ShootersHillGuru said:

thenewbie said:

So from what Bowyer is saying it seems the vast majority of terms etc are fine and all agreed, but there are a few details still being worked on.

Why it's taken what seems a long time I do not know but I would presume that if it is indeed a five year contract it has to cover a lot of potential futures, and have terms and conditions that vary depending on which division we are in in each of those years - LB should get paid more as a Championship manager than a League One manager but that leads to complications I presume.

Not just about money. Length of contract. Escape clause. Compensation. How compensation is payed. Assurances over staff and budget. Reviews of salary based on success or otherwise. Control of signings. The list is endless.

I do not know if this will help anyone but I thought it worth saying.  Football players for English clubs have a nice template contract.  The blanks are filled in (money, length etc) maybe a few riders are added and bingo, contract complete and signed. 

Perhaps surprisingly, there is no such standard contract for managers.  While the League Managers' Association stands ready to provide advice to its members, these contracts will be far more complex and pretty much bespoke rather than prêt-à-porter.  They will need to include notice periods, gardening leave, poaching clauses, etc, etc.  Some clauses take on much more significance the longer the contract.  If anyone doubts the complexity, look up Bruce/Palace, Conte/Chelsea or Curbishley/West Ham.

Then, in football, 5 years is almost equivalent to the Mesozoic Era.  How many managers' contracts has Southall seen recently?  Probably none.  And don't forget Bowyer will have little experience of managers' contracts apart from the post-it note that Duchatelet got him to sign.  Both the club and Lee would be well advised to seek expert legal input and that takes time.

 

That's why Lee, quite rightly, uses an agent who will have seen lots of contracts.

BTW does anyone know more about Rob Segal's background?

I posted this on the "Bowyer Talks" thread, but maybe it belongs on here?

clive said:

https://www.cafc.co.uk/news/view/5e20746f5b160/bowyer-on-his-new-contract-players-returning-from-injury-and-looking-ahead-to-preston

"Like I said, me and my team have worked hard and I think that we deserved to be treated the same as other people in other clubs, so that’s all we’ve ever asked for and it looks like that’s going to happen."

This contract situation, as I think it reads, is not just about Bowyer.
It also includes the playing Management team.

Maybe Bowyer's insisted on that and it's been one of the sticking points?

LargeAddick said:

cafcfan said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

thenewbie said:

So from what Bowyer is saying it seems the vast majority of terms etc are fine and all agreed, but there are a few details still being worked on.

Why it's taken what seems a long time I do not know but I would presume that if it is indeed a five year contract it has to cover a lot of potential futures, and have terms and conditions that vary depending on which division we are in in each of those years - LB should get paid more as a Championship manager than a League One manager but that leads to complications I presume.

Not just about money. Length of contract. Escape clause. Compensation. How compensation is payed. Assurances over staff and budget. Reviews of salary based on success or otherwise. Control of signings. The list is endless.

I do not know if this will help anyone but I thought it worth saying.  Football players for English clubs have a nice template contract.  The blanks are filled in (money, length etc) maybe a few riders are added and bingo, contract complete and signed. 

Perhaps surprisingly, there is no such standard contract for managers.  While the League Managers' Association stands ready to provide advice to its members, these contracts will be far more complex and pretty much bespoke rather than prêt-à-porter.  They will need to include notice periods, gardening leave, poaching clauses, etc, etc.  Some clauses take on much more significance the longer the contract.  If anyone doubts the complexity, look up Bruce/Palace, Conte/Chelsea or Curbishley/West Ham.

Then, in football, 5 years is almost equivalent to the Mesozoic Era.  How many managers' contracts has Southall seen recently?  Probably none.  And don't forget Bowyer will have little experience of managers' contracts apart from the post-it note that Duchatelet got him to sign.  Both the club and Lee would be well advised to seek expert legal input and that takes time.

 

I thought @bobmonro said the other day there was a standard LMA contract? He should know.

There is a base template- but as @cafcfan says a manager's contract has much more bespoking required than a player's.

