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Should we be resting some of the first 11?

edited September 2009 in General Charlton
Must admit I am concerned, is Shelvey a bit young to be starting every game, and are some of the senior players carrying injuries and need a rest?

Perhaps Southampton are a stronger side than their results would suggest?

I can see the value in starting the same 11 - its great we've been able to do so, but perhaps now is time to give the odd player a rest?
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Comments

  • I honestly think that any player who "rests" for a game or 2 would have a real struggle to get back in the team......
  • Noone should be taken out of the starting 11 unless they're injured.

    They can't be that tired - they've only played 7 games (8 if you include the Hereford game). During the 90s we probably had a couple of ever presents every season.
  • I recall Bowyer at a similar age to Shelvey, burning out towards the middle second half of the season and with it, our push for the playoffs
  • I wouldn't have thought anyone needs a rest yet but there's no way a 17 year old can be expected to play every single game so he'll definitely need to be rested at some point.
  • When they need a rest then rest them.

    Don't rest them before they need a rest.

    Injuries, suspensions, JPT and loss of form will give some of the squad a rest at some point so lets wait till then
  • rest some to protect your assets a little, also if you don't bring anyone else in before absolutely necessary would it be harder to get them to gel with the setup, and get match practice? Mind you I spose the increased number of subs has to help so I imagine Parky will bring players into the mix that way if we are a couple of goals up in the second half
  • I think we'll see players rested after 15 games and we know what the season holds.

    If we are storming then the easier games will see players rested but if we arent I think they will have to soldier on.

    This team seems to be feeding off confidence at the mo, rest a few players and start dropping points unexpectedly and who knows what could happen. Still think we need to get a qtr of the season out of the way before starting to think about rests.
  • Agree lardy
  • we're playing one game a week at the moment so why would we need to rest anyone?

    these guys are professionals who do nothing each week except train for a few hours three or four mornings a week then should be resting in the afternoons

    once two games a week kicks in next month then yes Parky will need to start using some of his squad members but surely for the next 2 games it should be the same starting XI if they are all fit?
  • All things in life is about confidence. You can acheive nearly anything if you believe it possible.

    The great thing with winning is it is felt by the whole squad, not just the starting 11. So when changes are made, the mentality of success is already there in the players coming in.

    The players coming in would not want to let down the others by being the reason for failure ( if that were to be the outcome of said changes made), and would work harder than usual to not want to let down those 11 that have put together such a sequence of wins. Success breads success Gents, and I feel when the changes are made, the wheels wont fall off. I hope!!! :)
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  • What others have said, rest them when they need a rest, we're only playing once a week at the moment. Worry for me is we rest any of them and the replacements don't have the same quality, especially in midfield.
  • Daily will need a rest soon but once Leeds and Norwich are past maybe we can afford this luxury, same with Shelvey. McLeod has looked very bright recently when coming on as sub so he could be a good option if we need a replacement. May mean changing system but guess we'll see.
    Sodje should be great at League 1 level so have no probs with him replacing someone for a while and we also have Leon McKenzie coming back to fitness so he could slot in on the left with Bailey in the Shelvey role or vice versa.
    Maybe in the JP someone will stake a claim... Dickson?
  • [cite]Posted By: cafcdan18[/cite]Daily will need a rest soon

    Interesting comment re Dailly from Scott Minto, who was doing co commentary for Sky on the Brentford game. Mints said that Dailly (as an ex West Ham teamate) was one of the fittest players in British football and that he had a real passion for the game - Mints reckoned he was a cert to go on playing until he was 38 or 39 at least. Centre back is also a less demanding position fitness wise (not like an overlapping full back or box to box midfielder) so he might play more games than we might first expect.

    I do think we need to keep one eye on protecting Jonjo a bit - perhaps a few more second half cameos from Izzy and/or Tuna are in order but with the current game a week schedule the rest of the senior pros should be okay. We do need to be a bit creful with selections for cup games though - although the Hereford defeat sorted one part of that dilema for us.
  • [cite]Posted By: christian da valiant[/cite]Success breads success Gents :)
    so what you are saying is the confidence from past success is the main ingredient for baking up more success
  • Why would you rest players who have played 7 games in 6 weeks, it is hardly testing for them IMO. When we start to play 2 games a week this would become relevant but at the moment we are not.

    The only thing that may be worth doing is making a sub slightly earlier (ie Mcleod on), to give short rests to the likes of Burton & JJ who are doing so much of the running for the team.
  • [quote][cite]Posted By: Henry Irving[/cite]When they need a rest then rest them.

    Don't rest them before they need a rest.

    Injuries, suspensions, JPT and loss of form will give some of the squad a rest at some point so lets wait till then[/quote]


    Disagree, rest players before they burn out, plus rotating the squad around will make sure that some of those on the bench who are playing reserve football are up to match speed when they are needed and not struggling to fit in if they are called up at short notice.
  • There are 168 hours in a week. To ask a pro to play 1.5 of those 168 hours on a regular basis is outrageous...... WTF???????

    6 or 7 games a month like Man Utd, Chelsea Etc maybe, but if I was Shelvey and they 'rested'/deprived me of my 90 minutes at the cutting edge I'd be livid.
  • [quote][cite]Posted By: Stone[/cite]There are 168 hours in a week. To ask a pro to play 1.5 of those 168 hours on a regular basis is outrageous...... WTF???????

