Surely Thomas is not the answer, we’ve been stuck in this shite league for so long people are a becoming used to mediocrity. Don’t doubt his commitment and he seems a nice guy but he’s not good enough for a promotion side
This all day long.
Personally don’t get the whole he’d be a good squad player argument either. But that’s me.
He’s been part of a defence that over the last two seasons will have conceded more than 130 league goals. He’s an average League One player.
We should not be resigning him for another season to be 4th choice or a ‘squad player’. What we need is better quality players who push each other and can compete at the top end of this league.
He’s not dominating in the air, he’s generally poor on the ball, he’s not incredibly strong or quick. I am convinced people like him because he’s local, passionate, and they’re unsure what is his preferred foot and because of that he plays across the defence. For me, that’s not enough to warrant a new deal in what needs to be a season of real intent to go and win promotion.
Could say the same about Ladapo who I remember you saying we should sign permanently fairly recently? Different position but we want similar qualities in our strikers too.
Please don’t put words in my mouth when that’s not true. I haven’t once said we should sign Ladapo. When he first signed I was excited like all fans. He has not lived up to any expectations.
What I have said is both Ladapo and Camara needed to show their quality before the end of the season and if they did, they would have a chance of staying. If not, we look elsewhere. I explained the type of striker Ladapo is and that his size confuses people as he’s not a target man. Overall, he has been poor and we will look elsewhere in the summer. No problem. However, it still would not surprise me to see him move to another League One club and be a success next season. His record shows that and backs that up.
There is no comparison between Ladapo and Thomas. Neither comment are related nor can be taken so.
I granted the fact that Thomas has been alright recently and has played better. But it doesn’t make him the answer and it doesn’t make him good enough to be in a team pushing for promotion.
He is 29 near the start of next season. This is the most he’s played in a single season for anyone and is the highest level he’s played at bar a couple of games in the Championship. I completely stand by my statement that if Thomas is the answer, the question does not have anything to do with promotion.
Surely Thomas is not the answer, we’ve been stuck in this shite league for so long people are a becoming used to mediocrity. Don’t doubt his commitment and he seems a nice guy but he’s not good enough for a promotion side
This all day long.
Personally don’t get the whole he’d be a good squad player argument either. But that’s me.
He’s been part of a defence that over the last two seasons will have conceded more than 130 league goals. He’s an average League One player.
We should not be resigning him for another season to be 4th choice or a ‘squad player’. What we need is better quality players who push each other and can compete at the top end of this league.
He’s not dominating in the air, he’s generally poor on the ball, he’s not incredibly strong or quick. I am convinced people like him because he’s local, passionate, and they’re unsure what is his preferred foot and because of that he plays across the defence. For me, that’s not enough to warrant a new deal in what needs to be a season of real intent to go and win promotion.
The thing is, I can remember us having the self same conversation about Purrington a few years ago, and we let him go but then didn't replace with better. Given that, and the fact he covers across the back four, I can understand the argument for giving him another year, although letting him go is probably an easier option for making space in the squad.
Letting Purrington go was the right decision at the time and it still was the right decision. Despite how crazy that might sound as to what happened next with poor recruitment.
The intention to sign better was there and rightly so, the execution was not. Just because some players may play okay or be solid or whatever it might be, doesn’t make them right for the club going forward.
Of course, until now we have not found a better left back than Purrington, but we had a mess of recruitment when it really should not have been that difficult.
We now have owners who are going to spend money and actually want to move the club forward. I genuinely believe that it won’t be difficult to sign a better centre back in the summer than Thomas.
Obviously all depends on budget and recruitment team but on the conditions that a) our budget is decent and b) that the failed Andy Scott has nothing to do with our recruitment then I wouldn't renew any of Thomas, Ness, Hector or Bakrin in the summer.
That would leave us with REG, Jones and Gillesphey (assuming Mitchell is still not ready) and we would likely need two big upgrades/starters bought in who imo would play alongside REG with Gillesphey and Jones as the backups as they both look average L1 CBs to me.
Surely Thomas is not the answer, we’ve been stuck in this shite league for so long people are a becoming used to mediocrity. Don’t doubt his commitment and he seems a nice guy but he’s not good enough for a promotion side
This all day long.
