I must be one of the best qualified Charlton fans to talk about this.
My mum is a Millwall fan. All my maternal uncles and cousins are Millwall fans. My maternal grandad is a Millwall fan. My great grandad worked at the docks and was a Millwall fan when they reached two FA Cup Semi-Finals and earnt their nickname 'Lions of the South' by beating the mighty Aston Villa team of the late Victorian era. My other half is a Millwall fan.
My dad is a Charlton fan.
I was taken to The Valley first. But have been to many Millwall games over the years.
Millwall fans do not 'hate' Charlton. They see it as their biggest local derby. Because it is. I have been to Millwall Charlton games at The Den in the home end. It is that kind of derby. There was no hate. Just a desire to beat us. I can say that, because I have been along to Millwall v West Ham, Leeds, Birmingham City, Chelsea and Everton games. That was hate filled. I have even been to Millwall v Palace and that isn't seen as big as a local derby as us, it does have more spite to it than our games. Maybe because it more a dockers/proper SE London club v a fake south London, suburban club. Whereas Millwall v Charlton is an actual SE London derby proper. Most of us know Millwall fans, be they family, mates neighbours or work colleagues.
I don't think any of the Millwall fans I personally know ever say it is not a rivalry. They enjoy the rivalry. Why wouldn't they? They hardly ever lose it. In my entire life (45 years) they have only lost to us three times in the league. I was at Selhurst Park when they tonked us 3-0 in first top flight derby match between the two and they treated it as a nice day out, as pretty most of the ground was Millwall fans. But if you go to a Millwall Charlton match as a Charlton fan expecting the infamous Millwall hostility, you will be sadly let down. They just don't see us that way. I've been to normal league games between Millwall and Stoke, Cardiff or Portsmouth, and it is a feistier atmosphere than our games, as both sets of hooligans are out.
Another thing I will say about my Millwall fans is they are not like Palace fans at all. They really do not give a stuff whether we have a bigger ground or have played more top flight football at all. They genuinely do not care about those things. One thing they do care about is us winning the FA Cup. I am often reminded that Millwall are the best giant killers in FA Cup history. This is actual an official fact. No other club has knocked out more higher placed opponents than them. This includes champions of England, FA Cup holders etc. It kills them that they have never won it, despite such a good record for a lower league club (5 Semi Finals & one Final).
I have the same feelings towards them that they do towards us, probably cos I live with them. Ie I really, really want to beat them for bragging rights. But there is no hate. But it is a big local derby. And they would agree.
Spot on. Although I’m not sure it ‘kills us’ that we haven’t won the FA cup, it would still be nice if we did lol. But as you say we have a good pedigree in the competition. (Also the first ever third tier team to make the semi final).
You’re spot on about us not giving a stuff about attendances, ground sizes, Premier League etc. Some fans of other clubs, including plenty of your fans, seem obsessed with being portrayed as a big club to other fans. We couldn’t give a monkeys and most of us actually revel in the fact that we punch above our weight. Biggest small club in the world and all that.
I actually know of Milllwall fans who wouldn’t want us to play in the PL and certainly wouldn’t want the ground expanded as they feel it would dilute the support. That’s not my personal opinion but plenty of our fans feel that way.
What would they do then if you reached the playoffs, want to lose ? Nonsense
Honestly, I’ve had this conversation with some of them, and find it utterly bizarre. They are in a minority, but there are some of our fans who wouldn’t want us going up. On my life.
Others say they just want a season or two up there and then come back down before the support changed too much and I sort of get that, although I don’t agree.
I get the opening paragraph totally.
From a fans view, particularly who go away, it is money draining with the fixtures being changed or in kick off times meaning overnight stays.
However, staying in the money league changes things for the finances of the club, the shitbags from SE25 highlight how it is.
PS @MillwallFan we share each others pain tonight. You're a good lad.
Cheers mate. Yeah sick as the proverbial parrot tonight. Gutted. Hey ho
The last time I went to a milllllllllllllllllllll game was the Stern John play-off game.
I vowed after after this I'll not see them again as quitting whilst ahead. I took this to against us home and away.
I was in Tropics before the 2-0 game, that night I was in the main stand, then joined in with "what a load of rubbish" I was not passing up on this!
My spanner herbert said if so and so says anything do not say you're Charlton(ffs).
In other words, milllll doing it today is NOTHING compared to the palice filth.
