@Airman Brown, playing a big part previously at the club, have you ever recently been asked or “offered “any advice re fan initiatives? As times like now I would have thought you would be quite useful? If you have time & commitment obviously.
I regularly respond to requests from relevant staff, but I’ve not had anything to do with the current management.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
If something works well there is no need to change it. Its when something doesn't work it needs to be pointed out
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
I don’t need your permission to comment, thanks.
I’m not even against the promotion, I’m just pointing out that there isn’t much value in it. Save £2 a game (one 16th of the price) in return for committing to all of them now isn’t much of a deal IMO. They’d be better off doing a high value deal for one Saturday game and attracting a bigger crowd of people who aren’t attending regularly in the hope that this generates repeat sales.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
I don’t need your permission to comment, thanks.
I’m not even against the promotion, I’m just pointing out that there isn’t much value in it. Save £2 a game (one 16th of the price) in return for committing to all of them now isn’t much of a deal IMO. They’d be better off doing a high value deal for one Saturday game and attracting a bigger crowd of people who aren’t attending regularly in the hope that this generates repeat sales.
I didnt even mention the price, just thought it was funny pointing out the obvious part which was that the deal only works for you if you plan to attend them all. Just seemed a strange thing to be using to complain.
Indeed nobody needs permission to talk, kinda what a forum is for... with the same logic we can point out something which makes no sense, no matter how many years a poster spent at the club. Im off to find all that positivity you share.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
I don’t need your permission to comment, thanks.
I’m not even against the promotion, I’m just pointing out that there isn’t much value in it. Save £2 a game (one 16th of the price) in return for committing to all of them now isn’t much of a deal IMO. They’d be better off doing a high value deal for one Saturday game and attracting a bigger crowd of people who aren’t attending regularly in the hope that this generates repeat sales.
I didnt even mention the price, just thought it was funny pointing out the obvious part which was that the deal only works for you if you plan to attend them all. Just seemed a strange thing to be using to complain.
Indeed nobody needs permission to talk, kinda what a forum is for... with the same logic we can point out something which makes no sense, no matter how many years a poster spent at the club. Im off to find all that positivity you share.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
I don’t need your permission to comment, thanks.
I’m not even against the promotion, I’m just pointing out that there isn’t much value in it. Save £2 a game (one 16th of the price) in return for committing to all of them now isn’t much of a deal IMO. They’d be better off doing a high value deal for one Saturday game and attracting a bigger crowd of people who aren’t attending regularly in the hope that this generates repeat sales.
I didnt even mention the price, just thought it was funny pointing out the obvious part which was that the deal only works for you if you plan to attend them all. Just seemed a strange thing to be using to complain.
Indeed nobody needs permission to talk, kinda what a forum is for... with the same logic we can point out something which makes no sense, no matter how many years a poster spent at the club. Im off to find all that positivity you share.
Even you shouldnt be able to find anything to complain about the performances atm so well done on that, club matters are a bit different though im sure.
If you were planning now to go to all six games and sit in the lower Covered End or family stand it’s a worthwhile offer, but there isn’t likely to be a big take-up because that's a relative small cohort as many of those people will already have season tickets.
It’s no benefit to anyone who can’t guarantee being able to attend all six elsewhere - a maximum adult saving from doing so of £17 or £12 in the east and west against an upfront commitment of £145 or £180.
Bit like most deals then ? only of value if they work for you.
Do you go in to Tesco and moan about the meal deals as you only wanted a snack and a sandwich ?
Do they offer a meal deal for £180? Hardly a sensible comparison.
Presumably we’re allowed to have a view on whether a deal offers any value or perhaps it should just be an announcement with no comment allowed?
Its a pertfect comparison, its blatantly obvious that if you cant attend all the games then the deals not for you..
You can obviously comment on prices as you always do, it’s just always the same type of negative response every single time.
It’s a factual comment. Sorry if the facts suggest the offer is a bit crap.
I designed the club’s ticket offers for 20 years (with some success). Hardly surprising then that I tend to look at what they do and have an idea what works and what doesn’t.
Your posts, on the other hand, are’t about the offer, they are about me. I doubt anyone cares what you think of me. Why would they?
The constant moaning about the club is boring though, no matter what you did for 20 years at the club. The club cant seem to do anything right though, if they reduced it any more people would moan that its unfair to ST holders.