Personally don’t get the whole he’d be a good squad player argument either. But that’s me.
He’s been part of a defence that over the last two seasons will have conceded more than 130 league goals. He’s an average League One player.
We should not be resigning him for another season to be 4th choice or a ‘squad player’. What we need is better quality players who push each other and can compete at the top end of this league.
He’s not dominating in the air, he’s generally poor on the ball, he’s not incredibly strong or quick. I am convinced people like him because he’s local, passionate, and they’re unsure what is his preferred foot and because of that he plays across the defence. For me, that’s not enough to warrant a new deal in what needs to be a season of real intent to go and win promotion.
Could say the same about Ladapo who I remember you saying we should sign permanently fairly recently? Different position but we want similar qualities in our strikers too.
Please don’t put words in my mouth when that’s not true. I haven’t once said we should sign Ladapo. When he first signed I was excited like all fans. He has not lived up to any expectations.
What I have said is both Ladapo and Camara needed to show their quality before the end of the season and if they did, they would have a chance of staying. If not, we look elsewhere. I explained the type of striker Ladapo is and that his size confuses people as he’s not a target man. Overall, he has been poor and we will look elsewhere in the summer. No problem. However, it still would not surprise me to see him move to another League One club and be a success next season. His record shows that and backs that up.
There is no comparison between Ladapo and Thomas. Neither comment are related nor can be taken so.
I granted the fact that Thomas has been alright recently and has played better. But it doesn’t make him the answer and it doesn’t make him good enough to be in a team pushing for promotion.
He is 29 near the start of next season. This is the most he’s played in a single season for anyone and is the highest level he’s played at bar a couple of games in the Championship. I completely stand by my statement that if Thomas is the answer, the question does not have anything to do with promotion.
I sort of see your point but wonder if he's a late developer. Not saying by any stretch that he should be a starter next year but maybe these are his prime years and he's better than he was before? Plus Jones has always been good at unlocking something more from players and teams. I won't be gutted if he goes but I won't be disappointed if he stays, the fact he can play across the back 3 and sort of at LB without major positioning flaws would be helpful. That could be covered off with good recruitment but we will see
Have been sceptical and nervous when he has been selected in the past as I have consistently believed him to have 1-2 errors per game in him. His performances of late have pleasantly surprised me and as long as he keeps playing well and as error free as possible, then good luck to him. More than deserves staying in the side at the minute.
His errors tend to be of the kind that don’t cost goals, mainly hoofing the ball into touch, rather than over the half way line. Can’t think of a single occasion when he’s cost us a goal, which is very unusual for a CB.
His strengths are his positioning, which leads to him making quite a lot of interceptions.
I hope he ends up on the bench, as that would mean we’ve signed a quality first choicer.
Our fans have ludicrous and abusive relationships with defenders. Everyone ends up thought of as error-prone and shit regardless of how well they play. We could do a complete rebuild and our fans would be onto the new lot as soon as we let a couple of goals in
That maybe has some merit but the stats don’t lie.
Stats are often on the side of the defender though, TT being an example. Although is there a stat for ‘mistakes that lead to a goal’?
Naby never recovered from the Millwall winner from the corner, when he allowed the attacker to climb on him to win the header. I remember one game where he was criticised in the post match for being error prone, but watching the whole match back he actually made zero errors.
Similarly, Hector made a couple of mistakes early on, and it took ages before we accepted he was actually making far fewer than Jones (when Jones’ form slumped for a few games).
It seems the key is to start off with one or two good performances. Charlie Barker and Mitchell spring to mind.
It’s an interesting topic, for sure.
I still think that was a foul on Naby.
It definitely was, as he lifted himslef up on Naby's shoulders. But CBs know they have to counter than, as refs don't always spot it.
He might now want the role at only 29, but Thomas is a brilliant option to have on the bench as he can play right across the backline.
Is he "top 2" standard, possibly not, but are any of our CBs that good? Jones has had a poor period this season, Gillesphey was poor on Friday, while REG was no better than Thomas on Monday.
Surely Thomas is not the answer, we’ve been stuck in this shite league for so long people are a becoming used to mediocrity. Don’t doubt his commitment and he seems a nice guy but he’s not good enough for a promotion side
This all day long.
