Injuries or not, this can't go on, BUT is Jones the man to put things right ? .. I don't think so
I think he has to be given the opportunity to show one way or the other honestly. He came in and corrected course after the Appleton disaster, but swapping managers every time it goes wrong isn't going to work.
I'm not at all impressed with what we've seen this season but chopping and changing constantly isn't viable.
19 points from 14 games, I've been lucky in that I missed all 3 October home games but it sounds like the football is just so uninspiring to watch.
The squad has zero excitement or creativity in it, it's a really poor L1 squad. Questions have to be asked of the ownership as to what they are actually trying to achieve
That’s good, solid, relegation avoiding, more-than-one-point-a-game form, right there.
Take out the 9 points from the first 3 games & you have 10 points from 11 games. That's good old relegation scrap form, right there.
I was being ironic.
What’s happening is both alarming and depressing, and once again you’ve been proven to be close to bang on the money. Which is a worry.
Sadly feels like we are about to embark on another run like last year when we had a few injuries - quite expecting to be in the shit by January and even if all players were fit, don't think we'd be in the play off spots. Just not good enough - players, manager, recruiters, directors, owners - you know when you have a promotion potential team and never once this season has it felt like that, even when we won the first 3 games. Turgid dross.
Another dull as dishwater performance, seeing us once again go behind in a game and flatter to deceive in front of goal. The chances were there to try and sneak a point. We are being set up to supposedly be difficult to break down and be strong off the ball, but that is a strategy that only shows it's true effectiveness against teams that want to get the ball on the ground and dominate with possession football. We are a boring, direct anti-football side that carries very little threat going forward and cannot keep sustained attacking pressure on anyone for more than around 10 per half. Whilst this has been a hallmark of NJ sides in the past, we have rarely taken any initiative all season and taken the shackles off to attack teams (aside from the very ends of games where we are scrapping to get something from a game).
Whilst the injuries are hampering us, I still don't believe that this squad being fully fit would make a significant difference. Our recruitment for both plan A (3-5-2) and plan B (4-2-2-2) have left us without wide options for pace on both sides, and with midfielders that lack quality on the ball in congested areas. Our strikers have all been left isolated all season, praying on the barest of scraps to contest with every L1 defenders favourite: the long, diagonal ball to contest aerially. It is dire, dreary and predictable.
Despite this, I still would not want to sack NJ - I honestly don't think we can find anyone else that has the ability to do any more with this squad. However, it is very concerning that NJ could not identify that Docherty (in particular, who has been my biggest disappointment) was not an attacking midfielder and that Berry is incapable of playing week in week out. The other frees have largely just been squad bodies. Ahadme has suffered through proxy of the lack of width/pace, but has not been the signing we wanted him to be. So many of them have not been good enough, and when Jones came out of the defence, we lost our defensive stability too. If we get into scrappy games again, I'd still probably edge keeping NJ out of having done the same job last season.
There is some semblance of a core in the side, but I fear that we'll be struggling again until Xmas with mixed or worse results. By then, we won't want to spend in January to chase a crazy points deficit or even justify it if we are lower half. We won't attract anyone decent and the cycle continues. We could still pull a few wins out of the bag through some luck or force of will - however, you have to stay within touching distance.
I fully empathise with so many - we're playing crap football in a crap league and it gives you very little to feel positive about. Even when January comes, I am very sceptical about whether we will spend to chase a highly unlikely dream of sneaking into the playoffs.
Paying the price for signing Potts and Allan Campbell in my opinion. We needed a decent back at CB and an attacking midfielder.
You drop that into our side, and we would be in a better place.
Instead, we used the last days of the window to sign these two. Wasted wages.
Both should be gone in January.
Ah but let me remind you that Allan Campbell should be playing in thre Championship and not slumming it in League one.
26/8/24
Technical Director Andy Scott added: “We’re very fortunate to be able to get Allan here. He was at Millwall in the Championship last year, and he should be playing in the Championship so to get him in League One is a terrific coup for us.
blackpool72 said:Message from Elf’s, get off your Lardy arse, stop moaning and get to a game, bubbles can’t take you everywhere
Groundhog day week after week. Sacking a manager every season will not bring success. Sooner or later you have to stick with a manager and back him. But I honestly don't think we will improve this season even when we get a few players back. Weather Jones can turn it around given timi have no idea but this season is over despite what some on here might say. Depressing.
Jones talked about injuries but many of them realistically don’t improve that team.
