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IFollow Streaming income - What’s fair?

Interesting debate I’ve seen on Twitter. 

Currently for away ticket gate receipts home team receive 95%, away team 5% commission. For games that can streamed in the UK, it’s 80% to the club who sell the stream and 20% to the EFL. 

Burton v Ipswich on Tuesday, Ipswich sold out 1,600 away tickets (95% income to Burton) and 5,300+ UK based streams (0% income to Burton).

The Accrington chairman is arguing that the lion share of the stream income from Ipswich sales should go to the home club (Burton), or pooled with all stream income and split across the league (like the Sky contract money is).

What do you think is fair? 

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    Do we give 20% as we're outside of iFollow?  
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    I originally presumed that iFollow income went to the Home team, until X amount of streams had been sold.

    Only once that happened, did the Away team start get a percentage
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    edited August 2022
    All income into a pot and given out to all 24 clubs equally 
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    Whatever benefits us the most, so probably whoever sells the stream at this level and an equal pool if we get to the Championship.
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    I originally presumed that iFollow income went to the Home team, until X amount of streams had been sold.

    Only once that happened, did the Away team start get a percentage
    Was that part of the arrangement during the covid-enforced stadium closures? I vaguely remember a club chairman or director making public the Fourth Division agreement (which then ended up on here as part of another debate) but I didn't know if that was an all-divisions deal or if the Championship and Division Three had tailored agreements.
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    Interesting debate I’ve seen on Twitter. 

    Currently for away ticket gate receipts home team receive 95%, away team 5% commission. For games that can streamed in the UK, it’s 80% to the club who sell the stream and 20% to the EFL. 

    Burton v Ipswich on Tuesday, Ipswich sold out 1,600 away tickets (95% income to Burton) and 5,300+ UK based streams (0% income to Burton).

    The Accrington chairman is arguing that the lion share of the stream income from Ipswich sales should go to the home club (Burton), or pooled with all stream income and split across the league (like the Sky contract money is).

    What do you think is fair? 
    Really good question.  

    The home club should really take the lion's share of income from televising a match.  That's because every stream paid for may result in one more empty seat in the ground.  

    My solution would be that the home team gets a 95%/5% split of streaming revenue for as many "seats" as it takes to fill the ground.  For example, if Charlton have 15,000 in the ground, that's 12,111 empty seats.  Charlton should get a 95% share of the first 12,111 streams sold; after that it should be split 80% to the club that sells the stream, 20% to the EFL.  
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    Scoham said:
    Whatever benefits us the most, so probably whoever sells the stream at this level and an equal pool if we get to the Championship.
    I know it’s never going to happen. But shouldn’t clubs argue based on what’s good for the game of football rather than just what’s good for ourselves. 

    This current income split from ifollow just furthers what we already see in league 1 with a big split between the budgets of the big teams and the small. If they carry on, and with streaming only getting bigger and bigger, then the divide will grow and make the league less competitive. The EFL is so good because it’s so competitive and unpredictable so this should be protected at all costs rather than just letting the rich clubs get richer
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    I think some of the stream income should go to the home club as it's their fixture, the selling club should take a smaller proportion, and the remainder to go into the general income pot to be shared across the division.

    No doubt everyone would argue what the percantages should be but something along the lines of 35% home, 15% away, 50% pot may be a starting point for negotiations.
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    I originally presumed that iFollow income went to the Home team, until X amount of streams had been sold.

    Only once that happened, did the Away team start get a percentage
    That was the system in covid times I think. But it was the away team had to give the home team the sales of what the expected away crowd would have been. So for example if we were playing Gillingham away we would have to give them the money for the first 2000 streams we sold. Now fans are back the club selling the stream keeps all the money 
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    edited August 2022
    shirty5 said:
    All income into a pot and given out to all 24 clubs equally 
    If it’s pooled, they should do it across all 72 clubs.

    You can argue that pooling is good for the game but I wonder if that’s actually the case or whether Andy Holt is just arguing for the good of his own football club.

    Much like the nonsense salary cap that he was a big proponent of. The basic principle of it made sense, control crazy spending. But upon implementation it hugely benefitted clubs like Accrington at the expense of others.


    If you have more overseas fans streaming, why shouldn’t you benefit from more of the streaming revenue?
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    Personally I'd say it should be split on video ticket sales. 
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    I've been following this closely for a while, at first I thought it was a tad amusing but when you look through Andy Holt's timeline these rants of his are almost daily. Part of me has some sympathy for him but then to be fair other people also make valid points as well which I think he often overlooks.

