RD admits mistakes and says he needs to stop us being relegated, so goes out and signs a 29 year old right back who has not played this season, still trying to work out his reasoning
The reasoning is how RD sees football and his ownership of football clubs. A number of people have said that he has no interest in football, but this is wrong. I know that he is very interested in football but in a way that is different to the rest of us. We see football as trying to build a team that can compete, trying to get a balanced side, looking for some entertainment during the game. We want to see our academy producing players for the first team, but in the context of a side which also has experienced pros who can mentor them through the toughness of competing in the championship.
In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold? Then in terms of play, how many accurate passes, assists, goals, tackles, and so on does the player make. He is the ultimate statto. The good player is the one with the best stats and can give the best financial return. Which league and level the player is at does not seem relevant,
I think that RD is measuring Riga's success on stats as well. How many games left, how many points needed, how many points per game required. So in RD's mind, is the team returning enough points per the games whilst Riga is charge for the rest of the season? At the moment we are below the determined line, but a win tomorrow and we are back on track, so would be considered a success. I think this is how he has measured all of the coaches. I suspect that RD's thinks Fraeye was a good coach but his statistical return was not good enough so had to go. RD treats coaches as junior business managers with targets to meet. I also think that RD has done the same sort of statistical analysis on potential coaches as he has on players. There little chance on having a UK coach as they are, in his mind, not good enough on a value for money basis (using his model). The are just too expensive against what they might return. This seems to go for the support coaching staff as well.
RD still believes that the club can break even and be competitive in the Championship. He was counting of FFP coming into place, so the changes to it has been a set back. However, as far as I can tell, he thinks that there is a model out there which will allow break even. His arguments seems to be that as he can achieve nearly break even in other parts of Europe, so why not in the UK. I believe he has been told that the Championship, with its financial madness (too much money coming down from the PL but not enough shared around all sides to make it truly competitive in both footballing and financial terms), is different to virtually every other league in Europe. The cost of players here is inflated and there is little that can be done to stop this as an individual club. I'm not sure he accepts this line and is determined to press ahead with his experiment.
He does seem to have acknowledged that there has not been enough depth in the squad to be competitive but I'm not sure he understands how to add the necessary depth. This is partly because players are measured by him as a set of statistics, so if the stats show the player is, say, a good RB, then he must be. How can the stats be wrong? This ignores all of the human elements, such as would this player be a good fit, how well do they know the Championship, and so on.
Every transfer window we have Colin saying we are chasing after this player or that and is often accused of making this stuff up. I think this is unfair because as far as I can tell, we have gone after many of the players he has talked about. But this is only half the story. For the most part, we will never sign them. Because RD is holding to this idea of treating players as assets which he can get a (financial) return on, his budgeting for each player seems to be very strict, both in terms of price and running cost. He is looking at what return he can get. There have been players where negotiations were a long way down the road, but the running costs were then evaluated and considered just too much to get a return. So we end up constantly getting cheap players, but with good playing stats, from other leagues.
We can see the major flaws in all of this, that reducing everything to the bottom line and a series of stats, ignores the real value of building a balanced side of players who can play in this league, and having a competitive team which might get you into the PL. (although I understand that RD still stating an ambition to get to the PL). It is where we are though, and there is little evidence that RD wants to abandon his project.
For what its worth, I think RD is concerned about the current state of the club the protests, and so on, and is looking for solutions. I suspect that he has been told a great deal this week. Whether he has properly heard the reality of the situation and where solutions can be found is an entirely different matter.
Hey, the really important thing is that he wants us to be the nicest club in London (you know, the sort of club where no-one complains, or points out awkward stuff like the cretinous manner in which the regime is running the club....
What he means by being the nicest is that we let other teams visit us and we give them 3 points.
Well done to the Mods on here, and for those of you who protest. Keep in mind that you have brought RD to the table. What he is saying is obviously not ideal, rather it's incredibly stupid, but you have forced him to start speaking to his decisions and attempting to outline how he runs the club. The problem remains, how on earth does he run this club?
This is something I have been thinking about over the last few days. It seems RD is determined to be with us for the a while yet. He also seems to be worried about things and has shown some signs of wanting to communicate. Against that, the protest aims are for him to leave which, at the moment, seems unlikely.
