Looking at the current leaders of the leagues across Europe almost half way through this season and it could be argued that there is absolutely nothing wrong with the EPL. The only downside at the moment is that it is so competitive that it impacts our teams' ability to compete with the big teams in the other leagues in the Champions League who have a cakewalk every year in their domestic leagues
They is no logical reason why Charlton should not be in Leicester's position in 7 or 8 years. Decent owners willing to spend a bit of money, a bit of luck, appointing experienced coaching staff and it could happen.
However when we sell without even giving the young player time to establish himself in our first team, that is when it gets silly.
And please don't lecture me it's a business. Of course it's a sodding business.
But if you have a player like Gomez and now Lookman playing regularly for us for at least a season plus, then the player's value will double or more over that time
Now that is good business. Selling him now is not.
Can some of you not even see that?
Absolutely correct.
There is also the value that these players will continue to add to our team whilst we have them.
Contracts mean nothing because they have so many built in clauses ....
I take it you've never seen a professional footballer's contract then Colin? Because actually, they are pretty straightforward and basic.
However in the normal business world their contents are confidential between the employer and employee. But football is not a normal business. It is infested with agents, whose activities are completely unregulated.
You get my gist, I am sure...best not to be more specific than that in the public domain.
It is an issue that I would expect Katrien Meire, as a lawyer, to be addressing, in order to safeguard the business model of developing young players to the point where they become valuable assets.
no I don't understand all this as it just doesn't make sense.
if we agree that RD's plan includes having a smaller squad of more experienced players and supplementing the squad with youth players as and when needed then you don't sell them at the first opportunity nor allow their contracts to leave as per Gomez.
but if we agree that RD is only in it for the money then why spend so much on the stadium and training ground, ah yes I'm seeing the light - RD receives interest on his spending and gets a bonus on the player sales which was highlighted by KM insisting that RD had spent many millions on new players but she didn't take into account the incoming fees as it is obvious they go straight to RD
do you know I think I'd prefer administration to our current owners
no I don't understand all this as it just doesn't make sense.
if we agree that RD's plan includes having a smaller squad of more experienced players and supplementing the squad with youth players as and when needed then you don't sell them at the first opportunity nor allow their contracts to leave as per Gomez.
but if we agree that RD is only in it for the money then why spend so much on the stadium and training ground, ah yes I'm seeing the light - RD receives interest on his spending and gets a bonus on the player sales which was highlighted by KM insisting that RD had spent many millions on new players but she didn't take into account the incoming fees as it is obvious they go straight to RD
do you know I think I'd prefer administration to our current owners
But it's catch 22. If RD is receiving interest it's only an amount of money on paper owed to him and if the debt gets too high that it warrants an asking price for the club which is too high then you only need to look at Bolton who's owner is pretty much willing to write off the debt owed to him to be able to sell the club. And I can't see RD allowing that situation to develop here.
"sees young players as free money". Right.... so free he subsidises the club around 6-8 million every season, and spends significant amounts on youth development.
How do you know Prague these players don't want to leave? Gomez seemed pretty certain he wanted to go. Yes we'd like more money, yes we'd like stability so players could see an improvement curve over more than a spring resurgence: Hopefully.
On what evidence do you say that? If you said "Gomez' agent " then you might be nearer the mark. Just for once, @colin1961 was on the money, the deal was stitched up a year earlier and we could not get out of it.
The Duchatelet model is supposed to be, develop youngsters and play them, then sell them for decent money. If they sell a young player based on three first team appearances and one gaol, then that is not the model, is it?
The model requires a robust contractual system for young players to be in place so that we don't get stitched up by agents like Gomez's, and therefore extract full value from their development. Full value includes them playing enough matches to help make us a better football team as well making them more saleable assets. See Palace and Zaha...
But now we have our own fans eagerly discussing which FAPL club it would be better to sell him to. An 18 year old with 3 games under his belt. Three. A player whose arrival in the first team is so recent that he is not even listed on the first team stats page on our OS.
Deary deary me. Perhaps we should take a look at ourselves rather than just blame everything on RD for things that have not even happened yet. Otherwise we are in danger of making these things come to pass.
At last a piece of calm common sense and understanding at this difficult time.
Is there any evidence that he wants to leave, or any club is serious about a bid? Not that I know of. Sure lots of prem clubs will be looking at him now - its what they do.
Could be wrong but I think 17/18 year old's can sign for max of 2 year contract? As he has I understand.
