[cite]Posted By: Chunes[/cite]The country running a deficit has little to do with the amount of people on benefits. Unfortunately for about the last 5 years all the Tory papers seem to have led people to believe otherwise. They've also constantly suggested that people on benefits are, by and large, immigrants - which in my experience is simply not true. Pop down your local wetherspoons at 12 o clock on a monday and take a good look around.
If immigrants weren't working here and our Government grew a spine they would make the indigenous people do the jobs or get no benefits. The benefits system in this country seems to reward those who don't want to work. Something has got to change.
The country "running a deficit" has a lot do with the amount of people on benefits Chunes, a huge amount. Not just immigrants but benefit ponces of all creeds and colours (I am not having a go at genuine folk here).
I had to write a statement about a young Irish lad who lived near us and was renting a flat from a housing association on benefits, it was obvious he was working, I saw him going to work but not only that, it turns out he was going back to Eire regularly and signing on there too.
Our benefits system is so open to abuse, many on here will know someone who is "working and signing" or a single Mum who has a boyfriend living with her, some kind of cross agency checking should be enforced to weed this fraud out and those caught should be properly punished.
On the one hand we have always been a soft touch only to willing to give away vast amounts of money in benefits to immigrants who can get all the benefits of our public services without necessarily contributing anything (although there are many immigrants who are massively productive and benefit our economy enormously). Of course this is why people want to come here. Unfortunately, criminals also want to come here because it is so easy to get away with crime and you will not be appropriately punished if you are caught. Thus the UK is a criminal's paradise that attracts criminals from all over the world. I don't care so much about immigration when it involves those who want to work and contribute (and have a positive effect upon our country), but I do care when we are defrauded by those whom we offer a helping hand and put out the red carpet for criminal scum from all over the globe.
On the other hand, and I think more significantly, we have large numbers of (mainly indigenous) unproductive people, who only know how to take (money, services, anything) and see it as their right - these are often the ones who will moan the loudest about immigration (and would freak out if they had to work as hard as many immigrants do). We have given these people a huge incentive to breed away to their heart's content, safe in the knowledge that the state will subsidise them and their families without ever hoping for anything in return. If they can't be bothered to look after their kids then the state will do it for them without attempting to stop history repeating itself or even holding them responsible; it truly is madness on a frightening scale.
Thus, it is clear why the country is financially in the excrement. The question is, are there any politicians out there with the guts and integrity to change the situation? I suppose we have moved forward in that at least it is deemed acceptable by the PC police to discuss immigration now, but the lack of aforementioned guts and integrity means that politicians are still driving people in to the open arms of the thickos at the BNP. Personally, I actually think that the second part of the problem (the benefits culture) is far more significant than the first and needs sorting out as a matter of urgency. I wonder how many dole scroungers vote BNP with a sense of righteous moral indignation?
[cite]Posted By: adamtheaddick[/cite]Just from a personal view when I was on a life support machine in lewisham hospital the staff in intensive care were mainly white british or white european and indian doctor, they looked after me amazingly when I was in a coma for a week so my family say! And when I used to try pull my tubes out they would calm me down, once I was better and placed on the ward the service went down fast I'm not going to say which form of immigrant ran the ward, but at least 6 times my parents had to ask the 'sister' who was sat reading that my drip needed changing and I needed another kind of bag emptying.
As I said the black staff looking after my dad in intensive care are, IMHO, very good as are the white. More to do with the better staff being in intensive care as it is a harder job but where you get 1 to 1 or 1 to 2 care rather then 1 to 20 on the wards.
Some black NHS staff are not good, bit like some white staff.
Some black people are lazy and ponce off the state, bit like some white people.
Not really an argument either way for immigration IMHO. The UK should, and is starting to, control non-EU immigration better than it has. Good thing I say.
Ironic that only yesterday people were celebrating their Irish heritage, another immigrant group that was once derided. What were those signs in the 50s, "No Dogs, No Blacks, No Irish"
[cite]Posted By: charlton_hero[/cite]I'm all for immigration in moderation, I don't think we should have an open door policy though.
This might sound weird, but I don't mind women immigrating, but would rather less men did. Men are more likely to do violent crimes and stuff, and women are usually more educated and intelligent. It would be unfair to stop all men immigrating, but maybe there should be a ratio, eg for every three women from Eastern Europe allowed in, one man from Africa or the Middle East can come in.
[cite]Posted By: charlton_hero[/cite]I'm all for immigration in moderation, I don't think we should have an open door policy though.