Not true. Yes the atmosphere at the old place was unique, mental and unbelievable a lot of the time. But people look back with rose tinted glasses. There was times when there was a few thousand rattling around in there, or when we were playing dead rubbers, and it was rubbish. And I’m saying that as someone who loved the old place and was bought up on those terraces.
We’ve had some absolutely electric (and very hostile) days in the new place and when all three home stands get going in unison it can give me goosebumps. When we played Huddersfield in the play off semis a few years back, that was as good an atmosphere as I’ve ever experienced, old or new. We could see the Huddersfield team literally melt before our eyes. Michael Calvin, the revered sports journalist who followed us around that season said the only atmosphere he could compare it to was when he witnessed Rangers win the title at Celtic Park.
I went to that Friday night Championship game v Wolves when Millwall were going for the play-offs. Did you go? That was very hostile. It appeared on that BBC Hooligan documentary, because the Wolves 'firm' had to call the police to save them from being murdered! The documentary shows them on coaches and mini-buses sheepishly entering the ground under escort, looking like they knew they had bitten off way more than they could chew. Dave Jones, the Wolves manager got so much abuse, he looked like he was going to have a break down. My work mate came along too, he was a bit of a ground hopper who supported Southend United, and said it was like going back to the 1970s, because as he was walking to ground he saw Millwall come flying out of the pub to attack the Wolves hooligan coaches and mini-buses (that appear on docu). Said it was like something out of Lord of the Rings. Hence they had to call for help. When Steve Claridge (I think) scored that late penalty I thought the roof was going to come off! And was just a league match, important yeah, but not do or die or anything.
You've tried your best but I really don't believe that you're a Charlton fan. Obsessed seems about right.
100% - if palace win the cup today there will be even more on here telling us how hard and loud they used to be
Palace hard and loud?! When was that.
No idea - Palace winning means u r now the only club south of the river with no major trophy so u will need to tell us even more how hard you used to be to compensate
What are you on about you silly old sod?? 😂
where have I been telling you how hard we used to be?? 🤷🏻🤷🏻 that was one of yours, this woodwork fella. Not me 😆
Not true. Yes the atmosphere at the old place was unique, mental and unbelievable a lot of the time. But people look back with rose tinted glasses. There was times when there was a few thousand rattling around in there, or when we were playing dead rubbers, and it was rubbish. And I’m saying that as someone who loved the old place and was bought up on those terraces.
We’ve had some absolutely electric (and very hostile) days in the new place and when all three home stands get going in unison it can give me goosebumps. When we played Huddersfield in the play off semis a few years back, that was as good an atmosphere as I’ve ever experienced, old or new. We could see the Huddersfield team literally melt before our eyes. Michael Calvin, the revered sports journalist who followed us around that season said the only atmosphere he could compare it to was when he witnessed Rangers win the title at Celtic Park.
I went to that Friday night Championship game v Wolves when Millwall were going for the play-offs. Did you go? That was very hostile. It appeared on that BBC Hooligan documentary, because the Wolves 'firm' had to call the police to save them from being murdered! The documentary shows them on coaches and mini-buses sheepishly entering the ground under escort, looking like they knew they had bitten off way more than they could chew. Dave Jones, the Wolves manager got so much abuse, he looked like he was going to have a break down. My work mate came along too, he was a bit of a ground hopper who supported Southend United, and said it was like going back to the 1970s, because as he was walking to ground he saw Millwall come flying out of the pub to attack the Wolves hooligan coaches and mini-buses (that appear on docu). Said it was like something out of Lord of the Rings. Hence they had to call for help. When Steve Claridge (I think) scored that late penalty I thought the roof was going to come off! And was just a league match, important yeah, but not do or die or anything.
You've tried your best but I really don't believe that you're a Charlton fan. Obsessed seems about right.
100% - if palace win the cup today there will be even more on here telling us how hard and loud they used to be
Palace hard and loud?! When was that.
No idea - Palace winning means u r now the only club south of the river with no major trophy so u will need to tell us even more how hard you used to be to compensate
What are you on about you silly old sod?? 😂
where have I been telling you how hard we used to be?? 🤷🏻🤷🏻 that was one of yours, this woodwork fella. Not me 😆
I must be one of the best qualified Charlton fans to talk about this.
My mum is a Millwall fan. All my maternal uncles and cousins are Millwall fans. My maternal grandad is a Millwall fan. My great grandad worked at the docks and was a Millwall fan when they reached two FA Cup Semi-Finals and earnt their nickname 'Lions of the South' by beating the mighty Aston Villa team of the late Victorian era. My other half is a Millwall fan.