Assuming that RD does want to listen and do things in a better way (I know this might not be the case) what, if anything, would people be willing to accept so that we go from being a club at war with itself to one where we have people working collaboratively for the benefit for the club and for all?
The fight and the stand off can continue and that potentially leads to the club withering and dying. But if we can get RD properly to a negotiating table and we decide to work together, what does that look like in practice?
I know this might never happen and that there will be a wide range of views on this. For some it is all or nothing, for others it is purely about results on the playing field. But I think it is worth discussing what a plan B might be if there is an opportunity to change the club's direction.
Very well put. This just feels like a never ending nightmare at the moment. Everyone can see how inept Pinnochio is, except he who can do something about it. I really do despair. I think the only thing that will be effective now is some kind of organised total boycott or walk out. Im sure many people feel like me.
I just cannot see anyway back for this regime and that in turn makes me really fear for the future of the club.
The bit where he says a big squad will leave 2/3rds of the players unhappy.
Unhappy individuals (that could also still be loaned out and managed better) is more important then charlton itself. Can he give an example of a big squad f*cking things up?
The bit where he says a big squad will leave 2/3rds of the players unhappy.
Unhappy individuals (that could also still be loaned out and managed better) is more important then charlton itself. Can he give an example of a big squad f*cking things up?
The clubs failings makes the fans unhappy.
Players forced to continue playing until either...
- short term injuries become long term (Vetokele, Diarra, Bauer and possibly others?), - they faint during half time (Cousins), - they end up playing so far out of their depth it's unfair (Piotr for 3 minutes, Naby for many more) - they're young and without support, meaning they lose confidence and get abuse (Fox), - they're no longer fit enough for a full 90 but continue out of necessity (Jackson), - (...I could go on...)
... must be so much better for their happiness.
Thank God Roland's looking out for their morale, I'd hate to see what he'd be doing if he didn't give a shit.
I think PITL has it right. If the protests die, the significant number of protesters will stay away. Unfortunately some for good. L1 will lose fans anyway. Was in Spain for last protest but there Saturday but not at match. Going to Bees and Fulham but in away ends. Will have no contact with the club financially until they are gone. My nephew ditto. Harder for him in away ends as he has a tattoo of the badge.
RD admits mistakes and says he needs to stop us being relegated, so goes out and signs a 29 year old right back who has not played this season, still trying to work out his reasoning
The reasoning is how RD sees football and his ownership of football clubs. A number of people have said that he has no interest in football, but this is wrong. I know that he is very interested in football but in a way that is different to the rest of us. We see football as trying to build a team that can compete, trying to get a balanced side, looking for some entertainment during the game. We want to see our academy producing players for the first team, but in the context of a side which also has experienced pros who can mentor them through the toughness of competing in the championship.
In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold? Then in terms of play, how many accurate passes, assists, goals, tackles, and so on does the player make. He is the ultimate statto. The good player is the one with the best stats and can give the best financial return. Which league and level the player is at does not seem relevant,
I think that RD is measuring Riga's success on stats as well. How many games left, how many points needed, how many points per game required. So in RD's mind, is the team returning enough points per the games whilst Riga is charge for the rest of the season? At the moment we are below the determined line, but a win tomorrow and we are back on track, so would be considered a success. I think this is how he has measured all of the coaches. I suspect that RD's thinks Fraeye was a good coach but his statistical return was not good enough so had to go. RD treats coaches as junior business managers with targets to meet. I also think that RD has done the same sort of statistical analysis on potential coaches as he has on players. There little chance on having a UK coach as they are, in his mind, not good enough on a value for money basis (using his model). The are just too expensive against what they might return. This seems to go for the support coaching staff as well.
RD still believes that the club can break even and be competitive in the Championship. He was counting of FFP coming into place, so the changes to it has been a set back. However, as far as I can tell, he thinks that there is a model out there which will allow break even. His arguments seems to be that as he can achieve nearly break even in other parts of Europe, so why not in the UK. I believe he has been told that the Championship, with its financial madness (too much money coming down from the PL but not enough shared around all sides to make it truly competitive in both footballing and financial terms), is different to virtually every other league in Europe. The cost of players here is inflated and there is little that can be done to stop this as an individual club. I'm not sure he accepts this line and is determined to press ahead with his experiment.
