What have we become?

Swisdom

I don't mean the club - I mean us, the fans. The Supporters.

Surely the word "Supporters" implies we need to support the team. Regardless of who runs it, owns it and plays in it - it's the red and white kit and the badge that make this club what it is.

At the weekend I was cringing when some of our number started the "you don't know what you are doing" crap. We know nothing of what happens on the training ground. Igor looks like he wants to play all the time but, if he is ineffective and carrying a knock we should remove him from the game. He needs a couple of games out of the team to fully recover so I would like to see Watt get a start - he has done more in his cameos than Harriott has in several games so hopefully is now nearer to being match-fit. Just need to get a big lump to do the hold-up work first.

Earlier in the season we were going well - it's largely the same players now so we just need to get that feelgood factor going again - and one of the most important components missing is each and every one of us supporting the team - and losing the poisonous atmosphere currently surrounding everything we do.

Dansk_Red

http://www.charltonlife.com/discussion/66208/my-perspective-on-the-situation#latest

FishCostaFortune

I am not saying I agree with what (John Sitton once referred to as) 'the circus upstairs' are doing, however perhaps a positive atmosphere at the Valley might produce a positive performance by the team.

The best I have seen us was against Cardiff when the team and the crowd both had the bit between there teeth.

red_murph

What have we become?

A shadow of ourselves off and on the pitch.

ricky_otto

We have become what Roly has made as become....a complete and utter fucking mess.

tricky

I think many fans are probably being caught between wanting to support their team as much as possible, and at the same time wanting to make it clear that they do not endorse the current situation/decision making.

Nicholas

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

kentred2

Swisdom said:

I don't mean the club - I mean us, the fans. The Supporters.

Surely the word "Supporters" implies we need to support the team. Regardless of who runs it, owns it and plays in it - it's the red and white kit and the badge that make this club what it is.

At the weekend I was cringing when some of our number started the "you don't know what you are doing" crap. We know nothing of what happens on the training ground. Igor looks like he wants to play all the time but, if he is ineffective and carrying a knock we should remove him from the game. He needs a couple of games out of the team to fully recover so I would like to see Watt get a start - he has done more in his cameos than Harriott has in several games so hopefully is now nearer to being match-fit. Just need to get a big lump to do the hold-up work first.

Earlier in the season we were going well - it's largely the same players now so we just need to get that feelgood factor going again - and one of the most important components missing is each and every one of us supporting the team - and losing the poisonous atmosphere currently surrounding everything we do.

Those same old calls to support the team are dead now sadly Swidsom.

The team and the owners are now part of a network not our Charlton the club we all follow. Yes support the club we love I agree but destroy the team and network in anyway you can

paulsturgess

kentred2 said:

Swisdom said:

I don't mean the club - I mean us, the fans. The Supporters.

Surely the word "Supporters" implies we need to support the team. Regardless of who runs it, owns it and plays in it - it's the red and white kit and the badge that make this club what it is.

At the weekend I was cringing when some of our number started the "you don't know what you are doing" crap. We know nothing of what happens on the training ground. Igor looks like he wants to play all the time but, if he is ineffective and carrying a knock we should remove him from the game. He needs a couple of games out of the team to fully recover so I would like to see Watt get a start - he has done more in his cameos than Harriott has in several games so hopefully is now nearer to being match-fit. Just need to get a big lump to do the hold-up work first.

Earlier in the season we were going well - it's largely the same players now so we just need to get that feelgood factor going again - and one of the most important components missing is each and every one of us supporting the team - and losing the poisonous atmosphere currently surrounding everything we do.

Those same old calls to support the team are dead now sadly Swidsom.

The team and the owners are now part of a network not our Charlton the club we all follow. Yes support the club we love I agree but destroy the team and network in anyway you can

Precisely. We are supporters of Charlton Athletic. That means we support what's best for the club and doesn't mean you have to blindly get behind any old chumps doing what the bloody hell they like with it.

I don't care what anyone says about the new seats, Roland has been 99% bad for this club, I do not support him and whilst they might be lovely people with the best of intentions, sadly as his spineless puppets that means I can't support Luzon or Katrien either.

paulsturgess

(*CUE* -

Succession of retorts about impressive new catering, we were going down without him, we were going to admin without him, bla bla bla)

Swisdom

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Swisdom

paulsturgess said:

(*CUE* -

Succession of retorts about impressive new catering, we were going down without him, we were going to admin without him, bla bla bla)

We were screwed, heading for administration. Not paying bills. Skint.

