So how long is it before the AFC Wimbledon option becomes a reality. An alternative Charlton that is the real Charlton not the mad experiment that RD and KM are failing with. I sometimes drift into thinking RD has money and if he had an able CEO it would improve. I know this option is not going to happen. RD must know that KM is the major cause of the rejection of the club by many thousands of fans. Yet he does nothing about it, if he cared, had an agenda to develop the club for football purposes he would have removed her ages ago. It really is a shame that Charlton " names" e.g. Ex Directors do not speak out more. I have had private conversations with some and their views do not differ from those of us that despair at what RD and KM are doing.
We are still a way off that scenario. Getting him out still looks much more realistic than forming a new club.
Robinson has spoken really well tonight. The best I've heard him speak. Well done KR.
You're very positive these days covered end. Not that you weren't before, but you seem to have a more upbeat tone from your recent posts. Any reason?
Yes. I've always supported the team by attending matches and I've always supported & joined all the protests including going to Belgium. I have also always said criticise when it is due and don't just criticise everything, because it undermines our "case". I have not changed my view on any of this.
However, my biggest complaint with RD, is that he has not been running Charlton like a proper football club.
Ok. I could come up with a hundred things that I've been very unhappy about. But the main one is not running Charlton as a proper football club.
Now, I'm nobodies fool and I'm acutely aware that RD could do something tomorrow to enrage me and if he does I'll be the first to say so.
But, in recent times, (I'll say recent because there's no point disagreeing over how many months), I think we have been run like a proper football club again.
Ok, we're a club now in League 1 and we really shouldn't be. But to me at least, we are now being run like a League 1 club and not some player farm/circus.
We have an experienced League 1 manager and we have recruited players who are used to playing in the English leagues.
We have 2 coaches who are ex Charlton players, one of whom is a Charlton legend and many recently wanted as manager.
We can all discuss the merits of the manager & coaches, but that's just normal football banter.
We've stopped the ridiculous merry go round of foreign coaches and foreign players who were not appropriate, being foisted upon us.
Fans that are boycotting, good luck to them, I don't criticise anyone, I've said time and time again, everyone has to do what they have to do.
Me personally I could never boycott. Charlton is my true love, my religion, my call to prayers.
If they are playing at home I'll be there, it's not optional, it's a given.
I suppose I have the passion like the 50,000 Geordies that turn up every match, even when they are bottom of the league.
If fans have been boycotting for 3 years and RD is still the owner in another 5 years, that's heading towards a decade of non attendance. Despite what fans says, for many there's no turning back from that, despite what they may genuinely believe.
Even if they do come back, we may have lost a generation of supporters, just as we did at Selhurst. Our kids won't be supporting Charlton, because they are not allowed their team's kit and they are not allowed to watch their team. So guess what it won't be their team. We'll be the smallest South London club again back like the in the late 80's, with Palace and even Millwall getting bigger attendances. Personally, that isn't what I want. I preferred it when we were top dog.
All that effort to get us back to The Valley and then build the club up to a brilliantly run Premiership club down the pan.
Inevitably, RD will sell up at some stage and what sort of Charlton will be left ?
So much damage has been done, my sons no longer attend.
The constant negativity on here, even for the positive things is sapping my strength.
So, I'll be going along as usual. I'll be meeting my mates for a beer beforehand as usual and I'll support the team as usual, as I have done since the late 60's and since holding a S/T since 1973.
God I could cry for what we've become.
Even as 1 of the boycotters, I have to say that's a brilliant post, Churchillesque in fact. Fair play!
So how long is it before the AFC Wimbledon option becomes a reality. An alternative Charlton that is the real Charlton not the mad experiment that RD and KM are failing with. I sometimes drift into thinking RD has money and if he had an able CEO it would improve. I know this option is not going to happen. RD must know that KM is the major cause of the rejection of the club by many thousands of fans. Yet he does nothing about it, if he cared, had an agenda to develop the club for football purposes he would have removed her ages ago. It really is a shame that Charlton " names" e.g. Ex Directors do not speak out more. I have had private conversations with some and their views do not differ from those of us that despair at what RD and KM are doing.