    If you have to pool all the income then how about pooling all the expense that comes with a matchday too, would Holt be keen on that? Highly unlikely as it would increase his costs massively if he had to share our expenses too but seems he only wants to share the income only.

    There's also an argument that with a limited away capacity clubs are selling passes to fans that wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend like we've done before showing AFC Wimbledon and Millwall away in The Fans Bar before.

    Holt has argued that it's not for the other team to sell but then it can also be argued back that he doesn't have 5k Ipswich fans to sell to.

    Personally I would allow each team to be able to sell there own pass for the same game eg Accrington sell a streaming pass on there website for anyone who wishes to buy from them and they get to keep all that income while the away team can buy the same pass from there own website to which the away team keeps all that income. Therefore effectively selling to your own fans.

    Well worth a read on Andy's timeline.
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    I think some of the stream income should go to the home club as it's their fixture, the selling club should take a smaller proportion, and the remainder to go into the general income pot to be shared across the division.

    No doubt everyone would argue what the percantages should be but something along the lines of 35% home, 15% away, 50% pot may be a starting point for negotiations.
    I don’t think 50% pot is realistic for this. Unlike TV money, which is central rights that everyone gets a cut from, this is individual clubs selling to their fans. Broadcast rights are selling to a lot of neutrals for any game, this is directed specifically a fans of the two clubs. I doubt many neutral fans sign up for other peoples games. 

    Suggestions - 

    - a percentage to iFollow to fund the service

    - home team streams keep everything 

    - away team streams - 95% home/5% away up to the point where stream + tickets sold equal the away ticket allocation. 50/50 split on anything over that, as it’s effectively money that wouldn’t have been made otherwise. It also stops away teams from pocketing cash by not selling tickets. 
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    I've been following this closely for a while, at first I thought it was a tad amusing but when you look through Andy Holt's timeline these rants of his are almost daily. Part of me has some sympathy for him but then to be fair other people also make valid points as well which I think he often overlooks.

    If you have to pool all the income then how about pooling all the expense that comes with a matchday too, would Holt be keen on that? Highly unlikely as it would increase his costs massively if he had to share our expenses too but seems he only wants to share the income only.

    There's also an argument that with a limited away capacity clubs are selling passes to fans that wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend like we've done before showing AFC Wimbledon and Millwall away in The Fans Bar before.

    Holt has argued that it's not for the other team to sell but then it can also be argued back that he doesn't have 5k Ipswich fans to sell to.

    Personally I would allow each team to be able to sell there own pass for the same game eg Accrington sell a streaming pass on there website for anyone who wishes to buy from them and they get to keep all that income while the away team can buy the same pass from there own website to which the away team keeps all that income. Therefore effectively selling to your own fans.

    Well worth a read on Andy's timeline.
    That is what seems sensible to me - or set it up in a PPV style, if you purchase through the Home/Away team they get X% of the income, the rest gets split through the league
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    NabySarr said:
    Scoham said:
    Whatever benefits us the most, so probably whoever sells the stream at this level and an equal pool if we get to the Championship.
    I know it’s never going to happen. But shouldn’t clubs argue based on what’s good for the game of football rather than just what’s good for ourselves. 

    This current income split from ifollow just furthers what we already see in league 1 with a big split between the budgets of the big teams and the small. If they carry on, and with streaming only getting bigger and bigger, then the divide will grow and make the league less competitive. The EFL is so good because it’s so competitive and unpredictable so this should be protected at all costs rather than just letting the rich clubs get richer
    League 1, recently has become even more unequal than the Premier league.  Sunderland were getting crowds 10 times the size of some of the clubs.

    We know now which 12 clubs are going to have the biggest income.  They are also going to have the biggest loses.  So no one is getting rich are they?  With 1 or 2 exceptions those 12 clubs will all finish in the top half.   

    This is all part of a much bigger argument.  What's the point of organised football?

    Is it dog eat dog and sod the rest or is it a collective but someone happens to win?

    The way it is at the moment is the clubs who actually generate the money want to keep more of it and the clubs that don’t want more of it.  I don't think there is an easy answer.


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    Interesting debate I’ve seen on Twitter. 

    Currently for away ticket gate receipts home team receive 95%, away team 5% commission. For games that can streamed in the UK, it’s 80% to the club who sell the stream and 20% to the EFL. 

    Burton v Ipswich on Tuesday, Ipswich sold out 1,600 away tickets (95% income to Burton) and 5,300+ UK based streams (0% income to Burton).

    The Accrington chairman is arguing that the lion share of the stream income from Ipswich sales should go to the home club (Burton), or pooled with all stream income and split across the league (like the Sky contract money is).