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
I don’t need your permission to comment, thanks.
I’m not even against the promotion, I’m just pointing out that there isn’t much value in it. Save £2 a game (one 16th of the price) in return for committing to all of them now isn’t much of a deal IMO. They’d be better off doing a high value deal for one Saturday game and attracting a bigger crowd of people who aren’t attending regularly in the hope that this generates repeat sales.
I didnt even mention the price, just thought it was funny pointing out the obvious part which was that the deal only works for you if you plan to attend them all. Just seemed a strange thing to be using to complain.
Indeed nobody needs permission to talk, kinda what a forum is for... with the same logic we can point out something which makes no sense, no matter how many years a poster spent at the club. Im off to find all that positivity you share.
Even you shouldnt be able to find anything to complain about the performances atm so well done on that, club matters are a bit different though im sure.
Maybe an initiative like this would be an idea. Treat a friend to a matchday at Blues for as little as £5
As a gesture of thank you, the Club is giving all Season Ticket Holders the opportunity to to 'treat a friend' to this matchday at St. Andrew's @ Knighthead Park, with the opportunity to purchase tickets at a discounted price.
Maybe I’m being green on this but surely “6 games for £100!” would have sounded better?With no differential in price dependent on where you sit and a similar promotion for accompanying children (maybe £20 for the 6 games?).
Do we not just want bums on seats watching us win, buying beer and burgers and picking up a discounted shirt or two from the club shop?
Also slightly lower pricing would mean you wouldn’t have felt too bad if you had to miss one of the games…
As with so many of the club’s promotions (for this owner and the previous), it all just seems a bit clunky….
Maybe I’m being green on this but surely “6 games for £100!” would have sounded better?With no differential in price dependent on where you sit and a similar promotion for accompanying children (maybe £20 for the 6 games?).
Do we not just want bums on seats watching us win, buying beer and burgers and picking up a discounted shirt or two from the club shop?
Also slightly lower pricing would mean you wouldn’t have felt too bad if you had to miss one of the games…
As with so many of the club’s promotions (for this owner and the previous), it all just seems a bit clunky….
I broadly agree with you but I think the problem is that too many promotions are seen as undermining future season ticket sales (and pissing off relatively existing loyal season ticket holders) i.e. why buy a season ticket if you anticipate that there will be other offers throughout the season.
However, I think the above concern about devaluing season tickets isnt t valid when there is a 1/2 empty stadium that needs bums on seats.
As mentioned previously, I would like to see the club price tickets to get the ground fuller whilst understanding that if promotion to the Championship doesnt happen then they will have to "compensate" existing season ticket holders with lower prices next season for having to put up with another season in League 1.
PS All the above written without having any idea how that would affect revenues. Airman Brown your assistance is required!
Maybe I’m being green on this but surely “6 games for £100!” would have sounded better?With no differential in price dependent on where you sit and a similar promotion for accompanying children (maybe £20 for the 6 games?).
Do we not just want bums on seats watching us win, buying beer and burgers and picking up a discounted shirt or two from the club shop?
Also slightly lower pricing would mean you wouldn’t have felt too bad if you had to miss one of the games…
As with so many of the club’s promotions (for this owner and the previous), it all just seems a bit clunky….
I broadly agree with you but I think the problem is that too many promotions are seen as undermining future season ticket sales (and pissing off relatively existing loyal season ticket holders) i.e. why buy a season ticket if you anticipate that there will be other offers throughout the season.
However, I think the above concern about devaluing season tickets isnt t valid when there is a 1/2 empty stadium that needs bums on seats.
As mentioned previously, I would like to see the club price tickets to get the ground fuller whilst understanding that if promotion to the Championship doesnt happen then they will have to "compensate" existing season ticket holders with lower prices next season for having to put up with another season in League 1.
PS All the above written without having any idea how that would affect revenues. Airman Brown your assistance is required!
We have very low match by match sales compared to the season ticket base, in part because the season tickets are (mostly) reasonably priced and the match tickets are now overpriced.
Virtually nobody is going from zero attendance to buying this offer, I would think, so it appears to be an offer aimed at firming up existing attenders. There’s a particular problem with Tuesday night games but generally I think the Sky coverage is a problem.
