I was firmly in the Powell out group, not because I don't like the man, in fact hes a huge hero in my eyes, but I felt he was tactically inept, played defensive, percentage football and made many wrong decisions in games. I felt he had under performed and though he had reasonably tough circumstances, bottom of the league and lowest goal tally cannot be overlooked.
I am not yet concerned about my club, and will only be concerned when/if we get rid of young talent at no financial gain to the club.
If we move stadium, I will only be concerned if we share or move away from SE London
If we sell our best players, I will only be concerned if it's to RD teams/direct rivals
If we get relegated, I won't be concerned at all, it happens and sometimes it kickstarts a new era
The only way I can look at it is something had to change at the club, (not the sacking this is refrence too) but the whole way it was being run
we had years of miss management by RM and tht resulted in the need to sell to two bob tony and market stall slater
then they had to go as it was clear they didn't have a bean once cash done one
so along came RD
Powell was always going to be got rid of either this season or next and that was never in doubt
So far I still have not seen anything that suggests that the RD way wont work, (not saying it will either)
I blame Yann as much as RD for him going
I really don't like timing of Powelly going or the way it has transpired that it has happened
Powelly should've either said to RD I aint doing that from the off or RD should've told him sorry but you must go on the day he took over
I think Powelly is a gentleman, an honourable man and it has been a privilege to have had him as our mgr in fact I would go as far to say an honour
I am glad Powelly was principled enough to say no I wont pick who you say as I would expect no more from a decent human being and a real Charlton man
He will bounce back and ultimately will get a gig that gets him to the prem, if backed with cash and the freedom to manage powell will win that's not in doubt
As for us we are where we are and who is to say RD has a plan that can work or it cant
We are bottom of the league not because of him but because with the players we have chris could get no more from them, we don't create enough chances we are fearful attacking wide, we don't gamble enough , now this may be Chris's fault only now will we see there are plenty of games left to get out of trouble, the way the players capitulated sunday was scandalous and not acceptable something had to change and that was not going to be RD , like I have said I don't like the way its transpired I wish it was different but we are where we are
The question is NLA, who's it going to work for? If, as it feels today, we're little more than a feeder club then I'd take a mismanaged club back in a heartbeat. If the owner wants comedy keepers played at the cost of our results and league position, then he cares nothing about us and that can't end well for those of us who have a lifetime invested in Charlton. Terrible day, not so much for the Powell sacking since that was inevitable, but for what it reveals about our future.
For me, today shows that RD is not an honourable man nor one of the truth. "We want Powell to be our head coach for years to come", "Each club must stand alone". It's bullshit, and today light was shed upon it.
Unless CogiTraining involves some kind of 15 minute, fully-invasive procedure, like a Laser Eye Surgery for the football brain, then our Jose ain't got a chance in hell of getting what's left of our "team" playing the kind of football that will keep us up. It ain't going to happen.
Many people hated Slater and TJ but I still got the feeling they respected our club, its history and understood the predicament we were in when Powell was hired.
Roland, on the other hand, just sees us as Liege B which is very disrespectful, especially when we have the potential to be a far, far bigger club (if we aren't already).
TJ and Slater actually had a decent enough plan on the football side when they had Cash's cash in my opinion. I think Cash deserves more of our anger, but rich people can choose how they spend their money!
It's a brilliantly written article as you would expect from such a renowned journalist but is what he says speculation or fact?
As far as I can tell the comment by RD along the lines of '...don't rule out any Charlton players going to Liege...' has been interpreted as 'Charlton is Liege's feeder club'. I'm not sure he meant that and he would be a fool to ignore the financial return of Charlton in the Premiership.
Has RD ever explicitly said that CAFC will be SL's feeder club?
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? I urge you to watch the video the BBC made interviewing Roland and the SL guy, the link is on a couple of threads.
Posted this on the Powell sacked thread, but more appropriate here. Sorry for double post.
Look, it really doesn't matter what his motives are, Martin Samuels has written a piece which sets out well the case against RD and his plan. Yes, there is some bias but there are also some irrefutable realities.