This might sound weird, but I don't mind women immigrating, but would rather less men did. Men are more likely to do violent crimes and stuff, and women are usually more educated and intelligent. It would be unfair to stop all men immigrating, but maybe there should be a ratio, eg for every three women from Eastern Europe allowed in, one man from Africa or the Middle East can come in.
[cite]Posted By: charlton_hero[/cite]I'm all for immigration in moderation, I don't think we should have an open door policy though.
This might sound weird, but I don't mind women immigrating, but would rather less men did. Men are more likely to do violent crimes and stuff, and women are usually more educated and intelligent. It would be unfair to stop all men immigrating, but maybe there should be a ratio, eg for every three women from Eastern Europe allowed in, one man from Africa or the Middle East can come in.
Is that a joke, or genuine misanthropy?
Do you mean misogyny (?spelling) rather than misanthropy?
Misanthropy = hatred of human kind.
Misogyny = hatred of women.
Being lazy has naff all to do withthe pigment of someones skin.
Idiology of mass imigration , the denial of it happening, the benefit system that rewards so many wasters, all down to the pile of Kak called HM Government.
As already said, some people are lazy and it has nothing to do with the colour of their skin. I would prefer to have a million immigrants who came here to work hard and get on than a million of the indiginous population sitting on their fat arses breeding and taking dole without any intention of getting a job.
Well my wife had her citizenship ceremony yesterday and is now a british citizen.
The only thing she claims is this child support. The only reason we decided she should become british is that it makes it easier for us to travel around the world.
You wouldnt beleive how hard it is to go anywhere without a british passport. Every trip was a nightmare as we needed visas evrywhere.
Now she can apply for her british passport it opens up a lot more places.
[cite]Posted By: All_Thaid_Up[/cite]Well my wife had her citizenship ceremony yesterday and is now a british citizen.
The only thing she claims is this child support. The only reason we decided she should become british is that it makes it easier for us to travel around the world.
You wouldnt beleive how hard it is to go anywhere without a british passport. Every trip was a nightmare as we needed visas evrywhere.
Now she can apply for her british passport it opens up a lot more places.
Congratulations! I love the thought of foreign nationals taking out citizenship here - brings a lump to the throat. You must be very proud!
[cite]Posted By: floydandharvey[/cite]Most British people have been travelling to Poland, Hungary etc for dental work for years.
Really, I'm fairly certain most Brits do not in fact travel to these countries for dental work.
On the basis 90% of your posts are full of made up facts that are perhaps only real in your mind, on that basis I'm going to have to go ahead and call shenanigans on this too:
[cite]Posted By: floydandharvey[/cite]
Neither. It is a statement of fact. Would you deny that girls get better A-level results than boys? You can't, it's fact. Would you deny that, despite women being the majority of the population (51.3%), 94.3% of the people in prison in the UK are men? You can't, it's a fact. So what is wrong with my statement that men are more criminal and women are more intelligent? Nothing, it's a fact. Don't call something a "joke" just because your own prejudices prevent you from accepting the truth.
I'm sure if we looked up the figures of which gender provides more with regards to Tax/NI the males would win. So, you can churn out whatever numbers you like, the idea alone is stupid beyond all belief, yes, 3 woman for every man let in indeed, imagine if the suggestion was the other way around, bra's would be burnt on every street corner.
Not bad for a WUM I guess, still, don't you have anything that needs hoovering or cooking, rather than wasting time on here?
Firstly, I am very impressed with the level of debate so far - I have reclassed this forum as 'posh football for intelects' in my favourites! A few pointers have already been mentioned - Bigstemarra pretty well hits my point of view - I am not bothered whoever works for the NHS, as long as they are adding value. I also think (if we can afford to) we should treat anybody in their hour of need. The bigger picture is: 1.Controlled immigration (+ out of the EU politcally - a bit myopic, but I am of a certain age and a country boy) 2. If you ain't put anything in - you don't get anything out - my brother lives in Aus and says that until you have worked for 2 years you cannot claim for a penny. On a positive note regarding our local 'cottage hospital' - one Saturday afternoon (Vics were away at Woking) 3 years ago I was tiling the bathroom and whilst cutting tiles got a sliver in my eye (had safety glasses on, but still got past the shields), I drove to the hospital arriving at 3:00pm; eye frozen, sliver removed and out 10 mins later.
I agree, I too feel that we have to leave the European Union. The European needs us more than we need them, if continue to stay part of the European we will continue to lose more identity as a nation.
[cite]Posted By: floydandharvey[/cite]Most British people have been travelling to Poland, Hungary etc for dental work for years.
Really, I'm fairly certainmostBrits do not in fact travel to these countries for dental work.