It's inevitable that the big clubs will be looking at any young player who shows a smidgen of talent .. nothing new there .. in these days of glamour clubs and big big bucks, who can for their playersblame anyone for signing with a club offering a contract at 18 or 19 years old which could make the recipient financially secure for life .. if Lookman has his head turned by the flirtations of another club offering a very sweet deal, he will go, simple as that .. .. AND that would be the case if our owner was Roland D, the CAFC Trust, 'Lord' Loadsamoney or Jesus Christ .. just a reality of modern commercial/football life .. no good at all whinging about it
Yes it's inevitable but it's now so skewed it's become a sick joke. These rich clubs have squads of 70 - 80 professionals. Am I right that Chelsea had over 30 players out on loan last season ? It's bonkers. They do it because of the stupid money they have access to not because anybody at their club seriously thinks that the player will be anything other than a reasonable punt.
this .. the loan system is ridiculous .. any moderately wealthy Championship club can sign decent almost Premier quality players on a 'sale or return' basis in a bid for promotion, whilst the Chelseas of the world get subsidised trials and experience for their young players .. and not only Champ clubs .. Bamford loaned to Palace .. he's had more clubs than (yes folks) Jack Niklaus and he's still only 22 years old .. the likelihood is that he'll NEVER be a regular at Chelsea .. AND Coquelin, Wenger probably didn't realise that he had such a diamond on the books until he turned it on for us ..
The question of course is .. would the Lookmans of the world be content signing for a wealthy/big club, earning BIG money only to find they're playing reserve/youth team football or are forever being loaned out to outfits far from their home and mates ? ... Alas, I think the answer almost invariably would be a resounding ... YES ((: <)
The game needs a massive shake up, it needs a Chelsea to not just get relegated,but to then suffer in the championship and then some! oh wait theyre 15th you say....
Unfortunately if in the event Chelsea do get relegated I can see the premier league wanting to push harder for no relegation from the premier league. No way they want to lose as big a "brand" as chelski
question of what comes sooner .. a Super Euro League or a no relegation English Premier League .. we will see
The game needs a massive shake up, it needs a Chelsea to not just get relegated,but to then suffer in the championship and then some! oh wait theyre 15th you say....
Unfortunately if in the event Chelsea do get relegated I can see the premier league wanting to push harder for no relegation from the premier league. No way they want to lose as big a "brand" as chelski
question of what comes sooner .. a Super Euro League or a no relegation English Premier League .. we will see
Bournemouth / Norwich / Watford will be deducted points because they've not complied with FFP either that or the three teams promoted from the Championship won't be allowed up for the exact same reasons.
Don't worry about the price - RD will have his mind on that already. My guess is he will sell all the good bits of CAFC to get his money back, and then bale out on us. League One gates at the Valley would be 8-10k max, and advance ST sales would be badly hit. So why would he bother carrying on? He would need to find (and sell) a Gomez and a Lookman every year just to keep us afloat, and the value of young first team players in L1 would be much less than the Championship.
Just out of curiosity... What would people take next season?
Having Lookman in the Squad... With three / four players coming in Selling Lookman for X amount of money... Having six / seven players coming in
At the same time, it would be great to keep Lookman for a number of years but if selling him has the same impact that selling Jenkinson had...
*Note: I still expect Gudmundsson to move on to the Premier League or a better Championship next season regardless due to Euro 2016
Depends on who we bring in. If we spend the money on players like Bauer, Gudmundsson and Diarra then great. Another set like Sarr, Polish Pete, Lepoint, Ba and Bergdich then sod the whole thing. Which do you honestly think is more likely?
Just out of curiosity... What would people take next season?
Having Lookman in the Squad... With three / four players coming in Selling Lookman for X amount of money... Having six / seven players coming in
At the same time, it would be great to keep Lookman for a number of years but if selling him has the same impact that selling Jenkinson had...
*Note: I still expect Gudmundsson to move on to the Premier League or a better Championship next season regardless due to Euro 2016
Depends on who we bring in. If we spend the money on players like Bauer, Gudmundsson and Diarra then great. Another set like Sarr, Polish Pete, Lepoint, Ba and Bergdich then sod the whole thing. Which do you honestly think is more likely?
Probably a mixture... We'll probably get one or two in the type of Bauer but also a few in the type of Bergdich
It was clear from day one lookman was special. From a business point of view why play him if his not tied down to a long contract. Yes we would have to sell him at some stage but to get some experience with us first which would increase his value and for us to benefit from his talents for at least a couple of seasons surely is good business sense! Have no faith in any profit we make being spent wisely with our recent player purchasing policy!
Just out of curiosity... What would people take next season?
Having Lookman in the Squad... With three / four players coming in Selling Lookman for X amount of money... Having six / seven players coming in
At the same time, it would be great to keep Lookman for a number of years but if selling him has the same impact that selling Jenkinson had...
