I'm quite happy, it's hard to justify to the wife and my daughters that I'm off to watch Charlton on Boxing day even when we are at home, this fixture just takes it out of the equation, it's no brainer.
no public transport = use Valley Express. I'm quite happy to be going to Yeovil on Boxing Day.
This is what I don't understand. When there's a will there's a way, there are other ways of getting to grounds, no one has posted on here asking if they could get a lift.
no public transport = use Valley Express. I'm quite happy to be going to Yeovil on Boxing Day.
Well I'm going on Valley Express too. Unlike you, I am not happy about it, not one little bit. I can't even take a flask of coffee with rum in it for fear of having the entire coach arrested. But I will be there. And I will be at Orient too, even though that also cocks up a lot of perfectly normal NYE plans, and for what good reason?
NSS
If everyone deserves a break, then that includes professional footballers. Not to mention the poor people who have to work in the shops that everyone piles off to on Boxing day
Heresy I know, but I'm (luckily have a car) quite looking forward to my road trip to Yeovil on Monday now the weather looks like it will be OK. A contrast to last year when PaddyP17 and I spent the best part of a day clearing snow and ice at the away approaches to the Valley only for that wanaker D'Urso to call it off. No Boxing day footie due to a power intoxicated self-serving arrogant referee with the sensitivity and intelligence of a dead cockroach...I bet his decision to ruin the day for 20k+ people provided him with a decent alternative to Viagra.
Through being a local busybody I have a small insight into the policing at Brentford and this would almost certainly be a local decision. It may not even have got to Borough Commander level (they have had a busy year and have a whole bunch of savings/cuts to deal with). It may not even get to the Borough Commander but be dealt with by the Liaison Officer for the club.
Consider the Chelsea/Fulham game. That probably counts as a very low impact game as far as policing is concerned. Fulham don't really have any kind of firm, not one that is going to go after Chelsea anyway. there'll be no pissed up northereners driving around and not knowing how to get home.And in the search for a quiet life, it's a good fixture I would have thought. Orient is in Newham I think, with shoppers all going to Westfield for the Sales. Perhaps it's in Waltham Forest, I can't be bothered checking, but anyway a tiny crowd on Boxing Day will be preferable.
Fair play to you for having a go. Yeovil is stupid. We could have got to, I dunno, Colchester.
Any decisions regarding police attendance at a game is managed by "duties" who work alongside senior management with the borough.
Through being a local busybody I have a small insight into the policing at Brentford and this would almost certainly be a local decision. It may not even have got to Borough Commander level (they have had a busy year and have a whole bunch of savings/cuts to deal with). It may not even get to the Borough Commander but be dealt with by the Liaison Officer for the club.
Consider the Chelsea/Fulham game. That probably counts as a very low impact game as far as policing is concerned. Fulham don't really have any kind of firm, not one that is going to go after Chelsea anyway. there'll be no pissed up northereners driving around and not knowing how to get home.And in the search for a quiet life, it's a good fixture I would have thought. Orient is in Newham I think, with shoppers all going to Westfield for the Sales. Perhaps it's in Waltham Forest, I can't be bothered checking, but anyway a tiny crowd on Boxing Day will be preferable.
Fair play to you for having a go. Yeovil is stupid. We could have got to, I dunno, Colchester.
no public transport = use Valley Express. I'm quite happy to be going to Yeovil on Boxing Day.
Well I'm going on Valley Express too. Unlike you, I am not happy about it, not one little bit. I can't even take a flask of coffee with rum in it for fear of having the entire coach arrested. But I will be there. And I will be at Orient too, even though that also cocks up a lot of perfectly normal NYE plans, and for what good reason?
NSS
If everyone deserves a break, then that includes professional footballers. Not to mention the poor people who have to work in the shops that everyone piles off to on Boxing day
I still believe that mate. Sales should be like the old days NEW YEAR SALES. Having a family now mate as much as I love it no football on Boxing Day would make life a lot easier.
Good grief, what a fuss about nothing. So you miss a game? Get over it! So you spot an alternative fixture? Just shifting the problem so some other poor sod cant make the game. Utterly unnecessary moaning for the sake of it. A look at the bigger picture would help. Sending an email ''disgusted of Tonbridge'' style, should really sort it out to your benefit!
no public transport = use Valley Express. I'm quite happy to be going to Yeovil on Boxing Day.