My dad is a Charlton fan.
I was taken to The Valley first. But have been to many Millwall games over the years.
Millwall fans do not 'hate' Charlton. They see it as their biggest local derby. Because it is. I have been to Millwall Charlton games at The Den in the home end. It is that kind of derby. There was no hate. Just a desire to beat us. I can say that, because I have been along to Millwall v West Ham, Leeds, Birmingham City, Chelsea and Everton games. That was hate filled. I have even been to Millwall v Palace and that isn't seen as big as a local derby as us, it does have more spite to it than our games. Maybe because it more a dockers/proper SE London club v a fake south London, suburban club. Whereas Millwall v Charlton is an actual SE London derby proper. Most of us know Millwall fans, be they family, mates neighbours or work colleagues.
I don't think any of the Millwall fans I personally know ever say it is not a rivalry. They enjoy the rivalry. Why wouldn't they? They hardly ever lose it. In my entire life (45 years) they have only lost to us three times in the league. I was at Selhurst Park when they tonked us 3-0 in first top flight derby match between the two and they treated it as a nice day out, as pretty most of the ground was Millwall fans. But if you go to a Millwall Charlton match as a Charlton fan expecting the infamous Millwall hostility, you will be sadly let down. They just don't see us that way. I've been to normal league games between Millwall and Stoke, Cardiff or Portsmouth, and it is a feistier atmosphere than our games, as both sets of hooligans are out.
Another thing I will say about my Millwall fans is they are not like Palace fans at all. They really do not give a stuff whether we have a bigger ground or have played more top flight football at all. They genuinely do not care about those things. One thing they do care about is us winning the FA Cup. I am often reminded that Millwall are the best giant killers in FA Cup history. This is actual an official fact. No other club has knocked out more higher placed opponents than them. This includes champions of England, FA Cup holders etc. It kills them that they have never won it, despite such a good record for a lower league club (5 Semi Finals & one Final).
I have the same feelings towards them that they do towards us, probably cos I live with them. Ie I really, really want to beat them for bragging rights. But there is no hate. But it is a big local derby. And they would agree.
You must have very fond memories of your family get togethers at Belmarsh
Might come as a bit of a shock to some Millwall fans but quite a few dockers came from Woolwich/ Plumstead and walked thru the foot tunnel shoulder to shoulder to the Royals. My wife’s old man started at the London Docks, moved to Royal and finished up in Tilbury. Many others worked in Silvertown at Tate n Lyles & Cross & Blackwells as well as the foundries in Charlton. We’re not all bank managers
I must be one of the best qualified Charlton fans to talk about this.
My mum is a Millwall fan. All my maternal uncles and cousins are Millwall fans. My maternal grandad is a Millwall fan. My great grandad worked at the docks and was a Millwall fan when they reached two FA Cup Semi-Finals and earnt their nickname 'Lions of the South' by beating the mighty Aston Villa team of the late Victorian era. My other half is a Millwall fan.
My dad is a Charlton fan.
I was taken to The Valley first. But have been to many Millwall games over the years.
Millwall fans do not 'hate' Charlton. They see it as their biggest local derby. Because it is. I have been to Millwall Charlton games at The Den in the home end. It is that kind of derby. There was no hate. Just a desire to beat us. I can say that, because I have been along to Millwall v West Ham, Leeds, Birmingham City, Chelsea and Everton games. That was hate filled. I have even been to Millwall v Palace and that isn't seen as big as a local derby as us, it does have more spite to it than our games. Maybe because it more a dockers/proper SE London club v a fake south London, suburban club. Whereas Millwall v Charlton is an actual SE London derby proper. Most of us know Millwall fans, be they family, mates neighbours or work colleagues.
I don't think any of the Millwall fans I personally know ever say it is not a rivalry. They enjoy the rivalry. Why wouldn't they? They hardly ever lose it. In my entire life (45 years) they have only lost to us three times in the league. I was at Selhurst Park when they tonked us 3-0 in first top flight derby match between the two and they treated it as a nice day out, as pretty most of the ground was Millwall fans. But if you go to a Millwall Charlton match as a Charlton fan expecting the infamous Millwall hostility, you will be sadly let down. They just don't see us that way. I've been to normal league games between Millwall and Stoke, Cardiff or Portsmouth, and it is a feistier atmosphere than our games, as both sets of hooligans are out.
