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England v Germany - Match Thread
Comments
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Tbf I dont think Mings did much wrong and Ukraine like to cross the ball and he has been pretty solid dealing with crosses. Not ideal no but if Maguire gets a booking I would rather Mings play Ukraine than Denmark4
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I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.9
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It's not resting, it's protecting. I'd rather play mings and not risk losing Maguire for the Semi. Mings is good enough to play against Ukraine.LawrieAbrahams said:I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.1 -
That has to be true. We can believe that they are potentially the least challenging opponents we have faced in the competition and we are probably right. But Southgate or the players have to approach the game as if they will be the most challenging. That doesn't mean that on looking at their strengths and weaknesses we don't set up differently and if we are comfortable we try a few things we wouldn't otherwise.LawrieAbrahams said:I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.0 -
Surely no manager would risk the backlash if he put out non-first XI on a major tournament quarter final and his team got beat.Dazzler21 said:
It's not resting, it's protecting. I'd rather play mings and not risk losing Maguire for the Semi. Mings is good enough to play against Ukraine.LawrieAbrahams said:I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.At this stage you play your best players available in each game.0 -
Two games in 5 days for Maguire who was injured at the start of the tournament - that alone might be enough reason that Southgate should rest him, plus the booking issue.
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Trouble is if we beat Ukraine yet lose to Denmark because we dont have Maguire, Phillips, Rice you just know that the social media / newspaper arguments will turn on its head and the question will be why werent those three restedse9addick said:
Surely no manager would risk the backlash if he put out non-first XI on a major tournament quarter final and his team got beat.Dazzler21 said:
It's not resting, it's protecting. I'd rather play mings and not risk losing Maguire for the Semi. Mings is good enough to play against Ukraine.LawrieAbrahams said:I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.At this stage you play your best players available in each game.2 -
Maguire got 15 yellows in 54 apps for United last season. You’d trust him not to get booked in a game where the defence shouldn’t be under much pressure.1
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Tell you what. There are 1 or 2 posters who were battering Southgate / England on every single page before last night, and they’re nowhere to be seen right now.8
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Maybe because it's a wednesday and there's no games on for two days?cafctom said:Tell you what. There are 1 or 2 posters who were battering Southgate / England on every single page before last night, and they’re nowhere to be seen right now.
I think you'll find most of those posters after last night praised the team and are now giving Southgate plenty of credit.3 - Sponsored links:
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They'll be back as soon as we get knocked out.cafctom said:Tell you what. There are 1 or 2 posters who were battering Southgate / England on every single page before last night, and they’re nowhere to be seen right now.
Unless of course it really does come home, in that case their profile pics should be replaced with screenshots of their anti Gareth comments.
For now I'd like to say "Party on Garth" (Gareth)1 -
Don't worry all the comments will return, unless we win the competition.cafctom said:Tell you what. There are 1 or 2 posters who were battering Southgate / England on every single page before last night, and they’re nowhere to be seen right now.5 -
Southgate has been brave enough to ignore the media so far, so I can't see him being swayed now.ForeverAddickted said:
Trouble is if we beat Ukraine yet lose to Denmark because we dont have Maguire, Phillips, Rice you just know that the social media / newspaper arguments will turn on its head and the question will be why werent those three restedse9addick said:
Surely no manager would risk the backlash if he put out non-first XI on a major tournament quarter final and his team got beat.Dazzler21 said:
It's not resting, it's protecting. I'd rather play mings and not risk losing Maguire for the Semi. Mings is good enough to play against Ukraine.LawrieAbrahams said:I don't think you can rest players in a QF, regardless of who you are playing.At this stage you play your best players available in each game.
He'll do what he thinks is right.3 -
Trouble is it’s not necessarily all down to Maguire. One daft bit of refereeing, or a stupid pass by a teammate that means he has to “take one for the team” to stop a Ukrainian going through on goal (like Rice did vs Germany) and he’s out of the next game.ValleyGary said:Maguire got 15 yellows in 54 apps for United last season. You’d trust him not to get booked in a game where the defence shouldn’t be under much pressure.You don’t want to treat this like a Carabao Cup second round match but England are now blessed with enough depth that you can protect Magiire and one of Rice and Phillips without really weakening the team.2 -
Different perspective (for the purposes 'balance') -Dazzler21 said:Grealish turned the game because he came on against a tiring Germany. I do not believe he'd have added any more than Saka did had he started in his place.