This is what I don't understand. When there's a will there's a way, there are other ways of getting to grounds, no one has posted on here asking if they could get a lift.
Meanwhile in Walsall on Boxing day...
Are they really bringing that many to walsall ?? I mean have they got trains going there ? They are mahoooosive
1. On Boxing Day, Wycombe play Exeter. I quote from your website: "One thing I feed into the computer in advance are the Boxing Day games, these are hand picked to ensure that travel is minimised because there is no public transport anywhere in England." Why did your fixture working group not do the obvious thing, and have Wycombe play Charlton while Yeovil played Exeter in a classic derby game?
Problem with this is that game is happening over the christmas period anyway, so I imagine they'll suggest that you do a little more research. On that day every other team has been matched up with someone reasonably close. We've got two London games out of the three and because of their remoteness Exeter and Yeovil are always going to be a problem for someone.
You are right, I see that Exeter play Yeovil on 2nd Jan. However, we are being asked to travel for four hours, on a day where there is no public transport. That is exceptional. And it is another issue. If the football authorities cared two figs about their customers they'd be making strong recommendations to the Government that the trains should be running. Its another thing that does my head in. We are the only country in Europe where nothing at all runs on the day after the Christmas celebration.
Wonder how many teams actually have a significantly shorter journey time to Exter than us?
With the exception of Yeovil, there are no other West Country teams - Plymouth, Torquay, the Brizzles, Cheltenham, Hereford, Swindon are all outside League 1. Maybe Bourenmouth, but having driven from Plymouth to Southampton in the past I know that's a bitch of a journey due to the Motorway option being far from the direct route and the route along the coast being a slow one. I would think that anyone north of Birmingham or along the M1 corridor would have just as long a journey to Exeter as Charlton. Maybe Wycombe would have been a sensible choice but as Morts says, Exeter's location and the current anomoly that sees all their near neighbours in different divisions means someone was always going to lumbered with an awkward joureny around Christmas. Hard luck it's us but I'm not convinced there was a significantly better option.
Good grief, what a fuss about nothing. So you miss a game? Get over it! So you spot an alternative fixture? Just shifting the problem so some other poor sod cant make the game. Utterly unnecessary moaning for the sake of it. A look at the bigger picture would help. Sending an email ''disgusted of Tonbridge'' style, should really sort it out to your benefit!
Who's missing a game? I'm going to both. The bigger picture is that the police have far too much unnecessary and unaccountable influence over fixtures, as do Sky; and we put up with the railways helping themselves to an extra day of holiday when most of the country seems to regard Boxing Day as an active rather than a quiet/religious day. All this happens because we just quietly accept it all, which makes the FL/police/Sky think we are perfectly happy to put up with all. The only way to show that you are not happy with it is to raise your hand and say something.
I am not going as it is too much time away from the family. This wouldn't have changed if there had been a train service running.
However, as much as I am disappointed that I'll be missing the Boxing Day fixture I can't help but wonder if you think the Police or the rail companies should fork out for excessive overtime to schedule games on Boxing Day (which is technically a Bank Holiday) for football fans benefit?
As I suspect you don't pay UK Tax, which pays for the Police salaries, and their overtime on Bank Holidays, it clearly doesn't make much difference to you, but I am more than happy for the Police to make decisions that save money while not endangering the pubic they are payed to protect.
As has been said, someone had to play them, and I would like to think that we are not so elitist that we think it should, automatically, be someone else.
As for Sky moving fixtures, we can't complain when we take their money for showing live football, when they choose to do just that.
I am not going as it is too much time away from the family. This wouldn't have changed if there had been a train service running.
However, as much as I am disappointed that I'll be missing the Boxing Day fixture I can't help but wonder if you think the Police or the rail companies should fork out for excessive overtime to schedule games on Boxing Day (which is technically a Bank Holiday) for football fans benefit?
As I suspect you don't pay UK Tax, which pays for the Police salaries, and their overtime on Bank Holidays, it clearly doesn't make much difference to you, but I am more than happy for the Police to make decisions that save money while not endangering the pubic they are payed to protect.
As has been said, someone had to play them, and I would like to think that we are not so elitist that we think it should, automatically, be someone else.
As for Sky moving fixtures, we can't complain when we take their money for showing live football, when they choose to do just that.
I think the issue with Sky is not that games and times are moved but that they have a habit of getting games changed relatively late and therefore inconveniencing people who have already bought match tickets and rail/air tickets and then find they can't make the re-aranged date.