Another thing I will say about my Millwall fans is they are not like Palace fans at all. They really do not give a stuff whether we have a bigger ground or have played more top flight football at all. They genuinely do not care about those things. One thing they do care about is us winning the FA Cup. I am often reminded that Millwall are the best giant killers in FA Cup history. This is actual an official fact. No other club has knocked out more higher placed opponents than them. This includes champions of England, FA Cup holders etc. It kills them that they have never won it, despite such a good record for a lower league club (5 Semi Finals & one Final).
I have the same feelings towards them that they do towards us, probably cos I live with them. Ie I really, really want to beat them for bragging rights. But there is no hate. But it is a big local derby. And they would agree.
You must have very fond memories of your family get togethers at Belmarsh
Ironically, it is my dad, the Charlton fan, who is considered the black sheep of the family! I never even heard my Millwall supporting grandad swear & my uncle is a mild mannered quantity surveyor!!
Re the ‘bigging them up for being hard’, it was more @MillwallFan reminded me of this documentary (it was big deal at time, as England were bidding for the 2006 World Cup) & the fact that I went to that Wolves match featured on it and my work mate (a Southend fan & Primary school teacher - so far from being a ‘geezer’) just so happened to witness the Wolves hooligans getting attack & then calling police for help! No conspiracy theory!!
I must be one of the best qualified Charlton fans to talk about this.
My mum is a Millwall fan. All my maternal uncles and cousins are Millwall fans. My maternal grandad is a Millwall fan. My great grandad worked at the docks and was a Millwall fan when they reached two FA Cup Semi-Finals and earnt their nickname 'Lions of the South' by beating the mighty Aston Villa team of the late Victorian era. My other half is a Millwall fan.
My dad is a Charlton fan.
I was taken to The Valley first. But have been to many Millwall games over the years.
Millwall fans do not 'hate' Charlton. They see it as their biggest local derby. Because it is. I have been to Millwall Charlton games at The Den in the home end. It is that kind of derby. There was no hate. Just a desire to beat us. I can say that, because I have been along to Millwall v West Ham, Leeds, Birmingham City, Chelsea and Everton games. That was hate filled. I have even been to Millwall v Palace and that isn't seen as big as a local derby as us, it does have more spite to it than our games. Maybe because it more a dockers/proper SE London club v a fake south London, suburban club. Whereas Millwall v Charlton is an actual SE London derby proper. Most of us know Millwall fans, be they family, mates neighbours or work colleagues.
I don't think any of the Millwall fans I personally know ever say it is not a rivalry. They enjoy the rivalry. Why wouldn't they? They hardly ever lose it. In my entire life (45 years) they have only lost to us three times in the league. I was at Selhurst Park when they tonked us 3-0 in first top flight derby match between the two and they treated it as a nice day out, as pretty most of the ground was Millwall fans. But if you go to a Millwall Charlton match as a Charlton fan expecting the infamous Millwall hostility, you will be sadly let down. They just don't see us that way. I've been to normal league games between Millwall and Stoke, Cardiff or Portsmouth, and it is a feistier atmosphere than our games, as both sets of hooligans are out.
Another thing I will say about my Millwall fans is they are not like Palace fans at all. They really do not give a stuff whether we have a bigger ground or have played more top flight football at all. They genuinely do not care about those things. One thing they do care about is us winning the FA Cup. I am often reminded that Millwall are the best giant killers in FA Cup history. This is actual an official fact. No other club has knocked out more higher placed opponents than them. This includes champions of England, FA Cup holders etc. It kills them that they have never won it, despite such a good record for a lower league club (5 Semi Finals & one Final).
I have the same feelings towards them that they do towards us, probably cos I live with them. Ie I really, really want to beat them for bragging rights. But there is no hate. But it is a big local derby. And they would agree.
That may have been the first top flight derby match between the two sides, but only because we were in the top flight for a couple of decades without our near neighbours. Our record against them is appalling, although under Seed I believe it was played two, won two?
Comments
A Charlton V Millwall fixture - will always be a heated local London rivalry derby. Set in stone.
We have been dreadful against them over the last 29 years but its still a fixture to highly anticipate.
I just wish a considerable percentage of their fans weren't born thugs and didn't also hate every other club on the planet.
It would then be more of a direct 1 on 1 personal rivalry.
More like a Portsmouth/Southampton
Birmingham/villa etc
Not great examples but you get the point etc
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=l73hbZ-CiPI
Anyways, it is a nice bit of social history if you like that sort of thing!