Has Dobson actually fallen from grace? I know he was left out at the weekend but with the number of midfielders we have someone was always going to be left out. I dont think he has done much wrong in the games he has played and it would be harsh imo if he has fallen down the pecking order. As a side note Watson definitely put in his best performance at the weekend maybe that was down to him feeling dobson breathing down his neck for the spot.
Dobson left out of the squad yet 2 centre half’s on bench is a strange one to keep an eye on as well if we are doing some wheeling and dealing - no info just a guess
Was Dobson dropped or injured?
Dropped / rested is what I took from Adkins interview after the game on charlton tv
Ruthless yet necessary. For me the biggest disappointment out of our signings so far. But who knows maybe this will help him turn it around, football is strange like that.
They need to put out a team on Tuesday for the Pizza Cup. Makes sense to rest some who are going to have to play the full 90.
Dobson’s role is to screen the back 4. Not act as a deep lying play maker. He does that job very well and it’s fine in a 3 as the other two can play out. Now we look keen to be playing a two in the middle you need both players who can pass out and therefore Dobson doesn’t fit into that.
Dobson will come good I am sure. It’s not easy to fit straight into a new team with a brand new midfield. Managers and training would be pointless if it was. He’s shown some really good glimpses of talent and hard tackles.
He has been a bit slow in getting us moving and Adkins rightly thought that Watson would be the better playmaker against Crewe who are the weakest team we’ve played this season.
Arter and Watson will be great people for him to learn off. Adkins has said he’s starting tomorrow and I would guess it’ll be him, Clare and Lee so will be really interesting to see how they get on together.
It's got to be said that going from being signed as the fulcrum of an ambitious, promotion seeking team to being usurped by a 36 year old Ben Watson within five games would be a pretty spectacular fall from grace for Dobson.
That said, I think with confidence and the right combination beside him he could at the very least do a job for us. I think he'd look considerably better in a midfield with Arter, Lee and a Morgan in the right position. (Though probably Clare would too.)
It's always going to be about the combination of players ...... no player plays in isolation.
There's a player in Dobson though. He's well capable of doing a job for the team.
The player hadn't made the best start in a team that hadn't made the best start. That might be a clue and the player just needs to settle.
Dobson has already excelled in this division at Walsall, and Wimbledon last season - which is why we signed him.
Has Dobson actually fallen from grace? I know he was left out at the weekend but with the number of midfielders we have someone was always going to be left out. I dont think he has done much wrong in the games he has played and it would be harsh imo if he has fallen down the pecking order. As a side note Watson definitely put in his best performance at the weekend maybe that was down to him feeling dobson breathing down his neck for the spot.
Charlton also started the game with a change of formation.
Maybe Dobson's role didn't fit into a changed gameplan?
Dobson situation. Isn't it called having a squad? Different players fit different formations. With the manager we have I'm sure they will coach Dobson up and give him every opportunity.
Dobson situation. Isn't it called having a squad? Different players fit different formations. With the manager we have I'm sure they will coach Dobson up and give him every opportunity.
Dobson has looked poor but I agree surely Adkins can’t have made his mind up already
Were we to sign Dempsey I wouldn’t care if we’d been insulting to his current club, unsettled the player through mind games. It all seems to be the way transfers are managed and achieved these days and our club is just as likely to be on the receiving end from others.
Dempsey appears to me to be just the right kind of player to be looking for - a long term bet in terms of his age and one definitely on an upwards trajectory in his skill set and experience.
Given where he currently plies his trade we shouldn’t have to worry about any upheavals in his domestic life - he probably wouldn’t even need to move home.
I haven’t checked on his height for the CL test.
Hopeful SG is able to weave some magic before the window closes and I am genuinely looking forward to thousands more comments on here about every rumour. It doesn’t look as if we’ve assembled a squad to blow the league apart but it’s not all doom and gloom. It’s early on in the season and I think some of those earlier results were down to pants tactics which I’m sure NA is more than capable of learning from.
If you replace pants tactics with a pants midfield I think your right.