Given the lack of transport on Boxing Day it also makes sense to schedule away games against teams that are relatively close - the problem however is that this year there are very few local derbies, we only have Brentford and Orient in London and that's it. Yeovil isn't a bad run all things considered - it's mostly motorway and A roads from South East London, but for most people it's going to be a five-six hour round trip with two hours chucked in for the game. Also many clubs like to avoid local debies on Boxing Day - on the basis that it usually attracts a decent crowd whoever the away team are, the deby matches can be saved for another day.
Firstly, as I pointed out on the Euro thread, I pay UK personal income tax (and corporation tax on what is effectively my personal income too.). I also have a vote in national elections and am proud to use it. I listen to the Today programme in the morning and PM in the evening. Welcome to the world of a Briton in Europe.
Secondly you are obviously not aware that THE CLUBS PAY THE COST OF POLICING. The clubs have no control either over how much police are deemed necessary. I can't imagine, nor can you, that there will be a sniff of trouble at Orient but if the police decide there could be, and staff accordingly. there isnt anything the clubs can do.
As Ross pointed out above, some police are perfectly happy to staff up on BD, as Chelsea are playing Fulham. What we then learnt from Airman - and I was surprised about this - it is not a Met-wide policy, but the whim of a local commander. So it seems that Chelsea- Fulham is OK on BD, but not Orient - Charlton. Which you must admit is absurd, and we should expect a more reasonable, consistent and consultative approach from the police.
Re Sky, I agree that to a large extent we are stuffed because "we" take the money. However the Orient game at 5.20 on NYE is ridiculous. Who is going to watch that? And you might be surprised how little money the clubs get from Sky at this level. It may not be profitable for them to have live games. Airman will know more than me. But again it's right to ask the question, and make sure the FL make sensible decisions. They too are paid from our money. If there were no paying spectators there would not be an FL.
great letter Prague, so many inconsistencies in the way fixture decisions seemed to be made, and hardline police decisions can be quickly adjusted when Mr Sky comes calling.
You don't ask, you don't find out why. Ignore the (few) who don't see it that way.
Secondly you are obviously not aware that THE CLUBS PAY THE COST OF POLICING. The clubs have no control either over how much police are deemed necessary. I can't imagine, nor can you, that there will be a sniff of trouble at Orient but if the police decide there could be, and staff accordingly. there isnt anything the clubs can do.
I think that the clubs only pay for policing in their footprint: in the ground and car park. The majority of the cost of football policing is borne by the tax payer. It was debated recently in parliament (an MP was suggesting the Premiership should pick up the whole tab).
I wasn't aware that the clubs pay the Policing costs, however I suspect that there would be costs not covered by the club's arrangement. I'm sure there was a report about the cost of the Old Firm derby that was not covered by the clubs's contribution.
I do agree that there is no benefit, for us, to the Orient kick off time, nor do I think there will be any trouble, however, I suspect that there will be something of an audience for it as it is a London derby with the league leaders (probably) and a play off challenger. Also if we were going to play Orient on Boxing Day are you suggesting that we be away to Yeovil on NYE? If not when do we play them and who do that play on those two dates?
I have no issues with you questioning the FL, but I, personally, believe that there was never going to be a solution to the trio of Christmas fixtures when Yeovil are so isolated from almost every club in the division. If someone has to play them over the holiday period (assuming that don't have to do two long journeys) then the FL can't win.
Maybe Bourenmouth, but having driven from Plymouth to Southampton in the past I know that's a bitch of a journey due to the Motorway option being far from the direct route and the route along the coast being a slow one. I would think that anyone north of Birmingham or along the M1 corridor would have just as long a journey to Exeter as Charlton.
Even with that in mind X, Bournemouth are playing Yeovil in the NY game. The problem with all of this is the league has clearly attempted to do all of the things that they've been criticised for in this thread. Yes, it's horrendously inconvenient for Charlton fans but all of the obvious fixtures that the two geographical outliers could have had, were arranged.
Secondly you are obviously not aware that THE CLUBS PAY THE COST OF POLICING. The clubs have no control either over how much police are deemed necessary. I can't imagine, nor can you, that there will be a sniff of trouble at Orient but if the police decide there could be, and staff accordingly. there isnt anything the clubs can do.
I think that the clubs only pay for policing in their footprint: in the ground and car park. The majority of the cost of football policing is borne by the tax payer. It was debated recently in parliament (an MP was suggesting the Premiership should pick up the whole tab).