He said 10 players but mentioned Edun who despite not really being able to play was on the bench. He’s our 3rd choice LB/a back up CM.
Mannion isn’t going to create or score goals.
Watson is an average at best L1 player.
Aneke, a miss yes but only capable of playing 30 minutes. Doesn’t improve us in the first 60, and Jones admitted we weren’t good enough in the first half.
Turned out Anderson had an injury. Might have been better than Allan Campbell or Docherty, but Jones chose to sign them this summer.
TC’s pace is a miss, but Jones chose not to sign another winger, that’s on him. Unless you count Dixon, who couldn’t make the bench ahead of Hylton, despite Ahadme being back.
Dan Potts probably doesn’t start ahead of Gillesphey, but neither are starters is L Jones is fit.
Kanu would no doubt be in the squad, but Leaburn and Godden on paper at least is our best front two. Either way a different striker doesn’t get the FBs an midfield playing better football, other than Kanu being the best at chasing lost causes.
Jones talked about injuries but many of them realistically don’t improve that team.
He said 10 players but mentioned Edun who despite not really being able to play was on the bench. He’s our 3rd choice LB/a back up CM.
Mannion isn’t going to create or score goals.
Watson is an average at best L1 player.
Aneke, a miss yes but only capable of playing 30 minutes. Doesn’t improve us in the first 60, and Jones admitted we weren’t good enough in the first half.
Turned out Anderson had an injury. Might have been better than Allan Campbell or Docherty, but Jones chose to sign them this summer.
TC’s pace is a miss, but Jones chose not to sign another winger, that’s on him. Unless you count Dixon, who couldn’t make the bench ahead of Hylton, despite Ahadme being back.
Dan Potts probably doesn’t start ahead of Gillesphey, but neither are starters is L Jones is fit.
Kanu would no doubt be in the squad, but Leaburn and Godden on paper at least is our best front two. Either way a different striker doesn’t get the FBs an midfield playing better football, other than Kanu being the best at chasing lost causes.
Jones and Ramsay were no doubt missed.
We do have injuries, but that points up is that ever season we have large squad but the back ups are not as good as the best starting eleven, and they are not thst good. Your squad has to be made up of good quality players through out. You should look at the players not making the match day squad and know any other team would have them in their starting eleven. We have never has a squad any where near that good. Do I believe we are the 4th highest spenders on players in the league, no!
My point was most of the injured players don’t get in the starting 11, and those that are good subs wouldn’t have changed the poor first half.
On wages probably around there, the clubs share their budgets which is why Methven is able to estimate that’s how much we’re spending.
You don’t need 20-25 top quality players. Bowyer and Powell had plenty of average players making up their squads. Other clubs weren’t jealous that we had the likes of Wagstaff, Evina, Reeves, Marshall etc.
What this squad doesn’t have is enough players who could play at Championship level. We were supposed to get they in Docherty, Campbell and so on, but they look nowhere near it.
Take your point but the more immediate problem is we don't seem to have enough players who can play at League 1 level.
Someone said during closed season , we are looking to bring players in who can perform in The Championship for us as well.
Whoever that was , was pulling the wool over the supporters eyes.
The Owners need to stand up and tell us who is at fault for the mess we are in.
Well that was Methven & his merry men & pulling the wool over peoples eyes is what he does.
It's rumoured that our billionaire owners took outside advice on the signing of NJ, maybe they should be taking advice on this crock of shit SMT.
Also, I missed the game as I'm having chest issues again, but despite that, best weekend I've had in ages. Just dossed about playing Call of Duty and FIFA, didn't even watch the game on Charlton TV.
Sorry to those that went, but f**k me it's easier to accept we are shit from home. Only positive about the whole thing.
I didn’t go either, had the train booked but didn’t buy a ticket. Fully accepted that who ever we play away from home we will look second best to them, and without us playing a 100%, or with some luck we will probably get beaten at every match.
Great dodge by us.
My little cousin was actually happy we wasn't going and got to spend the weekend with his mates instead. Not to worry though, Charlie Methven said that young fans aren't too bothered about the match results and more so the match day experience.
He can't wait to get down to the Valley next week to experience our luxury match day experience before getting dumpstered by Peterborough
Who cares, hopefully we can all have a dance in the bar afterwards, hmm why not invite the Belgian to start the dancing
No passion No width No plan B No entertainment No creativity No hope
After the first few matches, I commented that we are awful to watch. The response from most was along the lines of "I don't care as long as we keep winning and get out of this shit league".