If he wants the fans on board, RD really needs to come out with the case FOR the plan. He has so far been somewhat inconsistent. For example, saying that all his clubs are independent entities who simply share the synergies of european scouting networks, top class medical facilities etc, and that it is impossible to "love one of you children more than the others" on the one hand - and then saying that Charlton's best players could be "sold" to Liege and instructing his manager to play Liege reserves. Unless Duchatelet has been seriously misquoted, either way, this is inconsistent. What's the real truth Roland? I doubt he will ever tell us, so we will have to draw our own conclusions from his actions, as the rest of this season and the next unfolds.
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? When that clown Thuram-Ulien runs out at the Valley tonight, with the new manager at RD's instructions having relegated Ben Hamer to the subs bench (a goalkeeper who is being chased by a number of Premiership clubs at the moment according to speculation in today's papers) will that convince you all is not well?
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? I urge you to watch the video the BBC made interviewing Roland and the SL guy, the link is on a couple of threads.
Seth, I've already watched it many times & to me it doesn't come across in that way at all. They are just talking about moving players around the group - which IS one of the core principles of RD's plan - & the SL guy is talking from a SL perspective, so of course he's talking about players moving from Charlton to SL. We've already seen players move the other way & if they had been interviewing anybody else you would have got an alternative perspective.
RD would not pay the best part of 20 million pounds to buy a "feeder" club languishing in Division 1. There are far cheaper ways of setting up a "feeder" club in England, if that was what he actually wanted. Also, as I understand it, RD has already indicated that he would be prepared to sell SL for 60 million Euros, having already turned down an offer of 50 million. So if he does sell it, where would that leave all the other teams in the group if their sole purpose was to "feed" players to SL?
The whole concept is total nonsense & is based on nothing more than two guys talking in a language that is not their first language & therefore subject to misunderstanding.
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Before Recent events I was happy to think that way, and am still trying to.
Firstly were not being told much and actions speak louder than words, especially when that's all you have to evaluate. Even if you put aside the emotional aspect of sacking of CP. The immediate (ie obviously already planned) appointment of a man who is clearly a technical coach and not a manager, who has not much if any managing pedigree and none outside his home countries tinpot leagues. Who wasn't deemed good enough by RD himself to manage a team with bigger resources in a less competitive league; then it is natural that people are seeing it as a realistic concern. And that's without arguments over whether our squad has been strengthened or weakened and why did we spend lots of money on a kid clearly not ready when we have issues that need addressing now? And another kid here for experience that probably won't be staying.
I hope you're right, it might well be all paranoid rubbish. But Dismissing so readily the idea as ridiculous speculation can just as easily be argued as having the proverbial head in the sand.
The thing is, even if we were in the Premier League, your best chance of playing Champions League football would be to leave Charlton, be it Liege or one of the top 4, so that's not really for dispute.
What is for dispute is the idea we're a feeder club, at no point has anyone from Starnix said that, so it's become an article of faith for some based on how you viewed the BBC interview. What we've seen is a commitment to a strong youth policy and a stated aim to get a Cat 1 academy, the plans are now with the council, so hopefully progress quickly.
I have a lot of sympathy for the RD approach that the club is run on sound financial basis and we don't dope with money we don't have or borrow, whether that will work will be seen in the next few years, and whether having a few players from the network will support that.
I'm sad Powell has gone, I thought he was a great man, and with the right backing will do well, but we're being run in a different way now, and if the guy keeping the club financially sound wants it run his way, you have to respect that. I hope Riga gets us out of the bottom 3, it's doable.
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? When that clown Thuram-Ulien runs out at the Valley tonight, with the new manager at RD's instructions having relegated Ben Hamer to the subs bench (a goalkeeper who is being chased by a number of Premiership clubs at the moment according to speculation in today's papers) will that convince you all is not well?
What if he has already made it clear he won't sign a new contract? Would you still choose to play him
Very simple question for me, when I can't win a fight, I don't pick one. Take a look at the bigger picture. We are being asked to accept a future where we are financially secure, and have a constant flow of talented youngsters comin through, and we are aiming at the Premier league. Who of you can honestly produce a better plan ?
