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When will UEFA take racism seriously?
Comments
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Sometimes innocents have to suffer for the greater good, it might not be right, it's just how it is.BR7_addick said:
No, it’s why people that do bad things should be punished and not innocent people.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Which is why they should be playing behind closed doors.BR7_addick said:
Why? It’s 2019, surely their fa can identify via CCTV? And if they can’t the fine needs to be even heavier for not having it.se9addick said:
That isn’t feasible.BR7_addick said:
Then ban (insert %) then.Stu_of_Kunming said:
It was more than 1%.BR7_addick said:Stadium ban is punishing the 99% of fans that didn’t commit these idiotic acts. Heavy fines for Montenegro FA, as in actual serious hit in the pocket. And of course find the idiots and ban them for life.2 -
In answer to the original question - racism won't be taken seriously by UEFA so long as their pockets continue to be lined.
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Which is exactly what I said on a subject relating to stop and search and the moral high ground police lost it. This is Monteneglamophobia.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Sometimes innocents have to suffer for the greater good, it might not be right, it's just how it is.BR7_addick said:
No, it’s why people that do bad things should be punished and not innocent people.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Which is why they should be playing behind closed doors.BR7_addick said:
Why? It’s 2019, surely their fa can identify via CCTV? And if they can’t the fine needs to be even heavier for not having it.se9addick said:
That isn’t feasible.BR7_addick said:
Then ban (insert %) then.Stu_of_Kunming said:
It was more than 1%.BR7_addick said:Stadium ban is punishing the 99% of fans that didn’t commit these idiotic acts. Heavy fines for Montenegro FA, as in actual serious hit in the pocket. And of course find the idiots and ban them for life.0 -
I'd be fully in favour of our players just walking off the pitch. It's the only way UEFA/FIFA will do anything about it.0
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I wasn't one of those as I agree with stop n search too.BR7_addick said:
Which is exactly what I said on a subject relating to stop and search and the moral high ground police lost it. This is Monteneglamophobia.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Sometimes innocents have to suffer for the greater good, it might not be right, it's just how it is.BR7_addick said:
No, it’s why people that do bad things should be punished and not innocent people.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Which is why they should be playing behind closed doors.BR7_addick said:
Why? It’s 2019, surely their fa can identify via CCTV? And if they can’t the fine needs to be even heavier for not having it.se9addick said:
That isn’t feasible.BR7_addick said:
Then ban (insert %) then.Stu_of_Kunming said:
It was more than 1%.BR7_addick said:Stadium ban is punishing the 99% of fans that didn’t commit these idiotic acts. Heavy fines for Montenegro FA, as in actual serious hit in the pocket. And of course find the idiots and ban them for life.
I was searched yesterday before getting on the metro, didn't bother me at all.1 -
Speaks very well for someone so young.The Red Robin said:
I actually think Sterling n co did the right thing in NOT walking off, they took the jack Grealish route, dusted themselves down and did the business on the pitch, no better f*ck you to the idiots IMO.5 -
I did said "Whilst obviously not WASP"? And as a certified pedant, I am compelled to point out that protestants are christian anyway...Henry Irving said:
They look Christian?Algarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
What do Christians look like?
In any case the claim was "protestant"
Prompted by another poster's comment, and responses to it, I decided to do a little research and came up with this. I then expressed an opinion based on the available evidence - the appearance, nationality and names of the people in the pictures. As almost every one of them comes from a predeominantly christian country, be it catholic, protestant, Russian or Greek orthodox, then I think it is safe to assume that the majority of them would fit in with the norm...
We may have accidentally stumbled upon a group of desciples of David Icke, or adeherants to the church of the flying spaghetti monster, stranger things have happened, but I feel that most normal people would get what I was on about.
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And another reason why all of the migrants head straight to the UK by passing the countries you mention.Riviera said:When the majority of countries within UEFA sort out racism in their own societies. We are streets ahead of countries like Spain and Italy when it comes to racism and in much of Eastern Europe it's like 1960's and 70's Britain.0 -
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Sorry I have no faith in UEFA / FIFA at the moment...The Red Robin said:I'd be fully in favour of our players just walking off the pitch. It's the only way UEFA/FIFA will do anything about it.
