NS: CAST considering FA action on KM comments

IdleHans · May 2016

I thought the word 'Belgian' was used between 'you' and 'wankers' for two reasons:
A) it serves to identify the subjects of the song clearly
b) two syllables are needed to make the song scan properly

It is not racist per se, but if Katrien would prefer it to be replaced with the word 'shitty' (clearly one she seems to find acceptable) then I am sure we could accommodate that.

MuttleyCAFC · May 2016

Of course the coward has put her in the firing line but if she resigns, she will only be replaced by another puppet. The coward is the one we need to topple. At least if she goes it will annoy him a bit.

ElfsborgAddick · May 2016

IdleHans said:
I thought the word 'Belgian' was used between 'you' and 'wankers' for two reasons:
A) it serves to identify the subjects of the song clearly
b) two syllables are needed to make the song scan properly

It is not racist per se, but if Katrien would prefer it to be replaced with the word 'shitty' (clearly one she seems to find acceptable) then I am sure we could accommodate that.

"You shitty wankers get out of our club"

Fanny Fanackapan · May 2016

shirty5 said:
She thinks the media is against her, so let's tell the world. E mail, tweet, poke any media outlet or journalist you can think of that would be interested in this story.

Poking a journalist is NOT one of my habits but if it helps the cause, who am I to refuse....

Louis ?

Louis ?

Where are you hiding ?

Covered End · May 2016

I think she should be reported for her swearing in a public meeting & thereby bringing the game into disrepute.

Davo55 · May 2016

A very good statement from the Trust. I particularly like the final paragraph, which reinforces the message given at the recent meeting.

Alwaysneil · May 2016

Thanks @Davo55 it's easy to forget how good the original CAST response was.

I thought it was excellent.

Badger · May 2016

Covered End said:
I think she should be reported for her swearing in a public meeting & thereby bringing the game into disrepute.</blockquote

oh SHIT.

The_Organiser · May 2016

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

It is not being chanted at her because of her nationality though. It's because they're shite. Their nationality is added so that everyone is fully aware of who the request is being aimed at.

mogodonman · May 2016

She's deleted all negative stories from search engines. I wouldn't rule out her making up evidence of the so-called criminal acts she mentions but has done nothing to prove.

Alwaysneil · May 2016

Racialist? Is that cos I is black?

shirty5 · May 2016

If the trust don't get anywhere with this, how about a protest outside the FA's office at Wembley Stadium on a set day?

MuttleyCAFC · May 2016

The Organiser said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.
It is not being chanted at her because of her nationality though. It's because they're shite. Their nationality is added so that everyone is fully aware of who the request is being aimed at.

Exactly right. I made this point in an earlier post - it is an understanding of our language that is needed. If you want to call me a winker, you could refer to me as an f***ing winker - that is quite strong and doesn't really point me out. But a normal approach is to pick on a characteristic - like I am bald or fat so I could be a fat winker for instance. The point being made is that i'm a winker, the fat bit aims it at me. Now if you have a couple of winkers, one a senile old man, and one a young woman, you have to find a word that fits them both or refer to the lazy f***ing. If anybody can find an alternative to Belgian, i'd like to know what it is. It is certainly not saying that all Belgians are winkers, unlike Meire's comments that can be seen as suggesting all Charlton fans are law breaker or racists.

AddicksAddict · May 2016

bazjonster said:

MuttleyCAFC said:
When you call somebody a bastard for instance- you have to put a word in there before the bastard. Now you could put a swear word in, but the norm is to include a characteristic. So as I have a lack of hair, I am a bald bastard. Now if somebody calls me that, I think the point they are accentuating is that I am a bastard, not that I am bald, but the language demands something goes in there. The same could be said is somebody calls me a fat bastard. It is unlikely my weight is the reason they are providing this critique but something has to go in there. So adding Belgian in there should not be seen as a slight against Belgians. Many of us love a pint of Stella!
Ah yes, Stella. The gaseous, bulk produced, flavourless fizz of Belgian fame. Dig deeper, there's a whole host of wonderful beers in that country that make Stella taste like water.