No, it disgusts me. I'd like to think that I'd have the strength of character for this to be unaffected by whether it is successful on the pitch, or financially aswell. The club means more to me than a balance sheet or even a league position. Fed up of the whole business, we've been owned by bumblers and wide boys and Ivan put up with that,but this is a bridge too far.
The thing is, even if we were in the Premier League, your best chance of playing Champions League football would be to leave Charlton, be it Liege or one of the top 4, so that's not really for dispute.
What is for dispute is the idea we're a feeder club, at no point has anyone from Starnix said that, so it's become an article of faith for some based on how you viewed the BBC interview. What we've seen is a commitment to a strong youth policy and a stated aim to get a Cat 1 academy, the plans are now with the council, so hopefully progress quickly.
I have a lot of sympathy for the RD approach that the club is run on sound financial basis and we don't dope with money we don't have or borrow, whether that will work will be seen in the next few years, and whether having a few players from the network will support that.
I'm sad Powell has gone, I thought he was a great man, and with the right backing will do well, but we're being run in a different way now, and if the guy keeping the club financially sound wants it run his way, you have to respect that. I hope Riga gets us out of the bottom 3, it's doable.
Hurrah! Sanity in a sea of absolute *********. Could not have put it better myself, entirely encapsulates what I think.
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? When that clown Thuram-Ulien runs out at the Valley tonight, with the new manager at RD's instructions having relegated Ben Hamer to the subs bench (a goalkeeper who is being chased by a number of Premiership clubs at the moment according to speculation in today's papers) will that convince you all is not well?
What if he has already made it clear he won't sign a new contract? Would you still choose to play him
Even if that were true, could you blame him if he's now refusing to sign? Has one even been offered to him? And yes I would pick him, anyone who thinks differently is delusional.
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? I urge you to watch the video the BBC made interviewing Roland and the SL guy, the link is on a couple of threads.
Seth, I've already watched it many times & to me it doesn't come across in that way at all. They are just talking about moving players around the group - which IS one of the core principles of RD's plan - & the SL guy is talking from a SL perspective, so of course he's talking about players moving from Charlton to SL. We've already seen players move the other way & if they had been interviewing anybody else you would have got an alternative perspective.
RD would not pay the best part of 20 million pounds to buy a "feeder" club languishing in Division 1. There are far cheaper ways of setting up a "feeder" club in England, if that was what he actually wanted. Also, as I understand it, RD has already indicated that he would be prepared to sell SL for 60 million Euros, having already turned down an offer of 50 million. So if he does sell it, where would that leave all the other teams in the group if their sole purpose was to "feed" players to SL?
The whole concept is total nonsense & is based on nothing more than two guys talking in a language that is not their first language & therefore subject to misunderstanding.
This is exactly as I see it. I wanted nothing more than for Chris Powell to stay with us for many years and lead us to success. I am gutted that he will not be with us but have the utmost respect for the man. He obviously, like many on here, does not believe in RD's 'network' concept, so fair play to him, he stuck to his principles.
However, I believe that the plan is innovative and has a good chance of success, although it will take a couple of seasons to see it ... as it did with Standard Liege. RD supports the growth of young players within an internal academy, as do many of us as proven with Valley Gold. Whilst I can see the arguments, and Martin Samuel outlined them very well, I do not accept that the plan is to turn us into a feeder club.
I cannot prove this, and obviously I am not 100% confident that it will work out. But something needs to change in football. Too many clubs are living beyond their means ... it is unsustainable. To be on a safe financial footing, with a group of promising young players coming through seems to me to be the right way forward.
Time will tell, but I am optimistic.
The moment RD purchased the club, I think many of us knew that Chris would not be with us at the end of the season ... unfortunately he has gone even sooner than we would have hoped. It is not the end of this club, just the end of a (wonderful) era. I support Charlton not one man.
Having said that, my eyes are not closed to the possible alternatives which many have highlighted. If indeed I am totally wrong and have misinterpreted RD's plans, and we do become a 'feeder club', I will be as vociferous as anyone in fighting against it. I just do not believe that this is his plan.