I think if we were to do that then we'd be the ones that they'd discipline2 -
Yeh, they probably would, but the PR hit for them doing that might force them into a rethink.ForeverAddickted said:
Sorry I have no faith in UEFA / FIFA at the moment...The Red Robin said:I'd be fully in favour of our players just walking off the pitch. It's the only way UEFA/FIFA will do anything about it.
I think if we were to do that then we'd be the ones that they'd discipline1 -
FIFA? Bloody foreigners!
Oopsey...0 -
It’s the responsibility for the country’s government to act. If it doesn’t then it exposes how deep the racism is within and tackling it is more long term. UEFA could embarrass the country by banning for a period until it’s satisfied that the country is tackling the root cause; with programmes .such as red black and white events and through their educational system. It did with English clubs to tackle hooliganism.2
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better to ignore it than to show them how cowardly they are? are you on the UEFA panel which will be brushing this under the carpet, or are you even worse than that.palarsehater said:whilst i think it is disgusting what was said, my only niggle is in a country like that sterlings celebration could of caused serious harm to the england fans that were there, who were far outnumbered ( not that it should be tolerated but in these countries it is expected due to the ignorance of the home fans )
with the expansion of the comp and more teams playing in it who's home fans have a history of the racist crap it will only get worse.
uefa need to come in with stadium bans for HOME supporters and points deductions, otherwise it will continue.
no appeasement, no excuses not ever - sitting idly by and wringing your hands over vile bigotry perpetuates the crime.1 -
fuck me what a toby - impossible you a not on a wind upStigThundercock said:
better to ignore it than to show them how cowardly they are? are you on the UEFA panel which will be brushing this under the carpet, or are you even worse than that.palarsehater said:whilst i think it is disgusting what was said, my only niggle is in a country like that sterlings celebration could of caused serious harm to the england fans that were there, who were far outnumbered ( not that it should be tolerated but in these countries it is expected due to the ignorance of the home fans )
with the expansion of the comp and more teams playing in it who's home fans have a history of the racist crap it will only get worse.
uefa need to come in with stadium bans for HOME supporters and points deductions, otherwise it will continue.
no appeasement, no excuses not ever - sitting idly by and wringing your hands over vile bigotry perpetuates the crime.0 -
No atheists?Algarveaddick said:
I did said "Whilst obviously not WASP"? And as a certified pedant, I am compelled to point out that protestants are christian anyway...Henry Irving said:
They look Christian?Algarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
What do Christians look like?
In any case the claim was "protestant"
Prompted by another poster's comment, and responses to it, I decided to do a little research and came up with this. I then expressed an opinion based on the available evidence - the appearance, nationality and names of the people in the pictures. As almost every one of them comes from a predeominantly christian country, be it catholic, protestant, Russian or Greek orthodox, then I think it is safe to assume that the majority of them would fit in with the norm...
We may have accidentally stumbled upon a group of desciples of David Icke, or adeherants to the church of the flying spaghetti monster, stranger things have happened, but I feel that most normal people would get what I was on about.
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Age has nothing to do with being a bigot.addick05 said:ForeverAddickted said:
Not to mention the fact none of them seem very young so will be stuck in the traditions etc. they grew up withAlgarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
And this is the point, plus which their attitudes will be passed on to future generations. Arrest those individuals responsible, close the stadiums, fine the countries involved, ban them from entering competitions...this will NOT change the mindset of those people responsible for the racist chanting. This will happen again and will fill endless column inches (and Charlton Life) with the same (quite rightly) outraged posters. There is no solution to this problem, only years and years of education.0 -
Mebee…Henry Irving said:
No atheists?Algarveaddick said:
I did said "Whilst obviously not WASP"? And as a certified pedant, I am compelled to point out that protestants are christian anyway...Henry Irving said:
They look Christian?Algarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
What do Christians look like?
