If Argyle are slumbering Oggy then they need a new alarm clock. They have never delivered despite all the location related advantages you have mentioned.
[cite]Posted By: Chris_from_Sidcup[/cite]If we were to fail to go up, whats to stop us doing what Southampton did, take a 10 point hit for next season, then find a buyer and keep all our best players?
our best players won't play in League One for another season
The board pumped in £7m and borrowed another £2m from the bank to balance the books for this season, promotion is worth £4m in TV money and gate reciepts, so we will still need to find £5m or cut £5m in wages to balance the books if we go up next year so some of our best players won't be playing for us next season regardless :0(
[cite]Posted By: ShootersHillGuru[/cite]If Argyle are slumbering Oggy then they need a new alarm clock. They have never delivered despite all the location related advantages you have mentioned.
Just pointing out that most of the factors are already in place for Argyle to be a lower Prem team ...... a Stoke, Wigan, Burnley, Hull, Blackburn, Bolton, etc
It's just a decent team they are lacking at the moment, lol
And attracting the best players is their biggest problem .....players don't often choose to live in an area so far away from the main centres of population.
But if they get relegated, and involved with the promotion race next season ..... they'll be a big player.
[cite]Posted By: ShootersHillGuru[/cite]If Argyle are slumbering Oggy then they need a new alarm clock. They have never delivered despite all the location related advantages you have mentioned.
I'd agree with Oggy on this. I spend a lot of time in Cornwall and, whilst most footie fans there 'support' one of the big 4, Plymouth is everyone's other team and many take in 3-5 games a season there. If Plymouth were in the Prem and had a 40k stadium I think they'd sell out many home games and certainly average over 35k.
The fact that they've never delivered doesn't diminish that potential.
doubt if they get relegated there be getting any world cup matches,being honest never rember any staggering great crowds there doubt there ever will be.
[cite]Posted By: nolly[/cite]doubt if they get relegated there be getting any world cup matches,being honest never rember any staggering great crowds there doubt there ever will be.
Argyle getting relegated this season won't make any difference, Nolly.
The decision has already been made - Plymouth are hosting World Cup matches in 2018.
And the funding will be made available to expand the ground.
Plymouth is a big industrial city, one of the biggest in the UK.
It's just in the wrong place geographically, compared to other main centres of population.
It's not a carrot crunching, wurzel growing place like Yeovil.
Lots of clubs are flirting with administration. If we don't go up, we will chop our wage bill but so will most other clubs. I might be wrong but I don't think many clubs will be able to offer the likes of Nicky Bailey much more than what he is currently on. I look forward to the time when clubs are sensibly run again and players earn money from the gate revenue rather than from a bank loan, or a loan shark aka palace. I don't think we will go into administration because the debt is carried by our directors but they sure won't want to keep losing 5-10 millions of pounds each year. What is refreshing is seeing our acadamy producing decent players for the 1st team. Was it 5 or 6 in the team last week?
Not sure how this thread turned into us discussing Plymouth's crowds but if i remember rightly, a few years back they got promotion twice in 2-3 years from League 2 up to the championship and were getting sell outs for their final games in each of their promotion years. So the crowds are there.
Only know this as i used to work with a Plymouth fan.
[cite]Posted By: Chris_from_Sidcup[/cite]Not sure how this thread turned into us discussing Plymouth's crowds but if i remember rightly, a few years back they got promotion twice in 2-3 years from League 2 up to the championship and were getting sell outs for their final games in each of their promotion years. So the crowds are there.
Only know this as i used to work with a Plymouth fan.
You're spot on, Chris.
The crowds are there, if the football is there.
But not many want to watch a team that can't score; play their only tactic of stopping the other team playing at all costs.
It's dreadful dirgy stuff and the fans have voted with their feet.
But big cup matches and promotion race games fire the imagination of the locals.
And they sell out, nigh on 20,000 crowds. Even in Division 1 & 2.
The Plymouth posts started because somebody dismissed them as a small town club with no support.
They easily have the potential to do what Charlton achieved in the past dozen years.
I plead guilty that I started this stuff about Plymouth but I did not dismiss them 'as a small town club with no support' . I accept they have potential , but their gates compared to ours in a lower division are lower. I would like people to look at the context of my comments.
My point was that they are not as big as Leeds, Norwich or Southampton and I was saying this season was probably the hardest League One to have been in because of this. My understanding is also that they have financial problems.
I accept if they come down they will be competitive , but in my opinion not as much as Leeds or Norwich.
From our point of view next year could be different with probably only Southampton remaining.
[cite]Posted By: Chris_from_Sidcup[/cite]They also brought a good 2k or so to the Valley on a tuesday night a couple of years ago.
Although Oohaah will tell you they all lived within the M25.
Not all of them, by any stretch of the imagination.
You'll be surprised at the level of their away support..... especially for key matches.
For that Charlton v Argyle mid-week match they certainly did take 2,000.
About 20 of them went up from my office, in 5 cars.
We lost. God, my life was unbearable at work next day.
Bleedin' "Green Army!" in my face all day.
Anyway, not meaning to dig you out RichardJ.
