Yes a proper hard headed businessman.... What hurts them the most......money! No money in their pockets!!
I think a lot of posters on here have been CL'd. Great site it is and I am on here every day (sad case I know), I think we have a very inflated opinion of our opinions. I propose the majority of our support (off this and any board), 1) acknowledge Chris Powell the player, 2) are grateful for his efforts in difficult circumstances and 3) are relieved that something has changed.
Cannot see the sort of quorum amongst the support needed to effect RD in any way, at the moment.
Yes a proper hard headed businessman.... What hurts them the most......money! No money in their pockets!!
I think a lot of posters on here have been CL'd. Great site it is and I am on here every day (sad case I know), I think we have a very inflated opinion of our opinions. I propose the majority of our support (off this and any board), 1) acknowledge Chris Powell the player, 2) are grateful for his efforts in difficult circumstances and 3) are relieved that something has changed.
Cannot see the sort of quorum amongst the support needed to effect RD in any way, at the moment.
I think some are relieved for a change but I see a change for the worse. I'm worried about the direction RD is pushing our club.
I'm not sure how much of this you've read, (and there's a lot so wouldn't expect it) but it's worrying RD has pushed out Powell because Powell refused to play who RD wanted.
RD wanted Powell to be a "yes man" and to be a part of his horrendous networking strategy and he wasn't getting that.
A change like that would be bad for us and that looks like the direction it's heading in.
He's already had an offer to sell weeks ago and knocked it back.
Really? How do you know that?
Can you share anything else about that SHG ? Like how much he was offered / legitimate decent owners who wanted to invest in the club and run it properly. It would be brilliant for Charlton to be run by a straight forward non visionary non penny pinching owner. Waking up and finding out that 2chalet is just an unpleasant memory.
Yes a proper hard headed businessman.... What hurts them the most......money! No money in their pockets!!
I think a lot of posters on here have been CL'd. Great site it is and I am on here every day (sad case I know), I think we have a very inflated opinion of our opinions. I propose the majority of our support (off this and any board), 1) acknowledge Chris Powell the player, 2) are grateful for his efforts in difficult circumstances and 3) are relieved that something has changed.
Cannot see the sort of quorum amongst the support needed to effect RD in any way, at the moment.
I think there's a lot to be said in that. Message boards are full of fanatics who spend all day thinking about the club. I'd imagine most supporters go to football to get a break from the real world without obsessing about this stuff non-stop.
From the people around me last night I would say the feeling of the majority of non-forum-lurking fans is ambivalence towards RD at the moment. Yes there are grumbles about the nature and timing of Powell's departure but more than a few see it as justified thanks to results (without the endless debate of where the blame lies for that.)
It would take many thousands of fans acting in concert for RD to even pay attention, much less act, and despite what the more passionate/vociferous/deranged [delete as appropriate] fans on here may think, there really is that much discontent amongst fans at large about RD's management right now.
Fans react AFTER it's obvious bad stuff is happening at the club, most are too scared to be pro active. Some may never reach this point of action and are just happy going to watch football week in week out, regardless of the way the club is being run, the players we are being forced upon etc.
I stand by what R.D's doing is wrong for modern football, people from the outside in can see this, fans of other club within this 'network' can see this, but a lot of Charlton fans want to stink blinkers over there eyes and hope for the best. I will be eating humble pie for the rest of my life if we get into the PL any time soon. Not a hope.
My credibility is very low in the eyes of many here.
However I will report on the rumour that I heard from several people last night that there are indeed still people out there who would buy Charlton Athletic.
Now this is with the caveat regarding who, how much, and the idea that there are always some people somewhere prepared to buy football clubs.
I have also been told that to propose anything to Roland means that you have to gain access to him (I am afraid that is speaking in a bit of code there...sorry).
I can't think why Roland would sell anyway.
Is it really only about money? He is a cerebral man, and rich enough to indulge his whims for good or for not. He started a political party, he is reported to have an almost scholarly interest in the mathematical algorithms that can be related to football, he talks about the cultural aspect of a football match experience, he buys many clubs, muses on youth development, and a new footballing business model, he is interested in innovation and experimentation.