Southgate is getting it right so far. As boring as the football may seem.
You could argue that Southgate is getting it right and that he's a tactical genius; or, you could also argue that he's fumbling in the dark and riding his luck(?). His decisions are underpinned by his risk-averse nature.
For instance, if Havertz's half volley had gone 6 inches either side of Pickford, it's a goal. If Müller hadn't have missed a sitter, it's extra time and penalties, etc.
Germany were a pedestrian, mediocre side. Yes, history makes us view the result in a slightly blinkered way, but they are not a great side at all. Just like the road to the 2018 semi-final, we haven't faced anyone to really test us. In this instance, that will now not happen until the final, and that's when Southgate should be judged, arguably.
I personally don't understand the propensity to insist that we play with 2 defensive midfielders, just like I don't understand how Grealish doesn't start, but then again that's why I am not a football manager. At the end of the day, it's a game of opinions 'Saint' and we are in a quarter-final! Nonetheless, I am enjoying the ride.
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You can question Southgates team selection and tactics whilst acknowledging the team is doing well.
how many times have you seen Charlton lose a game but said you wouldn’t be able to watch that opposition all season due to the way they play.?90% of pre tournament comments were about how much attacking flair this squad has and that we should be really going for it against teams and how the defence is weak link.Southgate has addressed the defensive side of things at a cost to the attack. The number of goal attempts we have in the group games attests to that.I’m an ideal world we would the tournament playing like Brazil 70 but if not that, then let’s just try and win.Southgate is pragmatic. He is there to get the result and not high scores for looking pretty on the pitch.3 -
It would make sense to rest Maguire,and either Rice or Phillips,the team would not be weakened by playing Mings,or Henderson.0
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Our depth also means we no longer have to fear injuries. Remember the drama of past tournaments, pondering whether Rooney, Beckham, etc. would be able to make it, and essentially all our hopes resting on a player being fit. I think you could take any players out of this England side and there's a good replacement waiting in the wings.8
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thickandthin63 said:It would make sense to rest Maguire,and either Rice or Phillips,the team would not be weakened by playing Mings,or Henderson.
Agreed
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I haven't seen anyone pick up on this but apologies if I have missed it. When push came to shove, he picked 7 of the 11 that played in the world cup semi final.
I know Germany had a couple of world cup winners but that was thier first knock out game in 5 years. Only 3 or 4 of them ever played in a knockout game.
This is already Sterling's s 4th major tournament and the core of this team will probably go all the way to the USA in 2026.
We have got a seriously good chance of winning something in the next 5 years.5 -
Three things stand out from that:Callumcafc said:
1) George hasn't a clue what's happened. Why did William and Kate take him? They could have picked up any kid who knows about football on the way to the ground and stuck him in that privileged seat.
2) Why was Neuer diving before the ball even got to Sterling? If he'd stayed on his feet he might have got to the ball.
3) Pickford at the end looks like he's kicked the post without any boots on.4 -
Especially now we're not playing a central midfield of Lingard & Alli.0
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OK, lets get our feet back on the ground now, enough of how great we are. We won our last game, but The Germans are not the all conquering force they once were, although still a force to be reckoned with. We have rode our luck well, (all 4 games), they didn't. We had two goals, that in the cold light of day, were as good as any passing movement goal from any team in the euros. But we did have few errors that on another day would have cost us. At 0-0 even a bad team can sneak a goal and then park the bus, that could of but happily didn't happen. That wasn't a final and I have seen this euphoria all before only to be severely disappointed.
As much as it seems we have a favorable draw the other teams will have a game plan to combat ours, especially at this stage. I don't believe there are bad sides in the Euros, some are better than others, some have a large slice good luck and some have the opposite. If I sound a little negative that come from supporting Charlton and England for bloody decades. I know other teams don't and won't relish playing us, certainly not in the QF & hopefully the SF, (and dare I say it final) at Wembley but like most England supporters we have seen so many false dawns.2 -
Combined with the Henderson video when Kane scored, thats the Southgate effect for me - These are attitudes from players Ive never seen with the England teambobmunro said:5 -
I’m sorry but what a weird thing to say number 1 is. I took my little girl down the valley when she was 6, she didn’t have a scooby what the rules were but she loved the atmosphere and has asked to go again. WTF does them being privileged have to do with it? ‘Footballs for everyone’ right?AddicksAddict said:
Three things stand out from that:Callumcafc said:
1) George hasn't a clue what's happened. Why did William and Kate take him? They could have picked up any kid who knows about football on the way to the ground and stuck him in that privileged seat.