He does seem to have acknowledged that there has not been enough depth in the squad to be competitive but I'm not sure he understands how to add the necessary depth. This is partly because players are measured by him as a set of statistics, so if the stats show the player is, say, a good RB, then he must be. How can the stats be wrong? This ignores all of the human elements, such as would this player be a good fit, how well do they know the Championship, and so on.
Every transfer window we have Colin saying we are chasing after this player or that and is often accused of making this stuff up. I think this is unfair because as far as I can tell, we have gone after many of the players he has talked about. But this is only half the story. For the most part, we will never sign them. Because RD is holding to this idea of treating players as assets which he can get a (financial) return on, his budgeting for each player seems to be very strict, both in terms of price and running cost. He is looking at what return he can get. There have been players where negotiations were a long way down the road, but the running costs were then evaluated and considered just too much to get a return. So we end up constantly getting cheap players, but with good playing stats, from other leagues.
We can see the major flaws in all of this, that reducing everything to the bottom line and a series of stats, ignores the real value of building a balanced side of players who can play in this league, and having a competitive team which might get you into the PL. (although I understand that RD still stating an ambition to get to the PL). It is where we are though, and there is little evidence that RD wants to abandon his project.
For what its worth, I think RD is concerned about the current state of the club the protests, and so on, and is looking for solutions. I suspect that he has been told a great deal this week. Whether he has properly heard the reality of the situation and where solutions can be found is an entirely different matter.
Stunning post. Very insightful.
As you say there are so many pitfalls with relying on stats like this. A player's stats will be influenced not just by their ability but the quality and form of their team and their opposition, their current fitness levels, etc. And how can you accurately model the differences between the Championship and, say, the Juliper league?
So Polish Pete, Loic Nego etc. all look great on paper, but the stats lie because they lack contextual insight.
As for whether he's properly heard the reality of the situation - well, who has he been listening to? Because those articles and videos betray to me that he's listened only to his staff who have their heads firmly planted in the sand. "It's just results, it will all be ok when we start winning again" etc. He needs to properly listen to the fans, because his staff don't have a scooby.
RD admits mistakes and says he needs to stop us being relegated, so goes out and signs a 29 year old right back who has not played this season, still trying to work out his reasoning
The reasoning is how RD sees football and his ownership of football clubs. A number of people have said that he has no interest in football, but this is wrong. I know that he is very interested in football but in a way that is different to the rest of us. We see football as trying to build a team that can compete, trying to get a balanced side, looking for some entertainment during the game. We want to see our academy producing players for the first team, but in the context of a side which also has experienced pros who can mentor them through the toughness of competing in the championship.
In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold? Then in terms of play, how many accurate passes, assists, goals, tackles, and so on does the player make. He is the ultimate statto. The good player is the one with the best stats and can give the best financial return. Which league and level the player is at does not seem relevant,
I think that RD is measuring Riga's success on stats as well. How many games left, how many points needed, how many points per game required. So in RD's mind, is the team returning enough points per the games whilst Riga is charge for the rest of the season? At the moment we are below the determined line, but a win tomorrow and we are back on track, so would be considered a success. I think this is how he has measured all of the coaches. I suspect that RD's thinks Fraeye was a good coach but his statistical return was not good enough so had to go. RD treats coaches as junior business managers with targets to meet. I also think that RD has done the same sort of statistical analysis on potential coaches as he has on players. There little chance on having a UK coach as they are, in his mind, not good enough on a value for money basis (using his model). The are just too expensive against what they might return. This seems to go for the support coaching staff as well.
RD still believes that the club can break even and be competitive in the Championship. He was counting of FFP coming into place, so the changes to it has been a set back. However, as far as I can tell, he thinks that there is a model out there which will allow break even. His arguments seems to be that as he can achieve nearly break even in other parts of Europe, so why not in the UK. I believe he has been told that the Championship, with its financial madness (too much money coming down from the PL but not enough shared around all sides to make it truly competitive in both footballing and financial terms), is different to virtually every other league in Europe. The cost of players here is inflated and there is little that can be done to stop this as an individual club. I'm not sure he accepts this line and is determined to press ahead with his experiment.
He does seem to have acknowledged that there has not been enough depth in the squad to be competitive but I'm not sure he understands how to add the necessary depth. This is partly because players are measured by him as a set of statistics, so if the stats show the player is, say, a good RB, then he must be. How can the stats be wrong? This ignores all of the human elements, such as would this player be a good fit, how well do they know the Championship, and so on.
