutrality.

It has been on display all over social media. Without any context or explanation, just a wild claim it's representative of fan culture. 

Actually I don't agree with all that long list. I'm quite happy to be offended if it's a genuine part of our history. I was deeply offended by much of what I saw in Bergen-Belsen but if it starts to lose its mark on me I'll be back in a shot. 

My main gripe is that the defence of it is nonsensical. It's literally got nothing to do with the club other than it has our badge on it and someone may or may not have stuck it up in away ground toilets. Hardly the historic totem of fan culture that seems to be being claimed.

I value what you all do and I know it's a tough job. However when people disagree with something you're doing, particularly when it's clearly several unconnected voices, maybe it deserves seeking understanding on your part as much as demanding understanding back from the critics. Thus far most of what I've heard is arguing to win rather than to further mutual understanding.

If you were defending including something controversial but a genuine part of our history I'd back you to the hilt. In this instance, the hill you've opted to die on is a Nigel f'ing Farage sticker. I doubt anyone would give two hoots if it was filed in a bin. 

I doubt the majority give two hoots that it's in the museum. 

What a huge overreaction to a 7cmx10cm bit of sticky paper. 

Go check out Twitter for the pretty consistent comments. Recognise that's not the majority of fans, but there's a similar story here too. 

SporadicAddick said:

Chizz said:

cafc999 said:

Chizz said:

I think there are several reasons why the - otherwise excellent - Museum should not display stickers featuring Nigel Farage:  

Political neutrality - The museum should remain an inclusive space for all fans, avoiding associations with divisive political figures.  Displaying a sticker linked to Farage, even unintentionally, could suggest an endorsement of his views.  

Potential offence to fans - Farage is a highly controversial figure, and his presence in the museum may alienate or upset Charlton supporters.  Many fans may feel uncomfortable seeing a far-right-linked figure associated with their club’s history. 

Not relevant to Charlton Athletic - The museum’s purpose is to celebrate Charlton Athletic’s rich football history, not unrelated political movements. It's mission is to preserve, present and promote the heritage of the club.  A sticker created by political supporters of Farage has no meaningful connection to the club’s heritage. 

Misrepresentation of the club’s values - Charlton has a strong tradition of community engagement, diversity and inclusion.  Associating with a divisive political figure could misrepresent the club’s ethos and alienate fans.  In fact, it could damage the club's image. 

Risk of Political Exploitation - The sticker’s presence could be used to suggest that Charlton Athletic or its museum has links to Farage’s ideology.  This could damage the club’s reputation among supporters and the wider football community.  

Encouraging further political symbolism in football - Football is often used as a tool for political messaging, but the museum should resist becoming a battleground for political discourse. Keeping the sticker on display may encourage others to introduce more political symbols, creating unnecessary controversy.  

Respect for the Club’s supporters’ diverse views - Charlton fans come from a wide range of backgrounds and political beliefs.  A display featuring Farage risks alienating sections of the fanbase who strongly oppose him.  

Negative Publicity for the Museum and the Club - The presence of the sticker risks attracting criticism from fans, media and advocacy groups.  This could overshadow the museum’s intended purpose and damage its reputation - that's too much to risk. 

Potential breach of anti-discrimination policies - Many football clubs, including Charlton, adhere to anti-discrimination initiatives.  Given Farage’s links to far-right rhetoric, displaying his image could be seen as conflicting with these policies. 

Lack of Historical or Cultural Significance - A politically motivated sticker does not contribute to the historical documentation of Charlton Athletic.  The museum usually prioritises artefacts that genuinely reflect the club’s legacy.  

In summary, keeping the sticker in the museum risks political controversy, misrepresentation of the club and alienation of supporters. The best course of action would be to remove it to maintain the museum’s neutrality and focus on Charlton’s football heritage.  The Museum itself is a great part of the club's heritage.  Something like this tawdry sticker shouldn't be allowed to diminish the great and genuine pride a lot of supporters have in the work that the museum does. 
Thank you for letting me give my view. 

The sticker isn't on display btw - it's just in our archive.

Thanks for your input on what we should be doing and how to maintain our neutrality.

Maybe things are getting lost on a written medium but that just feels so unnecessarily aggressive!

I find it patronising rather than aggressive. Oh the irony...

Patronising? Gosh that's a big word. Well done you. 

Lots of people on here that have a fundamental misunderstanding of the purpose of the museum, or any enterprise set up to save history for future generations.

You don't pick and choose, you collect, collate and display some on a rotation basis.

The museum trustees would in dereliction in their duties if they chose to destroy, or not include something because of pressure from people with an aim to rewrite facts.

The trustees don't have to like all things in the collection, but they do have to save them all. What don't some of you understand? Should they not save any Killer Che Guevara material now?

Pico said:

TellyTubby said:

Lots of people on here that have a fundamental misunderstanding of the purpose of the museum, or any enterprise set up to save history for future generations.

You don't pick and choose, you collect, collate and display some on a rotation basis.

The museum trustees would in dereliction in their duties if they chose to destroy, or not include something because of pressure from people with an aim to rewrite facts.

The trustees don't have to like all things in the collection, but they do have to save them all. What don't some of you understand? Should they not save any Killer Che Guevara material now?

Have another go at reading some of the comments above from people like Charlton Charlie and Rikofold. Make an effort to understand what they are saying about what constitutes Charlton culture and history (and therefore appropriate for the museum), and what doesn't. As Charlie says:

"...this sticker isn't 'our history' in any way, shape or form. It's a hijacking of us.."

I understand, I just don't agree, it is clearly a part of our history, however much you wish it wasn't.

Just for the record, I've no idea why anyone would produce such a sticker, but it has been produced and is therefore part of our history.