Personally don’t get the whole he’d be a good squad player argument either. But that’s me.
He’s been part of a defence that over the last two seasons will have conceded more than 130 league goals. He’s an average League One player.
We should not be resigning him for another season to be 4th choice or a ‘squad player’. What we need is better quality players who push each other and can compete at the top end of this league.
He’s not dominating in the air, he’s generally poor on the ball, he’s not incredibly strong or quick. I am convinced people like him because he’s local, passionate, and they’re unsure what is his preferred foot and because of that he plays across the defence. For me, that’s not enough to warrant a new deal in what needs to be a season of real intent to go and win promotion.
The thing is, I can remember us having the self same conversation about Purrington a few years ago, and we let him go but then didn't replace with better. Given that, and the fact he covers across the back four, I can understand the argument for giving him another year, although letting him go is probably an easier option for making space in the squad.
Letting Purrington go was the right decision at the time and it still was the right decision. Despite how crazy that might sound as to what happened next with poor recruitment.
The intention to sign better was there and rightly so, the execution was not. Just because some players may play okay or be solid or whatever it might be, doesn’t make them right for the club going forward.
Of course, until now we have not found a better left back than Purrington, but we had a mess of recruitment when it really should not have been that difficult.
We now have owners who are going to spend money and actually want to move the club forward. I genuinely believe that it won’t be difficult to sign a better centre back in the summer than Thomas.
Isn't the trick to let a player go *after* you've found a replacement, rather than letting him go and taking a gamble that you'll find someone better? And every club that gets promotion will be carrying a few players who you would label as 'not being good enough for a side seeking promotion'. They're the squad players who end up playing because of injuries or suspesions to others. Josh Parker springs to mind. Thomas is a decent squad player who won't let you down if called upon to play, but who perhaps should be starting in a side with top two ambitions. As I've said elsewhere it's hard to grade the CBs as they all have their strengths and their flaws. Jones is brilliant when the opposition plays the long ball game, but looks suspect against passing sides with a bit of guile. Gillesphey looks ok one week, and poor the next. REG is steady, but needs a midfielder ahead of him who makes himself available. Ness has potential, but didn't win a single header when he came on against Stevenage. Hector looks very classy, but some think he's prone to switching off. Well I think he'll get a run in the side under NJ, and I reckon he'll earn himself a new contract. However, I think we need a nailed on starter signing like Ricardo Santos would be.
Defensively he been very good over the past few months especially since he moved more central … he not a passer of the ball and never will be so people moaning about that is just stupid .. he does his job tackle clear the ball .
I drew up a list of who I'd keep from the starting line up and came up with Isted (as no 2) REG HEC Small Coventry Kanu May ( if we can find a proper position for him)
The differing views on who to keep shows how bruised the fan base is from our recruitment over recent years. Many of the players being discussed are very average players but our fear of letting some go is more due to the fear of not replacing them rather than how good the players actually are.
Ultimately I think we have to trust NJ and the Board to get it right. That said I’ll be disappointed if we keep a lot of what’s been one of the worst Charlton teams and defences ever.
We have conceded 59 goals this season. The top two have conceded 35 and 37 respectively. Even under NJ we have achieved only one clean sheet.
Why the enthusiasm to perpetuate the problem?
Because development isn't perpetuation. We've improved defensively under Jones in just two months. He's only in his 9th week of working with this squad and the stupid mistakes that used to happen every single game have reduced, the lack of concentration as games go on and the total fear in he backline has diminished. He'll then have the whole summer to bring in some new players, work on fitness and tactics and get the players well drilled. In 8 weeks Jones has got more out of Thomas than most would have said was possible and he looks assured as a defender. He's still dodgy on the ball but we'll need a squad to get through next season and hopefully we'll bring in someone better than Thomas and have him as a versatile, capable and readily available backup. If not we can let him go but we'll still need to sign a first team CB and then we'll need to sign a backup to that CB who will most likely be on the same level as Thomas but with the need to acclimatise and get used to working under Jones. It would be pretty stupid to turf out all the players who played in impossible circumstances under Appleton, especially when they've looked good in a brief spell under Jones. Of all the many, many issues we've had this season Thomas hasn't been the problem, he's been one of the better players
I feel the same as you when Dobson's possible transfer location was revealed.