Every transfer window we have Colin saying we are chasing after this player or that and is often accused of making this stuff up. I think this is unfair because as far as I can tell, we have gone after many of the players he has talked about. But this is only half the story. For the most part, we will never sign them. Because RD is holding to this idea of treating players as assets which he can get a (financial) return on, his budgeting for each player seems to be very strict, both in terms of price and running cost. He is looking at what return he can get. There have been players where negotiations were a long way down the road, but the running costs were then evaluated and considered just too much to get a return. So we end up constantly getting cheap players, but with good playing stats, from other leagues.
We can see the major flaws in all of this, that reducing everything to the bottom line and a series of stats, ignores the real value of building a balanced side of players who can play in this league, and having a competitive team which might get you into the PL. (although I understand that RD still stating an ambition to get to the PL). It is where we are though, and there is little evidence that RD wants to abandon his project.
For what its worth, I think RD is concerned about the current state of the club the protests, and so on, and is looking for solutions. I suspect that he has been told a great deal this week. Whether he has properly heard the reality of the situation and where solutions can be found is an entirely different matter.
Think you've nailed it what you say makes sense and clicks.
Looking at a human being...a footballer and just seeing numbers floating about is quite creepy and just wrong... completely stupid and naive.
Running a football club like F*ckin FIFA ultimate team.
I have always felt that there is some merit to aspects of Duchatelet's approach, but where he has got it wrong is in the execution. He isn't good at listening to the advice of others, including fans - only those inside his trusted circle. I have never wanted him to throw money at the problem, but you have to legislate for a few things. Injuries and loss of form are big ones. This is in two ways - how can I cover the injury of my central midfielder or right back for example. Then, can I create competition to get the best out of players, and allow me to drop players when they lose form. Most of us concede that there is a nucleous of around 12-13 players who if they were to stay fit, would make us very competitive. The problem is, their ability to withstand a division that is very physical, reffed differently to the rest of Europe, and is full of knowledgable pros and some very talented players doesn't seem to be a factor in their recruitment. The manager doesn't seem to be a big enough factor in the recruitment of players and when money is tight, this becomes even more important. Curbishley used to put as much importance on other factors, not just ability when he brought a player in. Chrissy Powell learned this from him - you need to find a Charlton player. The research that was done on a player went beyond how well they kick a ball. They didn't get it right every time, but the success rate was good. It seems that Duchatelet goes simply on stats which is crazy.
I say that when actually I have a theory that stats aren't used enough in football. The problem stems from Charles Hughes. He is derided in football as the inventor of the long ball game. I think he was a visionary, but he made one mistake. It was visionary to compile stats and work out how most goals were scored. His error was to compile them from stats/data of limited, British players. He was right that it is better to make as few passes as you can before having an attempt on goal. But that was only because the standard of passing in a country that did not value technique was poor. The trick with stats is understanding their limitations and this is clearly a shortfall of our owner. This is where a good manager comes in - when recruiting a player, you ideally want somebody who can sniff them out. By all means look at the stats but if you have the right man in there, their gut is just as important. Some managers have this more than others - Curbs had it- Harry Redknapp didn't which made him a very expensive manager to employ. (I mention him in the example as an article in the standard saying Daniel Sturridge was world class and England's best player made me sigh).
In the Championship, if you are not going to throw money at the problem, you need to find that manager. My assessment of Chrissy Powell was that his in game management was often poor but his ability to sniff out a player was excellent. With a bit of backing he has the ability to assemble a good team/squad. It fills me with great sadness that he wasn't supported after the season we finished 9th, he was getting us there. He was an ideal manager for Duchatelet in many ways. But he wasn't part of the network, and Duchatelet's agenda was about implementing his ideas rather than learning. Had he given Powell a bit of money and gave him the autonomy to fix the squad with no interference, I suspect we would be in different position now and would have spent less money to boot. But managers have come and gone and usually rue the size of their squad when the they do depart. New managers have different ideas and it unsettles players and they rate different qualities, so a centre half like Morrison is given away whilst still under contract. You can't build a team on the cheap doing this. At this level you won't get Alex Ferguson, but Powell was a good fit for this club, and the owner should have stood back and let him manage with a bit of support. Riga may be a good fit - he needs to be left alone to manage and bring his players in. We need a decent manager to be given space and time, and support.