Attacking midfielders are already light with Marshalls injury
Full backs we are light with Page injury
We need a solid No1 keeper!!
Odds on kashi will break down within the first few months of the season and have a lengthy layoff which will leave us short in midfield as JJ and crofts aren't up to it.
To me it looks like KR will play 4-2-3-1 and he's relying on the '3' to feed off a striker that will hold up the ball. IMHO this won't work in this division. We know that the majority of teams aren't technically great sides but what they will do against the 'bigger' teams like us is get men behind the ball and scrap for every second ball. So many teams will play 4-5-1 against us at the valley and our '3' won't get a sniff. I'm on favour of a 4-4-2 formation with one striker being the goal poaching type and the other being a aerial threat who drops deep at times. Two fast tricky wingers Two centre mids who have a good range of passing and can tackle and bring the ball forward.
We played a lot of 4-4-2 last year under Slade and looked shit doing it. I think there's a decent case that we didn't have the central midfield for it, but finding two central midfielders who have the range of passing and athleticism required is...very, very, very difficult, even though we might have them in Kashi and JFC. We did have the little and large up front including a target man and a poacher. And that got us nowhere. It's 2017. It's time to move past the flat 4-4-2.
It doesn't matter what year it is. I know the formation isn't in trend at the moment but with the right players I still think it's the best about. Kashi and JFC would work well in the formation, so would Holmes.
I hate to say it but Millwalls strike force last year Is exactly what you need in this division. I just feel with 4-2-3-1 the formation entices teams to overplay it. It might be old school but there's nothing better then a winger beating a man putting a decent cross in and your centre forward powering a header into the roof of the net.
4-2-3-1 suits the arsenals, city, Uniteds who are playing on pitches like carpets week in week out and who have the players to do it
The pitches is our League are not that bad overall. I would say that over the course of five or six games, you should count the average number of passes you make before you lose the ball, the best tactic after that is to try to get a shot off with less passes than the average. If you have good passers in the side and not the weak links, then you can play like Arsenal at whatever level.
Nothing wrong with being old school, but you need to play to your strengths and attribues. Whether that is old school or not. I don't want to be disrespectful, but Sheff Utd killed us at the Valley - despite us snatching a draw at the death. What I noted was that they only had one player what I would call a skillful footballer. They were strong and fit and big. That is the shortcut to success in League one. Millwall were similar. It may not be a bad way to go as you can bring better players in as you climb up. We are certainly not adopting that approach, so we need to be good in every position, in relation to the level. I prefer to watch skill, so I am not moaning about it. Although I probably won't watch us too much. As the season nears I do have a voice urging me to go - I won't need much of a push - KM going would probably be enough for me to return.
it doesn't matter what the formation is if the only game play is to pass back, the players have no movement, don't look for space and want the ball when we are in possession and don't back each other up or try to win the ball back when the opposition has it. The three Irish games I watched on the Utube looked like we had a squad of players who actually knew each other for once, were familiar with kicking a ball straight, were looking to have the ball passed to them, wanted to attack and play in the oppositions half and were constantly moving.
To revert to Robinson for a moment. I hope he has a plan B if plan A doesn't work. I also hope he is able to mold decent formations when injuries kick in.
Passes can be broken down into two types IMO, the simple ones and the visionary ones (which usually but not always have more risk) The latter are generally the passes you need to open up a team. Our problem in recent years is that we don't have enough simple ones in us and this is due to the efforts of the receivers rather than the passers. When you look at the best passing sides in the world, 90% of the passes they make are simple - ones we could make - but they can make so many because the receivers can find the space and can control the ball. No heavy touches. mis-controls etc...
So if you set out to be a passing side - you need a) energy to give simple passing options to the passer all the time, b) good control as sometimes a pass is only bad because of the receiver's inability to control it and c) you need some players with vison who can make those chance creating passes.