On the basis 90% of your posts are full of made up facts that are perhaps only real in your mind, on that basis I'm going to have to go ahead and call shenanigans on this too:
[cite]Posted By: floydandharvey[/cite]
Neither. It is a statement of fact. Would you deny that girls get better A-level results than boys? You can't, it's fact. Would you deny that, despite women being the majority of the population (51.3%), 94.3% of the people in prison in the UK are men? You can't, it's a fact. So what is wrong with my statement that men are more criminal and women are more intelligent? Nothing, it's a fact. Don't call something a "joke" just because your own prejudices prevent you from accepting the truth.
I'm sure if we looked up the figures of which gender provides more with regards to Tax/NI the males would win. So, you can churn out whatever numbers you like, the idea alone is stupid beyond all belief, yes, 3 woman for every man let in indeed, imagine if the suggestion was the other way around, bra's would be burnt on every street corner.
Not bad for a WUM I guess, still, don't you have anything that needs hoovering or cooking, rather than wasting time on here?
Oh come on Stu - all PROPER Charlton jet off to Budapest for a filling, surely you know that?
I think f&h is just a WUM - and not a very good one either.
migrant workers in the NHS get treated different than those born here FACT.
my partner moved here last year to work as a nurse at the local A & E department (and to live with me). following a long and protracted discussion about her salary with HR & Department Manager she has finally been told that whilst she has been practicing as a qualified nurse within 'another' EU country for 7 years and the experience enables her to work here and take on all of the responsibilities relating to said experience, she is only entitled to be paid a salary equivalent to a newly qualified nurse. anyone agree with me that it doesn't sound fair?
Sounds like a disgrace to me. If she's qualified to do the job, why shouldn't she get the same salary? Her experience will no doubt lead to her doing the tasks of an equivalently qualified nurse.
she's from Malmö in Sweden (where whilst taking in the local footballing delights at Malmö FF i happened to come across a certain Jonatan Johansson playing in their forward line-up and as per usual looked father average). according to the matron, whilst her nurse training (longer than in the uk) and experience (higher skills base than in the uk) were good enough to offer her the job, experience whilst employed outside of the nhs cannot be counted towards wages grades and hence it is common practice to start all foreign nurses at bottom of scale regardless of experience. incidentally she has a Norwegian colleague that was also started at bottom of scale with 15 years nursing experience. .....and she certainly didn't come here for the wages as in her former job she earned more whilst working 30 hours per week full-time and 15% of hours must be spent on further training (and they say our national health service is the best in the world!!!).
did anyone know that nurse bands don't exist outside of the UK and India.
i work in nhs psychiatry and most of our new doctors are from asian countries and generally have a great work ethic. without migrants our nhs would be fu''ed.
Comments
That will be local elections although could also be a general election as would make sense to double them up.
If immigrants weren't working here and our Government grew a spine they would make the indigenous people do the jobs or get no benefits. The benefits system in this country seems to reward those who don't want to work. Something has got to change.
The country "running a deficit" has a lot do with the amount of people on benefits Chunes, a huge amount. Not just immigrants but benefit ponces of all creeds and colours (I am not having a go at genuine folk here).
I had to write a statement about a young Irish lad who lived near us and was renting a flat from a housing association on benefits, it was obvious he was working, I saw him going to work but not only that, it turns out he was going back to Eire regularly and signing on there too.
Our benefits system is so open to abuse, many on here will know someone who is "working and signing" or a single Mum who has a boyfriend living with her, some kind of cross agency checking should be enforced to weed this fraud out and those caught should be properly punished.
On the one hand we have always been a soft touch only to willing to give away vast amounts of money in benefits to immigrants who can get all the benefits of our public services without necessarily contributing anything (although there are many immigrants who are massively productive and benefit our economy enormously). Of course this is why people want to come here. Unfortunately, criminals also want to come here because it is so easy to get away with crime and you will not be appropriately punished if you are caught. Thus the UK is a criminal's paradise that attracts criminals from all over the world. I don't care so much about immigration when it involves those who want to work and contribute (and have a positive effect upon our country), but I do care when we are defrauded by those whom we offer a helping hand and put out the red carpet for criminal scum from all over the globe.
On the other hand, and I think more significantly, we have large numbers of (mainly indigenous) unproductive people, who only know how to take (money, services, anything) and see it as their right - these are often the ones who will moan the loudest about immigration (and would freak out if they had to work as hard as many immigrants do). We have given these people a huge incentive to breed away to their heart's content, safe in the knowledge that the state will subsidise them and their families without ever hoping for anything in return. If they can't be bothered to look after their kids then the state will do it for them without attempting to stop history repeating itself or even holding them responsible; it truly is madness on a frightening scale.