We are now solvent, cracking pitch (albeit players not taking advantage of it) and at least talking to prospective players (allegedly). We are about to embark on spending a shed load of cash on one of the best academies outside the premiership.

That side of the business is infinitely better than a year ago. Now it's the playing staff that need sorting. And for the fans to stop expecting the world

oohaahmortimer

the players are shot to bits /shit because they have been brought in by the freak show or run down by it , the players are not performing to their maximum ability because the puppets have lost the spirit in the dressing room

kentred2

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Roland (is?) will be the darkest day eg when the club left the valley we lost the valley but still had a team led by Chartlton fans as directors who saw away from the valley as the best way to progress the team in football terms. Roland has no desire to progress in football terms.

Nicholas

I know your not personally saying its the fans fault, however the players/managers owners etc have a part to play as well. if they cant give a 100% and fight for every 50-50 or tackle it rubs off straight away to the fans.

hoof_it_up_to_benty

Hard to get behind the team when they're playing so badly and a number of them don't really want to be there. Any other set of fans would have reacted far worse - makes me laugh when people get at our support.

nth_london_addick

Players shouldn't allow anything off field to interfere with their performance. However it does and it's hard for it not too but it shouldn't

_MrDick

Support the team, not the regime

Swisdom

kentred2 said:

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Roland (is?) will be the darkest day eg when the club left the valley we lost the valley but still had a team led by Chartlton fans as directors who saw away from the valley as the best way to progress the team in football terms. Roland has no desire to progress in football terms.

how can you know this? The redevelopment of Sparrows Lane is to generate better, young footballers. That can only be a good thing.

paulsturgess

nth london addick said:

Players shouldn't allow anything off field to interfere with their performance. However it does and it's hard for it not too but it shouldn't

Yeh it shouldn't if the players were robots - but football wouldn't be much of a spectator sport if they were, and they're not, so that comment's irrelevant.

Swisdom

Nicholas said:

I know your not personally saying its the fans fault, however the players/managers owners etc have a part to play as well. if they cant give a 100% and fight for every 50-50 or tackle it rubs off straight away to the fans.

Cardiff last season. We were playing shit and losing 0-2 at home.

The fans upped their game massively and we thumped them. Some say that turned our season around - maybe, maybe not - but it was certainly an "I was there" moment and showed the power of the fans

ricky_otto

_MrDick said:

Support the team, not the regime

The trouble is half the team have / will have been recruited from the regime.

Dansk_Red

Swisdom said:

kentred2 said:

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Roland (is?) will be the darkest day eg when the club left the valley we lost the valley but still had a team led by Chartlton fans as directors who saw away from the valley as the best way to progress the team in football terms. Roland has no desire to progress in football terms.

how can you know this? The redevelopment of Sparrows Lane is to generate better, young footballers. That can only be a good thing.

But it is not his project, the original plans were in place and funded, before RD joined us, he has changed the plans which is causing the hold up in planning consent.

WestCountryAddick

nth london addick said:

Players shouldn't allow anything off field to interfere with their performance. However it does and it's hard for it not too but it shouldn't

Easier said than done. Most of them probably didn't want to come here in the first place. The ones that were already ready here were either shipped out or are forced to play with these disinterested newcomers and wondering how long it will be until their own time is up and more network players take their places.

alan dugdale

In answer to the question, we have a become one fifth of a dictatorial conglomerate of businesses lacking the soul and individuality associated with football clubs.

Big William

What I find, in the North Upper at least, is that at the start of every game there's a bit of singing, a bit of atmosphere etc. As the game unfolds it get quieter and quieter, there's almost a sense of impending doom. It's an old argument about should the crowd lift the team or vice-versa, but it's very hard to leap out of your seat at yet another sideways pass. The mood around me on saturday was more mickey taking (you've got 3 weeks Luzon sort it out!) and resignation rather than anger; over the years there's always been a lively mixture of opinions (to say the least), the odd argument here and there, but virtually everybody seems to have given up hope at the moment.

paulsturgess

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

I know your not personally saying its the fans fault, however the players/managers owners etc have a part to play as well. if they cant give a 100% and fight for every 50-50 or tackle it rubs off straight away to the fans.

Cardiff last season. We were playing shit and losing 0-2 at home.

