Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
But didn't we have some hope and enthusiasm during the first twelve matches of last season? I suppose you could say that was Slaters fault for not investing in the squad before the start of this season. Can't really put that down to commercial failings though can you?
Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
But didn't we have some hope and enthusiasm during the first twelve matches of last season? I suppose you could say that was Slaters fault for not investing in the squad before the start of this season. Can't really put that down to commercial failings though can you?
I don't fully agree because you can make a difference and the decline is a steep one, but following your logic I'm not sure how I or others are being held responsible for commercial performance in League One then? It's a complete fantasy to imagine Slater and Jimenez took action on the basis of commercial performance and a bit sad that some are so desperate to believe any old nonsense that's trotted out, even if the evidence contradicts it.
The paradox has always been that a regime that was wilfully bad at communication was nonetheless sensitive to what is thought and said about it, as is now being demonstrated.
Greatest Regret: Not focusing on commercial operation sooner That looks like a dig at you Airman
After the disaster of relegation to League One under the ludicrous tenure of Steve Waggott as chief exec, the club's position was retrieved by Peter Varney and Steve Kavanagh, who left in the summer of 2012 because of the way these people were behaving, not as a result of any commercial judgement made by them.
Which people? And how were they behaving specifically?
Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
But didn't we have some hope and enthusiasm during the first twelve matches of last season? I suppose you could say that was Slaters fault for not investing in the squad before the start of this season. Can't really put that down to commercial failings though can you?
I don't fully agree because you can make a difference and the decline is a steep one, but following your logic I'm not sure how I or others are being held responsible for commercial performance in League One then? It's a complete fantasy to imagine Slater and Jimenez took action on the basis of commercial performance and a bit sad that some are so desperate to believe any old nonsense that's trotted out, even if the evidence contradicts it.
I don't disagree.A commercial operation is only as good as the product it's trying to shift. After the shit they've been through over the last few years Charlton supporters are a tough crowd.
Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
But didn't we have some hope and enthusiasm during the first twelve matches of last season? I suppose you could say that was Slaters fault for not investing in the squad before the start of this season. Can't really put that down to commercial failings though can you?
The on-field decline started once Cash pulled the pin, after that Powell plugged the gaps as best he could but we have been exposed this season where our squad is smaller and weaker than last season.
The close season striker debacle has really cost us, we had no funds to spend - because we had no cash - so had to eventually bring in Church on a freebie and Sordell on loan and we haven't recovered from that really.
To be reasonable about it I don't suppose there was much Slater/Jiminez could do about that as they were not the ones with the cash anyway.
Only the people inside the club really know about the off field stuff, so that's me out.
Home support (published attendances less away fans) is down 13 per cent this season over the first 12 matches compared to last season. It's an imperfect measure for various reasons, but it's not an inaccurate benchmark of where the club is commercially.
Airman I see your other posts and perhaps another time (on or offline) but what you say here is key! Home support is down this season due to league position, second season syndrome (same at Hudds and Wednesday) prices up and this is the bit where we all agree: absolutely zero comms and support from the board. The irony is that if the board had funded the squad to keep Fuller on or replace with an equivalent talent then we would: 1) be in a better league position 2) crowds would be better 3) the new owners might be in a position to contemplate a drive to 6th position 4) they would have achieved a better sale price! Perhaps by as much as £4 or 5M
but fuck it! we are where we are... CAFC lives on and we can all aim for a blinding 2014/15 season
This is a new dawn or perhaps "won't get fooled again" and there's a;ways the cup?!
More seriously if the club (and perhaps Trust?) get it right then attendances up next season? Who knows
Airman; Who cares about communication? If our revenue is crap because the commercial operation lags behind the likes of Palace and we can't compete due to financial fair play we've got big problems. Somebody should take responsibility for this. At least Slater and Jiminez admit they made a mistake not dealing with the problem sooner. Perhaps rather than criticise the people who poured millions into the club you should reflect on your part in the shortcomings in the commercail department
As far as I am aware neither Steve Bradshaw nor Ben Kemsell have been brought in to replace Airman Brown, which suggests Airman's part in the 'shortcomings' are pretty negligible. People are saying good things about Ben Kemsell. He sounds like an asset to CAFC. But it ought to have been possible to bring in someone like Ben without that entailing the rancorous demolition of an entire team which has worked long and hard for many years for CAFC.
As per my other post just now, what's done is done. There is a management structure put in place over the last two years and now there are new owners with an as yet to be announced board / executive structure let alone the commercial and back office. People have their theories about the past but perhaps time to move on and back the club? We have had the darkest hour (before the dawn) but there is some serious heavy lifting to be done!
Except this time the owner has taken a club to the top of the league in Belgium as opposed to being part of a team at Newcastle for a brief period. And the owner is worth €1/2 Bn as opposed to knowing someone in that league. From a supporters Trust perspective it is all about sustainability - we are not Birmingham, Palace or Portsmouth falling over and losing tens of millions and the club losses are coming down. I sit opposite a West Ham fan at work these days and they have serious problems! Sounds like they have spent far to much time dreaming about their Olympic stadium and they forgot about staying in the Premier League lol!