Thus, it is clear why the country is financially in the excrement. The question is, are there any politicians out there with the guts and integrity to change the situation? I suppose we have moved forward in that at least it is deemed acceptable by the PC police to discuss immigration now, but the lack of aforementioned guts and integrity means that politicians are still driving people in to the open arms of the thickos at the BNP. Personally, I actually think that the second part of the problem (the benefits culture) is far more significant than the first and needs sorting out as a matter of urgency. I wonder how many dole scroungers vote BNP with a sense of righteous moral indignation?
As I said the black staff looking after my dad in intensive care are, IMHO, very good as are the white. More to do with the better staff being in intensive care as it is a harder job but where you get 1 to 1 or 1 to 2 care rather then 1 to 20 on the wards.
Some black NHS staff are not good, bit like some white staff.
Some black people are lazy and ponce off the state, bit like some white people.
Not really an argument either way for immigration IMHO. The UK should, and is starting to, control non-EU immigration better than it has. Good thing I say.
Ironic that only yesterday people were celebrating their Irish heritage, another immigrant group that was once derided. What were those signs in the 50s, "No Dogs, No Blacks, No Irish"
I have worked in the NHS and have seen fantastic and rubbish staff of all creeds and colours, you simply cannot generalise. People are people.
P.S like the sound of the 'women only' immigration policy! :)
Is that a joke, or genuine misandry?
EDIT: Didn't read properly first time ignore!
Misanthropy = hatred of human kind.
Misogyny = hatred of women.
What is the term for hatred of men?
The error was on my part too because I initially thought he'd expressed hatred of women rather than men!
My ex girlfriend....
You learn something every day!
So this site has experienced a case of misandry today.
Can't wait for the opportunity to call my missus an old misandrist.
Idiology of mass imigration , the denial of it happening, the benefit system that rewards so many wasters, all down to the pile of Kak called HM Government.
The only thing she claims is this child support. The only reason we decided she should become british is that it makes it easier for us to travel around the world.
You wouldnt beleive how hard it is to go anywhere without a british passport. Every trip was a nightmare as we needed visas evrywhere.
Now she can apply for her british passport it opens up a lot more places.
Really, I'm fairly certain most Brits do not in fact travel to these countries for dental work.
On the basis 90% of your posts are full of made up facts that are perhaps only real in your mind, on that basis I'm going to have to go ahead and call shenanigans on this too:
I'm sure if we looked up the figures of which gender provides more with regards to Tax/NI the males would win. So, you can churn out whatever numbers you like, the idea alone is stupid beyond all belief, yes, 3 woman for every man let in indeed, imagine if the suggestion was the other way around, bra's would be burnt on every street corner.
Not bad for a WUM I guess, still, don't you have anything that needs hoovering or cooking, rather than wasting time on here?
A few pointers have already been mentioned - Bigstemarra pretty well hits my point of view - I am not bothered whoever works for the NHS, as long as they are adding value. I also think (if we can afford to) we should treat anybody in their hour of need.
The bigger picture is:
1.Controlled immigration (+ out of the EU politcally - a bit myopic, but I am of a certain age and a country boy)
2. If you ain't put anything in - you don't get anything out - my brother lives in Aus and says that until you have worked for 2 years you cannot claim for a penny.
On a positive note regarding our local 'cottage hospital' - one Saturday afternoon (Vics were away at Woking) 3 years ago I was tiling the bathroom and whilst cutting tiles got a sliver in my eye (had safety glasses on, but still got past the shields), I drove to the hospital arriving at 3:00pm; eye frozen, sliver removed and out 10 mins later.
Oh come on Stu - all PROPER Charlton jet off to Budapest for a filling, surely you know that?
I think f&h is just a WUM - and not a very good one either.
Erm, isn't that because men earn more than women............why is that?....I've never understood!
my partner moved here last year to work as a nurse at the local A & E department (and to live with me). following a long and protracted discussion about her salary with HR & Department Manager she has finally been told that whilst she has been practicing as a qualified nurse within 'another' EU country for 7 years and the experience enables her to work here and take on all of the responsibilities relating to said experience, she is only entitled to be paid a salary equivalent to a newly qualified nurse. anyone agree with me that it doesn't sound fair?
Where she from out of interest?
did anyone know that nurse bands don't exist outside of the UK and India.
i work in nhs psychiatry and most of our new doctors are from asian countries and generally have a great work ethic. without migrants our nhs would be fu''ed.