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Is this the worst England squad ever?

Goalkeepers: Jack Butland (Stoke City), Joe Hart (West Ham - loan from Manchester City), Jordan Pickford (Everton).

Defenders: Ryan Bertrand (Southampton), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Joe Gomez (Liverpool), Phil Jones (Manchester United), Michael Keane (Everton), Harry Maguire (Leicester), Danny Rose (Tottenham), John Stones (Manchester City), Kieran Trippier (Tottenham), Kyle Walker (Manchester City).

Midfielders: Eric Dier (Tottenham), Jesse Lingard (Manchester United), Jake Livermore (West Brom), Ruben Loftus-Cheek (Crystal Palace - loan from Chelsea), Ashley Young (Manchester United).

Forwards: Tammy Abraham (Swansea - loan from Chelsea), Marcus Rashford (Manchester United), Jamie Vardy (Leicester).

Can anyone remember a worse squad? (not including Gomez in that)
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Comments

  • Remember if we fail to win the World Cup in Russia then its no worse than the teams that tried and failed every time beforehand
  • Much rather see us give someone like Foden or Sancho a chance. Tell me what the point is calling Young or Livermore up?
  • Much rather see us give someone like Foden or Sancho a chance. Tell me what the point is calling Young or Livermore up?

    Seconded. Even if the 2 you mentioned got 10 mins each, in one game, they would get a taste of what it’s all about.
  • Surely now is the time to give untried players a go in case we need some to come in for the world cup
  • Goalkeepers: Jack Butland (Stoke City), Joe Hart (West Ham - loan from Manchester City), Jordan Pickford (Everton).

    Defenders: Ryan Bertrand (Southampton), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Joe Gomez (Liverpool), Phil Jones (Manchester United), Michael Keane (Everton), Harry Maguire (Leicester), Danny Rose (Tottenham), John Stones (Manchester City), Kieran Trippier (Tottenham), Kyle Walker (Manchester City).

    Midfielders: Eric Dier (Tottenham), Jesse Lingard (Manchester United), Jake Livermore (West Brom), Ruben Loftus-Cheek (Crystal Palace - loan from Chelsea), Ashley Young (Manchester United).

    Forwards: Tammy Abraham (Swansea - loan from Chelsea), Marcus Rashford (Manchester United), Jamie Vardy (Leicester).

    Can anyone remember a worse squad? (not including Gomez in that)

    Yes, the last one, then the one before that.

  • Carlton Palmer isn't included so no, it isn't the worst squad ever.
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  • Defence and gk look fine, but the midfield and attack is desperately weak. Young has been playing as a full/wing back recently

    Surprised the likes of Leicester's Albrighton or Gray haven't been considered
  • Much rather see us give someone like Foden or Sancho a chance. Tell me what the point is calling Young or Livermore up?

    Before they've even had a run of first team games? Wouldn't that be rewarding them far too early?
  • The problem is that young players will be given a chance in these games, but we all know that the likes of Hart, Cahill, Henderson etc. will still be there starting in Russia.

    Butland has been much better than Hart this season, and should be first choice imo. I don't know why Hodgson and Southgate are so afraid to drop Hart. They can't use the fact that it might damage his confidence as an excuse, as surely he hasn't got any anyway after being sent on loan from Man City and now West Ham who are struggling, as well as his poor displays in the Euros and against Scotland.
  • Lets hope Joe gets a run out and we trigger more money from Liverpool.
  • Scoham said:

    Much rather see us give someone like Foden or Sancho a chance. Tell me what the point is calling Young or Livermore up?

    Before they've even had a run of first team games? Wouldn't that be rewarding them far too early?
    I know who I would rather see in the starting lineup in Russia...
  • Lets hope Joe gets a run out and we trigger more money from Liverpool.

    Can we wait for Roland to sell before than happens?
  • It's not that bad, Carlton Palmer is not in it.
  • Scoham said:

    Much rather see us give someone like Foden or Sancho a chance. Tell me what the point is calling Young or Livermore up?

    Before they've even had a run of first team games? Wouldn't that be rewarding them far too early?
    I know who I would rather see in the starting lineup in Russia...
    Then when they don’t perform they’ll be slagged off for being overrated and never recover. No need to call them up yet.
  • edited November 7
    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane
  • No,just the worst England manager ever
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  • dizzee said:

    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane

    I like that team

  • Doesn't matter who plays. The inspirational Gareth Southgate is sure to give them a rousing motivational speech that will ensure a stellar performance.
  • dizzee said:

    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane

    dizzee said:

    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane

    Butland

    Stones, Cahill, jones

    Walker Wilshere Dier Lallana Rose

    Alli

    Kane
  • dizzee said:

    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane

    Very good going forward but not one of that midfield is better suited to acting as cover. Someone like Dier has to come in (and a CB to replace him) but, otherwise, looks good.

