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Roland: What division do you want?

drewmandrewman
in General Charlton
Bearing in mind I think we've established RD has no interest in getting Charlton promoted to the Prem, who knows enough about the cost of running a Championship club vs the cost of running a league one club and the financial rewards of both divisions, tv money, dwindling crowds etc to speculate on whether survival this year is really what RD wants? I may be being over cynical - and I wouldn't be the first - but just wondering really. Not an expert on the finances to have an informed opinion.
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Comments

  • A-R-T-H-U-RA-R-T-H-U-R
    You're also not an expert in establishing the interest of a new owner, either!
    ;-)
  • ValleyTalkBlogValleyTalkBlog
    Blackpool, Burnley and now Charlton follow very different models.
  • iaitchiaitch
    Maybe our model will be the most successful? Let's wait and see.
  • ValleyTalkBlogValleyTalkBlog
    I have no idea if it will or if it won't.

    But, to feed into the wider debates happening on this forum atm, I don't think people's concerns about RD model lie with its potential for success or not.
  • CallumcafcCallumcafc
    ValleyTalkBlog said:

    Blackpool, Burnley and now Charlton follow very different models.

    Doesn't mean it's impossible to achieve promotion our way too. They were just two examples. Charlton ourselves in the 90s is another good example. We've always been a second tier club that flirted with promotion one season, then relegation the next. Can't see that changing now, despite the new network strategy.

  • iaitchiaitch
    I think most people do not like change or something different. I'm not for or against at the moment.
  • seth plumseth plum
    The club statement is that the manager is there to keep Charlton Athletic up. That is evidence that Roland wants championship football,
    The £4mil relegation clause is evidence that Roland has at least contemplated relegation.
  • kigeliakigelia
    If you took off the first point you made from your original post I think it would be an interesting piece of discussion about finances and I am sure there is information out there that will provide some enlightenment.

    However your initial assumption appears to me, at least, to have no evidence to back it up.
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  • shine166shine166
    Where did he ever say that ? All I've heard is they don't think we will ever be top 4 in the Premier league.. Hardly saying they never want promotion is it ?
  • Henry IrvingHenry Irving
    kigelia said:

    If you took off the first point you made from your original post I think it would be an interesting piece of discussion about finances and I am sure there is information out there that will provide some enlightenment.

    However your initial assumption appears to me, at least, to have no evidence to back it up.

    Agree. Silly opening statement

    As to relative income we would lose 3m in TV, reduced ticket income (esp away sales) and other commercial income.

    We also become less attractive to potential signings at first team and youth level and will find it harder to keep the good players and kids we have.

    So the 4m clause (3m from some sources) would just about cover the TV money and ticket sales lost.

    If we go straight back up (huge if) then we might be OK but the long term damage is still there.

    The club was losing 5m to 7m a year so RD still needs to cover that plus pay for the pitch and the new academy building so the temptation might be to cut costs which means player wages and fees.
  • BedsaddickBedsaddick
    Why on earth would he not wan't us in the Prem? Odd statement.
  • ClaretforeverClaretforever
    New pitches aren't cheap. The one at Burnley was paid for with the Premier League money, and cost somewhere in the region of £800K. It's one of those Desso pitches like Arsenal, Wembley etc. Wear well and don't cut up the same - a small percentage is plastic fibres to hold it all together. It's looked fantastic all season, even with all the rain we've had.

    We'd had lots of problems for a few years with ours prior. Been a great investment for us but it's difficult to justify when you may need players as well.
  • ShootersHillGuruShootersHillGuru
    Thanks claretforever. Have you actually seen our pitch ? It's pretty much a disaster and serious investment is absolutely essential.
  • ClaretforeverClaretforever
    Desso Grassmaster

    http://youtu.be/ETrfhSVHOtY
  • hoof_it_up_to_bentyhoof_it_up_to_benty
    If RD is in it for the long term then a Desso pitch makes sense.
  • DRAddickDRAddick
    Whilst I'm clearly not a fan of most of what's been done by RD since takeover, even I think this is a bit silly and presumptious.