I think this offer is very risk averse - don’t upset season ticket holders, don’t risk compromising existing ticket sales and bank whatever interest there is now in case we end up playing one or more dead rubber games at the end.
Another way of looking at the situation is that there are quite a few people who have stopped going regularly in the last few years, so make a big effort to get them to one game now and trust the team to hook them back at just the time you want to market season tickets.
There are multiple ways to try that, but I would personally charge £10 for all adults against Exeter and make a noise about getting behind Nathan Jones and the players for the run-in. Might work. Might not. But I don’t think you achieve much tinkering at the edges.
Maybe you should get Peter Varney to issue a rallying cry for fans to attend then @Airman Brown ? I dunno? Seems like a decent enough offer for discounted tickets for those that could be tempted and isn't undercutting ST holders. COYA
A free ticket for every season ticket holder to bring a friend is always the best way to boost the crowd imho - people buying on a match per match basis will probably not go to many more matches even if they save a few quid with some sort of deal- getting season ticket holders to encourage friends and family however is a much better way to increase the bums on seats.
As the Addicks chase a top-six finish, don’t miss the crucial final six home games of the season with the 'Super 6 - The Run-In' bundle.
Starting with the visit of Barnsley on Tuesday, March 4th, the bundle also includes Charlton's home games against Wigan Athletic (Saturday, March 15th), Huddersfield Town (Saturday, March 29th), Lincoln City (Saturday, April 5th), Northampton Town (Friday, April 18th) and the final game of the season against Burton Albion (Saturday, May 3rd).
Be there and be part of the journey with this special bundle. Adult tickets are available from £110 - just £18.33 per game - while U11s bundles can be purchased from just £15.
As the Addicks chase a top-six finish, don’t miss the crucial final six home games of the season with the 'Super 6 - The Run-In' bundle.
Starting with the visit of Barnsley on Tuesday, March 4th, the bundle also includes Charlton's home games against Wigan Athletic (Saturday, March 15th), Huddersfield Town (Saturday, March 29th), Lincoln City (Saturday, April 5th), Northampton Town (Friday, April 18th) and the final game of the season against Burton Albion (Saturday, May 3rd).
Be there and be part of the journey with this special bundle. Adult tickets are available from £110 - just £18.33 per game - while U11s bundles can be purchased from just £15.
Maybe I’m being green on this but surely “6 games for £100!” would have sounded better?With no differential in price dependent on where you sit and a similar promotion for accompanying children (maybe £20 for the 6 games?).
Do we not just want bums on seats watching us win, buying beer and burgers and picking up a discounted shirt or two from the club shop?
Also slightly lower pricing would mean you wouldn’t have felt too bad if you had to miss one of the games…
As with so many of the club’s promotions (for this owner and the previous), it all just seems a bit clunky….
I broadly agree with you but I think the problem is that too many promotions are seen as undermining future season ticket sales (and pissing off relatively existing loyal season ticket holders) i.e. why buy a season ticket if you anticipate that there will be other offers throughout the season.
However, I think the above concern about devaluing season tickets isnt t valid when there is a 1/2 empty stadium that needs bums on seats.
As mentioned previously, I would like to see the club price tickets to get the ground fuller whilst understanding that if promotion to the Championship doesnt happen then they will have to "compensate" existing season ticket holders with lower prices next season for having to put up with another season in League 1.
PS All the above written without having any idea how that would affect revenues. Airman Brown your assistance is required!
We have very low match by match sales compared to the season ticket base, in part because the season tickets are (mostly) reasonably priced and the match tickets are now overpriced.
Virtually nobody is going from zero attendance to buying this offer, I would think, so it appears to be an offer aimed at firming up existing attenders. There’s a particular problem with Tuesday night games but generally I think the Sky coverage is a problem.
I think this offer is very risk averse - don’t upset season ticket holders, don’t risk compromising existing ticket sales and bank whatever interest there is now in case we end up playing one or more dead rubber games at the end.
Another way of looking at the situation is that there are quite a few people who have stopped going regularly in the last few years, so make a big effort to get them to one game now and trust the team to hook them back at just the time you want to market season tickets.
There are multiple ways to try that, but I would personally charge £10 for all adults against Exeter and make a noise about getting behind Nathan Jones and the players for the run-in. Might work. Might not. But I don’t think you achieve much tinkering at the edges.