In any case the claim was "protestant"
Prompted by another poster's comment, and responses to it, I decided to do a little research and came up with this. I then expressed an opinion based on the available evidence - the appearance, nationality and names of the people in the pictures. As almost every one of them comes from a predeominantly christian country, be it catholic, protestant, Russian or Greek orthodox, then I think it is safe to assume that the majority of them would fit in with the norm...
We may have accidentally stumbled upon a group of desciples of David Icke, or adeherants to the church of the flying spaghetti monster, stranger things have happened, but I feel that most normal people would get what I was on about.
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Your description of woman is in my opinion dreadfulPragueAddick said:
Not just confined to the Yugoslav countries. I know Bulgaria well, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism there, and unless UEFA take tough action , I fear it will be bad in Sofia. Why it is so, I am not quite sure. I can certainly say that it has been allowed to flourish since the fall of Communism. Even one of my good Bulgarian buddies suffers from it, it's like a disease in his head. We were up in Newcastle together for Euro 96 with the BG team, and I discovered the two other BG guys he'd brought with him from Toronto were bloody Holocaust deniers. On our last night we ended up in a club in Whitley Bay, and easily the best looking, sorry the only good looking woman, in a sea of slappers was dark skinned, but he didn't want to go near her.killerandflash said:Southgate got the tone of his comments right. There is a slight danger of England coming over a bit pious, attacking other countries for their racism as if we were perfect.
As for the Montenegran fans, less than 25 years ago the area was the scene of a brutal war, with ethnic cleansing against the Bosnian Muslims, so it's sadly not a surprise that people there still have unacceptable attitudes to race. Indeed the Kosovo war was exactly 20 years ago
Prague is nowhere near as bad, I don't expect trouble here of any kind, unless some England want to start it.PragueAddick said:
Not just confined to the Yugoslav countries. I know Bulgaria well, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism there, and unless UEFA take tough action , I fear it will be bad in Sofia. Why it is so, I am not quite sure. I can certainly say that it has been allowed to flourish since the fall of Communism. Even one of my good Bulgarian buddies suffers from it, it's like a disease in his head. We were up in Newcastle together for Euro 96 with the BG team, and I discovered the two other BG guys he'd brought with him from Toronto were bloody Holocaust deniers. On our last night we ended up in a club in Whitley Bay, and easily the best looking, sorry the only good looking woman, in a sea of slappers was dark skinned, but he didn't want to go near her.killerandflash said:Southgate got the tone of his comments right. There is a slight danger of England coming over a bit pious, attacking other countries for their racism as if we were perfect.
As for the Montenegran fans, less than 25 years ago the area was the scene of a brutal war, with ethnic cleansing against the Bosnian Muslims, so it's sadly not a surprise that people there still have unacceptable attitudes to race. Indeed the Kosovo war was exactly 20 years ago
Prague is nowhere near as bad, I don't expect trouble here of any kind, unless some England want to start it.2 - Sponsored links:
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Agreed - I've seen plenty of youngsters who are still racist despite all the education on the subject. It's a myth that the problem only lies with the older generation.iainment said:
Age has nothing to do with being a bigot.addick05 said:ForeverAddickted said:
Not to mention the fact none of them seem very young so will be stuck in the traditions etc. they grew up withAlgarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
And this is the point, plus which their attitudes will be passed on to future generations. Arrest those individuals responsible, close the stadiums, fine the countries involved, ban them from entering competitions...this will NOT change the mindset of those people responsible for the racist chanting. This will happen again and will fill endless column inches (and Charlton Life) with the same (quite rightly) outraged posters. There is no solution to this problem, only years and years of education.
Racism goes hand in hand with ignorance and stupidity - there's never been a shortage of stupid people.