Clare, Dobson and Morgan (as a ten) aren’t good enough, as a 3. I think that's caused a bit of panic, or change in tactics in the market, that has resulted in getting Lee and Arter. I don't think we would have gone for Lee if Morgan had performed, as he did in preseason, nor Arter if Dobson had impressed, like he did for AFCW.
Suddenly with two experienced midfeilders coming in and Morgan impressing deeper we have better options, and depth. It now wouldn't surprise me if Dobson went out on loan. He looks a long way from the first team at this point. But things change very quickly.
It was more a change of tactics, as the formation and lineup we had for most of the match on Saturday didn't need any new midfielders, indeed it was how we ended against Wigan, where Washington came off the bench to replace Dobson and Morgan moved back.
I would agree that Dobson seems a bit out of favour at the moment, being subbed 3 games running, then left out completely. By contrast Morgan has actually played every minute so far this season, and Watson the full 90 for the last 2 games. Dobson is also behind Clare in the pecking order too.
Evans from Gills trying to do the usual stir the pot rubbish.
Nice link in the article to a brawl in their last game that ended with 4 red cards. Evans says there is no place for behaviour like that and that they were picked on.
Apparently Shrews manager, Steve Cotterell had a go at Steve Evans for reminding the ref he had issued a Shrewsbury player with a second yellow but had not administered the red. I don't see what the hell Steve Cotterell has to complain about. Any manager would remind the ref.
Yeah because i'm sure Evans politely reminded the ref.
Give over, he would have been abusing all and sundry the whole game, like he does every single week.
Has Dobson actually fallen from grace? I know he was left out at the weekend but with the number of midfielders we have someone was always going to be left out. I dont think he has done much wrong in the games he has played and it would be harsh imo if he has fallen down the pecking order. As a side note Watson definitely put in his best performance at the weekend maybe that was down to him feeling dobson breathing down his neck for the spot.
Charlton also started the game with a change of formation.
Maybe Dobson's role didn't fit into a changed gameplan?
Was it a drastically different formation or was Washington doing what Albie has ment to have done in the Wigan game?
I seem to remember one of that stand outs from the last game was Stockley constantly being on Morgan's case for not being close enough to him. Which I would credit with Morgan being a natural midfielder and being asked to do a job he isn't up to?
I also notice that Will Keane, who has previously been an out and out striker, plays as the "10" for Wigan. Despite them having more obvious candidates.
How much of that was down to the Watson Morgan partnership being better than Clare Dobson or Dobson and Watson and how much of that was down to Crewe being significantly the worst team we have played so far? I would ask the same about the full backs pushing on more, it's chicken and eggs isn't it?
Were we to sign Dempsey I wouldn’t care if we’d been insulting to his current club, unsettled the player through mind games. It all seems to be the way transfers are managed and achieved these days and our club is just as likely to be on the receiving end from others.
Dempsey appears to me to be just the right kind of player to be looking for - a long term bet in terms of his age and one definitely on an upwards trajectory in his skill set and experience.
Given where he currently plies his trade we shouldn’t have to worry about any upheavals in his domestic life - he probably wouldn’t even need to move home.
I haven’t checked on his height for the CL test.
Hopeful SG is able to weave some magic before the window closes and I am genuinely looking forward to thousands more comments on here about every rumour. It doesn’t look as if we’ve assembled a squad to blow the league apart but it’s not all doom and gloom. It’s early on in the season and I think some of those earlier results were down to pants tactics which I’m sure NA is more than capable of learning from.
If you replace pants tactics with a pants midfield I think your right.
Clare, Dobson and Morgan (as a ten) aren’t good enough, as a 3. I think that's caused a bit of panic, or change in tactics in the market, that has resulted in getting Lee and Arter. I don't think we would have gone for Lee if Morgan had performed, as he did in preseason, nor Arter if Dobson had impressed, like he did for AFCW.
Suddenly with two experienced midfeilders coming in and Morgan impressing deeper we have better options, and depth. It now wouldn't surprise me if Dobson went out on loan. He looks a long way from the first team at this point. But things change very quickly.