I don't think he is only motivated by the balance sheet, there is more to it, more to him than that in my opinion. If he had a chance to make a quick five million or so from buying and selling Charlton Athletic I don't think he would take it, and not because he sees personal wealth in the future, but because he is intrigued by what he might achieve.
However if my analysis is (a bit) right, we have lost autonomy as a stand alone football club. We seem to be an asset to be exploited, our youth system, infrastructure, standing in English football, and the loyalty of our fan base. It may be he cares about Charlton as part of his experiment, we may be the Bunsen burner heating up Standard Liege, we may also be expendable to him as seems to be the case where, for example, Reza was expendable to Standard Liege.
Or it may be he feels the same love for Charlton Athletic I do, or he is at least on his way to it.
I am finding it very hard to come to terms with the apparent fact that we don't have autonomy any more. I like to think that those committed to Charlton Athletic want only the best, and only for Charlton Athletic, and if that is what is happening I'm not getting it.
Anybody else out there who wants to buy us may be worse, and Roland holds the keys to the store, he does not have to sell, he can do what he likes, he has paid the piper.
@sethplum Your credibility is just fine in my eyes.
Seth - in many ways your credibility as a passionate, intelligent, articulate, open-minded Charlton supporter has been enhanced over the last few days. (contra to the perhaps well meant but nevertheless shallow transactional analysis stuff in another thread).
A lot of us a very upset about CP and suspicious of the sanity of the new model but not as convinced as you are about the feeder club stuff. Therefore we feel depressed & anxious but not desperate !
Seth you are one of the most credible read worthy posters on here. Just because I happen not to agree with you at the moment it still doesn't mean that I don't read with interest whenever you post.
I agree with your post above in the main except for the last third. (Ish)
Seth you are one of the most credible read worthy posters on here. Just because I happen not to agree with you at the moment it still doesn't mean that I don't read with interest whenever you post.
I agree with your post above in the main except for the last third. (Ish)
No credibility lost in my eyes.
Seconded, however much I disagree with some of what is said there are very few posters on here whose opinions I don't think are genuine and heartfelt (though of course only mine are totally correct ) and I am genuinely quite enjoying discussing the pros and cons of the new style Charlton from a theoretical/debating side of things.
Quite agree - you always give good reasons for what you say, so more power to you. I don't happen to agree, but I do understand your concerns and, the fact is that the plan RD has set out so far is definitively not a 'quick, throw money at it' one, so none of us are going to be able to really judge if we are right or wrong for quite some long time, so you might prove to have been right all along!
Seth we all have our different journey to make over this new terrain. I have made it quickly because I work in change management albeit a different industry. I have no objection to different opinions and perceptions of the reality and unfolding events but I have a problem with mainstream media sensationalised... I understand your point about autonomy but we had none under the last owners and they were out of cash. RD is reported to have considered offers for Liege - maybe he sells but I don't think that changes things for us. And I expect he will sell us in 3-5 years when he has "built value" whatever that means. We all agree that the only value at CAFC commercially is to be in the Premier League or at least close to it - so the rational assumption is that he would want CAFC to survive this season and push on next. What is confusing is that he is not pursuing survival at all costs because that contradicts his values and his way of operating. And because Kermorgant went and no serious money spent on a replacement people are naturally sceptical. All we can do is watch the games coming thick and fast - look for results, team selection and number of chances to see if there is an improvement. And the loan window is still open so will the new coach get additional players? I repeat what I have seen and written elsewhere that if we were a complete puppet club then all 6 January arrivals would have featured last night and not 2 in the team and 2 unused subs. Not long to wait for the next instalment.
Comments
Just thinking desperately now....
Season chips in a tenner we'll have err about sixty quid I reckon.
I've bought one but apparently Ivor Bailey is going to get it if today's mail out is anything to go by. Chuck my tenner in Ivor. Cheers mate.
He's not an idiot so I guess we just have to see what happens from here
Cannot see the sort of quorum amongst the support needed to effect RD in any way, at the moment.