I know that my team does not have a European-level fan base. It is still acceptable in Hungary, the number of spectators can even rise to over 10,000 in bigger matches, but in the case of the Puskás Academy, we cannot speak of a real team.
There would be no spectators at a Puskás Academy match even if they were brought to Budapest, because no one would go out as a neutral. While we had 20,000 against Chelsea, PAOK, AEK Athens, BATE, or over 10,000 against Köln, Trabzon, Sporting in Székesfehérvár, they would not have even 2,000 spectators, mostly children with free tickets.
In matches with only thousand of spectators of the domestic league, where all you have to do is listen to the visiting team. With an invaluable record in European competitions.
The small stadium is beautifull, like a jewelry box. The salary is high, but nothing else.
For what it's worth I would offer Thomas at least another year as he wd be good to on the bench and in reserve. Our defence will be better next year after a decent pre season and a good keeper on board..
We need a versatile player as part of the squad. Thomas is a decent standard and we would possibly need two players to replace him. Yes, you can always get better but that desn't mean it is as easy as people think. Many of us were quite happy Claire went but we replaced him with worse. The budget needs focusing on the players that will make a difference. Thomas is not the issue and is a useful player for us. Also, he is not injury prone! Absolutely he should be offered a new deal.
TT is below average, who does try his best [which ain’t good enough]
Except we got promoted last time with Marshall, Reeves, Parker, Lapslie, Page, Morgan and Ajose. And in 11/12 we got promoted with Doherty, Evina, Wagstaff, Hayes, Euell, Russell, Leon Clarke and Dany N'Guessan. Plenty of average players in the squads, all of them useful and reliable when called on as squad players. Every team that gets promoted does it with average players, if you think you're getting 2 top L1 players who could do a job at Championship level in every position then you aren't living in reality. We need a better first choice CB ahead of Thomas but he's the perfect player for the squad given that he's shown he can play well at this level, is versatile and is almost always available.
Surely Thomas is not the answer, we’ve been stuck in this shite league for so long people are a becoming used to mediocrity. Don’t doubt his commitment and he seems a nice guy but he’s not good enough for a promotion side
This all day long.
Personally don’t get the whole he’d be a good squad player argument either. But that’s me.
He’s been part of a defence that over the last two seasons will have conceded more than 130 league goals. He’s an average League One player.
We should not be resigning him for another season to be 4th choice or a ‘squad player’. What we need is better quality players who push each other and can compete at the top end of this league.
He’s not dominating in the air, he’s generally poor on the ball, he’s not incredibly strong or quick. I am convinced people like him because he’s local, passionate, and they’re unsure what is his preferred foot and because of that he plays across the defence. For me, that’s not enough to warrant a new deal in what needs to be a season of real intent to go and win promotion.
The thing is, I can remember us having the self same conversation about Purrington a few years ago, and we let him go but then didn't replace with better. Given that, and the fact he covers across the back four, I can understand the argument for giving him another year, although letting him go is probably an easier option for making space in the squad.
Letting Purrington go was the right decision at the time and it still was the right decision. Despite how crazy that might sound as to what happened next with poor recruitment.
The intention to sign better was there and rightly so, the execution was not. Just because some players may play okay or be solid or whatever it might be, doesn’t make them right for the club going forward.
Of course, until now we have not found a better left back than Purrington, but we had a mess of recruitment when it really should not have been that difficult.
We now have owners who are going to spend money and actually want to move the club forward. I genuinely believe that it won’t be difficult to sign a better centre back in the summer than Thomas.
You're right. That does sound crazy. Weakening the squad by replacing a solid if not especially pacy left back with wingers/right backs out of position, youth players that were nowhere near ready and injury prone loanees can really not be said to have been "still the right decision". If we'd managed to replace him with better that summer then that'd be a different matter, but it's only since we've signed Small that it looks like we might have finally done that, and it's still probably a bit too early to say.