Agree other than I don’t see Dobson or anyone other than maybe Schwartz leaving on loan or permanently - we know how quickly injuries can build up and what that can do to your season.
Funny how we always want more signings and depth to cover injuries/suspensions, but we always seem to get to a point where that goes the other way and we start speculating about players leaving as we have too many!
The thing with Dobson would be that he would be 23 and no where near the first team, assuming Arter signs, we have only got 3 midweek league games before Christmas.
If he was ahead of Watson in the pecking order I wouldn't be suggesting we sent Watson out on loan. I think there is a player in Dobson but he won't improve by not playing. And unlike some of the older u23s there would be little value in a loan to a national league team.
It's a tough one. I would expect our Dempsey to go somewhere on loan, he is even further away from even the squad.
It’s not that set it in stone, especially after missing out on the squad for a single game.
The situation around injuries, suspensions, formations, partnerships, opposition, form, training performances etc constantly changes throughout the season, and with that so will our plans.
It’s a simple one for me, he was signed to be part of our first team squad and he needs to here with the chance to prove himself over a decent period of time. It’s far too early to tell him he’s not up to it and loan him out.
With a few more signings someone else will be left out of our next league game. That’s a good thing as it means we’re keeping players fit and have competition for places.
Having more than 20 senior players and not having a huge injury crisis every season should be seen as normal. That means some miss out and it might be a few weeks or even a couple of months before they get a proper chance again.
Agree about our Dempsey going out on loan, very much needed for him, same for those of a similar age in the u23s.
Tomorrow, but you can have paperwork in place and ready to go but some might not be finalised until Thursday due to international duty, or if it’s Covid related issues
Are you counting another CM on top of Arter? I think we'll just see a defender and Arter join personally.
No, but Arter hasn't been confirmed yet. Can speculate all we want, but until he's announced then we don't know for sure, and have to assume it's a position that needs filling.
Were we to sign Dempsey I wouldn’t care if we’d been insulting to his current club, unsettled the player through mind games. It all seems to be the way transfers are managed and achieved these days and our club is just as likely to be on the receiving end from others.
Dempsey appears to me to be just the right kind of player to be looking for - a long term bet in terms of his age and one definitely on an upwards trajectory in his skill set and experience.
Given where he currently plies his trade we shouldn’t have to worry about any upheavals in his domestic life - he probably wouldn’t even need to move home.
I haven’t checked on his height for the CL test.
Hopeful SG is able to weave some magic before the window closes and I am genuinely looking forward to thousands more comments on here about every rumour. It doesn’t look as if we’ve assembled a squad to blow the league apart but it’s not all doom and gloom. It’s early on in the season and I think some of those earlier results were down to pants tactics which I’m sure NA is more than capable of learning from.
If you replace pants tactics with a pants midfield I think your right.
Clare, Dobson and Morgan (as a ten) aren’t good enough, as a 3. I think that's caused a bit of panic, or change in tactics in the market, that has resulted in getting Lee and Arter. I don't think we would have gone for Lee if Morgan had performed, as he did in preseason, nor Arter if Dobson had impressed, like he did for AFCW.
Suddenly with two experienced midfeilders coming in and Morgan impressing deeper we have better options, and depth. It now wouldn't surprise me if Dobson went out on loan. He looks a long way from the first team at this point. But things change very quickly.
Agree other than I don’t see Dobson or anyone other than maybe Schwartz leaving on loan or permanently - we know how quickly injuries can build up and what that can do to your season.
Funny how we always want more signings and depth to cover injuries/suspensions, but we always seem to get to a point where that goes the other way and we start speculating about players leaving as we have too many!
The thing with Dobson would be that he would be 23 and no where near the first team, assuming Arter signs, we have only got 3 midweek league games before Christmas.
If he was ahead of Watson in the pecking order I wouldn't be suggesting we sent Watson out on loan. I think there is a player in Dobson but he won't improve by not playing. And unlike some of the older u23s there would be little value in a loan to a national league team.
