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Why did RD buy us?

edited January 2014 in General Charlton
Just intrigues me this whole situation. Seems to me that this scheme of buying multiple clubs around Europe works well for the parent club & weaker feeder clubs - so I can see the benefits for Standard Liege & say CZ Jena or Alcorcon - but the English Championship is a whole different ball game to the Hungarian League or a small team in the Spanish Second Division. I cannot understand really other than boosting the squad numbers - what the likes of Koc, Azradevic & even Thuram are bringing to us - other than tying up resources & adding more stress onto CP as he blaances a squad of his own & RD's players.

Is this plan to shift Standard fringe players it?

Has it been thought out much more than that?

Realistically we need serious money pumping in to the club to secure our place in the Championship next season & it's going to be a hell of a fight just to do that.

Does he have that kind of money? Sure he was able to turn things around at Liege, but he had the luxury of a half decent team in the first place upon which to build as opposed to the husk of Charlton Athletic he has inherited. How much money did he spend in turning Liege around.

Platitudes about youth development & improving match day experience is great - but what is the plan for the next 3 months.

Does he really have one - or has he been sold a dud bought on a whim to further this fantasy football network he has built up.
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Comments

  • I don't think anyones quite worked it out yet , he must love a challenge , and boy has he got one!
  • Totally agree oakster. I can't make sense of this takeover.
  • Outside of the fear of administration, it doesn't really feel much different to Slater and Jiminez. Sure we have a few loanees sat on the bench, but that isn't enough to keep us up.

    The early optimism is going to be completely gone in 3 days if we haven't signed anyone.
  • edited January 2014
    I can see how it's potentially great for Upjest say as Std. Liege are clearly a bigger team in a bigger league - so they (UD) benefit from this relationship in both directions. They can take the Standard Liege fringe players, & players in Hungary or coming to Europe via Hungary have an incentive to play well & step up the ladder to Liege.

    For us it's a different scenario - its highly doubtful we will attract British talent because of the Liege link as the incentive to go & play in the Juliper League isn't there.

    I could surmise that RD ultimately wants Standard to grow & become the clear leaders in Belgium & he needs a better class of farm club for the talented youngsters & fringe players that will come to Liege as their stature grows. No good farming out higher quality players to the German 3rd Division or whatever. So in effect its a tiered system that benefits Standard in the long terms. But what about us?
  • Its only been three weeks. Lets bump this thread up in a year or two maybe
  • cafctom said:

    Its only been three weeks. Lets bump this thread up in a year or two maybe

    I agree Tom - but still why did he buy us? How do we fit into the stable of clubs. Don't think there's anything wrong in trying to figure this out....
  • New car, caviar, four star daydream
    Think I'll buy me a football team
  • I still believe RD is a short term owner, we were heading for admin and a certain relegation. RD has stepped in, will stabalize the club in the championship this year and then sell us on. Nothing that has happened so far has changed my mind on that
  • edited January 2014
    His belief is that there is money to be made in football provided that you don't pay the players too much. He seems to think that he can move his assets around like pieces on a chess board, apparently not noticing that he is dealing with human beings that have emotions. History will decide if he is visionary or deluded, but right now his money making prospects aren't looking good.
  • His belief is that there is money to be made in football provided that you don't pay the players too much. He seems to think that he can move his assets around like pieces on a chess board, apparently not noticing that he is dealing with human beings that have emotions. History will decide if he is visionary or deluded.

    From HIS point of View it would make good sense.
    Lets take four of his teams... and although they are in different countries, they are all a league below each other. Liege being the top team. He could then potentially give us enough players for free from them that are not getting a game but are better than what we have to improve our team. Lets then say we get promoted with those players..... we are then worth more to sell than what he bought us for with minimum investment. In the mean time our players that are not getting in our team then move to the team that is in the next league below (all be it in a diff country) Again this help improve them with minimum investment and could potentially sell them for more than he bought them for. This would apply to the next team in the lower division.
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  • The flaw in this though is that there almost certainly isn't enough quality in the Liege outcasts to get us promoted.
  • edited January 2014

    I agree that he may well think this should be an effective business model. The flaw, as I see it, is that to stick footballers in hotel rooms, in a strange country with a different language does not seem to be a good way to motivate a player. Good for robots, not human beings. He is known to be a man who likes statistics and mathematical ideas and that is what worries me in addition to the quality issues.

    Absolutely right. However, the wholesale trafficking of young players will prove to be a test of the players' characters as much as the development of their footballing talents. Players these days are mercenaries, if not by their own inclination then at the behest of their agents, and the days of the young man serving his local club in a one-club career are far in the past.

    I've said it before - the critical figures in this whole scheme are the coaches and their support staff, who will have a vital role to play not only in nurturing talent but also in nurturing the individual, otherwise their technical expertise as trainers will count for nothing if they fail to care for those in their charge.
  • I still believe RD is a short term owner, we were heading for admin and a certain relegation. RD has stepped in, will stabalize the club in the championship this year and then sell us on. Nothing that has happened so far has changed my mind on that

    He's going to need to do something by making us a stabalized championship club because that is looking very tough challenge.
    We've got a long 3 days to get through. Then we will see what RD plan is.
  • "The history of the club ... Huh?"
    "The youth academy ... Huh"?
  • Oakster

    Right now, I have exactly the same doubts as you, both about what the general plan actually is, and whether it will work in practice (because lets not forget, it is almost as new for RD as it is for us. It is not the "Network" that has helped take Standard to the top of the Belgian league).