    The other option for that position, although I doubt it will happen simply because I don't think we have enough quality CBs, is to sit Stones in front of the back 3/4. He reads the game well, has a physical presence and can pass the ball.
  • Seeing Carlton Palmer's name reminded me of a classic comment made by Ron Atkinson when Palmer was at Villa.

    Atkinson............" Carlton Palmer's 1st touch is sometimes abysmal. He can trap a ball further than I can kick it"
  • Remember if we fail to win the World Cup in Russia then its no worse than the teams that tried and failed every time beforehand

    Exactly.

    The quoted all time best premier league back four is

    G,nev terry Ferdinand Ashley cole

    Add to that frank lampard, gerrard Rooney Scholes Michael owen and at least a few more stars. They played terribly together when it came to crunch time.

    from the current era, only Harry kane and maybe deli ali would get in the side. Sterling being a very slight possibility.

    The problem with those players is that they were not managed properly and thought way too highly of themselves. The FA did a particularly terrible job of recruiting managers.

    That Italian fella being the worst and most disappointing of the bunch, capello.

    Apart from gary Neville and frank lampard who seem ok, the golden generation were mostly simply all wankers too.

  • Doesn't look very special but Southgate will be spectacularly unlucky if his squad for russia'18 looks much like that for midfield and attackers.
    It's been the same now for a generation, players being pulled out of friendlies on the slimmest of excuses.
    GS's on a hiding to nothing with these games, god knows why they went for such strong opponents but if the FA picks weaker sides he gets no credit for good results, if the results are less good the press bill him as a chump regardless of how strong Germany, Brazil, whoever might be. If he's really lucky 2 or 3 younger inexperienced chaps will shine and give him more to choose from next May/June time.
    I suspect these games have more to do with the fuckwits on the gravy train at the FA being in thrall to the sponsors.
  • edited November 8
    dizzee said:

    For the WC playing in a 3-5-2:

    Butland (Better than Hart)

    Cahill (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Dier (Used to playing 3-5-2)
    Stones

    Walker
    Wilshere
    Lllalana
    Alli
    Rose

    Rashford
    Kane

    I don't think you can get away with playing those three in central midfield. I think you need some sort of anchor or water carrier. Pushing Dier up or bringing in Henderson perhaps. I know it's not sexy, but there just isn't enough tactical discipline with Alli and Lallana.

    That said, I like that you've picked out that England have center backs that play in a back three at club level. It should be noted that Stones, Smalling, Keane, and Jones have all also played in a back three at club level this year.

    For me:
    Hart (sorry, Butland and Pickford are only better when they have to face loads of shots. Hart may have a rick in him but he's still more rounded).

    Jones Stones Cahill
    Walker Dier Wilshere Rose
    .....Lallana.....Alli
    ..............Kane

    All of those players bar Wilshere have played in a 3-5-2/3-4-3 this year, and I believe Wilshere played in one with Bournemouth last year.

    I still think Rashford blows slightly too hot and cold. I think as a sub he's an excellent option. And you could also bring him into the first team and play 4-2-3-1 against weaker sides/when chasing the game.

    The reason I like this so much is that it gives England's three most creative players: Wilshere, Lallana, and Alli all some measure of freedom. When played as a 10 in front of Henderson and Dier, it's far too easy for teams to put one or two holding midfielders on Alli and nullify him. Moving him to that inside left role, where he's had a lot of success with Spurs, gives him freedom to drag players out of position, be it the opposition winger, fullback, or holding player. Same with Lallana on the other side, who is great at finding little pockets of space.

    Playing with the back three plus Dier gives Wilshere the freedom to start moves from deep then continue them further up the pitch, which I would argue is his strongest suit. Not quite traditional box-to-box, but a bit more freedom than a holding player.
  • Doesn't look very special but Southgate will be spectacularly unlucky if his squad for russia'18 looks much like that for midfield and attackers.
    It's been the same now for a generation, players being pulled out of friendlies on the slimmest of excuses.
    GS's on a hiding to nothing with these games, god knows why they went for such strong opponents but if the FA picks weaker sides he gets no credit for good results, if the results are less good the press bill him as a chump regardless of how strong Germany, Brazil, whoever might be. If he's really lucky 2 or 3 younger inexperienced chaps will shine and give him more to choose from next May/June time.
    I suspect these games have more to do with the fuckwits on the gravy train at the FA being in thrall to the sponsors.

    A lot depends I guess on how seriously the Germans and Brazilians take these matches, I assume their squads will also have withdrawals?
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