And despite everything, I just cannot wait until Saturday ... the perverseness of football might just mean that for once we get the result we need and want at the Den.
Very simple question for me, when I can't win a fight, I don't pick one. Take a look at the bigger picture. We are being asked to accept a future where we are financially secure, and have a constant flow of talented youngsters comin through, and we are aiming at the Premier league. Who of you can honestly produce a better plan ?
Are we aiming at the premier league though or the Begian pro league / Champions League?
The assertion that we are a feeder club is nothing more than ridiculous speculation. Why don't we wait and see what actually happens before condemning RD's plan?
Ridiculous speculation? When that clown Thuram-Ulien runs out at the Valley tonight, with the new manager at RD's instructions having relegated Ben Hamer to the subs bench (a goalkeeper who is being chased by a number of Premiership clubs at the moment according to speculation in today's papers) will that convince you all is not well?
What if he has already made it clear he won't sign a new contract? Would you still choose to play him
To be honest, I would. For the simple reason if we are to have any chance of staying up, we need our best players on the field, not on the bench.
And anyway, if the club were going to offer him a new contract, presumably they would have done it at the same time as Wiggins was offered one.
I just don't get the mass hysteria here these days. You get people with snippets of gossip and mostly just that....gossip, and two or three pages on it's been turned from gossip to unfounded fact and then you get numpties arguing the toss about pure fiction. I liked CP, nice guy. RD has stumped up his cash and bought us.....he looks at the club first hand and decides after a month that it needs a change of direction, so he makes his choice and decides to relieve CP of duties.....which is his prerogative. It was never going to rest easy with all of us fans, but it's the way things go in the football world. Chris will move on and with 80% of the fans good wishes. I've not seen any hard evidence of RD tampering with the team selection, but he must have asked serious questions as to why some of the recent imports were not playing when it was so obvious the incumbents werent up to the task but were picked regardless....I know I would have been asking questions if it was my money. So much of what we read here is unsubstantiated. Everyone seems to take random bits of information as hard evidence. The fact is, we don't really know all the facts and probably never will. I cannot in my wildest dreams imagine that we are worse off than we were under the last regime, therefore, take a chill pill and give the new regime a fighting chance. Plenty of time later to shoot them down in flames later if it goes pear shaped. I don't care deeply who manages us or owns us as long as we are competitive and give it a go.....sadly, we haven't seen any real spirit this season and CP paid the ultimate price.....he won't be the first and he won't be the last. Just get on with supporting the club and forget all the politics.We are not in administration, we aren't about to go under.....let's stop all the stressing and give this new regime a go.
Comments
I am not yet concerned about my club, and will only be concerned when/if we get rid of young talent at no financial gain to the club.
If we move stadium, I will only be concerned if we share or move away from SE London
If we sell our best players, I will only be concerned if it's to RD teams/direct rivals
If we get relegated, I won't be concerned at all, it happens and sometimes it kickstarts a new era
For me, today shows that RD is not an honourable man nor one of the truth. "We want Powell to be our head coach for years to come", "Each club must stand alone". It's bullshit, and today light was shed upon it.
And by the way, isn't Richard Murray's position untenable right now?
Roland, on the other hand, just sees us as Liege B which is very disrespectful, especially when we have the potential to be a far, far bigger club (if we aren't already).
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2578563/It-stinks-great-club-like-Charlton-eighth-highest-attendance-English-football-history-turned-cheap-dumping-ground-MARTIN-SAMUEL.html
As far as I can tell the comment by RD along the lines of '...don't rule out any Charlton players going to Liege...' has been interpreted as 'Charlton is Liege's feeder club'. I'm not sure he meant that and he would be a fool to ignore the financial return of Charlton in the Premiership.
Has RD ever explicitly said that CAFC will be SL's feeder club?
Look, it really doesn't matter what his motives are, Martin Samuels has written a piece which sets out well the case against RD and his plan. Yes, there is some bias but there are also some irrefutable realities.