Oggy Red said:

I posted this on the "Bowyer Talks" thread, but maybe it belongs on here?

clive said:

https://www.cafc.co.uk/news/view/5e20746f5b160/bowyer-on-his-new-contract-players-returning-from-injury-and-looking-ahead-to-preston

"Like I said, me and my team have worked hard and I think that we deserved to be treated the same as other people in other clubs, so that’s all we’ve ever asked for and it looks like that’s going to happen."

This contract situation, as I think it reads, is not just about Bowyer.
It also includes the playing Management team.

Maybe Bowyer's insisted on that and it's been one of the sticking points?

FFS. Very disappointed.

"My team and I".

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

Braziliance said:

Just out of curiosity how complex is it to sign a manager that wants to stay and the owners apparently want to keep.

They were all in the same vicinity at the weekend, we were told they would talk, they did, it's now 5 nights since then and we are still 'very very close' surely it's a pressing matter and they should be getting to the bottom of it rather than letting the days go by. Each to their own but if I had just bought a football club and truly wanted the manager to stay, I would make time for him and not leave that room until we come to an agreement. I don't understand the hold up 

MS - "Gonna offer £7k a week"
LB - "£12k!"
MS - "£8k!"
LB - "£10K!"
MS - "DONE"
LB - "Right let's go do the pub......"

Wake me up when Bows is very very very very very very very very very very
very very very very very very very very
very very very very very very very very
very very very very very very very very
very very very very very very very very
close to signing that fucking contract!

Ta

TEL said:

Leeds_Addick said:

PaddyP17 said:

soapboxsam said:

ShootersHillGuru said:

SoundAsa£ said:

Jamie19 said:

Covered End said:

Scoham said:

Covered End said:

charltonbob said:

Covered End said:

Cafc43v3r said:

Covered End said:

bobmunro said:

MuttleyCAFC said:

Just calling it as I see it. I think it is vitally important we give ourselves as much chance as possible on Saturday. Others may not be so bothered but it is a valid position seeing as we have had over two weeks to deal with what we should all agree is a crisis.

Buying new players isn't like going to the supermarket, sticking them in the trolley, and checking-out!

It starts with expressing interest/seeking permission to speak - and from that point onwards the vast majority of decisions are outwith the buying club's control.

Yes I am concerned, but not because I believe we are not trying.

So many football fans are fantasists.

They must think we speak to a player/manager and they should just sign almost immediately on the dotted line.

We're Charlton you're not allowed to have time to think whether the deal is acceptable.
We're Charlton just sign right here and now and no you can't discuss it with you partner.
We're Charlton sign now, we don't care if you have issues with your kids and schools.
We're Charlton, we don't get if you'll have to move house or live in a hotel for 6 months, sign here & now.
We're Charlton .....

But none of that is the case with Bowyer. 

Southall said he spoke him about not leaving for another club.  The smart money is either Cardiff or Huddersfield.  That would have been mid November.  3 months ago. 

The take over was announced at the end of November.   

It received EFL approval in the first week of January. 

If you number 1 priority was to get the incumbent manager to sign a new contract, why has it taken over 90 days to actually offer a contract?  That appears to be not actually be acceptable to Bowyer?

I used the word "stinks" last night, which was probably to strong, but something doesn't add up to me. 

What is wrong is that Bowyer hasn't agreed the contract.
It's a negotiation.
Who knows the terms, but I'd suggest it's not straight forward.

Negotiation is fine, the fact that we've been negotiating since October isn't. Obviously it's not straight forward which is why he hasn't signed. No player is going to sign if they don't know if LB is staying.

Now this is why you're getting in such a state.
They haven't been negotiating since October.

NB I expect a signing to be announced very soon.

A signing soon, is that just a guess or something more?

I'm hoping Toffolo will be signed this week.

Covered End said:

Scoham said:

Covered End said:

charltonbob said:

Covered End said:

Cafc43v3r said:

Covered End said:

bobmunro said:

MuttleyCAFC said:

Just calling it as I see it. I think it is vitally important we give ourselves as much chance as possible on Saturday. Others may not be so bothered but it is a valid position seeing as we have had over two weeks to deal with what we should all agree is a crisis.

Buying new players isn't like going to the supermarket, sticking them in the trolley, and checking-out!