I guess the problem with flat ticket price offers, is while it might be fine for a single game, with the price of season tickets and normal tickets varying so much around the ground, having it for 6 games (over a quarter of the home season) would make a nonsense of the price differential between Zone 1 and Zone 3 season tickets.
Maybe I’m being green on this but surely “6 games for £100!” would have sounded better?With no differential in price dependent on where you sit and a similar promotion for accompanying children (maybe £20 for the 6 games?).
Do we not just want bums on seats watching us win, buying beer and burgers and picking up a discounted shirt or two from the club shop?
Also slightly lower pricing would mean you wouldn’t have felt too bad if you had to miss one of the games…
As with so many of the club’s promotions (for this owner and the previous), it all just seems a bit clunky….
I broadly agree with you but I think the problem is that too many promotions are seen as undermining future season ticket sales (and pissing off relatively existing loyal season ticket holders) i.e. why buy a season ticket if you anticipate that there will be other offers throughout the season.
However, I think the above concern about devaluing season tickets isnt t valid when there is a 1/2 empty stadium that needs bums on seats.
As mentioned previously, I would like to see the club price tickets to get the ground fuller whilst understanding that if promotion to the Championship doesnt happen then they will have to "compensate" existing season ticket holders with lower prices next season for having to put up with another season in League 1.
PS All the above written without having any idea how that would affect revenues. Airman Brown your assistance is required!
We have very low match by match sales compared to the season ticket base, in part because the season tickets are (mostly) reasonably priced and the match tickets are now overpriced.
Virtually nobody is going from zero attendance to buying this offer, I would think, so it appears to be an offer aimed at firming up existing attenders. There’s a particular problem with Tuesday night games but generally I think the Sky coverage is a problem.
I think this offer is very risk averse - don’t upset season ticket holders, don’t risk compromising existing ticket sales and bank whatever interest there is now in case we end up playing one or more dead rubber games at the end.
Another way of looking at the situation is that there are quite a few people who have stopped going regularly in the last few years, so make a big effort to get them to one game now and trust the team to hook them back at just the time you want to market season tickets.
There are multiple ways to try that, but I would personally charge £10 for all adults against Exeter and make a noise about getting behind Nathan Jones and the players for the run-in. Might work. Might not. But I don’t think you achieve much tinkering at the edges.
I guess the problem with flat ticket price offers, is while it might be fine for a single game, with the price of season tickets and normal tickets varying so much around the ground, having it for 6 games (over a quarter of the home season) would make a nonsense of the price differential between Zone 1 and Zone 3 season tickets.
I wouldn’t suggest that. I just think you need to be clear what you are trying to do and what constitutes success, because this offer is going to appeal to some attending fans and the model I suggested to people who aren’t going (much). You could sell a couple of hundred six game tickets and not take much extra money. It’s low risk and low benefit, but it won’t add much to the gate.
Comments
Would love to hear more of what you do think works well as many posters hold your comments in high regard.
Indeed nobody needs permission to talk, kinda what a forum is for... with the same logic we can point out something which makes no sense, no matter how many years a poster spent at the club. Im off to find all that positivity you share.
Treat a friend to a matchday at Blues for as little as £5
https://www.bcfc.com/pages/en/media-article/blues-announce-ticket-initiatives-for-leyton-orient-fixture
However, I think the above concern about devaluing season tickets isnt t valid when there is a 1/2 empty stadium that needs bums on seats.
As mentioned previously, I would like to see the club price tickets to get the ground fuller whilst understanding that if promotion to the Championship doesnt happen then they will have to "compensate" existing season ticket holders with lower prices next season for having to put up with another season in League 1.
PS All the above written without having any idea how that would affect revenues. Airman Brown your assistance is required!
I think this offer is very risk averse - don’t upset season ticket holders, don’t risk compromising existing ticket sales and bank whatever interest there is now in case we end up playing one or more dead rubber games at the end.
Another way of looking at the situation is that there are quite a few people who have stopped going regularly in the last few years, so make a big effort to get them to one game now and trust the team to hook them back at just the time you want to market season tickets.
There are multiple ways to try that, but I would personally charge £10 for all adults against Exeter and make a noise about getting behind Nathan Jones and the players for the run-in. Might work. Might not. But I don’t think you achieve much tinkering at the edges.