The phrase that you have to pay for you mistakes is very true. Duchatelet has made so many that he does have to throw some money at the problem to fix it. We have needed a central midfielder to help Cousins out for some time, but we have got two right backs recently. One yes - cover is important, but we also have one of the best right backs in the division in the first team. This lack of a strategy in recruitment is crazy. And when the squad is stretched, there have been opportunities to address the crisis in windows that have not been taken. There have been winnable games- both this season and last, where we have thrown away any chance of winning the points by the weakness and inexperience of the side we put out. We are in the middle now of some key games where the squad needed strengthening and players brought in haven't covered the right areas and they haven't been fit enough to play in the important games - We won't play Bristol City again this season, this was a team that we needed to beat, but the loans didn't help us do that!
Unfortunately, if 90% of your plan makes sense, the other 10% can sink you. Especially if you have no concept how to, or are too rigid in your strategy to identify and fix it. This is why I am protesting. Not because of money, but by the ineptitude of how the club is being run. It falls into mistakes, the same ones, with alarming regularity. It doesn't learn from them as it keeps making them. Fraeye was a mistake that shouldn't have happened. It was crazier than crazy. That is why Duchatelet is killing our club, and why I was genuinely hoping for some evidence that he has learned and will fix it. His interviews proved the opposite. I hate the position we are now in, and wasn't looking to pick holes in the interview/s. I was looking for hope in them. Sadly, all I found was poorly delivered bullshit.
Listening to him, I can understand why we got Peeters, Luzon and Fraeye because of his philosophy regarding younger players and the academy, but he made the same mistake 3 times because they were all under prepared for the rigours of the Championship. Now maybe making the same mistake twice with Bob and Guy was just about acceptable possibly, doing it again with dear Karel was unforgivable. As was getting shot of some of our best players and recruiting crap. The guy just can't see beyond the bubble that is Belgium or his chums.
Would've been 4 times if the Ujpest guy had taken the job.
Brilliant insight by henrythecat. Thank you. Helps me understand why he does what he does. I assume he doesn't tell us himself because he thinks that he doesn't want other clubs to copy him. I don't think there is much of a risk there myself.
Was talking to my next door neighbours best mate last night,he works as a scout,primarily for Fulham. As if we didnt know already,he said Charlton is a basket case of a club,no one in football wants to deal with them and theres LOTS of off field problems. Happy Saturday everyone
Was talking to my next door neighbours best mate last night,he works as a scout,primarily for Fulham. As if we didnt know already,he said Charlton is a basket case of a club,no one in football wants to deal with them and theres LOTS of off field problems. Happy Saturday everyone
I'd "like" this, meaning you speak the truth, but like isn't quite the right word. Did he elaborate on the problems, as he understands them?
Was talking to my next door neighbours best mate last night,he works as a scout,primarily for Fulham. As if we didnt know already,he said Charlton is a basket case of a club,no one in football wants to deal with them and theres LOTS of off field problems. Happy Saturday everyone
I'd "like" this, meaning you speak the truth, but like isn't quite the right word. Did he elaborate on the problems, as he understands them?
No,he wouldnt elaborate but just said in the football world,no one is surprised at whats happening at Charlton. Whether it was because he didnt know or wasnt prepared to divulge im not sure. Had no reason to disbelieve him,will try to find out more.It was only a brief chat but he wished us supporters good luck for the future.
Was talking to my next door neighbours best mate last night,he works as a scout,primarily for Fulham. As if we didnt know already,he said Charlton is a basket case of a club,no one in football wants to deal with them and theres LOTS of off field problems. Happy Saturday everyone
I'd "like" this, meaning you speak the truth, but like isn't quite the right word. Did he elaborate on the problems, as he understands them?
No,he wouldnt elaborate but just said in the football world,no one is surprised at whats happening at Charlton. Whether it was because he didnt know or wasnt prepared to divulge im not sure. Had no reason to disbelieve him,will try to find out more.It was only a brief chat but he wished us supporters good luck for the future.
Excellent posts henrythecat - but I just want to highlight a couple of lines that I think it's important to get across to the media (and some of our fans):
“In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold?”
In other words 'player farming'.