It's a tough one. I would expect our Dempsey to go somewhere on loan, he is even further away from even the squad.
It’s not that set it in stone, especially after missing out on the squad for a single game.
The situation around injuries, suspensions, formations, partnerships, opposition, form, training performances etc constantly changes throughout the season, and with that so will our plans.
It’s a simple one for me, he was signed to be part of our first team squad and he needs to here with the chance to prove himself over a decent period of time. It’s far too early to tell him he’s not up to it and loan him out.
With a few more signings someone else will be left out of our next league game. That’s a good thing as it means we’re keeping players fit and have competition for places.
Having more than 20 senior players and not having a huge injury crisis every season should be seen as normal. That means some miss out and it might be a few weeks or even a couple of months before they get a proper chance again.
Agree about our Dempsey going out on loan, very much needed for him, same for those of a similar age in the u23s.
Sorry I didn't say/make it clear in my original post I don't think Arter is instead of our interest in two other central midfielders. It's a reaction to how bad our midfield has been in 3 of our first 4 games.
I still think there is interest in Lowey and/or Dempsey. That would make Dobson 6th choice for 2 positions.
Are you counting another CM on top of Arter? I think we'll just see a defender and Arter join personally.
No, but Arter hasn't been confirmed yet. Can speculate all we want, but until he's announced then we don't know for sure, and have to assume it's a position that needs filling.
Yeah fair enough, agree with that. Certainly seems a done deal though.
Were we to sign Dempsey I wouldn’t care if we’d been insulting to his current club, unsettled the player through mind games. It all seems to be the way transfers are managed and achieved these days and our club is just as likely to be on the receiving end from others.
Dempsey appears to me to be just the right kind of player to be looking for - a long term bet in terms of his age and one definitely on an upwards trajectory in his skill set and experience.
Given where he currently plies his trade we shouldn’t have to worry about any upheavals in his domestic life - he probably wouldn’t even need to move home.
I haven’t checked on his height for the CL test.
Hopeful SG is able to weave some magic before the window closes and I am genuinely looking forward to thousands more comments on here about every rumour. It doesn’t look as if we’ve assembled a squad to blow the league apart but it’s not all doom and gloom. It’s early on in the season and I think some of those earlier results were down to pants tactics which I’m sure NA is more than capable of learning from.
If you replace pants tactics with a pants midfield I think your right.
Clare, Dobson and Morgan (as a ten) aren’t good enough, as a 3. I think that's caused a bit of panic, or change in tactics in the market, that has resulted in getting Lee and Arter. I don't think we would have gone for Lee if Morgan had performed, as he did in preseason, nor Arter if Dobson had impressed, like he did for AFCW.
Suddenly with two experienced midfeilders coming in and Morgan impressing deeper we have better options, and depth. It now wouldn't surprise me if Dobson went out on loan. He looks a long way from the first team at this point. But things change very quickly.
Agree other than I don’t see Dobson or anyone other than maybe Schwartz leaving on loan or permanently - we know how quickly injuries can build up and what that can do to your season.
Funny how we always want more signings and depth to cover injuries/suspensions, but we always seem to get to a point where that goes the other way and we start speculating about players leaving as we have too many!
The thing with Dobson would be that he would be 23 and no where near the first team, assuming Arter signs, we have only got 3 midweek league games before Christmas.
If he was ahead of Watson in the pecking order I wouldn't be suggesting we sent Watson out on loan. I think there is a player in Dobson but he won't improve by not playing. And unlike some of the older u23s there would be little value in a loan to a national league team.
It's a tough one. I would expect our Dempsey to go somewhere on loan, he is even further away from even the squad.
It’s not that set it in stone, especially after missing out on the squad for a single game.
The situation around injuries, suspensions, formations, partnerships, opposition, form, training performances etc constantly changes throughout the season, and with that so will our plans.
It’s a simple one for me, he was signed to be part of our first team squad and he needs to here with the chance to prove himself over a decent period of time. It’s far too early to tell him he’s not up to it and loan him out.