Their current gates reflects the fact that their club is in the doldrums at the moment.
A successful Argyle in League One could easily be on a par with Norwich; save for the gates restricted to a 20,000 capacity crowd. They are no Leeds, but then neither are Charlton.
For the past 25 years, I've worked in Plymouth and live less than 20 miles away (in SE Cornwall)..
I mix with Argyle supporters every day.
Well it does seem the statement of the obvious! does it not.... Not sure how much money is being made in this league as well as the championship come to think of it!. There are even a few teams in the prem working that one out at present.......... My concern is that if we do get promoted how will we get the finance to rebuild and strenghten the squad.! We will pressumably need a bigger squad, and I would suggest 5 new players for the first team. Not really sure about any of the front men except Burton once fit, and then to be convinced!. Despite the more relistic valuations of players valuations salaries are still far too high, Charlton cannot be seperate from this league the market rate will have to be paid, to state the obvious....... is that not why Peter Varney is back at the Valley! for new investment..... His task now looks a lot harder than a few months back, and he did not think it was too easy then! ( sorry just seen the posting I was in hospital yesterday)
Peterborough - depends how long they put up with Jim Gannon. If he's sacked at the end of this season, Posh are not a threat. Who could they get to manage them after doing what they did to Fergie Jr and then again to Gannon?
Plymouth - depends on the scale of their financial worries, but I reckon they're probably a threat.
A.N. Other - depends on who it is. Unlike the previous poster, I hope it's someone like Wednesday or Palace (a potless club), even Reading. Disaster would be Ipswich, because they have the money to get out of it, and I wouldn't be in any way confident with Scunthorpe or Doncaster, who will probably be able to keep the bulk of their team together.
Teams coming up are not a threat, now that Notts County have been ruled out even if they come up. Rochdale might get that winning feeling, but Bournemouth and Rotherham would be more focussed on stabilising than pushing on.
As for the teams who'll stay in League 1, Swindon and Huddersfield look pretty good. MK Dons should be targeting promotion just like Plymouth would be, and Pardew will have the cash to splash. Do Brentford have the potential? How about Carlisle?
I have been thinking about this for a few days and I just cannot see what motive Richard Murray has for pointing out to potential buyers that if the team does not win promotion this season all the best players will have to be sold if the club is to survive. I know that any prospective buyer would probaly come to that conclusion during due diligence but why point it out up front.
Unless it's all just smokescreen by overstating the bleedin' obvious.
Murray can be a wiley old campaigner at times, perhaps?
If anything is going on behind the scenes ........ coming out with a red herring and letting people believe whatever they want to believe wouldn't do the Board's cause any harm.
[cite]Posted By: Red_in_SE8[/cite]I have been thinking about this for a few days and I just cannot see what motive Richard Murray has for pointing out to potential buyers that if the team does not win promotion this season all the best players will have to be sold if the club is to survive. I know that any prospective buyer would probaly come to that conclusion during due diligence but why point it out up front.
Agree with this SE8. Not seen that slant on this before and agree its odd.
OK . Heres one. Peter Varney has a prospective consortium buyer lined up. Richard Murray, for some reason does not like the prospective buyer or the structure of the deal, so issues a press release stating that if we don't win promotion in the next 3 months the club will have to sell its best players. This, as intended, spooks members of the buying consortium. Peter Varney resigns in disgust.
I love a conspiracy theory but I rekon thats a leap too far. As Airman says it would appear that PV is continuing with the role but not as a director. Don`t understand this either but can`t agree with your latest theory. Have you been drinking ?
OK. What about this one. As someone has already pointed out maybe Peter Varney is involved with the prospective buyers/consortium that he has lined up so resigns as a director to avoid any conflict of interest issues. Richard Murray is not happy with the prospective buyers so issues the press release to spook them.
[cite]Posted By: Red_in_SE8[/cite]OK. What about this one. As someone has already pointed out maybe Peter Varney is involved with the prospective buyers/consortium that he has lined up so resigns as a director to avoid any conflict of interest issues. Richard Murray is not happy with the prospective buyers so issues the press release to spook them.
And spook any others as well !...........Noooooooooooooo
Murray and Varney are good mates. Varney left when Chappell took over and returned when Murray retook the reigns. I don't know why Varney has just left again.
Murray said months ago, that if we were not promoted we would probably have to let our best players go, as the Sky revenue is £3M in The Championship and £300,000.00 in League 1.
Additionally, a lot of the players that are out of contract at the season's end could walk for free, as we can't renew contracts at this stage as we couldn't afford to.
There are no conspiracies, this is old news which some people have apparently not heard.
Comments
Just pointing out that most of the factors are already in place for Argyle to be a lower Prem team ...... a Stoke, Wigan, Burnley, Hull, Blackburn, Bolton, etc
It's just a decent team they are lacking at the moment, lol
And attracting the best players is their biggest problem .....players don't often choose to live in an area so far away from the main centres of population.
But if they get relegated, and involved with the promotion race next season ..... they'll be a big player.
19,950 ..... it used to be around 30,000 before becoming all seater.
