I think a lot of the comments on here indicate the way versatility can be used in fans' minds to re-imagine a lot of footballers. It's like a non-injury version of 'we really miss x player, it'll be fine when he gets back'. We thought that about Inniss and Famewo when they both got injured, but when they came back we couldn't recapture the defensive form. We've heard it about Sessegnon all season; because he's right footed people lose their minds about him playing on the left but he'd be Cafu if he was on the right.
With Clare his best position is always the one he's not playing in. We signed him to play as a central midfielder and he was terrible. So bad. He was dropped by Adkins and then Jackson didn't fancy him at all there. In his first two games Jackson brought him on late in central midfield for Elliot Lee to help close down a game we were winning. He came in at RCB against Burton after we had yet another injury crisis; no Lavelle, no Pearce, no Matthews, no Gunter, all of whom were initially ahead of him in the CB spot. More accurately, Matthews and Gunter were the RCBs who were initially tasked with pushing out to RB in possession and pulling narrow out of it. I don't blame Clare for this but part of our stagnation under Jackson came when we stopped doing that shape change well and became rigid in our shape, which arguably was because we were no longer playing a natural RB in that spot.
Clare did well initially and kept his place from there, (though looking back at some of those matches you do have to question if Jackson had lost his mind. We lost 1-0 to Shrewsbury with a back 3 of Purringon, Pearce and Clare, with Souare and CBT at wingback. We had injuries but Jesus Christ, was Jacko ever a slave to the shape!) but the cracks started to show. We conceded so many goals in the channel between Clare and an Adam Matthews who had completely lost interest in playing football. A tough bit to patrol when you've got limited support but it did show Clare's inability to concentrate through a full move and learn from mistakes. He wasn't going to be a centre back.
Garner signed Egbo, who got injured immediately and Clare was our right back. He didn't do badly and it's where he's been most effective for us but it's still clear Clare isn't really a right back and also fairly clear he'd really rather not be there. He's better at RB because he doesn't have to be aware of threats coming from the subs' bench to his right but he still forgets that players move after the first pass or after the corner is struck. So many times an opposition player scores and it's Clare trailing behind him looking annoyed and confused because he had him covered 5 seconds ago and then decided that was job done. Not a right back.
But then you always hear that he'd be alright elsewhere. When he was playing CM for us people pointed out he'd done well at RB for Oxford. When he was at RCB people said the same thing. Now he's had a season there people wanted him to stay as backup at CM or RCB. The fact is if you have Sean Clare for an extended period in any position you're going to be dissatisfied with the result. His greatest strength is that he's managed not to catch the Charlton injury curse, but it also means you'll always see him playing multiple games and it will not be good. He would have done better if you'd played him in the other position though. Or the other one. Or the other one..
You make it sound as if he had an extensive run in midfield. I can only remember a couple of games at most, I bet it was less than 10/ no -5 games at very most of 93. I agree that his best position was never established, but he has a good range of passing, good accuracy of pass, faster pace than most in Div 1, good shot when given the chance, good interplay eg Morgan goal. Yep there were the errors in marking in set pieces. Overall a very talented player-frustrating that we couldn't find the role for him.
He got as long a run in midfield as his performances merited. He was terrible against Wednesday (0-0), terrible against Oxford (1-2), terrible against MK Dons (1-2), was dropped for a bit and then was terrible against Bolton (1-4) and terrible against Accrington (2-3). That was long enough for me and it was evidently long enough for Adkins, Jackson, Garner and Holden. With Dobson, who was also terrible up to the point Adkins left, you could see how he might work in another system. With Clare there was absolutely nothing visible there in his appearances. Constantly bypassed, never aware of where his runners were until it was too late, he just didn't know where to be when the ball turned over. That's why he's better further back with the play in front of him. I agree with you, I think there's a lot of talent there but it's absolutely not workable in central midfield. Right of a midfield 4 where his job is to provide balance for an attacking left winger would suit him best I think. I wouldn't really trust him with an overlapping RB behind him though, too much third man running for him to track. He's still relatively young, I think if a good coach can get him to work on his positioning and awareness then he could be a very decent player, I hope that happens for him.