    There have been behind the scenes whispers to reassure us that we, rather than Standard, are the priority, because of the huge revenue boost that would come from promotion to the FAPL. It dwarfs what he can get even by ensuring Standard get to the UCL group stage (which is a big ask for them, given their Europa League performance). The trouble is that we have not seen any action in the transfer window to back this up.

    As for whether it is too early to ask this question, I disagree. Everybody will have their own way of taking their interest in CAFC, personally I want to know exactly how it is run as a business, because I see the direct relationship with what happens on the field. That's why I do my best to contribute to the Trust, because it is a group of fans who also think that way and try to build a clear constructive dialogue with owners about the direction of the Club. So, anyone else who thinks about these issues, please join the Trust.

  • What was the outcome of the recent meeting between CP and RD?
    I figured it was to discuss contracts and transfers.....so what's happening?
  • I recently posted on the Avram Grant thread that I could see him creating a football Business, run as a potential profit earner and healthy asset. This seems to be confirmed this morning in the Mail who talk about his owning 5 Clubs in 5 Countries, and wanting to bring it together as a profit centre. That should help us all to understand his motives.
  • Granpa said:

    I recently posted on the Avram Grant thread that I could see him creating a football Business, run as a potential profit earner and healthy asset. This seems to be confirmed this morning in the Mail who talk about his owning 5 Clubs in 5 Countries, and wanting to bring it together as a profit centre. That should help us all to understand his motives.

    That'll need more explanation. What is a profit centre?
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  • Give it a rest please it's only been 3 week the change will come at the end of the season/ start of next season. The club needs a big rebuild start with the pitch then if Powell gets a new contact or we get a new manager. I feel the new board have there work cut out as we are in a big mess and going could happen as well.Then that will descide if we give out new contact. I would like to keep some but there are a lot I would not.
  • edited January 2014
    Valley11 said:

    Granpa said:

    I recently posted on the Avram Grant thread that I could see him creating a football Business, run as a potential profit earner and healthy asset. This seems to be confirmed this morning in the Mail who talk about his owning 5 Clubs in 5 Countries, and wanting to bring it together as a profit centre. That should help us all to understand his motives.

    That'll need more explanation. What is a profit centre?
    You've got five clubs which are all registered businesses in their own right, and they have to file their accounts as separate national businesses, each one makes its own profit (or because this is football) its loss. Granpa is arguing that RD would not worry about the individual result if, consolidated across the group, he makes a profit.

    If that is his business plan, there are a number of implications and even more imponderables. And it has never been done before. There was the ENIC case but I am not sure if they treated their clubs as one profit centre.

    Let me know if I explained that OK. Its an important point which Granpa is raising here.

  • Have no idea what his plan is - does he?
  • It's amazing that most people seem to have his MO, and business strategy within weeks. As Prague Addick says Charlton are the team that will have the biggest revenue stream of all his teams if we're in the prem. Getting a few champ players on loan would make sense to me, but we'll see and even then how do we know transfer targets didn't slip through our fingers?
  • I don't know anything about Belgian tax laws, but seeing as we're now owned, in effect, by a Belgian company, could he offset our losses (say £7m) against the profits of his main business to avoid paying corporation tax?
  • can't believe he spent £20m on us to be in league 1 that's for sure...at the moment it's baffling to most as to why he bought us, however no one really knows what's going on behind the scenes right now - suspect we'll have a clearer picture come the weekend
  • Hold on, I thought it was all Chris Powells fault?
  • Accumulate to speculate? He seems to be developing a multi national corporation, losses and gains offset each other overall. Footballs Murdoch.
  • edited January 2014
    Perhaps he's after all of the value that owning multiple clubs can bring you, not merely a feeder pyramid style operation.

    *Replication: Liege seem to be churning out talent and winning. Replicate that elsewhere in the medium to long term at all your clubs and suddenly you hit it big. One of our coaches has gone back to Gillingham this week, is he making room for a new person?

    Perhaps the same can be applied for best practise across the network.

    *Bulk negotiation for sponsorship, services, etc

    *Economies from geography, it may be cheaper to produce talent in certain areas. What he has built is a network with operations in certain specific countries, why is that? Belgium is where he's from, England has the biggest rewards but what of the others?

    *Share squad players from loans or freebies to run a leaner operation: within the network and maybe you have a string of successful clubs

    Last in his list will be needing to buy talent, but if he's exhausted the above he's made a saving.


    And this is where the football realities start to bite.

    *Can you really commodotise players? Nationality may be a factor.

    *There won't actually be that much loaning across the network because the rules prohibit it to excess - matchday squad and limit from one club.

    *What if there is a rule change, there is a Championship level pan European competition planned, might multi ownership come a cropper with UEFA?

    *In Charlton's case there is whacking great hole in the roof and the club needs stabilising - they've said that is a priority, little sign of that so far.. do it wrong and it will cost you at least another £5m you didn't need to spend. The Championship and of course the Premiership are big nuts to crack though.


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