With a few more signings someone else will be left out of our next league game. That’s a good thing as it means we’re keeping players fit and have competition for places.
Having more than 20 senior players and not having a huge injury crisis every season should be seen as normal. That means some miss out and it might be a few weeks or even a couple of months before they get a proper chance again.
Agree about our Dempsey going out on loan, very much needed for him, same for those of a similar age in the u23s.
Sorry I didn't say/make it clear in my original post I don't think Arter is instead of our interest in two other central midfielders. It's a reaction to how bad our midfield has been in 3 of our first 4 games.
I still think there is interest in Lowey and/or Dempsey. That would make Dobson 6th choice for 2 positions.
That makes more sense but I doubt we’ll sign Arter and another CM. If Cawley is right Lee coming in has ended our interest in Dempsey. Both are goalscoring midfielders, I don’t see us signing both. We also have Gilbey for that role.
Might be wrong but Lowery is more of a creative midfielder and would be an alternative to Morgan? To me that seems more likely than Dempsey but it may be more sensible to use that budget elsewhere, CBT as our only cover for both Kirk and DJ isn’t ideal.
Were we to sign Dempsey I wouldn’t care if we’d been insulting to his current club, unsettled the player through mind games. It all seems to be the way transfers are managed and achieved these days and our club is just as likely to be on the receiving end from others.
Dempsey appears to me to be just the right kind of player to be looking for - a long term bet in terms of his age and one definitely on an upwards trajectory in his skill set and experience.
Given where he currently plies his trade we shouldn’t have to worry about any upheavals in his domestic life - he probably wouldn’t even need to move home.
I haven’t checked on his height for the CL test.
Hopeful SG is able to weave some magic before the window closes and I am genuinely looking forward to thousands more comments on here about every rumour. It doesn’t look as if we’ve assembled a squad to blow the league apart but it’s not all doom and gloom. It’s early on in the season and I think some of those earlier results were down to pants tactics which I’m sure NA is more than capable of learning from.
If you replace pants tactics with a pants midfield I think your right.
Clare, Dobson and Morgan (as a ten) aren’t good enough, as a 3. I think that's caused a bit of panic, or change in tactics in the market, that has resulted in getting Lee and Arter. I don't think we would have gone for Lee if Morgan had performed, as he did in preseason, nor Arter if Dobson had impressed, like he did for AFCW.
Suddenly with two experienced midfeilders coming in and Morgan impressing deeper we have better options, and depth. It now wouldn't surprise me if Dobson went out on loan. He looks a long way from the first team at this point. But things change very quickly.
Agree other than I don’t see Dobson or anyone other than maybe Schwartz leaving on loan or permanently - we know how quickly injuries can build up and what that can do to your season.
Funny how we always want more signings and depth to cover injuries/suspensions, but we always seem to get to a point where that goes the other way and we start speculating about players leaving as we have too many!
The thing with Dobson would be that he would be 23 and no where near the first team, assuming Arter signs, we have only got 3 midweek league games before Christmas.
If he was ahead of Watson in the pecking order I wouldn't be suggesting we sent Watson out on loan. I think there is a player in Dobson but he won't improve by not playing. And unlike some of the older u23s there would be little value in a loan to a national league team.
It's a tough one. I would expect our Dempsey to go somewhere on loan, he is even further away from even the squad.
It’s not that set it in stone, especially after missing out on the squad for a single game.
The situation around injuries, suspensions, formations, partnerships, opposition, form, training performances etc constantly changes throughout the season, and with that so will our plans.
It’s a simple one for me, he was signed to be part of our first team squad and he needs to here with the chance to prove himself over a decent period of time. It’s far too early to tell him he’s not up to it and loan him out.
With a few more signings someone else will be left out of our next league game. That’s a good thing as it means we’re keeping players fit and have competition for places.
Having more than 20 senior players and not having a huge injury crisis every season should be seen as normal. That means some miss out and it might be a few weeks or even a couple of months before they get a proper chance again.