Shows how far we have fallen when Clare is seen as a loss. Came across as a decent fella, but could not defend and had no impact on the occasions he played in midfield. The vast majority of players from the past 2 seasons have to be moved on and we start again
Exactly. We've been crying out for a clear out and as soon as we actually get rid of some of rhe bang average footballers that have been mainstays in our most pathetic showings in league one, half the fanbase gets all doughy eyed about them.
Shows how far we have fallen when Clare is seen as a loss. Came across as a decent fella, but could not defend and had no impact on the occasions he played in midfield. The vast majority of players from the past 2 seasons have to be moved on and we start again
Exactly. We've been crying out for a clear out and as soon as we actually get rid of some of rhe bang average footballers that have been mainstays in our most pathetic showings in league one, half the fanbase gets all doughy eyed about them.
Problem was he wasn't a midfielder, wasn't a full back, his passing was erratic, could tackle and clearly had pace and ability - Like many players that have played for us the attitude felt wrong too often.
Always one of my favourite players even though playing out of position in a very poor team. Thought he received a lot of unfair criticism on here and delighted for him that he escaped from the mad house.
Still can't fathom why he wasn't given a fair run in midfield alongside Dobbo and Fraser as he had bags of energy, athleticism and tackling in him plus a goal or two.
At least we still have McGrandles and Kirk, who have none of the above.
Always one of my favourite players even though playing out of position in a very poor team. Thought he received a lot of unfair criticism on here and delighted for him that he escaped from the mad house.
Still can't fathom why he wasn't given a fair run in midfield alongside Dobbo and Fraser as he had bags of energy, athleticism and tackling in him plus a goal or two.
At least we still have McGrandles and Kirk, who have none of the above.
Clare got 8 games for us starting as a CM before he was written off for that position.
McGrandles has had 4 games for us starting as CM before you have written him off for that position.
He had some fantastic qualities in a player and could really excite, there were games where I loved him. But while he could beat his man, he could rarely find the right cross/pass. He seemed to lack vision which precluded him from playing CM. Even at right back, you'd see players breaking the lines into space ahead of him but he'd just not spot them. I agree he lacked the right attitude at times and his concentration cost us (to be fair to him, he'd say he was playing out of position).
Away at Oxford, the game where Holden put his foot through the tactics board because players weren't even running, I thought he was the worst of them.
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Ahh all his managers have missed he's a worldie of a right mid. Definitely should have played ahead of Rak Sakyi.
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Ahh all his managers have missed he's a worldie of a right mid. Definitely should have played ahead of Rak Sakyi.
who mentioned 'worldie' ? .. i m o his position would be as a competent right sided midfielder .. and Sakyi is hardly a midfielder, so a void comparison ... I do worry about the observational abilities of some of the contributors on here and the propensity of snide snipers to add words to posts they disagree with in an attempt to justify their responses .. disagree, but disagree with what was written, not what you imagine or would have liked to have been written
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Ahh all his managers have missed he's a worldie of a right mid. Definitely should have played ahead of Rak Sakyi.
who mentioned 'worldie' ? .. i m o his position would be as a competent right sided midfielder .. and Sakyi is hardly a midfielder, so a void comparison ... I do worry about the observational abilities of some of the contributors on here and the propensity of snide snipers to add words to posts they disagree with in an attempt to justify their responses .. disagree, but disagree with what was written, not what you imagine or would have liked to have been written
Rak Sakyi played wide right for us in our midfield for much of last season.
Apologies for adding the worldie bit, but I do think you're overrating him somewhat. Personally much to his annoyance, he has been pushed to right back or right wing back by his managers multiple times as that's where he's been his best.
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Ahh all his managers have missed he's a worldie of a right mid. Definitely should have played ahead of Rak Sakyi.
who mentioned 'worldie' ? .. i m o his position would be as a competent right sided midfielder .. and Sakyi is hardly a midfielder, so a void comparison ... I do worry about the observational abilities of some of the contributors on here and the propensity of snide snipers to add words to posts they disagree with in an attempt to justify their responses .. disagree, but disagree with what was written, not what you imagine or would have liked to have been written
Rak-Sakyi played on the right side. He was more of a right midfielder than anyone else. Unless you think we should've changed formation to a midfield 4 just for Clare?