Of Belgian fame, yes, but quite often not even brewed in Belgium. In the 80s, it was brewed by Whitbread in Luton. I've no idea where it's made now, but I don't drink the piss so I don't care.

AddicksAddict · May 2016

Solidgone said:
Is the following protest song..... "Get out of our club, you Belgium c**ts get out of our club" racist? If not, it's totally distasteful.

Numbers said:
Nope that's fine

And it's "wankers", not "cunts". "C**t" is in the "Hey Roland..." song.

AddicksAddict · May 2016

Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.

I'm not sure you could prove "Belgian wankers" is a racist term. It's pointing out which particular wankers we want out of our club.

Addickted · May 2016

Would 'Flemish Wankers' be considered racist?

Cordoban Addick · May 2016

AddicksAddict said:

Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.
I'm not sure you could prove "Belgian wankers" is a racist term. It's pointing out which particular wankers we want out of our club.

Just to make sure as my post is a bit unclear. It is not racist for English people to use the term Belgian/Belgium in its abuse, we are the same race. It may be nationalist though.

Chizz · May 2016

.

Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.

So, despite having the detailed, clear explanation from the CPS, you still think it's not possible to be "racist toward Belgium"?

charltonnick · May 2016

I don't think we should complain , let her speak and let the world know how incompetent a CEO we have at Charlton. I'm sure the governing bodies have been inundated with messages of support for protection of incompetent foreign owners !!

man_at_milletts · May 2016

maddferrett said:
Caption competition?

I'm no expert on pancakes, but I know a tosser when I see one.

Alwaysneil · May 2016

AddicksAddict said:

Solidgone said:
Is the following protest song..... "Get out of our club, you Belgium c**ts get out of our club" racist? If not, it's totally distasteful.

Numbers said:
Nope that's fine
And it's "wankers", not "cunts". "C**t" is in the "Hey Roland..." song.

You pair of onanists get out of our club.

Cordoban Addick · May 2016

Chizz said:
.
Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.
So, despite having the detailed, clear explanation from the CPS, you still think it's not possible to be "racist toward Belgium"?

Not if you are the same race.

Chizz · May 2016

Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
.
Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.
So, despite having the detailed, clear explanation from the CPS, you still think it's not possible to be "racist toward Belgium"?
Not if you are the same race.

OK. So the law's wrong and you're right. Got it, thanks.

Cordoban Addick · May 2016

Chizz said:

Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
.
Cordoban Addick said:

Chizz said:
A quick reminder for anyone who still thinks "it's ok, because Belgian isn't a race":

Racialist chanting at football matches Section 3 Football Offences Act 1991 (as amended)

This offence is committed when a group of people, or one person acting alone, chants something of a racialist nature at a designated football match. "Racialist" means the same as "racist".

To prove this offence, the prosecution has to show that the chanting, which means the repeated uttering of words or sounds, was threatening, abusive or insulting to another person because of that person's colour, race, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin.

Hope that's clear. Do not chant threats, abuse or insults at someone because of that person's nationality. It's a criminal offence.

In all other respects, I believe it's totally fair to criticise her for the enormous number of things she's done wrong. Her inept decision-making, her flawed reasoning, her dissembling, her deceit, her "smugness", her cowardice. Call her out for her lack of experience, lack of football knowledge, lack of senior staff. Point eh finger at her for her callous attitude to the fans and the club's history. Demonstrate how she's failed in the most important aspect of her job - recruitment.

If you have to, have a op at her dress sense.

But don't break the law by throwing racist chants or comments in her direction. Rise above it. It gives her more ammunition than she deserves.

Racialist isn't a real word is it? And no matter what it says us (living in England) can not be racist toward Belgium as give or take a bit of multi-multiculturalism we are the same race. We could be being nationalist or prejudice.

Personally I am against the gender and nationality based abuse though. Lots of other things are fair game though.
So, despite having the detailed, clear explanation from the CPS, you still think it's not possible to be "racist toward Belgium"?
Not if you are the same race.
OK. So the law's wrong and you're right. Got it, thanks.

Yes that's right. Glad you got it in the end.