Agree about our Dempsey going out on loan, very much needed for him, same for those of a similar age in the u23s.
Sorry I didn't say/make it clear in my original post I don't think Arter is instead of our interest in two other central midfielders. It's a reaction to how bad our midfield has been in 3 of our first 4 games.
I still think there is interest in Lowey and/or Dempsey. That would make Dobson 6th choice for 2 positions.
That makes more sense but I doubt we’ll sign Arter and another CM. If Cawley is right Lee coming in has ended our interest in Dempsey. Both are goalscoring midfielders, I don’t see us signing both. We also have Gilbey for that role.
Might be wrong but Lowery is more of a creative midfielder and would be an alternative to Morgan? To me that seems more likely than Dempsey but it may be more sensible to use that budget elsewhere, CBT as our only cover for both Kirk and DJ isn’t ideal.
I think Lowery is more likely and I think I said this a dozen or so pages ago I would seen at as Arter/Watson with Lowey/Morgan and one of Lee/Gilbey. Clare could do a job as cover for all 3 and that would leave Dobson well out of the frame. Washington is then cover/rotation for any of the "3" behind Stockley.
Evans sounds like someone that has no concept of needing money to survive. Gills are skint at present and desperate for some cash flow. If he’s correct that our bid was £100k then perhaps that was low and cheeky but maintaining that Dempsey isn’t going anywhere is cloud cuckoo land stuff. If they can’t shift Tucker and Dempsey they will be financially struggling and probably have two quite unhappy players to boot and get stitched up when they do leave anyway. Looks like we haven't followed up any bid in any case. Fuck em.
I am still smarting over how little Newcastle got Robert Lee for
Comments
As a side note Watson definitely put in his best performance at the weekend maybe that was down to him feeling dobson breathing down his neck for the spot.
he will still play his part this season for sure.
There's a player in Dobson though. He's well capable of doing a job for the team.
The player hadn't made the best start in a team that hadn't made the best start. That might be a clue and the player just needs to settle.
Dobson has already excelled in this division at Walsall, and Wimbledon last season - which is why we signed him.
Maybe Dobson's role didn't fit into a changed gameplan?
I would agree that Dobson seems a bit out of favour at the moment, being subbed 3 games running, then left out completely. By contrast Morgan has actually played every minute so far this season, and Watson the full 90 for the last 2 games. Dobson is also behind Clare in the pecking order too.
Give over, he would have been abusing all and sundry the whole game, like he does every single week.
I seem to remember one of that stand outs from the last game was Stockley constantly being on Morgan's case for not being close enough to him. Which I would credit with Morgan being a natural midfielder and being asked to do a job he isn't up to?
I also notice that Will Keane, who has previously been an out and out striker, plays as the "10" for Wigan. Despite them having more obvious candidates.
How much of that was down to the Watson Morgan partnership being better than Clare Dobson or Dobson and Watson and how much of that was down to Crewe being significantly the worst team we have played so far? I would ask the same about the full backs pushing on more, it's chicken and eggs isn't it?
The situation around injuries, suspensions, formations, partnerships, opposition, form, training performances etc constantly changes throughout the season, and with that so will our plans.
It’s a simple one for me, he was signed to be part of our first team squad and he needs to here with the chance to prove himself over a decent period of time. It’s far too early to tell him he’s not up to it and loan him out.
Having more than 20 senior players and not having a huge injury crisis every season should be seen as normal. That means some miss out and it might be a few weeks or even a couple of months before they get a proper chance again.
Agree about our Dempsey going out on loan, very much needed for him, same for those of a similar age in the u23s.
GK
LB
Bare minimum.
Oh well.
I still think there is interest in Lowey and/or Dempsey. That would make Dobson 6th choice for 2 positions.
Might be wrong but Lowery is more of a creative midfielder and would be an alternative to Morgan? To me that seems more likely than Dempsey but it may be more sensible to use that budget elsewhere, CBT as our only cover for both Kirk and DJ isn’t ideal.