    There's no way he wouldn't want us getting into the Prem. The only question is what resources he's willing to spare to achieve it and what his priorities are.
  • WasCharleyOneWasCharleyOne
    Ridiculous statement. Charlton established in the Prem would be worth a hell of a lot to him,
  • Atletico AddickAtletico Addick
    WasCharleyOne said:

    Ridiculous statement. Charlton established in the Prem would be worth a hell of a lot to him,

    It would also need a hell of a lot of investment. You do not go from scoring 2 goals in 8 league matches to getting promoted out of the Champ during off-season. Would need a complete new batch of players. It's less about what Roland WANTS and more about what he is planning for imo.
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  • vffvff
    Claretforever said:

    Desso Grassmaster

    http://youtu.be/ETrfhSVHOtY

    Whole things looks cool. Great link there Claretforever.
  • drewmandrewman
    Ok, calm down, maybe my opening sentence was a little sweeping but, and I have not read everything he has said, I have not heard RD say anything about what division he envisages, or would like, Charlton to be playing in. I think we are a million miles away from premiership football and are a league one squad likely to be playing league one football next year. If I have missed something in his vision then tell me. Lets move past that on to the second part which was really my way of asking people more informed than me of the differences in finances between the middle two divisions. What, for example, is this £4m payment a couple of people have mentioned?
  • thenewbiethenewbie
    edited March 2014
    Claretforever said:

    New pitches aren't cheap. The one at Burnley was paid for with the Premier League money, and cost somewhere in the region of £800K. It's one of those Desso pitches like Arsenal, Wembley etc. Wear well and don't cut up the same - a small percentage is plastic fibres to hold it all together. It's looked fantastic all season, even with all the rain we've had.

    We'd had lots of problems for a few years with ours prior. Been a great investment for us but it's difficult to justify when you may need players as well.

    Know it is off topic but apparently we are looking at £850,000+ for the new pitch, the drainage system is totally screwed and will be replaced from scratch, and there will be undersoil heating installed - but not connected (on the basis if/when it is viable/necessary we will already have the facilities.) This is according to a groundsman at the Valley so I would imagine it is pretty accurate unless RD & Co. have been telling outright lies to the staff, which seems improbable and uncharacteristic. (Evasive and misleading are totally in character it seems though.)
  • ClaretforeverClaretforever
    ^^^ that figure sound about right as I put further up. We did the same; new pitch, drainage and under soil heating for circa £800K
  • boggzyboggzy
    I have a hunch he genuinely does not mind if we're relegated. I truly hope this isn't the case, and will be ecstatic if I'm wrong.
  • BolderhumphreyreidBolderhumphreyreid
    The red one.
  • thenewbiethenewbie
    boggzy said:

    I have a hunch he genuinely does not mind if we're relegated. I truly hope this isn't the case, and will be ecstatic if I'm wrong.

    I don't think it is a case of not minding, I do think it is more of he has two different plans - one if we stay up, one if we drop. I can't believe that he wasn't aware of the possibility of relegation and surely he has accounted for it in his way - once again the question is his way, vs the Charlton way I think.
  • Covered EndCovered End
    drewman said:

    Ok, calm down, maybe my opening sentence was a little sweeping but, and I have not read everything he has said, I have not heard RD say anything about what division he envisages, or would like, Charlton to be playing in. I think we are a million miles away from premiership football and are a league one squad likely to be playing league one football next year. If I have missed something in his vision then tell me. Lets move past that on to the second part which was really my way of asking people more informed than me of the differences in finances between the middle two divisions. What, for example, is this £4m payment a couple of people have mentioned?

    It is alleged (and I believe it's true) that RD pays TJ £16M if we stay up and £12M if we go down.

    If we go down we will arguably be £4M worse off, due to smaller TV & gate revenue.
  • jac52jac52
    Don't for second believe the man doesn't care about our division next season. In fact the 4m relegation clause actually illustrates that to me as its a shrewd businessman saying "hang on, if I pay 16m and we get relegated my investment is worth less and it'll cost me at least that to get it back". Bear in mind I said at least, as that will be a halfway house as we might not get relegated. Reckon if he bought us and we were def relegated that 4m discount would have been a lot more.
  • jac52jac52
    Also to note he will have been more than aware that in the summer we basically don't have any players so will have to stump up for a whole new squad or pay all the agent/signing on fees
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