But, as summarised by Grapevine49 on the 'Transfer Deadline Day - Charlton related' thread, even in this respect Duchatelet is an incompetent and failed 'farmer':
“5 head coaching appointments (plus supporting staff) in 2yrs
44 senior signings in 5 transfer windows of which probably just 13 will be contractually committed to the club at the end of the season and 2 of those have almost permanently been out on long term loan - effectively 25% staff retention
31 departures of which just one (acquired cheaply via co ownership of Standard Liege) will have generated net revenue for the club”
but even as a 'Crewe of the south' and 'nicest club in London' offering the chance to see 'future premier league players' on the cheap, Duchetelet's strategy is a disastrous failure.
Roland's overriding concern is to protect HIS money investment in the club. Totally understandable.
His knowledge of football is extremely limited (and extremely worrying for a club owner). He places an inordinate importance on "player stats" and reveals to me a naive and inadequate understanding of the essential requirements when buying and selling players. He saves money by employing cheap, unqualified employees who are able to convince him they know all about football and recognise tight budgeting is the major prioity for his strategy to work.
He is content then to allow his "yes men" to run the football side of HIS overall investment portfolio whilst he concentrates on the more important things in his life. It suits him to have an arms-length involvement so, satisfied he has the right people in place, he tends to believe everything his trusted employees tell him (which must be "everything is fine"). More than happy to hear this he carries on with his life (and replaces his head in the sand).
Only after serious national and international publicity does he wake up to the self inflicted crisis which is Charlton Athletic. Only then do we see him at The Valley to take part in a series of hurried press interviews to save some face. The content of his interviews shows an alarming insight into his inadequate understanding of even the basic requirements of running a Championship football club and his failure to offer any posiitve and immediate remedies to halt the rapid decline of the club.
A man like this will need to make a serious U turn in the way he runs the club...... or just get out.
(Nice photos,...........do you feel as bad as you look?)
Comments
In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold? Then in terms of play, how many accurate passes, assists, goals, tackles, and so on does the player make. He is the ultimate statto. The good player is the one with the best stats and can give the best financial return. Which league and level the player is at does not seem relevant,
I think that RD is measuring Riga's success on stats as well. How many games left, how many points needed, how many points per game required. So in RD's mind, is the team returning enough points per the games whilst Riga is charge for the rest of the season? At the moment we are below the determined line, but a win tomorrow and we are back on track, so would be considered a success. I think this is how he has measured all of the coaches. I suspect that RD's thinks Fraeye was a good coach but his statistical return was not good enough so had to go. RD treats coaches as junior business managers with targets to meet. I also think that RD has done the same sort of statistical analysis on potential coaches as he has on players. There little chance on having a UK coach as they are, in his mind, not good enough on a value for money basis (using his model). The are just too expensive against what they might return. This seems to go for the support coaching staff as well.
RD still believes that the club can break even and be competitive in the Championship. He was counting of FFP coming into place, so the changes to it has been a set back. However, as far as I can tell, he thinks that there is a model out there which will allow break even. His arguments seems to be that as he can achieve nearly break even in other parts of Europe, so why not in the UK. I believe he has been told that the Championship, with its financial madness (too much money coming down from the PL but not enough shared around all sides to make it truly competitive in both footballing and financial terms), is different to virtually every other league in Europe. The cost of players here is inflated and there is little that can be done to stop this as an individual club. I'm not sure he accepts this line and is determined to press ahead with his experiment.
He does seem to have acknowledged that there has not been enough depth in the squad to be competitive but I'm not sure he understands how to add the necessary depth. This is partly because players are measured by him as a set of statistics, so if the stats show the player is, say, a good RB, then he must be. How can the stats be wrong? This ignores all of the human elements, such as would this player be a good fit, how well do they know the Championship, and so on.
Every transfer window we have Colin saying we are chasing after this player or that and is often accused of making this stuff up. I think this is unfair because as far as I can tell, we have gone after many of the players he has talked about. But this is only half the story. For the most part, we will never sign them. Because RD is holding to this idea of treating players as assets which he can get a (financial) return on, his budgeting for each player seems to be very strict, both in terms of price and running cost. He is looking at what return he can get. There have been players where negotiations were a long way down the road, but the running costs were then evaluated and considered just too much to get a return. So we end up constantly getting cheap players, but with good playing stats, from other leagues.
