I've been to games in Italy and the way the ultras coordinate the singing/flags/banners/moped throwing definitely adds a lot to the occasion. Maybe Henry could get a megaphone and order the East stand to hold their flasks in the air at a prearranged moment and chant " We are the blanket mob"
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
And yes I'm over 30.
Thanks for an actual awnser from someone and yeah chances are will never happen and will stay boring but different countries/regions have different styles and focus on different areas for example some groups spend time creating massive cheographies paid for by fans and not do much else (Milan clubs) whereas others like Paok focus more of loud singing etc and pyro.
Also other groups are more spontaneous than others eg the Polish steroid lot are like robots in a way but look up Torcida Split, Napoli , Delije , Paok etc they are all spontaneous even with a capo leading it all.
Maybe England has been completely killed off but would be good too try to change and terraces are a start to bring fun back but doubt anything from Charlton judging but replies and other reasons, and if anyone else on here is interested in ultras/hooligan scene after reading this even though I doubt it check out Lech vs Basel, Cska Moscow vs Spara Praha, Rapid Wien vs Ajax in next few days in European qualifiers. Good video to watch is Rapid Wien ultras at Aston Villa few years ago to show comparison of when Europeans come to England
Also if everyone's so against it would you prefer lower north how it is now or packed full of an ultras group creating an atmosphere? Also Ultras groups don't have to have a stand full of large heavy flags if you are more interested in watching the game, look at Panathiniakos Gate 13, look at Ultras World on tour with them on YouTube
Just a few more different songs (that more than 6 drunks sing ) and a bit more passion is what I want Then I'll get greedy and ask for a few more of our fans to start going away games and create a bit more atmosphere Slowly slowly catchy monkey
Watching the video I can sense the general themes being skulls, flares, intimidation and pent-up aggression. None of which should be at a family club like ours. I've also noticed that in Europe, and especially in that video, the fans are back behind barriers and fences.
I can understand the want for a better atmosphere but there's more than one way to improve. More singing from thè whole crowd rather than ultra style would be my preference.
"Anyone who is more interested in watching the football"
Seriously why would anyone go to a football match not to watch the football? I don't agree that our fan base is old, (I'm 33 btw) but I think it is does have loads of elderly, middle aged, young children, disabled people, pregnant women etc as well as teenagers and young adults, one of the things that make CAFC a great club to visit is that all varietys of age groups and people can and do go regularly to watch the football and feel safe and comfortable. That is not a quality that I would want sacrificed because a couple of youngsters want to bring back hooliganism or ultraism (fun) into the valley. Take it to Millwall I'm sure you'll be welcome there.
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
And yes I'm over 30.
Maybe England has been completely killed off but would be good too try to change and terraces are a start to bring fun back but doubt anything from Charlton judging but replies and other reasons, and if anyone else on here is interested in ultras/hooligan scene after reading this....
Some very poor quality trolling going on but just for the heck of it I think you've fundamentally misjudged the demographics of our fan base and their approach to a tear up...
My List of priorities for Football supporting (in no particular priority).
1 Meet up with mates/family- find parking space within half hours walk of ground. 2 Able to get through easy to operate automatic turnstile (before kick off ideally). 3 Be able to see pitch from Seat (or Sofa) 4 Some decent football (theoretically) 5 Decent pie and pint (hopefully with change from a tenner) 6 Loo (hopefully working, not overflowing or crowded by illicit smokers). 7 Programme seller within half a Mile (buy VOTV). 8 Atmosphere (Crowd awake, singing) 9 Red Red Robin (preferably without the pitch side chap talking over, and audible) 10Scoreboard (Displaying team as you can no longer recognise any of your players) 11 Victory ideally (Someone jumping out of tunnel- ideally landing on sofa) 12 Exit (leave ground, cross police barrier and horse muck, reaching car within hour)
Sorry forgot a really nice thermos of Bovril.
not required Rain. Some wierd overpriced culinery sensation served by a wally in a cap. Some lunatic twonk with a bleeding big flag directly in front of me. A vuvuzuela blown in my ear because someone thought they were cool on telly. A bloke with a megaphone telling me what to do, we fought a war for christ sake...... A flare anywhere near me! A sado semi militia group carrying out there own private macho posturing on the back of a football team because there isnt a war on and the NF/Militant/Peoples Front of Jedea arn't what they used to be!.
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
And yes I'm over 30.
Maybe England has been completely killed off but would be good too try to change and terraces are a start to bring fun back but doubt anything from Charlton judging but replies and other reasons, and if anyone else on here is interested in ultras/hooligan scene after reading this....
Some very poor quality trolling going on but just for the heck of it I think you've fundamentally misjudged the demographics of our fan base and their approach to a tear up...
Down in front! Or Youngsters! Call that putting the boot in, rubbish! Or Oiy mind my Thermos Or Watch out your scuffing up the Sofa! Or Its much better watching the match on the screen now!
I've been to about a dozen games in Europe, mostly in Germany and although it is interesting to see through the haze of a dozen pilsners on a lads weekender, I wouldn't want it at Charlton and I don't think it would work.
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
And yes I'm over 30.
if anyone else on here is interested in ultras/hooligan
You started off by saying ultras and hooligans were very different & we shouldn't mix up the two.