    6 or 7 games a month like Man Utd, Chelsea Etc maybe, but if I was Shelvey and they 'rested'/deprived me of my 90 minutes at the cutting edge I'd be livid.[/quote]

    Shelvey won't be much use to us if he's sat in the stands from March/April onwards because he has a few stupid niggles from being overplayed. He'll play a lot of football this season for us - plus England age-group matches and there's a lot of training and travelling involved in those games. The smart thing would be to rest him to make sure that we don't fade away after Easter.
  • Players carrying a Knock or who are not fully fit should be rested, Nicky Bailey at weekend was prime example, clearly not fit but played anyway & was only at 70% at best.
  • not sure about resting players at this stage, bu certainly feelwe should use our substitutes more. On Saturday both Burton & Shelvy looked leggy with 10 mins to go and perhpas should have been subbed for Tuna & McLeod. This is my only criticism of Parky is that he is too re-active and doesn't think about changing things until too late (which luckily this season hasn't really happened).

    I always feel that with 10 mins left a couple of subs should be introduced so as to take advantage of their fresh legs and this just may be enough to gain an extra yard over a tiring defender -
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  • [cite]Posted By: Ketman[/cite]Players carrying a Knock or who are not fully fit should be rested, Nicky Bailey at weekend was prime example, clearly not fit but played anyway & was only at 70% at best.

    This might well be the case in a couple of weeks - with McKenzie and holden still not match fit Parky's options are limited and he may well have felt a 70% Bailey was at least equal if not greater than a Basey or a Wagstaff out of position.
  • The guy next door to me is competing as a Cross Country skier in the Winter Olympics in February next year - he trains 6 days a week & is fitter than any professional footballer you could care to mention. The stuff he is doing is much more physically demanding than a game of football.

    He doesn't rest at all - i think he takes a month off every year at the end of the season, but he has access to top class nutritionists, psychologists & physiotherapists. He also sleeps for several hours a day after training.

    I would argue that any player that needs to rest after 1 or 2 games a week, has an underlying fitness issue & should not be playing in the first place. The only argument i could see for resting a player is one coming back from injury or a much older player with dodgy joints.
  • Would be a good ides to give some minutes to a few fringe players as if we do need them, would be better if they are match fit- Basey, McLeod and Tuna come to mind.
    Team for JP v Barnet: Randolph, Solly, Sodje, Llera, Youga, Wagstaff, Semedo, Racon, Basey, McLeod, Tuna/McKenzie
  • [cite]Posted By: cafcdan18[/cite]Would be a good ides to give some minutes to a few fringe players as if we do need them, would be better if they are match fit- Basey, McLeod and Tuna come to mind.
    Team for JP v Barnet: Randolph, Solly, Sodje, Llera, Youga, Wagstaff, Semedo, Racon, Basey, McLeod, Tuna/McKenzie

    I'm afraid 6 of the starting XI in the JPT have to have appeared (or started, can't remember) in at least 50% of our matches. So unless Waggy gets involved a couple more times or we change the team a bit, we'll get thrown out with that lineup ;)
  • Elliot in goal then. Hope it is appeared rather than started as Waggy is not too far off that and if McLeod comes on on a couple more times he may be close
  • [cite]Posted By: Ketman[/cite]Players carrying a Knock or who are not fully fit should be rested, Nicky Bailey at weekend was prime example, clearly not fit but played anyway & was only at 70% at best.


    I think if it was someone like Tranmere or Exeter then he may well have been rested.
  • Blimey, we complained - rightly - that Pardew (and Parky last season) didn't know their best XI and deplored the chaos that ensued with a record number of players used in the season. Now we've got a settled and succesful side and people want to change it when there's no need!

    As Henry pointed out, injures and suspensions wll take their toll soon enough. So let's enjoy the luxury of a settled side while we can, eh?
  • In respect of resting players, I would be more inclined to rest them in the bigger games and save them for the games against lesser opposition. At the end of the day if we were able to beat the bottom half of the league home and away it would give us 72 points only 17 points short of the total that got the Posh automatic promotion last season. Remember Liverpool had a great record against the other top 3 last season, but when players were rested for teams lower down the league those results cost them the title.
  • [cite]Posted By: Oakster[/cite]The guy next door to me is competing as a Cross Country skier in the Winter Olympics in February next year - he trains 6 days a week & is fitter than any professional footballer you could care to mention. The stuff he is doing is much more physically demanding than a game of football.

    He doesn't rest at all - i think he takes a month off every year at the end of the season, but he has access to top class nutritionists, psychologists & physiotherapists. He also sleeps for several hours a day after training.

    I would argue that any player that needs to rest after 1 or 2 games a week, has an underlying fitness issue & should not be playing in the first place. The only argument i could see for resting a player is one coming back from injury or a much older player with dodgy joints.

    To be fair thats a completely different sport, and very different in way of fitness. He doesn't do little short sprints at full pace throughout his race and doesn't have people slide tackling him, he's not streching up to make an header or at full stretch to get his toe to the ball . I struggle to see what they have in common. I do think that unless injured most players should only just be reaching their peak fitness since the start of the season. So to rest them now would not make to much sense.
  • You should always keep a successful side going as long as possible. Injuries & suspensions dictate resting players unless lack of form creeps in to the odd individual.
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