The fans upped their game massively and we thumped them. Some say that turned our season around - maybe, maybe not - but it was certainly an "I was there" moment and showed the power of the fans

That's not strictly true. It's been romanticised in that way since the game as an example of us sucking the ball into the net from the stands but in reality, that day the fans were class and making sh*tloads of noise from the first whistle and it didn't stop us going 0-2 down. The players came back themselves that day because they had the ability, team spirit, motivation, management, self-belief etc etc to be capable of getting that result. There are millions of amateur teams up and down the country week in week out putting in similar comebacks and getting wins against the odds in their respective set-ups with crowds of 0 (zero) - that's because of these reasons.

Noise we were making made it more enjoyable probably for us and for the players but impact on the result will have been minimal.

The best thing we can do to support our club now is

a) all those blinkered / sit on the fencer Roly sympathisers recognise that this poisonous, greedy, self-righteous arrogant tosser is a cancer which is eroding the soul of the club
b) get on rolands back as much as possible week in week out in and out of the ground and unite to push said tosser and his minions out of our club and our lives Valley Party-style

nth_london_addick

It won't happen, we have been sold shit for years and all people moaned about was car park pot holes and running out of bovril in the west stand

There has been times that direct action and a mob rule should have been done and as a fan base we shyd away

Leige tried to.intimidate Rd and it didn't work

Swisdom

Dansk_Red said:

Swisdom said:

kentred2 said:

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Roland (is?) will be the darkest day eg when the club left the valley we lost the valley but still had a team led by Chartlton fans as directors who saw away from the valley as the best way to progress the team in football terms. Roland has no desire to progress in football terms.

how can you know this? The redevelopment of Sparrows Lane is to generate better, young footballers. That can only be a good thing.

But it is not his project, the original plans were in place and funded, before RD joined us, he has changed the plans which is causing the hold up in planning consent.

Poor design is the reason it had to be changed.

He didn't have to take it on - it was partly funded by Greenwich Council I think - not sure they are putting anywhere near as much in and the plans are improving I believe

paulsturgess

nth london addick said:

It won't happen, we have been sold shit for years and all people moaned about was car park pot holes and running out of bovril in the west stand

There has been times that direct action and a mob rule should have been done and as a fan base we shyd away

Leige tried to.intimidate Rd and it didn't work

agreed it won't happen but I'm just saying IMO that is what should be happening and is best approach.

plus didn't roland at one point say he would sell liege and put them up for sale?

Nug

Swisdom said:

Dansk_Red said:

Swisdom said:

kentred2 said:

Swisdom said:

Nicholas said:

Yep agree it's all the fans fault, nothing to do with the fuckwit managers who keep playing players in wrong positions, nothing to do with the shit signings, the shocking football, the merry go round of managers, the shit and the lies the belgiums spout to us.

Everyone who keeps banging on about the support, how about you come into the covered end and try and keep the atmosphere going whilst watching that shit.

I'm not saying it's the fans fault - but we do have a part to play.

I'm not just talking about in the ground. I "liked" the facebook page the other day - that is fucking car crash. This place is suicide central. ITTV is in meltdown. The Twitter feed is practically dead because everything they tweet is just shot down and turned into Anti Roland/Katrien bollocks.

We've had darker days but we have an owner who is solvent and willing to put his hand in his pocket (if the person and price are right). His decisions may appear strange sometimes and some are, frankly, bizarre but the fact remains we need to stay up and start again in the summer so lets play our part and start trying to spread a little positivity for the remainder of the season and get the players performing.

Roland (is?) will be the darkest day eg when the club left the valley we lost the valley but still had a team led by Chartlton fans as directors who saw away from the valley as the best way to progress the team in football terms. Roland has no desire to progress in football terms.

how can you know this? The redevelopment of Sparrows Lane is to generate better, young footballers. That can only be a good thing.

But it is not his project, the original plans were in place and funded, before RD joined us, he has changed the plans which is causing the hold up in planning consent.

Poor design is the reason it had to be changed.

He didn't have to take it on - it was partly funded by Greenwich Council I think - not sure they are putting anywhere near as much in and the plans are improving I believe

Do we know if that's true. Playing Devil's advocate maybe he changes the plans, keeps if tied up in red tape as a way not to do it. Be easier than immediately pissing off everyone involved in the club, admittedly he's found other ways to do that.