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Another academy prospect poached

In 2/3 years he could of been playing men’s football, but instead he will be stuck in the reserve and sent out on loan until he’s 26 and probably wasted his best years. 🤷🏻‍♂️
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Comments

  • Not good, there must be money involved somewhere, smells...
  • Redhenry said:
    Not good, there must be money involved somewhere, smells...
    Due to his age they only need to pay the minimal EPPP compensation, just as they did when they signed Kasey Palmer from us. Can’t see this being driven by our owners if that’s what you’re getting at.
  • Like Burstow and Beadle? Both are playing at a higher level (Beadle would have been sent out on loan to a National League or League 2 club instead of being an ever present in a side that is on course for automatic promotion) than they would have been had they stayed with us, with better coaching and on ten times the amount of money. It's no different to when we take a youngster from a non league academy. 
  • do we not take kids from other academies ?
  • MrOneLung said:
    do we not take kids from other academies ?
    Yep, it is exactly how the food chain works. Chelsea pinch from us, we pinch from Staines/Bury/Welling/Orient etc.
  • As a Cat 2 academy we're powerless to stop Cat 1 academies signing our kids when they choose.

    We get a few hundred thousand. The maximum at 17 is £400k IIRC but we'll probably get less as he is younger.

    The system is deliberately loaded to favour the bigger, richer Cat 1 clubs and there is nothing we can do about it other than becoming one ourselves which the current SMT don't see as a priority as it costs too much and we have a productive academy anyway.

    And he, or his parents, may have been offered some "inducements" but look at Mason Burstow. On more money, better facilities and played in the Chelsea first time this season even if he's been loaned out now.

    And then we actually employed and paid the "brains" behind it.
    We should be CAT1 purely for the level of talent we have bought through for decades.  Of course, even if we were this lad would likely have gone to Chelsea.
    Never mind, he's 15, I had never heard of him and in all likelihood never will again.
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  • Kids or any players joining us from lower ranked clubs are furthering their careers with a sensible move.

    Kids or players leaving us for higher ranked clubs are greedy bastards who will crash and burn.

    :smiley:
    Nailed it!
  • edited October 2023
    As a Cat 2 academy we're powerless to stop Cat 1 academies signing our kids when they choose.

    We get a few hundred thousand. The maximum at 17 is £400k IIRC but we'll probably get less as he is younger.

    The system is deliberately loaded to favour the bigger, richer Cat 1 clubs and there is nothing we can do about it other than becoming one ourselves which the current SMT don't see as a priority as it costs too much and we have a productive academy anyway.

    And he, or his parents, may have been offered some "inducements" but look at Mason Burstow. On more money, better facilities and played in the Chelsea first time this season even if he's been loaned out now.
    There should be some sort of ‘sell-on’ clause option for clubs who have players poached. That would encourage clubs to keep their academies open. 
    Would only require a fairly simple rule change. 
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Yes, but it would be harder and they'd have to pay more IIRC, possibly enough to deter them..
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Yes, but it would be harder and they'd have to pay more IIRC, possibly enough to deter them..
    Not sure that it would deter Chelsea - they've spent over £1bn in the last two years and half of those purchased will probably never make it as regulars. 
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Yes, but it would be harder and they'd have to pay more IIRC, possibly enough to deter them..
    Not sure that it would deter Chelsea - they've spent over £1bn in the last two years and half of those purchased will probably never make it as regulars. 
    Exactly, as long as they make a profit overall, sod the ones that don't make it...commodity market
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Yes, but it would be harder and they'd have to pay more IIRC, possibly enough to deter them..
    They would have to pay more, but then a Cat 1 academy costs a LOT more to run...
  • Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
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  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Yes, but it would be harder and they'd have to pay more IIRC, possibly enough to deter them..
    They would have to pay more, but then a Cat 1 academy costs a LOT more to run...
    Indeed but you are more likely to keep players like this and can nick players off other non-cat 1 players with impunity 
  • Chunes said:
    Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
    But then he went for £25m as a 17 year old to a German club and with probable add ons it is difficult to argue that Birmingham didn't get some value 
  • edited October 2023
    Chunes said:
    Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
    But then he went for £25m as a 17 year old to a German club and with probable add ons it is difficult to argue that Birmingham didn't get some value 
    Not about value. The point was that this Cat 1 - Cat 2 stuff is nonsense. The soon-to-be best player in the world came out of Birmingham. 

    Plus more than half the regular England eleven: Pickford, Stones, Maguire, Walker, Trippier, Jude, Henderson, Sterling, etc.. all out of Cat 2's or academies now classed as Cat 2's. 
  • lawhite said:
    In 2/3 years he could of been playing men’s football, but instead he will be stuck in the reserve and sent out on loan until he’s 26 and probably wasted his best years. 🤷🏻‍♂️
    I wanted to stay. But Chelsea's offer was too good to turn down. 
  • I don't want to wish a young player ill and I won't but if these sort of exits don't work out for the player it could help us in the longer term, especially if the youngsters that come through the first team are going on to bigger and better things.
  • Even if we were a Cat 1 academy, Chelsea could still poach players from us. 
    Exactly this. Chelsea and City sign kids from other category one clubs all the time.

    Yes they pay a bit more but i'm pretty sure a couple of hundred thousand more isn't going to deter them from signing a player who could be worth 15m in 4 years time.
  • Doesn't their academy make a profit when very few make it to their first team?
  • Chunes said:
    Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
    But then he went for £25m as a 17 year old to a German club and with probable add ons it is difficult to argue that Birmingham didn't get some value 
    Down to Bellingham though, as he signed a contract to make sure Birmingham got a big fee. Hence why he is so worshipped there 
  • Chunes said:
    Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
    But then he went for £25m as a 17 year old to a German club and with probable add ons it is difficult to argue that Birmingham didn't get some value 
    Down to Bellingham though, as he signed a contract to make sure Birmingham got a big fee. Hence why he is so worshipped there 
    Not sure that us sticking a £25m release clause for all our youngsters would work or, for that matter, any would be silly enough to sign such a contract. Didn't Joe Gomez sign a new contract to help us and James Beadle do likewise? 
  • Chunes said:
    Quite ironic that Bellingham came out of a Category 2 academy. 
    But then he went for £25m as a 17 year old to a German club and with probable add ons it is difficult to argue that Birmingham didn't get some value 
    Down to Bellingham though, as he signed a contract to make sure Birmingham got a big fee. Hence why he is so worshipped there 
    Not sure that us sticking a £25m release clause for all our youngsters would work or, for that matter, any would be silly enough to sign such a contract. Didn't Joe Gomez sign a new contract to help us and James Beadle do likewise? 
    Gomez did I think but Beadle was just poached. The Bellingham scenario worked because not only is he a great player he is a Birmingham fan. Our academy players are more likely to be Chelsea fans than Charlton ones so we’ve got little chance of keeping them around if Chelsea/Arsenal come sniffing 
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