    What do you think is fair? 
    Tricky one really.

    You could argue that as Ipswich sold their allocation out, then why should Burton make more money because additional Ipswich fans want to watch the game on a stream. They're Ipswich fans so the money should go to Ipswich.

    However on the flip side of that is the fact that the Premier league is the best league in the world because the tv money is split between all clubs unlike La Liga where Barca and Real take home far more than the other clubs.

    So i think it's probably fairest if it's split evenly.

    Make no mistake though, Holt isn't raising this issue as some kind of 'for the good of football' thing, he's clearly raising it because he knows his side are the smallest in the division and he wants a cut of the money that other clubs fans are spending.
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    Cafc43v3r said:
    NabySarr said:
    Scoham said:
    Whatever benefits us the most, so probably whoever sells the stream at this level and an equal pool if we get to the Championship.
    I know it’s never going to happen. But shouldn’t clubs argue based on what’s good for the game of football rather than just what’s good for ourselves. 

    This current income split from ifollow just furthers what we already see in league 1 with a big split between the budgets of the big teams and the small. If they carry on, and with streaming only getting bigger and bigger, then the divide will grow and make the league less competitive. The EFL is so good because it’s so competitive and unpredictable so this should be protected at all costs rather than just letting the rich clubs get richer
    League 1, recently has become even more unequal than the Premier league.  Sunderland were getting crowds 10 times the size of some of the clubs.

    We know now which 12 clubs are going to have the biggest income.  They are also going to have the biggest loses.  So no one is getting rich are they?  With 1 or 2 exceptions those 12 clubs will all finish in the top half.   

    This is all part of a much bigger argument.  What's the point of organised football?

    Is it dog eat dog and sod the rest or is it a collective but someone happens to win?

    The way it is at the moment is the clubs who actually generate the money want to keep more of it and the clubs that don’t want more of it.  I don't think there is an easy answer.


    In my opinion it has to be the collective first and foremost.

    If you look at the Premier League you've got three or four clubs who (think they) have realistic ambitions of winning the title a few more who are eyeing up a European place and everyone else is trying to avoid relegation. What is the point of a league where such a small proportion have a chance of becoming champions? Surely it's in the league's best interests to keep every team as competitive as possible.

    The bigger clubs are always going to find ways to rort the system but why not do what we can to help the smaller clubs who don't have as big a fan base? They have as much right to exist and challenge for titles/promotion etc as the likes of us, Portsmouth, Chef Wendy, Dipswich etc.

    As ever, the big clubs will want to keep everything for themselves and the smaller ones will want a larger share of what the big clubs have.
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    Cafc43v3r said:
    NabySarr said:
    Scoham said:
    Whatever benefits us the most, so probably whoever sells the stream at this level and an equal pool if we get to the Championship.
    I know it’s never going to happen. But shouldn’t clubs argue based on what’s good for the game of football rather than just what’s good for ourselves. 

    This current income split from ifollow just furthers what we already see in league 1 with a big split between the budgets of the big teams and the small. If they carry on, and with streaming only getting bigger and bigger, then the divide will grow and make the league less competitive. The EFL is so good because it’s so competitive and unpredictable so this should be protected at all costs rather than just letting the rich clubs get richer
    League 1, recently has become even more unequal than the Premier league.  Sunderland were getting crowds 10 times the size of some of the clubs.

    We know now which 12 clubs are going to have the biggest income.  They are also going to have the biggest loses.  So no one is getting rich are they?  With 1 or 2 exceptions those 12 clubs will all finish in the top half.   

    This is all part of a much bigger argument.  What's the point of organised football?

    Is it dog eat dog and sod the rest or is it a collective but someone happens to win?

    The way it is at the moment is the clubs who actually generate the money want to keep more of it and the clubs that don’t want more of it.  I don't think there is an easy answer.


    No one is getting rich but those teams with extra streaming income can then use that money to put more into their playing budgets, while those that aren't cannot so fall further behind. For me, football shouldn't just be about who has the most money wins. It should be more about who recruits the best, who has the best manager, the best players coming through the academy etc... Obviously money is always going to be a big factor but I think the EFL should be trying to limit that as much as possible to keep the leagues as competitive as possible. The EFL is brilliant because of how competitive it is but it is definitely getting more predictable (especially in the championship due to parachute payments)
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    In the interests of competitiveness and fairness the income should be shared among all 24 sides. However the clubs with bigger grounds carry more overheads so an argument can be made for the lions share going to the lions, I think I prefer an even split though
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