More revenues, lower costs and better players all makes loadsa sense. But as a certain ex-director said to me last summer "this ain't championship manager!". I could write loads on here about stats, models and solutions but it would all be bollocks because the reality is that business change management is on the ground and analyisis with real numbers - it's not a fight on a message board. What would be helpful is to learn the lessons of the meteoric rise in attendances in the 90s and then help the club to apply them today with the current situation: bigger stadium and empty seats, 21st century IT and still the same loyal following that wants to will our team up the shagging table starting 3pm vs t'Barnsley!
More revenues, lower costs and better players all makes loadsa sense. But as a certain ex-director said to me last summer "this ain't championship manager!". I could write loads on here about stats, models and solutions but it would all be bollocks because the reality is that business change management is on the ground and analyisis with real numbers - it's not a fight on a message board. What would be helpful is to learn the lessons of the meteoric rise in attendances in the 90s and then help the club to apply them today with the current situation: bigger stadium and empty seats, 21st century IT and still the same loyal following that wants to will our team up the shagging table starting 3pm vs t'Barnsley!
The point is that as a club we wrote the f***ing book on how to do this - other clubs that run group bookings, coach services, Football for a Fiver, etc, copied us. I've never argued it was rocket science, but we were the trailblazers and it did require passion and commitment to drive through the institutional resistance and it isn't just about having the right ideas. It requires implementation and delivery by people who believe in it, understand the market, and won't retreat into the lazy assumption that higher prices always equal greater revenue and a sale at less than full price is always made at the cost of the difference. The Trust can have as many good ideas as it likes, but if the club staff don't buy into them they won't work to their potential. That was exactly the lesson of Target 10,000 in 1994-96.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
It's a pretty clear answer actually.
Not when you're pissed.
But I still maintain that a yes or no would have sufficed. No need for the rest.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
It's a pretty clear answer actually.
Not when you're pissed.
But I still maintain that a yes or no would have sufficed. No need for the rest.
I think you or I would have responded in much the same way if us and our valued former colleagues had been sweepingly and unjustifiably referred to as "dead wood" and worse higher up the thread.
I saw the SLP article as a Tone Huffington type spin and writing their own legacy for their future involvement in the football business. Michael Slater's voice comes through a lot more strongly than TJ's article. It does appear that MS handles the withdrawal of the KC money by attempting to deflecting focus onto the operating side. I can understand why AB and other former staff would find that upsetting. It would have been better to skate over it but I guess that's not MS style.
The first year and half was great, and text book turn around of management and playing staff. If things had not gone pear shaped then Charlton were on track to do a Southampton. Post KC and the evident break down of key business relationships, it was always going to be a struggle, and seeking to deflect blame doesn't help. MS says that there was a lot of approaches to the club for sale. Maybe if they were not trying to sell at an inflated price then a deal could have been done ? Price was way to high and they held on too long.
I guess we will never know why the mystery bidder dropped out at the last minute. Water under the bridge now. Lets hope the second best choice buyer is good for the club.
TJ and MS did though without doubt cut the cloth accordingly, and did ship out dead wood on the playing side at first, we got rid of a whole team load of dead wood shite
in the offices and the mgmt. side, I think the removal of such key staff was a big factor in why we were not purchased earlier, you don't invest in business that removes and changes its senior mgmt team and key staff in such a quick manor it shows that there is a problem
however there is a good chance that RD would've wanted more of his own team involved in cafc so whos to say that they might have different ideas that a different style of person is required , than what we had previously in roles, so there for it may be a good thing that it happened
its a total new era for the club
players manager directors employees
no one is safe right now work hard do your best and hope that the new regieme value your worth and your way of working
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
It's a pretty clear answer actually.
Not when you're pissed.
But I still maintain that a yes or no would have sufficed. No need for the rest.
I think you or I would have responded in much the same way if us and our valued former colleagues had been sweepingly and unjustifiably referred to as "dead wood" and worse higher up the thread.
I know I would.
Since this question seems to intrigue people I'll say this. Having been involved in the issue of developing support (and ticket revenue) since the early 1990s and worked on it inside and outside the club, I have accumulated a lot of knowledge. I'm willing now, as I always have been, to advise the club on the basis of that knowledge on a voluntary basis if it's felt I have anything to offer. I'm not appealing for that opportunity in any way at all, but if my input is wanted it will always be available.
So Rik, are you going try and get your job back under the new regime?
That's not my point or my intention, but I will not have the record of people who worked hard and successfully for the club in very difficult times trashed.
Very loaded and extremely odd answer to a very straightforward question.
It's a pretty clear answer actually.
Not when you're pissed.
But I still maintain that a yes or no would have sufficed. No need for the rest.
I think you or I would have responded in much the same way if us and our valued former colleagues had been sweepingly and unjustifiably referred to as "dead wood" and worse higher up the thread.
I know I would.
The point was (albeit badly phrased), is that is what the last board thought with their sweep of staff. Why else was there such a purge?