Well Airman will clarify. I'll ask him at Yeovil if he doesnt pop up here first. What I know for sure is that in the Premier League we were frequently frustrated when Charlton home games were classified as higher risk, resulting in unjustifiable higher costs to the Club.
Good grief, what a fuss about nothing. So you miss a game? Get over it! So you spot an alternative fixture? Just shifting the problem so some other poor sod cant make the game. Utterly unnecessary moaning for the sake of it. A look at the bigger picture would help. Sending an email ''disgusted of Tonbridge'' style, should really sort it out to your benefit!
Who's missing a game? I'm going to both. The bigger picture is that the police have far too much unnecessary and unaccountable influence over fixtures, as do Sky; and we put up with the railways helping themselves to an extra day of holiday when most of the country seems to regard Boxing Day as an active rather than a quiet/religious day. All this happens because we just quietly accept it all, which makes the FL/police/Sky think we are perfectly happy to put up with all. The only way to show that you are not happy with it is to raise your hand and say something.
So you arent even missing a game and you are still moaning? Moaning at fixture people doing the best they can Moaning about the police who you surely cant think have something in for you and Charlton moaning about Sky even though its your best chance of watching the mighty Valiants when one is abroad. Raise your hand if you like, but spoilt naughty schooboys who complain too much will find things even worse next Christmas
Good grief, what a fuss about nothing. So you miss a game? Get over it! So you spot an alternative fixture? Just shifting the problem so some other poor sod cant make the game. Utterly unnecessary moaning for the sake of it. A look at the bigger picture would help. Sending an email ''disgusted of Tonbridge'' style, should really sort it out to your benefit!
Who's missing a game? I'm going to both. The bigger picture is that the police have far too much unnecessary and unaccountable influence over fixtures, as do Sky; and we put up with the railways helping themselves to an extra day of holiday when most of the country seems to regard Boxing Day as an active rather than a quiet/religious day. All this happens because we just quietly accept it all, which makes the FL/police/Sky think we are perfectly happy to put up with all. The only way to show that you are not happy with it is to raise your hand and say something.
So you arent even missing a game and you are still moaning? Moaning at fixture people doing the best they can Moaning about the police who you surely cant think have something in for you and Charlton moaning about Sky even though its your best chance of watching the mighty Valiants when one is abroad. Raise your hand if you like, but spoilt naughty schooboys who complain too much will find things even worse next Christmas
The thing is a lot of people who would normally attend cannot or will not.
I think Prague is writing on their behalf as much as himself and credit to him for it.
I should imagine the local borough commander decided he didn't want to have to send any officers to Orient on Boxing Day, which he couldn't do with Charlton. There is a level of discretion at that level and not much public accountability. Not all decisions are made at Scotland Yard.
Really? It's made at local level, with no common policy across the Met area?
What actually happened with the Orient game? How come Solaraddick was aware that originally the Orient game was going to be on Boxing Day but that the police objected?
I'm asking so that I put a nice sharp FOI request together :-)
I really have no idea. We (SMT) only see the fixtures about an hour before you do. Chris Parkes may know more, but I think the League only looks at them from a football perspective.
BTW a good question would be how they justify the fact that after Orient we will have played 10 at home and 13 away.
Orient and Charlton will get £30k each as facility fees for this live coverage, but bear in mind they also get the annual central payment for all League One clubs of about £750k. So their lost revenue for this fixture is unlikely to be covered by the facility fee. but clearly Sky don't make the main payment as a gratuity.
Clubs only pay for the police inside their ground and many games at this level will be police-free (i.e. no police inside and outside the ground). From Orient's perspective Charlton would be one of their livelier home games and the police would categorise it based on numbers and whether they think our hooligans are likely to turn out.
They'd have looked at Boxing Day as a 3,000 turnout, which I am sure would have merited a significant police presence.
Comments
Meanwhile in Walsall on Boxing day...
Through being a local busybody I have a small insight into the policing at Brentford and this would almost certainly be a local decision. It may not even have got to Borough Commander level (they have had a busy year and have a whole bunch of savings/cuts to deal with). It may not even get to the Borough Commander but be dealt with by the Liaison Officer for the club.