You can write reams and reams of well thought out reasons for attending, BUT the only way this lot will bugger of is if no one goes. Surely fans must see that nothing has changed, and won't while the Rat and Liar are in charge, and if you are bought by shiny trinkets in the post then nothing will dissuade you from going. As Albert Einstein said, Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
How can you be so sure that he will bugger off as you put it if no one goes to games. Why if he has no interest in making us a successful football club will he care about match day attendances and as many have said the income or lack of doesn't seem to bother him. I have given up my season ticket as has my son and we only attended 3 home games last year but I agree with so much that Covered end has said. Long term its our football club I still remember the hurt of losing the Valley, the years at Sellout ETC ETC ETC, we lost a generation of fans due to poor ownership/mismanagement, sound familiar!!!!. It was a long road back but we did it thanks to the fans and good honest owners who loved the club as they were fans too. Lets not go there again. I have said on many threads look at the examples of Leeds, Portsmouth and to a lesser degree Newcastle. The fans protested against the owners in many different ways but come match day they were there to support their team, their club and eventually things start to get better and most importantly the fans are still there.
Why are posters on here so quick to criticise and slag off people, we are just another club in tbe 3rd division, that aint Robinsons fault, I detest Roland and his crowd but why not give Robinson a bloody chance, far too much negativity and criticism. Mind you I remember Lawrence and then Curbishley getting stick and those two were over the past 4 decades the stand out managers, SCP did ok as well but only ok.
Not trying to inflame anything but how can a manager who gets 101 points, then takes you to 3 points from the playoffs the following season only get an "OK".
Why are posters on here so quick to criticise and slag off people, we are just another club in tbe 3rd division, that aint Robinsons fault, I detest Roland and his crowd but why not give Robinson a bloody chance, far too much negativity and criticism. Mind you I remember Lawrence and then Curbishley getting stick and those two were over the past 4 decades the stand out managers, SCP did ok as well but only ok.
Not trying to inflame anything but how can a manager who gets 101 points, then takes you to 3 points from the playoffs the following season only get an "OK".
SCP was excellent.
Always thought that SCP's biggest achievement was getting to within 3 points of the playoffs in the Championship in our first season back & thats without taking anything away from the 101 points in the L1 title season.
Loved Charlton then, want to come back but refuse to give Roland any of my hard earned
It's interesting that people are getting caricatured as 'positive' or 'negative' depending on their attitude to the regime and to the protests. When actually, supporting the regime and arguing against protesters/boycotters is no more or less positive than taking the opposite stance. It doesn't mean that you're more optimistic or that you have better views or that you're a better fan or anything like that. It purely means that you have a different opinion. People are taking negativity as in having negative beliefs about the regime and extrapolating from that some imagined general negativity. But the opposite could be said. I am a positive person. I am positive that I want Duchatelet and Meire out. I am positive that if we all stick together we can win. I am positive that one day they will be gone and we will get our club back. It strikes me that that is far more positive than worrying what might happen if someone misses a few matches. But of course that's just an opinion too. We all have different opinions, but it is silly to infer from that that there are two camps of Charlton fans one of which is more positive than the other.
First home pre season friendly of the season against decent opposition and I'm really struggling to be motivated to attend. Under normal circumstances after the weeks without football and this year missing out on Welling I would be champing at the bit for this one. In fact I'm almost looking for excuses not to go. It's not even as if I have far to go to get to The Valley or home after.
That is the reality of Roland and Katrien. That is what they have done to my previously unwavering support and commitment. I'm really unsure if I will ever bounce back to be honest.
I am looking forward to our first league game, more so than last season. We still need three players though. I believe that KR is a good Manager for us to have under this regime because he will not be afraid to ask for more funds.
That squad is nowhere near equipped to compete for promotion. Nothing has changed.
I understand you.....as it stands and given our recent history.....and bad luck with serious injuries.
But doesn't it also depend on the strength of the competition? I have no idea how the other clubs are shaping up......how relegations may have affected the Blackburns and Rotherhams......or say, whether Bury have used their new money wisely etc.