3 months down the line and the performances haven't improved and we can't buy a win. Jones needs to swallow his pride and admit he's completely fucked this up and either walk away, or change his approach ASAP. He's relied too much on players that did it for him at Luton, but 5(?) years ago, they were hungry young players. Now they find themselves back in league 1 with very little motivation. His tranfer policy hasn't worked, and his formation/style of play hasn't worked. The problem is I really can't see him changing anything, as he seems very stubborn and not the type to admit he's got it all wrong.
I'll be surprised if he's still here in the summer, and I won't be upset at his departure.
Agree with all that & I think he might walk but would we sack him with a 4/5 ? year contract ?
We were absolutely dire in the first half, incapable of putting two passes together (other than along the back line) and shaky at the back. Somehow we survived until half time but a dozy lack of marking at Exeter’s umpteenth corner early in the second half left their guy free for a near post header for what proved to be the winner.
We were better in that second half - we could hardly have been worse - but were unable to take either of two very decent chances, which would have earned us a point against a relatively modest Exeter side. Our loyal travelling support certainly deserved better.
What is now abundantly clear is that Nathan Jones has failed to construct a team with a discernible and effective style of play and anything approaching tactical nous. To compound matters, this summer’s recruitment has, with a couple of exceptions, been pretty lamentable. Although two of the manager’s favourites from Luton are on short-term deals until January, we are now saddled with 2,3 and 4 year contracts for a number of sub-standard players. Allied to Andy Scott’s generally poor recruitment in the two previous windows, we are now left with an under strength and unbalanced squad.
To make matters worse, Jones seems incapable of getting a tune out of them and his tactical, long-ball approach is neither effective nor remotely attractive to watch. We do have some good players but not enough of them and, even if we were able to acquire some quality in January (whether in permanent deals or on loan), I have little confidence that the manager would moderate his long-ball percentage game.
If the American owners have been labouring under a misapprehension about the level of investment required to make a credible attempt at achieving a top 6 finish, they will not be happy and the management team - on both the business and football fronts - may have some difficult questions to answer.
Don't worry, Charlie Methven told us at the Bromley meeting, that what the locals and fans wanted most, was a good fans zone and that the crowds would increase regardless of whether we were playing L1 dross football or not.
I've heard something along these lines, did he really say that ? If so he should go in the box with the Belgians.
Folk mentioning TC as our only wide player but for reasons unknown, most of this season he’s been played as a striker. We’re still waiting for his first league goal this season..
We were absolutely dire in the first half, incapable of putting two passes together (other than along the back line) and shaky at the back. Somehow we survived until half time but a dozy lack of marking at Exeter’s umpteenth corner early in the second half left their guy free for a near post header for what proved to be the winner.
We were better in that second half - we could hardly have been worse - but were unable to take either of two very decent chances, which would have earned us a point against a relatively modest Exeter side. Our loyal travelling support certainly deserved better.
What is now abundantly clear is that Nathan Jones has failed to construct a team with a discernible and effective style of play and anything approaching tactical nous. To compound matters, this summer’s recruitment has, with a couple of exceptions, been pretty lamentable. Although two of the manager’s favourites from Luton are on short-term deals until January, we are now saddled with 2,3 and 4 year contracts for a number of sub-standard players. Allied to Andy Scott’s generally poor recruitment in the two previous windows, we are now left with an under strength and unbalanced squad.
To make matters worse, Jones seems incapable of getting a tune out of them and his tactical, long-ball approach is neither effective nor remotely attractive to watch. We do have some good players but not enough of them and, even if we were able to acquire some quality in January (whether in permanent deals or on loan), I have little confidence that the manager would moderate his long-ball percentage game.
If the American owners have been labouring under a misapprehension about the level of investment required to make a credible attempt at achieving a top 6 finish, they will not be happy and the management team - on both the business and football fronts - may have some difficult questions to answer.
Don't worry, Charlie Methven told us at the Bromley meeting, that what the locals and fans wanted most, was a good fans zone and that the crowds would increase regardless of whether we were playing L1 dross football or not.
I've heard something along these lines, did he really say that ? If so he should go in the box with the Belgians.
Not his exact words, but yes he said he could grow the local support by providing off pitch entertainment, even if we're languishing mid table in L1.
Paying the price for signing Potts and Allan Campbell in my opinion. We needed a decent back at CB and an attacking midfielder.