We can see the major flaws in all of this, that reducing everything to the bottom line and a series of stats, ignores the real value of building a balanced side of players who can play in this league, and having a competitive team which might get you into the PL. (although I understand that RD still stating an ambition to get to the PL). It is where we are though, and there is little evidence that RD wants to abandon his project.
For what its worth, I think RD is concerned about the current state of the club the protests, and so on, and is looking for solutions. I suspect that he has been told a great deal this week. Whether he has properly heard the reality of the situation and where solutions can be found is an entirely different matter.
Assuming that RD does want to listen and do things in a better way (I know this might not be the case) what, if anything, would people be willing to accept so that we go from being a club at war with itself to one where we have people working collaboratively for the benefit for the club and for all?
The fight and the stand off can continue and that potentially leads to the club withering and dying. But if we can get RD properly to a negotiating table and we decide to work together, what does that look like in practice?
I know this might never happen and that there will be a wide range of views on this. For some it is all or nothing, for others it is purely about results on the playing field. But I think it is worth discussing what a plan B might be if there is an opportunity to change the club's direction.
I just cannot see anyway back for this regime and that in turn makes me really fear for the future of the club.
Unhappy individuals (that could also still be loaned out and managed better) is more important then charlton itself. Can he give an example of a big squad f*cking things up?
The clubs failings makes the fans unhappy.
- short term injuries become long term (Vetokele, Diarra, Bauer and possibly others?),
- they faint during half time (Cousins),
- they end up playing so far out of their depth it's unfair (Piotr for 3 minutes, Naby for many more)
- they're young and without support, meaning they lose confidence and get abuse (Fox),
- they're no longer fit enough for a full 90 but continue out of necessity (Jackson),
- (...I could go on...)
... must be so much better for their happiness.
Thank God Roland's looking out for their morale, I'd hate to see what he'd be doing if he didn't give a shit.
As you say there are so many pitfalls with relying on stats like this. A player's stats will be influenced not just by their ability but the quality and form of their team and their opposition, their current fitness levels, etc. And how can you accurately model the differences between the Championship and, say, the Juliper league?
So Polish Pete, Loic Nego etc. all look great on paper, but the stats lie because they lack contextual insight.
As for whether he's properly heard the reality of the situation - well, who has he been listening to? Because those articles and videos betray to me that he's listened only to his staff who have their heads firmly planted in the sand. "It's just results, it will all be ok when we start winning again" etc. He needs to properly listen to the fans, because his staff don't have a scooby.
Looking at a human being...a footballer and just seeing numbers floating about is quite creepy and just wrong... completely stupid and naive.
Running a football club like F*ckin FIFA ultimate team.
I say that when actually I have a theory that stats aren't used enough in football. The problem stems from Charles Hughes. He is derided in football as the inventor of the long ball game. I think he was a visionary, but he made one mistake. It was visionary to compile stats and work out how most goals were scored. His error was to compile them from stats/data of limited, British players. He was right that it is better to make as few passes as you can before having an attempt on goal. But that was only because the standard of passing in a country that did not value technique was poor. The trick with stats is understanding their limitations and this is clearly a shortfall of our owner. This is where a good manager comes in - when recruiting a player, you ideally want somebody who can sniff them out. By all means look at the stats but if you have the right man in there, their gut is just as important. Some managers have this more than others - Curbs had it- Harry Redknapp didn't which made him a very expensive manager to employ. (I mention him in the example as an article in the standard saying Daniel Sturridge was world class and England's best player made me sigh).
In the Championship, if you are not going to throw money at the problem, you need to find that manager. My assessment of Chrissy Powell was that his in game management was often poor but his ability to sniff out a player was excellent. With a bit of backing he has the ability to assemble a good team/squad. It fills me with great sadness that he wasn't supported after the season we finished 9th, he was getting us there. He was an ideal manager for Duchatelet in many ways. But he wasn't part of the network, and Duchatelet's agenda was about implementing his ideas rather than learning. Had he given Powell a bit of money and gave him the autonomy to fix the squad with no interference, I suspect we would be in different position now and would have spent less money to boot. But managers have come and gone and usually rue the size of their squad when the they do depart. New managers have different ideas and it unsettles players and they rate different qualities, so a centre half like Morrison is given away whilst still under contract. You can't build a team on the cheap doing this. At this level you won't get Alex Ferguson, but Powell was a good fit for this club, and the owner should have stood back and let him manage with a bit of support. Riga may be a good fit - he needs to be left alone to manage and bring his players in. We need a decent manager to be given space and time, and support.