There is also the loan window and it is conceivable that we could get a couple in even after the season has begun, to fill in some gaps.
It is also surely conceivable that young players like Aribo and KAG could make a serious breakthrough. Or maybe Tony Watt can rediscover his mojo....
I know it's probably 50/50 that it could be a good season but that's the the thing that keeps it interesting (for those that are interested). Get 35 league games out of Kashi and I think we'll be in the mix.
You can write reams and reams of well thought out reasons for attending, BUT the only way this lot will bugger of is if no one goes. Surely fans must see that nothing has changed, and won't while the Rat and Liar are in charge, and if you are bought by shiny trinkets in the post then nothing will dissuade you from going. As Albert Einstein said, Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
How can you be so sure that he will bugger off as you put it if no one goes to games. Why if he has no interest in making us a successful football club will he care about match day attendances and as many have said the income or lack of doesn't seem to bother him. I have given up my season ticket as has my son and we only attended 3 home games last year but I agree with so much that Covered end has said. Long term its our football club I still remember the hurt of losing the Valley, the years at Sellout ETC ETC ETC, we lost a generation of fans due to poor ownership/mismanagement, sound familiar!!!!. It was a long road back but we did it thanks to the fans and good honest owners who loved the club as they were fans too. Lets not go there again. I have said on many threads look at the examples of Leeds, Portsmouth and to a lesser degree Newcastle. The fans protested against the owners in many different ways but come match day they were there to support their team, their club and eventually things start to get better and most importantly the fans are still there.
Well of course thats your decision to go to games, but people are judged on actions, not words, the repeated mistakes/actions by our owners over the last couple of seasons have ruined our club. They will do the same this season, the playing squad will be parred to the bone, the manager doest even know if he's going to get the required 4 players in he says he needs. Now I could understand that if we had a skint owner then it would be tough, but the Rat has a ton of dough, and he has repeatedly said that the club is NOT a priority to him, he has no interest in it, other than to make money. His initial 'Network' model was a disaster, and I really dont think he has a Plan B. We know he wants to sell, but wants to recoup his loses, they only way to do that is to get us back to the Championship, at least he may get close to getting his dough back, BUT they dont know how to do that. And yes I do think that if enough people boycotted he would just cut his losses, I really do, however all the while people are turning up to games, then he is still fooling some people all of the time, like he fooled me for the last 2/3 seasons. Enjoy your 'match day experience', it will be the same as the last few seasons....and round and round we will all go.
TBH L1 looks a lot weaker this coming season than last. There are 4 big teams in it - us, Bradford, Blackburn and Pompey. A few teams with recent success like Wigan or new money like Rotherham or Bury. But really, we ought to be top 6 no problem. The fact that we're not locked on is in part because football is an unpredicatable game and part because of our ridiculous owner.
I can feel myself being sucked in just because I am so desperate to feel some positivity around my team. I'm pleased they've stuck with Karl even though I'm not convinced by him. I'd like to see some more signings, but my expectations are so low now ....
A lot of people go on about top six. Feck that. Outside the top two you risk not going up. Top six is not good enough, it has to be top two absolutely.
PS. We spent a whole lot of time last season worrying about relegation. We are certainly not entitled to anything, all resources must be on promotion as many of the players have alluded to, which is why it is a drag that Robinson is now downplaying the much needed recruitment still necessary.
What was Millwall's squad like last season? Did they have a deep squad, or just a core of decent players who stayed fit?
Hoofball with Morrison acting as a battering ram with Gregory as a partner. Effective if your front two are good at their jobs and Morrison is a monster. Won't work in The Championship but they've signed a couple of decent players. I expect them bottom six. Not sure Harris has the nous to change tactics.
I agree with much of what you have written, especially the frustration at what weve become, but I'm not sure at all that I understand HOW you are proposing to change things, @Covered End?
Well the only way is for the fans to return and support their team, but it's up to them isn't it ? I certainly don't want to get the flak for telling people what they should be doing, even though I'm expecting it anyway.
It's our choice as fans whether we now choose to be a smaller club than say Millwall or not. It's a buggers muddle and no mistake.