If he wants the fans on board, RD really needs to come out with the case FOR the plan. He has so far been somewhat inconsistent. For example, saying that all his clubs are independent entities who simply share the synergies of european scouting networks, top class medical facilities etc, and that it is impossible to "love one of you children more than the others" on the one hand - and then saying that Charlton's best players could be "sold" to Liege and instructing his manager to play Liege reserves. Unless Duchatelet has been seriously misquoted, either way, this is inconsistent. What's the real truth Roland? I doubt he will ever tell us, so we will have to draw our own conclusions from his actions, as the rest of this season and the next unfolds.
RD would not pay the best part of 20 million pounds to buy a "feeder" club languishing in Division 1. There are far cheaper ways of setting up a "feeder" club in England, if that was what he actually wanted. Also, as I understand it, RD has already indicated that he would be prepared to sell SL for 60 million Euros, having already turned down an offer of 50 million. So if he does sell it, where would that leave all the other teams in the group if their sole purpose was to "feed" players to SL?
The whole concept is total nonsense & is based on nothing more than two guys talking in a language that is not their first language & therefore subject to misunderstanding.
Firstly were not being told much and actions speak louder than words, especially when that's all you have to evaluate.
Even if you put aside the emotional aspect of sacking of CP. The immediate (ie obviously already planned) appointment of a man who is clearly a technical coach and not a manager, who has not much if any managing pedigree and none outside his home countries tinpot leagues. Who wasn't deemed good enough by RD himself to manage a team with bigger resources in a less competitive league; then it is natural that people are seeing it as a realistic concern. And that's without arguments over whether our squad has been strengthened or weakened and why did we spend lots of money on a kid clearly not ready when we have issues that need addressing now? And another kid here for experience that probably won't be staying.
I hope you're right, it might well be all paranoid rubbish. But Dismissing so readily the idea as ridiculous speculation can just as easily be argued as having the proverbial head in the sand.
playing Champions League football would be to leave Charlton, be it Liege or one of the top 4, so that's not really for dispute.
What is for dispute is the idea we're a feeder club, at no point has anyone from Starnix said that, so it's become an article of faith for some based on how you viewed the BBC interview. What we've seen is a commitment to a strong youth policy and a stated aim to get a Cat 1 academy, the plans are now with the council, so hopefully progress quickly.
I have a lot of sympathy for the RD approach that the club is run on sound financial basis and we don't dope with money we don't have or borrow, whether that will work will be seen in the next few years, and whether having a few players from the network will support that.
I'm sad Powell has gone, I thought he was a great man, and with the right backing will do well, but we're being run in a different way now, and if the guy keeping the club financially sound wants it run his way, you have to respect that. I hope Riga gets us out of the bottom 3, it's doable.
However, I believe that the plan is innovative and has a good chance of success, although it will take a couple of seasons to see it ... as it did with Standard Liege. RD supports the growth of young players within an internal academy, as do many of us as proven with Valley Gold. Whilst I can see the arguments, and Martin Samuel outlined them very well, I do not accept that the plan is to turn us into a feeder club.
I cannot prove this, and obviously I am not 100% confident that it will work out. But something needs to change in football. Too many clubs are living beyond their means ... it is unsustainable. To be on a safe financial footing, with a group of promising young players coming through seems to me to be the right way forward.
Time will tell, but I am optimistic.
The moment RD purchased the club, I think many of us knew that Chris would not be with us at the end of the season ... unfortunately he has gone even sooner than we would have hoped. It is not the end of this club, just the end of a (wonderful) era. I support Charlton not one man.
Having said that, my eyes are not closed to the possible alternatives which many have highlighted. If indeed I am totally wrong and have misinterpreted RD's plans, and we do become a 'feeder club', I will be as vociferous as anyone in fighting against it. I just do not believe that this is his plan.
And despite everything, I just cannot wait until Saturday ... the perverseness of football might just mean that for once we get the result we need and want at the Den.
And anyway, if the club were going to offer him a new contract, presumably they would have done it at the same time as Wiggins was offered one.