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Montenegro have been charged.0
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The only issue with sanctions like this is you could theoretically have fans from opposing nations attending games to deliberately attempt to get rival teams docked points. Something has got to be done though its disgustingForeverAddickted said:In terms of UEFA combating racism I think they need to dish out the harshest possible penalties possible
First Offence: Fine AND Points Deduction (Not some small amount either)
Second Offence: Games Get behind closed doors
Third Offence: Your thrown out of Qualification for the next Euros AND World Cup
At the moment its something that fans and footballing associations can get away with because they know they're going to get nothing more than a slap on the wrist without any serious form of retribution to try and educate or reform
Take English Football and hooligism for example; unfortunately it took the deaths of fans for UEFA to act yet as a result of the Heysel disaster our clubs got banned from Europe for five years - Yes since then there have been cases of trouble with English fans when going abroad but in a wider context you've got to argue that the ban worked2 -
Something has to be done to show its not acceptable - can't keep p***ing about. Clubs/countries will soon take it seriously if proper punishment is given out.Pelling1993 said:
The only issue with sanctions like this is you could theoretically have fans from opposing nations attending games to deliberately attempt to get rival teams docked points. Something has got to be done though its disgustingForeverAddickted said:In terms of UEFA combating racism I think they need to dish out the harshest possible penalties possible
First Offence: Fine AND Points Deduction (Not some small amount either)
Second Offence: Games Get behind closed doors
Third Offence: Your thrown out of Qualification for the next Euros AND World Cup
At the moment its something that fans and footballing associations can get away with because they know they're going to get nothing more than a slap on the wrist without any serious form of retribution to try and educate or reform
Take English Football and hooligism for example; unfortunately it took the deaths of fans for UEFA to act yet as a result of the Heysel disaster our clubs got banned from Europe for five years - Yes since then there have been cases of trouble with English fans when going abroad but in a wider context you've got to argue that the ban worked1 -
WestHam been causing trouble at Millwall again? Bastards!Pelling1993 said:
The only issue with sanctions like this is you could theoretically have fans from opposing nations attending games to deliberately attempt to get rival teams docked points. Something has got to be done though its disgustingForeverAddickted said:In terms of UEFA combating racism I think they need to dish out the harshest possible penalties possible
First Offence: Fine AND Points Deduction (Not some small amount either)
Second Offence: Games Get behind closed doors
Third Offence: Your thrown out of Qualification for the next Euros AND World Cup
At the moment its something that fans and footballing associations can get away with because they know they're going to get nothing more than a slap on the wrist without any serious form of retribution to try and educate or reform
Take English Football and hooligism for example; unfortunately it took the deaths of fans for UEFA to act yet as a result of the Heysel disaster our clubs got banned from Europe for five years - Yes since then there have been cases of trouble with English fans when going abroad but in a wider context you've got to argue that the ban worked3 -
iainment said:
Age has nothing to do with being a bigot.addick05 said:ForeverAddickted said:
Not to mention the fact none of them seem very young so will be stuck in the traditions etc. they grew up withAlgarveaddick said:Whilst obviously not WASP, here is the UEFA executive committee - they look pretty much white, male and Christian to me, with the addition of a solitary Arab millionaire, and a couple of women.
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/executive-committee/
And this is the point, plus which their attitudes will be passed on to future generations. Arrest those individuals responsible, close the stadiums, fine the countries involved, ban them from entering competitions...this will NOT change the mindset of those people responsible for the racist chanting. This will happen again and will fill endless column inches (and Charlton Life) with the same (quite rightly) outraged posters. There is no solution to this problem, only years and years of education.
Obviously. Sorry mate, don't see the point you are making.0 -
OK, let's modify it to say that in my opinion,, the lady in question was easily the most attractive in the club, but to my buddy she wasn't simply because she was dark skinned. And I was shocked by that, as I thought I knew him well.JohnnyH2 said:
Your description of woman is in my opinion dreadfulPragueAddick said:
Not just confined to the Yugoslav countries. I know Bulgaria well, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism there, and unless UEFA take tough action , I fear it will be bad in Sofia. Why it is so, I am not quite sure. I can certainly say that it has been allowed to flourish since the fall of Communism. Even one of my good Bulgarian buddies suffers from it, it's like a disease in his head. We were up in Newcastle together for Euro 96 with the BG team, and I discovered the two other BG guys he'd brought with him from Toronto were bloody Holocaust deniers. On our last night we ended up in a club in Whitley Bay, and easily the best looking, sorry the only good looking woman, in a sea of slappers was dark skinned, but he didn't want to go near her.killerandflash said:Southgate got the tone of his comments right. There is a slight danger of England coming over a bit pious, attacking other countries for their racism as if we were perfect.