Consider the Chelsea/Fulham game. That probably counts as a very low impact game as far as policing is concerned. Fulham don't really have any kind of firm, not one that is going to go after Chelsea anyway. there'll be no pissed up northereners driving around and not knowing how to get home.And in the search for a quiet life, it's a good fixture I would have thought. Orient is in Newham I think, with shoppers all going to Westfield for the Sales. Perhaps it's in Waltham Forest, I can't be bothered checking, but anyway a tiny crowd on Boxing Day will be preferable.
Fair play to you for having a go. Yeovil is stupid. We could have got to, I dunno, Colchester.
So you miss a game? Get over it!
So you spot an alternative fixture? Just shifting the problem so some other poor sod cant make the game.
Utterly unnecessary moaning for the sake of it. A look at the bigger picture would help.
Sending an email ''disgusted of Tonbridge'' style, should really sort it out to your benefit!
I mean have they got trains going there ?
They are mahoooosive
Wonder how many teams actually have a significantly shorter journey time to Exter than us?
With the exception of Yeovil, there are no other West Country teams - Plymouth, Torquay, the Brizzles, Cheltenham, Hereford, Swindon are all outside League 1. Maybe Bourenmouth, but having driven from Plymouth to Southampton in the past I know that's a bitch of a journey due to the Motorway option being far from the direct route and the route along the coast being a slow one. I would think that anyone north of Birmingham or along the M1 corridor would have just as long a journey to Exeter as Charlton. Maybe Wycombe would have been a sensible choice but as Morts says, Exeter's location and the current anomoly that sees all their near neighbours in different divisions means someone was always going to lumbered with an awkward joureny around Christmas. Hard luck it's us but I'm not convinced there was a significantly better option.
However, as much as I am disappointed that I'll be missing the Boxing Day fixture I can't help but wonder if you think the Police or the rail companies should fork out for excessive overtime to schedule games on Boxing Day (which is technically a Bank Holiday) for football fans benefit?
As I suspect you don't pay UK Tax, which pays for the Police salaries, and their overtime on Bank Holidays, it clearly doesn't make much difference to you, but I am more than happy for the Police to make decisions that save money while not endangering the pubic they are payed to protect.
As has been said, someone had to play them, and I would like to think that we are not so elitist that we think it should, automatically, be someone else.
As for Sky moving fixtures, we can't complain when we take their money for showing live football, when they choose to do just that.
I think the issue with Sky is not that games and times are moved but that they have a habit of getting games changed relatively late and therefore inconveniencing people who have already bought match tickets and rail/air tickets and then find they can't make the re-aranged date.
Given the lack of transport on Boxing Day it also makes sense to schedule away games against teams that are relatively close - the problem however is that this year there are very few local derbies, we only have Brentford and Orient in London and that's it. Yeovil isn't a bad run all things considered - it's mostly motorway and A roads from South East London, but for most people it's going to be a five-six hour round trip with two hours chucked in for the game. Also many clubs like to avoid local debies on Boxing Day - on the basis that it usually attracts a decent crowd whoever the away team are, the deby matches can be saved for another day.
Never subscribed to sky meself, can usually grab the coverage on the computer, anyway going to Orient, was always going to make that game.
helps I live in SE london.
You don't ask, you don't find out why. Ignore the (few) who don't see it that way.
I do agree that there is no benefit, for us, to the Orient kick off time, nor do I think there will be any trouble, however, I suspect that there will be something of an audience for it as it is a London derby with the league leaders (probably) and a play off challenger. Also if we were going to play Orient on Boxing Day are you suggesting that we be away to Yeovil on NYE? If not when do we play them and who do that play on those two dates?
I have no issues with you questioning the FL, but I, personally, believe that there was never going to be a solution to the trio of Christmas fixtures when Yeovil are so isolated from almost every club in the division. If someone has to play them over the holiday period (assuming that don't have to do two long journeys) then the FL can't win.
Moaning at fixture people doing the best they can
Moaning about the police who you surely cant think have something in for you and Charlton
moaning about Sky even though its your best chance of watching the mighty Valiants when one is abroad.
Raise your hand if you like, but spoilt naughty schooboys who complain too much will find things even worse next Christmas
Calling it well reasoned is also stretching the point.
Someone has to visit them, why not us?
Clubs only pay for the police inside their ground and many games at this level will be police-free (i.e. no police inside and outside the ground). From Orient's perspective Charlton would be one of their livelier home games and the police would categorise it based on numbers and whether they think our hooligans are likely to turn out.
They'd have looked at Boxing Day as a 3,000 turnout, which I am sure would have merited a significant police presence.