2) Why was Neuer diving before the ball even got to Sterling? If he'd stayed on his feet he might have got to the ball.
3) Pickford at the end looks like he's kicked the post without any boots on.
If those are the 3 things you’ve picked, I think George might know a bit more about the game than you do.6 -
I’m not sure the Royal Family can get away with kidnapping urchins off the streets of London anymore!AddicksAddict said:
Three things stand out from that:Callumcafc said:
1) George hasn't a clue what's happened. Why did William and Kate take him? They could have picked up any kid who knows about football on the way to the ground and stuck him in that privileged seat.
2) Why was Neuer diving before the ball even got to Sterling? If he'd stayed on his feet he might have got to the ball.
3) Pickford at the end looks like he's kicked the post without any boots on.
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This first bit isnt a criticism of point two but Neuer is one of the best Goalkeepers in the world.AddicksAddict said:
Three things stand out from that:Callumcafc said:
1) George hasn't a clue what's happened. Why did William and Kate take him? They could have picked up any kid who knows about football on the way to the ground and stuck him in that privileged seat.
2) Why was Neuer diving before the ball even got to Sterling? If he'd stayed on his feet he might have got to the ball.
3) Pickford at the end looks like he's kicked the post without any boots on.
It looks like he's got down on his knees early as he's able to anticipate exactly what type of shot is coming from Sterling - Had Sterling fluffed his effort closer to Neuer, then the 'keeper was already down at that level and could have been a comfortable save, had he still been on his feet then I imagine he'd have been forced to use his feet to try and save it, else he wasnt getting down quick enough.1 -
bazjonster said:
Different perspective (for the purposes 'balance') -Dazzler21 said:Grealish turned the game because he came on against a tiring Germany. I do not believe he'd have added any more than Saka did had he started in his place.
Southgate is getting it right so far. As boring as the football may seem.
You could argue that Southgate is getting it right and that he's a tactical genius; or, you could also argue that he's fumbling in the dark and riding his luck(?). His decisions are underpinned by his risk-averse nature.
For instance, if Havertz's half volley had gone 6 inches either side of Pickford, it's a goal. If Müller hadn't have missed a sitter, it's extra time and penalties, etc.
Germany were a pedestrian, mediocre side. Yes, history makes us view the result in a slightly blinkered way, but they are not a great side at all. Just like the road to the 2018 semi-final, we haven't faced anyone to really test us. In this instance, that will now not happen until the final, and that's when Southgate should be judged, arguably.
I personally don't understand the propensity to insist that we play with 2 defensive midfielders, just like I don't understand how Grealish doesn't start, but then again that's why I am not a football manager. At the end of the day, it's a game of opinions 'Saint' and we are in a quarter-final! Nonetheless, I am enjoying the ride.No, you really couldn't. Not if you were being serious. We are through to the Quarters without conceding a single goal, the only team to have done that. Our group included a recent World Cup finalist who made it to the last 16, taking Spain to extra time, and a team who just knocked Netherlands out and are into the Quarters. We beat them both. We beat a Germany team that put 4 past Portugal because Southgate figured them out and his players did their jobs. You can't say that a manager is lucky purely because the opposition miss chances. We had a Sterling shot saved and Kane had a near-open goal that he fluffed. Those chances count for nothing though, it's the results that matter.It's funny how the rules shift for Southgate every time isn't it. We got to a World Cup semi-final for the first time in 28 years but it doesn't count because England apparently lost against the first decent side they came up against. We beat Croatia since then, but it didn't count because it was the Nations League, so Southgate still bad. Then we beat them in these Euros but it didn't count because some of their players are different. Now we've beaten Germany and they're suddenly mediocre despite tearing Portugal apart and boasting 9 Champions League winners in their squad. Honestly, if we got to the final and beat Belgium people would claim we had an easy run and Roberto Martinez used to manage Wigan so it still doesn't count. Southgate will never win some fans over and they will be waiting to pounce after a bad result regardless of what has gone before
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