And you have to remember that Sandgaard also spent money and wanted to move the club forward. The problem was that he didn't know what he was doing. While there have been a few bright spots in the January recruitment, I think the jury is very much still out on whether the new ownership (or at least those they are delegating to) are sufficiently better at it to believe that it won't be difficult for them to sign a better centre back than Thomas. At the moment that's a faith based position rather than an evidence based one.
Had another very good game today I thought. Give the bloke a contract.
He was ok. Does he deserve a new contract? Not for me. My worry is like Hector has his form improved because it's new contract time. Not a coincidence in my opinion. If him or Hector I'd rather keep Hector 100% although I wouldn't be bothered if he left too which says it all really.
Had another very good game today I thought. Give the bloke a contract.
He was ok. Does he deserve a new contract? Not for me. My worry is like Hector has his form improved because it's new contract time. Not a coincidence in my opinion. If him or Hector I'd rather keep Hector 100% although I wouldn't be bothered if he left too which says it all really.
Or maybe they're playing better as we have a settled system, and a better manager?
Unbeaten in our last 11 games, zero goals attributable directly to Thomas, clearly valued by Jones and trusted to play across all three centre back positions, even given the armband and there’s still people saying don’t offer him a contract. Poor fella, what more can he do?
Comments
What I have said is both Ladapo and Camara needed to show their quality before the end of the season and if they did, they would have a chance of staying. If not, we look elsewhere. I explained the type of striker Ladapo is and that his size confuses people as he’s not a target man. Overall, he has been poor and we will look elsewhere in the summer. No problem. However, it still would not surprise me to see him move to another League One club and be a success next season. His record shows that and backs that up.
There is no comparison between Ladapo and Thomas. Neither comment are related nor can be taken so.
I granted the fact that Thomas has been alright recently and has played better. But it doesn’t make him the answer and it doesn’t make him good enough to be in a team pushing for promotion.
He is 29 near the start of next season. This is the most he’s played in a single season for anyone and is the highest level he’s played at bar a couple of games in the Championship. I completely stand by my statement that if Thomas is the answer, the question does not have anything to do with promotion.
The intention to sign better was there and rightly so, the execution was not. Just because some players may play okay or be solid or whatever it might be, doesn’t make them right for the club going forward.
Of course, until now we have not found a better left back than Purrington, but we had a mess of recruitment when it really should not have been that difficult.
We now have owners who are going to spend money and actually want to move the club forward. I genuinely believe that it won’t be difficult to sign a better centre back in the summer than Thomas.
That would leave us with REG, Jones and Gillesphey (assuming Mitchell is still not ready) and we would likely need two big upgrades/starters bought in who imo would play alongside REG with Gillesphey and Jones as the backups as they both look average L1 CBs to me.
Is he "top 2" standard, possibly not, but are any of our CBs that good? Jones has had a poor period this season, Gillesphey was poor on Friday, while REG was no better than Thomas on Monday.
And every club that gets promotion will be carrying a few players who you would label as 'not being good enough for a side seeking promotion'. They're the squad players who end up playing because of injuries or suspesions to others. Josh Parker springs to mind.
Thomas is a decent squad player who won't let you down if called upon to play, but who perhaps should be starting in a side with top two ambitions. As I've said elsewhere it's hard to grade the CBs as they all have their strengths and their flaws.
Jones is brilliant when the opposition plays the long ball game, but looks suspect against passing sides with a bit of guile.
Gillesphey looks ok one week, and poor the next.
REG is steady, but needs a midfielder ahead of him who makes himself available.
Ness has potential, but didn't win a single header when he came on against Stevenage.
Hector looks very classy, but some think he's prone to switching off. Well I think he'll get a run in the side under NJ, and I reckon he'll earn himself a new contract.
However, I think we need a nailed on starter signing like Ricardo Santos would be.
Isted (as no 2)
REG
HEC
Small
Coventry
Kanu
May ( if we can find a proper position for him)
The top two have conceded 35 and 37 respectively.
Even under NJ we have achieved only one clean sheet.
Why the enthusiasm to perpetuate the problem?
The small stadium is beautifull, like a jewelry box. The salary is high, but nothing else.
TT is below average, who does try his best [which ain’t good enough]
bloody predictive text
Or maybe they're playing better as we have a settled system, and a better manager?