It starts with expressing interest/seeking permission to speak - and from that point onwards the vast majority of decisions are outwith the buying club's control.

Yes I am concerned, but not because I believe we are not trying.

So many football fans are fantasists.

They must think we speak to a player/manager and they should just sign almost immediately on the dotted line.

We're Charlton you're not allowed to have time to think whether the deal is acceptable.
We're Charlton just sign right here and now and no you can't discuss it with you partner.
We're Charlton sign now, we don't care if you have issues with your kids and schools.
We're Charlton, we don't get if you'll have to move house or live in a hotel for 6 months, sign here & now.
We're Charlton .....

But none of that is the case with Bowyer. 

Southall said he spoke him about not leaving for another club.  The smart money is either Cardiff or Huddersfield.  That would have been mid November.  3 months ago. 

The take over was announced at the end of November.   

It received EFL approval in the first week of January. 

If you number 1 priority was to get the incumbent manager to sign a new contract, why has it taken over 90 days to actually offer a contract?  That appears to be not actually be acceptable to Bowyer?

I used the word "stinks" last night, which was probably to strong, but something doesn't add up to me. 

What is wrong is that Bowyer hasn't agreed the contract.
It's a negotiation.
Who knows the terms, but I'd suggest it's not straight forward.

Negotiation is fine, the fact that we've been negotiating since October isn't. Obviously it's not straight forward which is why he hasn't signed. No player is going to sign if they don't know if LB is staying.

Now this is why you're getting in such a state.
They haven't been negotiating since October.

NB I expect a signing to be announced very soon.

A signing soon, is that just a guess or something more?

I'm hoping Toffolo will be signed this week.

He’s going Huddersfield isn’t he ?

Going TO Huddersfield!!!!

No. Going t’Huddersfield

E by gum, going t'udders.

E by gum is the way Yorkshire folk do drugs.

@Leeds_Addick can you confirm please

'Goan 'uddersfield' is the correct translation, thanks.

T' missing....

 The T would be to express "to the" so not needed here.

Thought I would add a comment just to keep this thread alive

NapaAddick said:

Wonder if this thread, like the takeover thread, reaches 2000+ pages before he signs a contract.

It will never end, as soon as he signs a new contract there will be people on here the next day panicking that he has only 4 years and 364 days left and the club is going to get relegated 

ElfsborgAddick said:

i_b_b_o_r_g said:

MuttleyCAFC said:

I don't want you to apologise. There have been a number of posts where in isolation it is just disagreeing but when put together it feels personal. We have had run ins in the past so I am saying I find it tiring. Now if it is just we disagree on virtually everything, fair enough, it probably illustrates what I am saying. I can certainly try to steer clear of you if you do so with me.

Well uf those are your rules mate, then I'd better stick to em.

And I'm sorry for apologising too...

Apologising is a crime nowadays, it appears.

I’m sorry but it’s not.

hoof_it_up_to_benty said:

Amazed he hasn't signed yet - not filling anyone with confidence.

If you watch the press Conference from Thursday I don’t think there’s anything to be worried about, I think it’ll be done by the middle of next week latest, he said there’s a few small things to be done including sorting the back room staff.

Jamie19 said:

hoof_it_up_to_benty said:

Amazed he hasn't signed yet - not filling anyone with confidence.

If you watch the press Conference from Thursday I don’t think there’s anything to be worried about, I think it’ll be done by the middle of next week latest, he said there’s a few small things to be done including sorting the back room staff.

I wonder if Bowyer said something along the lines, "I'm only signing if my management team are signed up too?"
Hence a further delay.

The whole point of a 5 year contract for Bowyer, I should imagine, is to bring stability to the club plus give him time to build and develop the team.
And that includes his management team ...... he won't want to do that without Jacko, Gallen and Marshall - plus other key backroom staff.

Jamie19 said:

hoof_it_up_to_benty said:

Amazed he hasn't signed yet - not filling anyone with confidence.

If you watch the press Conference from Thursday I don’t think there’s anything to be worried about, I think it’ll be done by the middle of next week latest, he said there’s a few small things to be done including sorting the back room staff.

And last Saturday he said he hoped he’d be signing on Monday. I suppose he didn’t say which Monday ....