People make their own individual choices though. Mine has been to go to matches, although I don't enjoy them as much because I don't believe that the way the club is set up it can succeed.
I don't trust the people making the decisions because I don't believe that the numerous people who I respect who have tried their very best to work with Katrien Meire and who have no conceivable "agenda" can all be wrong when they say that she is out of her depth. That's people at all levels, inside and outside of the organisation. People who have massive credibility with fans.
I don't believe it's a coincidence that there isn't one such person saying to me, actually she's been treated unfairly, she deserves a chance, she's doing a really good job. I don't believe that from my own limited personal dealings with her and I don't believe it from the decisions she has made and the things she has said publicly.
Very clearly she has had a much larger role in the football side of the club than any previous chief executive. That has been a disaster.
On top of that we have an owner who intervenes on a whim, believes he is equipped by his genius to advise experienced professionals and IMO is clearly unhinged.
To get beyond that you have to believe the football side can operate entirely independent of this owner and this chief executive, when the whole experience of the last three and a half years has been the opposite.
You have to believe that Karl Robinson is such a good manager and has the depth and quality of squad that he can succeed despite these handicaps, despite how last season unfolded. That's still possible, but the evidence is not there.
It's a heroic leap of faith in my view at this point - otherwise it's covering your eyes and sticking your fingers in your ears to drown out the reality, simply because you want it to be true. I understand the appeal of that, but I can't do it and I think a lot of people are the same.
I agree with all of this and it sums up where we are at.
So what do we do, no longer attend and let the club continue to fail ?
No longer bring our kids and lose most of what we've built up over 30 years ?
Or do we keep the club alive and turn up in numbers like Newcastle, Portsmouth & Leeds fans did, despite them also protesting.
Perhaps we should continue to ape the Blackpool and Coventry fans and boycott ?
Those 2 clubs are "basket cases", the first 3 are on the up again.
What's the latest takeover news ? How close is he to selling ?
The mass demonstrations were driven on the hope of Varney introducing new owners, it never happened.
"They'll sell up when we're relegated and we can all come back". That didn't happen either.
There's only one person who knows when RD will sell up and even then he may just sell/gift to family.
If you enjoy supporting Charlton, the only certain thing is that you have the option to go along, meet your friends and family, take your kids. He's made it pretty clear he won't be forced out and nor will Meire.
I despise them both, but that doesn't alter the situation.
The players, manager and coaches, deserve our support and Charlton needs to start the recovery process.
When he sells let him sell a thriving club, not an empty shell of a League 2 club like Coventry.
Comments
Kashi and JFC would work well in the formation, so would Holmes.
I hate to say it but Millwalls strike force last year Is exactly what you need in this division. I just feel with 4-2-3-1 the formation entices teams to overplay it.
It might be old school but there's nothing better then a winger beating a man putting a decent cross in and your centre forward powering a header into the roof of the net.
4-2-3-1 suits the arsenals, city, Uniteds who are playing on pitches like carpets week in week out and who have the players to do it
Nothing wrong with being old school, but you need to play to your strengths and attribues. Whether that is old school or not. I don't want to be disrespectful, but Sheff Utd killed us at the Valley - despite us snatching a draw at the death. What I noted was that they only had one player what I would call a skillful footballer. They were strong and fit and big. That is the shortcut to success in League one. Millwall were similar. It may not be a bad way to go as you can bring better players in as you climb up. We are certainly not adopting that approach, so we need to be good in every position, in relation to the level. I prefer to watch skill, so I am not moaning about it. Although I probably won't watch us too much. As the season nears I do have a voice urging me to go - I won't need much of a push - KM going would probably be enough for me to return.
So if you set out to be a passing side - you need a) energy to give simple passing options to the passer all the time, b) good control as sometimes a pass is only bad because of the receiver's inability to control it and c) you need some players with vison who can make those chance creating passes.