I'm not sure how much of this you've read, (and there's a lot so wouldn't expect it) but it's worrying RD has pushed out Powell because Powell refused to play who RD wanted.
RD wanted Powell to be a "yes man" and to be a part of his horrendous networking strategy and he wasn't getting that.
A change like that would be bad for us and that looks like the direction it's heading in.
It would take many thousands of fans acting in concert for RD to even pay attention, much less act, and despite what the more passionate/vociferous/deranged [delete as appropriate] fans on here may think, there really is that much discontent amongst fans at large about RD's management right now.
I stand by what R.D's doing is wrong for modern football, people from the outside in can see this, fans of other club within this 'network' can see this, but a lot of Charlton fans want to stink blinkers over there eyes and hope for the best. I will be eating humble pie for the rest of my life if we get into the PL any time soon. Not a hope.
However I will report on the rumour that I heard from several people last night that there are indeed still people out there who would buy Charlton Athletic.
Now this is with the caveat regarding who, how much, and the idea that there are always some people somewhere prepared to buy football clubs.
I have also been told that to propose anything to Roland means that you have to gain access to him (I am afraid that is speaking in a bit of code there...sorry).
I can't think why Roland would sell anyway.
Is it really only about money? He is a cerebral man, and rich enough to indulge his whims for good or for not. He started a political party, he is reported to have an almost scholarly interest in the mathematical algorithms that can be related to football, he talks about the cultural aspect of a football match experience, he buys many clubs, muses on youth development, and a new footballing business model, he is interested in innovation and experimentation.
I don't think he is only motivated by the balance sheet, there is more to it, more to him than that in my opinion. If he had a chance to make a quick five million or so from buying and selling Charlton Athletic I don't think he would take it, and not because he sees personal wealth in the future, but because he is intrigued by what he might achieve.
However if my analysis is (a bit) right, we have lost autonomy as a stand alone football club. We seem to be an asset to be exploited, our youth system, infrastructure, standing in English football, and the loyalty of our fan base. It may be he cares about Charlton as part of his experiment, we may be the Bunsen burner heating up Standard Liege, we may also be expendable to him as seems to be the case where, for example, Reza was expendable to Standard Liege.
Or it may be he feels the same love for Charlton Athletic I do, or he is at least on his way to it.
I am finding it very hard to come to terms with the apparent fact that we don't have autonomy any more. I like to think that those committed to Charlton Athletic want only the best, and only for Charlton Athletic, and if that is what is happening I'm not getting it.
Anybody else out there who wants to buy us may be worse, and Roland holds the keys to the store, he does not have to sell, he can do what he likes, he has paid the piper.
Seth - in many ways your credibility as a passionate, intelligent, articulate, open-minded Charlton supporter has been enhanced over the last few days. (contra to the perhaps well meant but nevertheless shallow transactional analysis stuff in another thread).
A lot of us a very upset about CP and suspicious of the sanity of the new model but not as convinced as you are about the feeder club stuff. Therefore we feel depressed & anxious but not desperate !
I agree with your post above in the main except for the last third. (Ish)
No credibility lost in my eyes.
I understand your point about autonomy but we had none under the last owners and they were out of cash.
RD is reported to have considered offers for Liege - maybe he sells but I don't think that changes things for us. And I expect he will sell us in 3-5 years when he has "built value" whatever that means.
We all agree that the only value at CAFC commercially is to be in the Premier League or at least close to it - so the rational assumption is that he would want CAFC to survive this season and push on next.
What is confusing is that he is not pursuing survival at all costs because that contradicts his values and his way of operating. And because Kermorgant went and no serious money spent on a replacement people are naturally sceptical.
All we can do is watch the games coming thick and fast - look for results, team selection and number of chances to see if there is an improvement. And the loan window is still open so will the new coach get additional players?
I repeat what I have seen and written elsewhere that if we were a complete puppet club then all 6 January arrivals would have featured last night and not 2 in the team and 2 unused subs.
Not long to wait for the next instalment.