Plymouth is one of the grounds chosen to play World Cup matches in 2018 - and there are various plans to upgrade the ground to as much as 46,000.
Although more likely to around 35,000.
Argyle getting relegated this season won't make any difference, Nolly.
The decision has already been made - Plymouth are hosting World Cup matches in 2018.
And the funding will be made available to expand the ground.
Plymouth is a big industrial city, one of the biggest in the UK.
It's just in the wrong place geographically, compared to other main centres of population.
It's not a carrot crunching, wurzel growing place like Yeovil.
I hope it's a success for them but I fear it could backfire.
I look forward to the time when clubs are sensibly run again and players earn money from the gate revenue rather than from a bank loan, or a loan shark aka palace.
I don't think we will go into administration because the debt is carried by our directors but they sure won't want to keep losing 5-10 millions of pounds each year.
What is refreshing is seeing our acadamy producing decent players for the 1st team. Was it 5 or 6 in the team last week?
You never know ..... they could even be playing in the Prem by then.
And they won't be short of punters if that happens.
Who knows what the future will bring?
We didn't in 1985, 1990, 1995, 2005, etc.
Only know this as i used to work with a Plymouth fan.
You're spot on, Chris.
The crowds are there, if the football is there.
But not many want to watch a team that can't score; play their only tactic of stopping the other team playing at all costs.
It's dreadful dirgy stuff and the fans have voted with their feet.
But big cup matches and promotion race games fire the imagination of the locals.
And they sell out, nigh on 20,000 crowds. Even in Division 1 & 2.
The Plymouth posts started because somebody dismissed them as a small town club with no support.
They easily have the potential to do what Charlton achieved in the past dozen years.
My point was that they are not as big as Leeds, Norwich or Southampton and I was saying this season was probably the hardest League One to have been in because of this. My understanding is also that they have financial problems.
I accept if they come down they will be competitive , but in my opinion not as much as Leeds or Norwich.
From our point of view next year could be different with probably only Southampton remaining.
Although Oohaah will tell you they all lived within the M25.
Not all of them, by any stretch of the imagination.
You'll be surprised at the level of their away support..... especially for key matches.
For that Charlton v Argyle mid-week match they certainly did take 2,000.
About 20 of them went up from my office, in 5 cars.
We lost. God, my life was unbearable at work next day.
Bleedin' "Green Army!" in my face all day.
Anyway, not meaning to dig you out RichardJ.
Their current gates reflects the fact that their club is in the doldrums at the moment.
A successful Argyle in League One could easily be on a par with Norwich; save for the gates restricted to a 20,000 capacity crowd. They are no Leeds, but then neither are Charlton.
For the past 25 years, I've worked in Plymouth and live less than 20 miles away (in SE Cornwall)..
I mix with Argyle supporters every day.
So do rather have a finger on the pulse.
;o)
My concern is that if we do get promoted how will we get the finance to rebuild and strenghten the squad.! We will pressumably need a bigger squad, and I would suggest 5 new players for the first team. Not really sure about any of the front men except Burton once fit, and then to be convinced!. Despite the more relistic valuations of players valuations salaries are still far too high, Charlton cannot be seperate from this league the market rate will have to be paid, to state the obvious....... is that not why Peter Varney is back at the Valley! for new investment..... His task now looks a lot harder than a few months back, and he did not think it was too easy then! ( sorry just seen the posting I was in hospital yesterday)
Peterborough - depends how long they put up with Jim Gannon. If he's sacked at the end of this season, Posh are not a threat. Who could they get to manage them after doing what they did to Fergie Jr and then again to Gannon?
Plymouth - depends on the scale of their financial worries, but I reckon they're probably a threat.
A.N. Other - depends on who it is. Unlike the previous poster, I hope it's someone like Wednesday or Palace (a potless club), even Reading. Disaster would be Ipswich, because they have the money to get out of it, and I wouldn't be in any way confident with Scunthorpe or Doncaster, who will probably be able to keep the bulk of their team together.
Teams coming up are not a threat, now that Notts County have been ruled out even if they come up. Rochdale might get that winning feeling, but Bournemouth and Rotherham would be more focussed on stabilising than pushing on.
As for the teams who'll stay in League 1, Swindon and Huddersfield look pretty good. MK Dons should be targeting promotion just like Plymouth would be, and Pardew will have the cash to splash. Do Brentford have the potential? How about Carlisle?
Murray can be a wiley old campaigner at times, perhaps?
If anything is going on behind the scenes ........ coming out with a red herring and letting people believe whatever they want to believe wouldn't do the Board's cause any harm.
Right, conspiracy theory anyone ....?
;o)
Agree with this SE8. Not seen that slant on this before and agree its odd.
Now there's a good idea.
It is Poets day.
And spook any others as well !...........Noooooooooooooo
Murray said months ago, that if we were not promoted we would probably have to let our best players go, as the Sky revenue is £3M in The Championship and £300,000.00 in League 1.
Additionally, a lot of the players that are out of contract at the season's end could walk for free, as we can't renew contracts at this stage as we couldn't afford to.
There are no conspiracies, this is old news which some people have apparently not heard.