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Ahh all his managers have missed he's a worldie of a right mid. Definitely should have played ahead of Rak Sakyi.
who mentioned 'worldie' ? .. i m o his position would be as a competent right sided midfielder .. and Sakyi is hardly a midfielder, so a void comparison ... I do worry about the observational abilities of some of the contributors on here and the propensity of snide snipers to add words to posts they disagree with in an attempt to justify their responses .. disagree, but disagree with what was written, not what you imagine or would have liked to have been written
Rak-Sakyi played on the right side. He was more of a right midfielder than anyone else. Unless you think we should've changed formation to a midfield 4 just for Clare?
my last response to another ridiculous post .. Generally Sakyi played on the right of a three man forward line last season .. any theory that he was a 'proper midfielder' is complete rubbish .. check the line ups for our games last season, all are available on the BBC website
good signing for Wigan .. never played in his proper position for us (midfield) .. I hope we don't come to regret his release
Didn’t play there regularly under Adkins, Jackson, Garner or Holden, neither did he at Oxford.
Have all those managers really missed that they had a great central midfielder that just needed a run of games? Wigan are even calling him a defender.
CENTRAL midfield ? .. your word, NOT mine .. the right of midfield would be my choice .. AND, the useless managers you mention with the exception of Holden wouldn't recognise potential in a player even if they were looking through rose coloured binoculars
Fair enough, you see him as a right midfielder. I’m sure he’d do a decent job there but that would have meant changing the formation to fit Clare into what might be his best position, while also moving our main goal threat JRS out of his.
There’s a big range of opinions on Clare (no issue with that) but is he really a player you’d build a team around?
Always one of my favourite players even though playing out of position in a very poor team. Thought he received a lot of unfair criticism on here and delighted for him that he escaped from the mad house.
Still can't fathom why he wasn't given a fair run in midfield alongside Dobbo and Fraser as he had bags of energy, athleticism and tackling in him plus a goal or two.
At least we still have McGrandles and Kirk, who have none of the above.
Clare got 8 games for us starting as a CM before he was written off for that position.
McGrandles has had 4 games for us starting as CM before you have written him off for that position.
Dig duly digested ref McGrandles and time will tell of course but did Clare ever play in a midfield three with Dobbo and Fraser?
No, by the time Fraser joined Clare had been banished from midfield. Clare played in a 3 with Dobson and Morgan where they all competed to see who could look most out of place. After that he teamed up with Watson and Lee once and then Morgan and Gilbey in what I think legally speaking was a war crime.
That successful dribbles stat is hilarious. The majority of those would have been him sprinting up to the half way line before cutting the attack short and passing back to Inniss. Seems like a nice guy so I wish him the best but he’s a bog standard League One journeyman and the fact that anyone can rate him speaks volumes as to how poor we’ve been in the last couple of years.
Liked his effort and attitude and that is all I ask of a Charlton player to thank them.
Technically however, I felt he was one of the weakest players I have ever seen at Charlton. Strong running with the ball but his passing or crossing was utterly woeful.
If that is the quality Wigan are collecting then we can discount them as serious promotion rivals.
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Still can't fathom why he wasn't given a fair run in midfield alongside Dobbo and Fraser as he had bags of energy, athleticism and tackling in him plus a goal or two.
At least we still have McGrandles and Kirk, who have none of the above.
McGrandles has had 4 games for us starting as CM before you have written him off for that position.
Away at Oxford, the game where Holden put his foot through the tactics board because players weren't even running, I thought he was the worst of them.
Apologies for adding the worldie bit, but I do think you're overrating him somewhat. Personally much to his annoyance, he has been pushed to right back or right wing back by his managers multiple times as that's where he's been his best.
There’s a big range of opinions on Clare (no issue with that) but is he really a player you’d build a team around?
@Lincsaddick if he's a success there I will doff my cap to you sir.
I will imagine he plays the majority of his games at right back or right wing back. As he did at Oxford and here.
I don't remember it.
Technically however, I felt he was one of the weakest players I have ever seen at Charlton. Strong running with the ball but his passing or crossing was utterly woeful.
If that is the quality Wigan are collecting then we can discount them as serious promotion rivals.
Glad he has gone.