TJ and MS did though without doubt cut the cloth accordingly, and did ship out dead wood on the playing side at first, we got rid of a whole team load of dead wood shite
in the offices and the mgmt. side, I think the removal of such key staff was a big factor in why we were not purchased earlier, you don't invest in business that removes and changes its senior mgmt team and key staff in such a quick manor it shows that there is a problem
however there is a good chance that RD would've wanted more of his own team involved in cafc so whos to say that they might have different ideas that a different style of person is required , than what we had previously in roles, so there for it may be a good thing that it happened
its a total new era for the club
players manager directors employees
no one is safe right now work hard do your best and hope that the new regieme value your worth and your way of working
ooooopppppssss heads will role for todays shambles
TJ and MS did though without doubt cut the cloth accordingly, and did ship out dead wood on the playing side at first, we got rid of a whole team load of dead wood shite
in the offices and the mgmt. side, I think the removal of such key staff was a big factor in why we were not purchased earlier, you don't invest in business that removes and changes its senior mgmt team and key staff in such a quick manor it shows that there is a problem
however there is a good chance that RD would've wanted more of his own team involved in cafc so whos to say that they might have different ideas that a different style of person is required , than what we had previously in roles, so there for it may be a good thing that it happened
its a total new era for the club
players manager directors employees
no one is safe right now work hard do your best and hope that the new regieme value your worth and your way of working
ooooopppppssss heads will role for todays shambles
I think this month will tell us a lot about the new owners way of operating. Others have already pointed out the current management structure. Richard Murray is still on the board and now he is Chair (again) - he will have the history on both the comms side and the pitch. Let us see what happens next?
Comments
I suppose you could say that was Slaters fault for not investing in the squad before the start of this season.
Can't really put that down to commercial failings though can you?
I don't disagree.A commercial operation is only as good as the product it's trying to shift.
After the shit they've been through over the last few years Charlton supporters are a tough crowd.
The close season striker debacle has really cost us, we had no funds to spend - because we had no cash - so had to eventually bring in Church on a freebie and Sordell on loan and we haven't recovered from that really.
To be reasonable about it I don't suppose there was much Slater/Jiminez could do about that as they were not the ones with the cash anyway.
Only the people inside the club really know about the off field stuff, so that's me out.
Home support is down this season due to league position, second season syndrome (same at Hudds and Wednesday) prices up and this is the bit where we all agree: absolutely zero comms and support from the board.
The irony is that if the board had funded the squad to keep Fuller on or replace with an equivalent talent then we would:
1) be in a better league position
2) crowds would be better
3) the new owners might be in a position to contemplate a drive to 6th position
4) they would have achieved a better sale price! Perhaps by as much as £4 or 5M
but fuck it! we are where we are... CAFC lives on and we can all aim for a blinding 2014/15 season
This is a new dawn or perhaps "won't get fooled again" and there's a;ways the cup?!
More seriously if the club (and perhaps Trust?) get it right then attendances up next season? Who knows
Except this time the owner has taken a club to the top of the league in Belgium as opposed to being part of a team at Newcastle for a brief period. And the owner is worth €1/2 Bn as opposed to knowing someone in that league.
From a supporters Trust perspective it is all about sustainability - we are not Birmingham, Palace or Portsmouth falling over and losing tens of millions and the club losses are coming down. I sit opposite a West Ham fan at work these days and they have serious problems! Sounds like they have spent far to much time dreaming about their Olympic stadium and they forgot about staying in the Premier League lol!
More revenues, lower costs and better players all makes loadsa sense. But as a certain ex-director said to me last summer "this ain't championship manager!". I could write loads on here about stats, models and solutions but it would all be bollocks because the reality is that business change management is on the ground and analyisis with real numbers - it's not a fight on a message board. What would be helpful is to learn the lessons of the meteoric rise in attendances in the 90s and then help the club to apply them today with the current situation: bigger stadium and empty seats, 21st century IT and still the same loyal following that wants to will our team up the shagging table starting 3pm vs t'Barnsley!
But I still maintain that a yes or no would have sufficed. No need for the rest.
I know I would.
The first year and half was great, and text book turn around of management and playing staff. If things had not gone pear shaped then Charlton were on track to do a Southampton. Post KC and the evident break down of key business relationships, it was always going to be a struggle, and seeking to deflect blame doesn't help. MS says that there was a lot of approaches to the club for sale. Maybe if they were not trying to sell at an inflated price then a deal could have been done ? Price was way to high and they held on too long.
I guess we will never know why the mystery bidder dropped out at the last minute. Water under the bridge now. Lets hope the second best choice buyer is good for the club.
in the offices and the mgmt. side, I think the removal of such key staff was a big factor in why we were not purchased earlier, you don't invest in business that removes and changes its senior mgmt team and key staff in such a quick manor it shows that there is a problem
however there is a good chance that RD would've wanted more of his own team involved in cafc so whos to say that they might have different ideas that a different style of person is required , than what we had previously in roles, so there for it may be a good thing that it happened
its a total new era for the club
players
manager
directors
employees
no one is safe right now work hard do your best and hope that the new regieme value your worth and your way of working
Why else was there such a purge?
ooooopppppssss heads will role for todays shambles