I have given up my season ticket as has my son and we only attended 3 home games last year but I agree with so much that Covered end has said. Long term its our football club I still remember the hurt of losing the Valley, the years at Sellout ETC ETC ETC, we lost a generation of fans due to poor ownership/mismanagement, sound familiar!!!!. It was a long road back but we did it thanks to the fans and good honest owners who loved the club as they were fans too. Lets not go there again.
I have said on many threads look at the examples of Leeds, Portsmouth and to a lesser degree Newcastle. The fans protested against the owners in many different ways but come match day they were there to support their team, their club and eventually things start to get better and most importantly the fans are still there.
SCP was excellent.
Loved Charlton then, want to come back but refuse to give Roland any of my hard earned
That is the reality of Roland and Katrien. That is what they have done to my previously unwavering support and commitment. I'm really unsure if I will ever bounce back to be honest.
But doesn't it also depend on the strength of the competition? I have no idea how the other clubs are shaping up......how relegations may have affected the Blackburns and Rotherhams......or say, whether Bury have used their new money wisely etc.
There is also the loan window and it is conceivable that we could get a couple in even after the season has begun, to fill in some gaps.
It is also surely conceivable that young players like Aribo and KAG could make a serious breakthrough. Or maybe Tony Watt can rediscover his mojo....
I know it's probably 50/50 that it could be a good season but that's the the thing that keeps it interesting (for those that are interested). Get 35 league games out of Kashi and I think we'll be in the mix.
They will do the same this season, the playing squad will be parred to the bone, the manager doest even know if he's going to get the required 4 players in he says he needs. Now I could understand that if we had a skint owner then it would be tough, but the Rat has a ton of dough, and he has repeatedly said that the club is NOT a priority to him, he has no interest in it, other than to make money. His initial 'Network' model was a disaster, and I really dont think he has a Plan B. We know he wants to sell, but wants to recoup his loses, they only way to do that is to get us back to the Championship, at least he may get close to getting his dough back, BUT they dont know how to do that.
And yes I do think that if enough people boycotted he would just cut his losses, I really do, however all the while people are turning up to games, then he is still fooling some people all of the time, like he fooled me for the last 2/3 seasons.
Enjoy your 'match day experience', it will be the same as the last few seasons....and round and round we will all go.
I can feel myself being sucked in just because I am so desperate to feel some positivity around my team. I'm pleased they've stuck with Karl even though I'm not convinced by him. I'd like to see some more signings, but my expectations are so low now ....
Feck that.
Outside the top two you risk not going up.
Top six is not good enough, it has to be top two absolutely.
We spent a whole lot of time last season worrying about relegation.
We are certainly not entitled to anything, all resources must be on promotion as many of the players have alluded to, which is why it is a drag that Robinson is now downplaying the much needed recruitment still necessary.
Looking at their stats, 3 players played 51 times, with 7 more playing more than 40
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016–17_Charlton_Athletic_F.C._season
We had one player with 51 (Crofts), and just 2 with over 40 (Rudd and Magennis)
That's a massive difference in stability, whether because of injuries, January sales or managerial changes
So what do we do, no longer attend and let the club continue to fail ?
No longer bring our kids and lose most of what we've built up over 30 years ?
Or do we keep the club alive and turn up in numbers like Newcastle, Portsmouth & Leeds fans did, despite them also protesting.
Perhaps we should continue to ape the Blackpool and Coventry fans and boycott ?
Those 2 clubs are "basket cases", the first 3 are on the up again.
What's the latest takeover news ? How close is he to selling ?
The mass demonstrations were driven on the hope of Varney introducing new owners, it never happened.
"They'll sell up when we're relegated and we can all come back". That didn't happen either.
There's only one person who knows when RD will sell up and even then he may just sell/gift to family.
If you enjoy supporting Charlton, the only certain thing is that you have the option to go along, meet your friends and family, take your kids. He's made it pretty clear he won't be forced out and nor will Meire.
I despise them both, but that doesn't alter the situation.
The players, manager and coaches, deserve our support and Charlton needs to start the recovery process.
When he sells let him sell a thriving club, not an empty shell of a League 2 club like Coventry.