You drop that into our side, and we would be in a better place.
Instead, we used the last days of the window to sign these two. Wasted wages.
Both should be gone in January.
Ah but let me remind you that Allan Campbell should be playing in thre Championship and not slumming it in League one.
26/8/24
Technical Director Andy Scott added: “We’re very fortunate to be able to get Allan here. He was at Millwall in the Championship last year, and he should be playing in the Championship so to get him in League One is a terrific coup for us.
First time I have agreed with Andy Scott. Yes Alan SHOULD be playing in the Championship, can you arrange it in January please.
Cannot agree this is a crap league. Just because we are some of the others are not. The top 3 Wycombe Birmingham and Wrexham already look the teams to beat - they score goals and make us look pedestrian. As I said ages ago you need 80 + goals for promotion and those 3 are well on the way. We will be lucky to score 50.We shouldnt be complacent - a relegation fight still might come about. Several of the teams below us have beaten us this season so they are not hopeless just less so than us. Very sad to see our decline after 60 + years .
Cannot agree this is a crap league. Just because we are some of the others are not. The top 3 Wycombe Birmingham and Wrexham already look the teams to beat - they score goals and make us look pedestrian. As I said ages ago you need 80 + goals for promotion and those 3 are well on the way. We will be lucky to score 50.We shouldnt be complacent - a relegation fight still might come about. Several of the teams below us have beaten us this season so they are not hopeless just less so than us. Very sad to see our decline after 60 + years .
You only need to win games 1-0 remember famous Arsenal under Graham win the league winning 1-0 …. Boring boring Arsenal all this you have to score 80 to win promotion is crap …
Cannot agree this is a crap league. Just because we are some of the others are not. The top 3 Wycombe Birmingham and Wrexham already look the teams to beat - they score goals and make us look pedestrian. As I said ages ago you need 80 + goals for promotion and those 3 are well on the way. We will be lucky to score 50.We shouldnt be complacent - a relegation fight still might come about. Several of the teams below us have beaten us this season so they are not hopeless just less so than us. Very sad to see our decline after 60 + years .
You only need to win games 1-0 remember famous Arsenal under Graham win the league winning 1-0 …. Boring boring Arsenal all this you have to score 80 to win promotion is crap …
That would be a whole lot more relevant if we were in fact winning 1-0....
Comments
I'm not at all impressed with what we've seen this season but chopping and changing constantly isn't viable.
You drop that into our side, and we would be in a better place.
Both should be gone in January.
Whilst the injuries are hampering us, I still don't believe that this squad being fully fit would make a significant difference. Our recruitment for both plan A (3-5-2) and plan B (4-2-2-2) have left us without wide options for pace on both sides, and with midfielders that lack quality on the ball in congested areas. Our strikers have all been left isolated all season, praying on the barest of scraps to contest with every L1 defenders favourite: the long, diagonal ball to contest aerially. It is dire, dreary and predictable.
Despite this, I still would not want to sack NJ - I honestly don't think we can find anyone else that has the ability to do any more with this squad. However, it is very concerning that NJ could not identify that Docherty (in particular, who has been my biggest disappointment) was not an attacking midfielder and that Berry is incapable of playing week in week out. The other frees have largely just been squad bodies. Ahadme has suffered through proxy of the lack of width/pace, but has not been the signing we wanted him to be. So many of them have not been good enough, and when Jones came out of the defence, we lost our defensive stability too. If we get into scrappy games again, I'd still probably edge keeping NJ out of having done the same job last season.
There is some semblance of a core in the side, but I fear that we'll be struggling again until Xmas with mixed or worse results. By then, we won't want to spend in January to chase a crazy points deficit or even justify it if we are lower half. We won't attract anyone decent and the cycle continues. We could still pull a few wins out of the bag through some luck or force of will - however, you have to stay within touching distance.
I fully empathise with so many - we're playing crap football in a crap league and it gives you very little to feel positive about. Even when January comes, I am very sceptical about whether we will spend to chase a highly unlikely dream of sneaking into the playoffs.
Potts still used a wage that could have been used on a regular CB. The window was open whilst he was at the club.
26/8/24
Technical Director Andy Scott added: “We’re very fortunate to be able to get Allan here. He was at Millwall in the Championship last year, and he should be playing in the Championship so to get him in League One is a terrific coup for us.
It's rumoured that our billionaire owners took outside advice on the signing of NJ, maybe they should be taking advice on this crock of shit SMT.