As for the Montenegran fans, less than 25 years ago the area was the scene of a brutal war, with ethnic cleansing against the Bosnian Muslims, so it's sadly not a surprise that people there still have unacceptable attitudes to race. Indeed the Kosovo war was exactly 20 years ago
Prague is nowhere near as bad, I don't expect trouble here of any kind, unless some England want to start it.PragueAddick said:
Not just confined to the Yugoslav countries. I know Bulgaria well, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism there, and unless UEFA take tough action , I fear it will be bad in Sofia. Why it is so, I am not quite sure. I can certainly say that it has been allowed to flourish since the fall of Communism. Even one of my good Bulgarian buddies suffers from it, it's like a disease in his head. We were up in Newcastle together for Euro 96 with the BG team, and I discovered the two other BG guys he'd brought with him from Toronto were bloody Holocaust deniers. On our last night we ended up in a club in Whitley Bay, and easily the best looking, sorry the only good looking woman, in a sea of slappers was dark skinned, but he didn't want to go near her.killerandflash said:Southgate got the tone of his comments right. There is a slight danger of England coming over a bit pious, attacking other countries for their racism as if we were perfect.
As for the Montenegran fans, less than 25 years ago the area was the scene of a brutal war, with ethnic cleansing against the Bosnian Muslims, so it's sadly not a surprise that people there still have unacceptable attitudes to race. Indeed the Kosovo war was exactly 20 years ago
Prague is nowhere near as bad, I don't expect trouble here of any kind, unless some England want to start it.0 -
Oh please!!!!!palarsehater said:whilst i think it is disgusting what was said, my only niggle is in a country like that sterlings celebration could of caused serious harm to the england fans that were there, who were far outnumbered ( not that it should be tolerated but in these countries it is expected due to the ignorance of the home fans )
with the expansion of the comp and more teams playing in it who's home fans have a history of the racist crap it will only get worse.
uefa need to come in with stadium bans for HOME supporters and points deductions, otherwise it will continue.0 -
Tricky one this.
Doesn't seem fair to me to shut a ground for the behaviour of a few that probably can’t easily be proved either. Similar to the Birmingham issue the other week. Should the valley be shut for one loon shouting out racist abuse? Would you be happy?
Very hard in my opinion for the authorities in these countries to stop it happening, esp in these older grounds with less surveillance . Hard to identify these people when it’s just a noise, unlike the displaying of racist symbols or violence etc and how on earth can you know if someone entering a ground has racism potential in them? And whats to stop non-fans of that Country taking advantage of the punishment potential?
Also, players walking off the pitch? What about the hundreds of fans who have paid hundreds of hard earned pounds to attend? Fuck em presumably?
That probably would be the media and authorities reaction to be honest, because let’s be honest the fans often come under a barrage of abuse/violence in these type of countries (an explosive device was thrown into our end on the last visit out there) now I’m not being funny, racist abuse is moronic and should always be challenged but it is ‘just’ abuse at the end of the day, however unpleasant and sickening. Getting a limb blown off, or being stabbed is far more important in my eyes but our media and authorities don’t seem to give a shit when these events happen in these countries.
In summing up, I don’t know what the answer is.
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The Organiser said:Tricky one this.
Doesn't seem fair to me to shut a ground for the behaviour of a few that probably can’t easily be proved either. Similar to the Birmingham issue the other week. Should the valley be shut for one loon shouting out racist abuse? Would you be happy?
It wasn’t just a few yesterday; it was loud chanting from a big enough section of the crowd for it to be picked up by the mics and heard clearly on 5 Live’s coverage. From the third minute, through to the Rose booking. So easily proved.
It’s not tricky at all really.0