The phrase that you have to pay for you mistakes is very true. Duchatelet has made so many that he does have to throw some money at the problem to fix it. We have needed a central midfielder to help Cousins out for some time, but we have got two right backs recently. One yes - cover is important, but we also have one of the best right backs in the division in the first team. This lack of a strategy in recruitment is crazy. And when the squad is stretched, there have been opportunities to address the crisis in windows that have not been taken. There have been winnable games- both this season and last, where we have thrown away any chance of winning the points by the weakness and inexperience of the side we put out. We are in the middle now of some key games where the squad needed strengthening and players brought in haven't covered the right areas and they haven't been fit enough to play in the important games - We won't play Bristol City again this season, this was a team that we needed to beat, but the loans didn't help us do that!
Unfortunately, if 90% of your plan makes sense, the other 10% can sink you. Especially if you have no concept how to, or are too rigid in your strategy to identify and fix it. This is why I am protesting. Not because of money, but by the ineptitude of how the club is being run. It falls into mistakes, the same ones, with alarming regularity. It doesn't learn from them as it keeps making them. Fraeye was a mistake that shouldn't have happened. It was crazier than crazy. That is why Duchatelet is killing our club, and why I was genuinely hoping for some evidence that he has learned and will fix it. His interviews proved the opposite. I hate the position we are now in, and wasn't looking to pick holes in the interview/s. I was looking for hope in them. Sadly, all I found was poorly delivered bullshit.
Would've been 4 times if the Ujpest guy had taken the job.
I assume he doesn't tell us himself because he thinks that he doesn't want other clubs to copy him. I don't think there is much of a risk there myself.
The only upside I can detect is that the photos clearly indicate he has been dead for some weeks..
“In the world of RD, everything is reduced down to numbers. How much is this player worth when he comes in? how can we add value? What is the target value for them when the player is sold?”
In other words 'player farming'.
But, as summarised by Grapevine49 on the 'Transfer Deadline Day - Charlton related' thread, even in this respect Duchatelet is an incompetent and failed 'farmer':
“5 head coaching appointments (plus supporting staff) in 2yrs
44 senior signings in 5 transfer windows of which probably just 13 will be contractually committed to the club at the end of the season and 2 of those have almost permanently been out on long term loan - effectively 25% staff retention
31 departures of which just one (acquired cheaply via co ownership of Standard Liege) will have generated net revenue for the club”
https://charltonlife.vanillaforums.com/discussion/comment/2393773#Comment_2393773
So it's not just that his approach is incompatible with the repeatedly peddled claim (most recently by Murray) that the 'strategy' is to be a club:
“who can be competitive in the Championship, but has Premier League ambitions”
http://www.cafc.co.uk/news/article/charlton-athletic-richard-murray-interview-2887963.aspx#bkWRRGYmiKRyZC7V.99
but even as a 'Crewe of the south' and 'nicest club in London' offering the chance to see 'future premier league players' on the cheap, Duchetelet's strategy is a disastrous failure.
(Sorry)
Roland's overriding concern is to protect HIS money investment in the club. Totally understandable.
His knowledge of football is extremely limited (and extremely worrying for a club owner). He places an inordinate importance on "player stats" and reveals to me a naive and inadequate understanding of the essential requirements when buying and selling players. He saves money by employing cheap, unqualified employees who are able to convince him they know all about football and recognise tight budgeting is the major prioity for his strategy to work.
He is content then to allow his "yes men" to run the football side of HIS overall investment portfolio whilst he concentrates on the more important things in his life. It suits him to have an arms-length involvement so, satisfied he has the right people in place, he tends to believe everything his trusted employees tell him (which must be "everything is fine"). More than happy to hear this he carries on with his life (and replaces his head in the sand).
Only after serious national and international publicity does he wake up to the self inflicted crisis which is Charlton Athletic. Only then do we see him at The Valley to take part in a series of hurried press interviews to save some face. The content of his interviews shows an alarming insight into his inadequate understanding of even the basic requirements of running a Championship football club and his failure to offer any posiitve and immediate remedies to halt the rapid decline of the club.
A man like this will need to make a serious U turn in the way he runs the club...... or just get out.
(Nice photos,...........do you feel as bad as you look?)