*Note: I still expect Gudmundsson to move on to the Premier League or a better Championship next season regardless due to Euro 2016
The problem is, with the current scouting set up, I have zero confidence in the 6 or 7 players that might come in. At least when Jenkinson left, there were people at the club that knew the division, and knew what players we needed to bring in, in order to get out of it.
We're better off keeping him, though I don't think we will. It just remains to be seen if he goes in January or at the end of the season.
I think we're all forgetting the positives here. Lookman goes, frees up money to sign Shola Ameobi on contract until end of the season from Bolton in January, as they look to free up wages and cut costs.
I think we're all forgetting the positives here. Lookman goes, frees up money to sign Shola Ameobi on contract until end of the season from Bolton in January, as they look to free up wages and cut costs.
We all win
Well, now you put it like that I feel much better !
Just out of curiosity... What would people take next season?
Having Lookman in the Squad... With three / four players coming in Selling Lookman for X amount of money... Having six / seven players coming in
At the same time, it would be great to keep Lookman for a number of years but if selling him has the same impact that selling Jenkinson had...
*Note: I still expect Gudmundsson to move on to the Premier League or a better Championship next season regardless due to Euro 2016
Last summer there were exactly the same comments about the Gomez sale. Was it sethplum or someone who was saying it could be our Championship Jenks moment, ie sell him and use the money to build a promotion winning squad. Works well under these guys!
Come January and I will expect to see him go but there's a way to get this sorted out - sell him and get him back on loan till the end of the season, a win-win for us all, but I doubt that the guys at the top will push for it...
Comments
Because actually, they are pretty straightforward and basic.
They is no logical reason why Charlton should not be in Leicester's position in 7 or 8 years. Decent owners willing to spend a bit of money, a bit of luck, appointing experienced coaching staff and it could happen.
There is also the value that these players will continue to add to our team whilst we have them.
You get my gist, I am sure...best not to be more specific than that in the public domain.
It is an issue that I would expect Katrien Meire, as a lawyer, to be addressing, in order to safeguard the business model of developing young players to the point where they become valuable assets.
if we agree that RD's plan includes having a smaller squad of more experienced players and supplementing the squad with youth players as and when needed then you don't sell them at the first opportunity nor allow their contracts to leave as per Gomez.
but if we agree that RD is only in it for the money then why spend so much on the stadium and training ground, ah yes I'm seeing the light - RD receives interest on his spending and gets a bonus on the player sales which was highlighted by KM insisting that RD had spent many millions on new players but she didn't take into account the incoming fees as it is obvious they go straight to RD
do you know I think I'd prefer administration to our current owners
Is there any evidence that he wants to leave, or any club is serious about a bid? Not that I know of.
Sure lots of prem clubs will be looking at him now - its what they do.
Could be wrong but I think 17/18 year old's can sign for max of 2 year contract? As he has I understand.
and not only Champ clubs .. Bamford loaned to Palace .. he's had more clubs than (yes folks) Jack Niklaus and he's still only 22 years old .. the likelihood is that he'll NEVER be a regular at Chelsea .. AND Coquelin, Wenger probably didn't realise that he had such a diamond on the books until he turned it on for us ..
The question of course is .. would the Lookmans of the world be content signing for a wealthy/big club, earning BIG money only to find they're playing reserve/youth team football or are forever being loaned out to outfits far from their home and mates ? ... Alas, I think the answer almost invariably would be a resounding ... YES ((: <)
Anything less than 12m + would be a joke.
Is probably the only thing that'll lower Lookman's value a bit
Think Tony Cascarino.
A nice new set of kit for Waterloo.
Having Lookman in the Squad... With three / four players coming in
Selling Lookman for X amount of money... Having six / seven players coming in
At the same time, it would be great to keep Lookman for a number of years but if selling him has the same impact that selling Jenkinson had...
*Note: I still expect Gudmundsson to move on to the Premier League or a better Championship next season regardless due to Euro 2016
My guess is he will sell all the good bits of CAFC to get his money back, and then bale out on us.
League One gates at the Valley would be 8-10k max, and advance ST sales would be badly hit.
So why would he bother carrying on?
He would need to find (and sell) a Gomez and a Lookman every year just to keep us afloat, and the value of young first team players in L1 would be much less than the Championship.
Huddart
Jenkinson, Gomez, Lennon, THD
Harriott, Shelvey, Poyet, Palmer
Lookman, KAG
Bench
Solly
Pope
Fox
?
Always been the case for the last twenty years.
We're better off keeping him, though I don't think we will. It just remains to be seen if he goes in January or at the end of the season.
We all win
If he continues in his current form we may not see him next season.
Still at least can bring in a few decent players with the proceeds........................