Now you are asking if anyone is interested in ultras/hooligans.
OLD? OLD????!!!! 57 is the new 27 thank you very much. You should try one of our spiced-up half-time Bovrils in the Upper West if you want to know what living on the edge is like...
57 and 27 are titles of Biffy Clyro songs. Good songs, too.
Also, I'm 29.
That's the extent of my contribution to this thread.
Comments
Firstly, it wouldn't work because people from England don't like being told what to do. I've seen fans almost come to blows because one fella stands up and starts yelling at everyone else to 'sing up' then someone says 'I'll sing when they start playing' and next thing they're squaring up to each other. Now magnify that to having a twat at the front of the stand with a megaphone deciding what songs to sing and for how long etc and I think a few might get wound up.
It also kills any spontaneity. I've been at away games where songs have been sung just at this one game, taking the p1ss out of the fat bloke in the next stand, because the ref pulls up with cramp, a steward falls over, the announcer mispronounces a player's name and that gets sung instead and so on. This wouldn't be allowed unless megaphone man decides what can be sung and when.
There's also a lot of 'ultra' culture that doesn't involve just singing, for example, incessant flag waving. You may want to stand behind someone waving a skull and cross bones the size of a semi-detached house but I'd rather watch a game of football.
There's also a hell of a lot of organisation that is involved. I wouldn't give up my evenings to paint banners or learn new chants. Those flag wavers are changed every five minutes, so for half a dozen flags you need 100+ volunteers on flag duty. This means phoning round the flag crew on a Friday night checking that everyone is available the next days ultra-ing. The flags, banners, fares etc have to be paid for. A CSKA Sofia fan came at me with a charity box in Bulgaria because I hadn't donated to the cause when buying a match day ticket, luckily the language barrier saved me from making what appeared to be a statutory donation to their ultras.
I've rambled on a bit here, what I'm really saying is I can't be bothered and I doubt others would be either.
And yes I'm over 30.
Also other groups are more spontaneous than others eg the Polish steroid lot are like robots in a way but look up Torcida Split, Napoli , Delije , Paok etc they are all spontaneous even with a capo leading it all.
Maybe England has been completely killed off but would be good too try to change and terraces are a start to bring fun back but doubt anything from Charlton judging but replies and other reasons, and if anyone else on here is interested in ultras/hooligan scene after reading this even though I doubt it check out Lech vs Basel, Cska Moscow vs Spara Praha, Rapid Wien vs Ajax in next few days in European qualifiers. Good video to watch is Rapid Wien ultras at Aston Villa few years ago to show comparison of when Europeans come to England
Before the game I'm quite young but age considerably during the match, especially the last ten minutes.
Then I'll get greedy and ask for a few more of our fans to start going away games and create a bit more atmosphere
Slowly slowly catchy monkey
I can understand the want for a better atmosphere but there's more than one way to improve. More singing from thè whole crowd rather than ultra style would be my preference.
Seriously why would anyone go to a football match not to watch the football? I don't agree that our fan base is old, (I'm 33 btw) but I think it is does have loads of elderly, middle aged, young children, disabled people, pregnant women etc as well as teenagers and young adults, one of the things that make CAFC a great club to visit is that all varietys of age groups and people can and do go regularly to watch the football and feel safe and comfortable. That is not a quality that I would want sacrificed because a couple of youngsters want to bring back hooliganism or ultraism (fun) into the valley. Take it to Millwall I'm sure you'll be welcome there.
1 Meet up with mates/family- find parking space within half hours walk of ground.
2 Able to get through easy to operate automatic turnstile (before kick off ideally).
3 Be able to see pitch from Seat (or Sofa)
4 Some decent football (theoretically)
5 Decent pie and pint (hopefully with change from a tenner)
6 Loo (hopefully working, not overflowing or crowded by illicit smokers).
7 Programme seller within half a Mile (buy VOTV).
8 Atmosphere (Crowd awake, singing)
9 Red Red Robin (preferably without the pitch side chap talking over, and audible)
10Scoreboard (Displaying team as you can no longer recognise any of your players)
11 Victory ideally (Someone jumping out of tunnel- ideally landing on sofa)
12 Exit (leave ground, cross police barrier and horse muck, reaching car within hour)
Sorry forgot a really nice thermos of Bovril.
not required
Rain.
Some wierd overpriced culinery sensation served by a wally in a cap.
Some lunatic twonk with a bleeding big flag directly in front of me.
A vuvuzuela blown in my ear because someone thought they were cool on telly.
A bloke with a megaphone telling me what to do, we fought a war for christ sake......
A flare anywhere near me!
A sado semi militia group carrying out there own private macho posturing on the back of a football team because there isnt a war on and the NF/Militant/Peoples Front of Jedea arn't what they used to be!.
Or
Youngsters! Call that putting the boot in, rubbish!
Or
Oiy mind my Thermos
Or
Watch out your scuffing up the Sofa!
Or
Its much better watching the match on the screen now!
Now you are asking if anyone is interested in ultras/hooligans.
Which is it ?
Also, I'm 29.
That's the extent of my contribution to this thread.
Bottom link is for everyone who thinks it has to he aggression and skulls